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Old
06-14-2012, 10:30 AM
  #351
Jack de la Hoya
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Felix60 View Post
Is it even a sure thing Jagr is back in Philly next season? Wasn't it a one year contract?
He's a UFA, but by most accounts enjoyed his time in Philadelphia. There seems to be strong mutual interest in having him back--though I have some reservations about his play down the stretch and in the playoffs.

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Old
06-14-2012, 05:05 PM
  #352
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Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
The Flyers are loaded with forwards and do not need Nash and his contract. Back to JVR. Due to a concussion and foot injury, JVR lost most of last season to injury and now is facing off-season shoulder surgery. While he was gone, he has fallen way down the depth chart. Assuming that he stays, where does he play?

The real question is, how does Philly fit under the cap next yr? They are up against it right now (assuming Carle has AiP). It's temporarily set at $70M, but it's unlikely to stay that high under a new CBA. They still have to re-sign Jagr, Voracek and JVRs big contract sets in. I think they have to move him, or someone others for cap reasons (similar to last yr).

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06-14-2012, 06:08 PM
  #353
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Originally Posted by SunshineRays View Post
The real question is, how does Philly fit under the cap next yr? They are up against it right now (assuming Carle has AiP). It's temporarily set at $70M, but it's unlikely to stay that high under a new CBA. They still have to re-sign Jagr, Voracek and JVRs big contract sets in. I think they have to move him, or someone others for cap reasons (similar to last yr).
They are fine under the cap, actually.

They could actually add either Parise or Suter without too much trouble--essentially, let Jagr or Carle walk, put Pronger on LTIR, etc.

They certainly don't need to dump salary just to resign their current guys.

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Old
06-14-2012, 06:59 PM
  #354
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Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
They are fine under the cap, actually.

They could actually add either Parise or Suter without too much trouble--essentially, let Jagr or Carle walk, put Pronger on LTIR, etc.

They certainly don't need to dump salary just to resign their current guys.
The cap is temp. set at $70M next season, it was $64.3M this season. Under a new CBA, its likely next yrs cap will prob be around $65M or less (much less if owners get their way).

According to Capgeek, Philly is already at $61.2M for next season (top 4 teams in league with least cap space next season). They still have Voracek, Carle, Jagr, Kabina, Bourdon to sign (if they want). They could place Pronger on LTIR and save $5M of cap space, but then they have to replace him also (thus reducing available cap space).

If cap is $65M next yr, they'd only have $3.5M of cap space to sign all the above guys. Carle himself will demand much more than that.
Keep in mind they also have major contracts due next summer (Hartnell, Simmonds, Timmo). They are going to have cap issues again next yr (just like last yr).

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Old
06-14-2012, 07:22 PM
  #355
Jack de la Hoya
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SunshineRays View Post
The cap is temp. set at $70M next season, it was $64.3M this season. Under a new CBA, its likely next yrs cap will prob be around $65M or less (much less if owners get their way).

According to Capgeek, Philly is already at $61.2M for next season (top 4 teams in league with least cap space next season). They still have Voracek, Carle, Jagr, Kabina, Bourdon to sign (if they want). They could place Pronger on LTIR and save $5M of cap space, but then they have to replace him also (thus reducing available cap space).

If cap is $65M next yr, they'd only have $3.5M of cap space to sign all the above guys. Carle himself will demand much more than that.
Keep in mind they also have major contracts due next summer (Hartnell, Simmonds, Timmo). They are going to have cap issues again next yr (just like last yr).
I don't think anyone seriosuly believes that the owners are going to be able to reduce the players' share of revenues that dramatically. The only other way to bring the cap down would be, I guess, to give some money back to NBC, or cut ticket prices. Neither seems likely to me.

More likely is a tweaking of the formula re: cap and floor. There is also no reason to believe that the bonus cushion won't be re-instituted, so you can reduce some of the cap hits considerably.

Re: the Flyers situation, you have things generally right. A few points. Kubina won't be back. he was horrible. Pronger will be on LTIR, so factor that in. Voracek does need a modest raise (to ~$3 million). Timonen will either retire or return to Finland after next year by most accounts, and his money will be used for Giroux, Schenn, Couturier, etc. Ditto Briere a few years later.

If you look at the team, the salary structure really is not bad at all. Briere is the only truly "bad" contract.

Even if you assume the bonus cushion is out, and the cap is $65, the Flyers can still ice the following roster--basically, everyone by Jagr, who I'm not sure I want back anyway.

FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jakub Voracek ($3.250m)
James Van Riemsdyk ($4.250m) / Danny Briere ($6.500m) / Wayne Simmonds ($1.750m)
Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Eric Wellwood ($0.580m) / Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Zac Rinaldo ($0.544m)
Jody Shelley ($1.100m) /

DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Braydon Coburn ($4.500m)
Matt Carle ($4.500m) / Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Marc-Andre Bourdon ($0.875m)
Andreas Lilja ($0.738m) /

GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.667m)
Sergei Bobrovsky ($1.750m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $70,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,921,944; BONUSES: $3,555,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $5,378,056

Like I said, the Flyers really don't have any cap issues to speak of. This doesn't even include obvious cost-cutting measures--dumping Shelley, trading Bobrovsky and signing a $1 million backup, etc.

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Old
06-14-2012, 07:51 PM
  #356
jonrazor12
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If clb traded Nash to phi, the return would need to at least be....

Schenn or Couturier
JVR
2012 1st


.....anything less would not be worth it.

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Old
06-14-2012, 07:54 PM
  #357
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonrazor12 View Post
If clb traded Nash to phi, the return would need to at least be....

Schenn or Couturier
JVR
2012 1st


.....anything less would not be worth it.
I don't even want Nash in the first place with that cap hit and for that price hell no.

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Old
06-14-2012, 08:14 PM
  #358
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Originally Posted by cheesesteak View Post
I don't even want Nash in the first place with that cap hit and for that price hell no.
I agree with you. I don't think phi and clb make good trading partners. Phi has no reason to trade for Nash. They have all the offense in the world. If they wanted to trade JVR, it should be for a top ten pick or a solid d prospect with equal potential.

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Old
06-14-2012, 08:33 PM
  #359
Giroux tha Damaja
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonrazor12 View Post
If clb traded Nash to phi, the return would need to at least be....

Schenn or Couturier
JVR
2012 1st


.....anything less would not be worth it.
Nash wants out. Where is Poile's leverage to get that kind of price?

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Old
06-14-2012, 08:41 PM
  #360
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giroux tha Damaja View Post
Nash wants out. Where is Poile's leverage to get that kind of price?
He is not demanding a trade. He said he would agree to a trade if Poile could make it mutual beneficial. Clb will be a better team next year, especially if they can get some decent goaltending. You don't trade Nash for spare parts for the sake of trading him. Nash has the talent to be a top ten winger in the league. Guys like him don't come around often. He will not be traded unless there is significant pieces coming back.

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Old
06-14-2012, 08:48 PM
  #361
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonrazor12 View Post
He is not demanding a trade. He said he would agree to a trade if Poile could make it mutual beneficial. Clb will be a better team next year, especially if they can get some decent goaltending. You don't trade Nash for spare parts for the sake of trading him. Nash has the talent to be a top ten winger in the league. Guys like him don't come around often. He will not be traded unless there is significant pieces coming back.
This sounds like someone trying to put a nice spin on Rick Nash asking for a trade. If it were up to me (which of course it isn't), I wouldn't be willing to part with more than two of the three assets you asked for, unless one of them was the first, in which case I might throw in another pick. That's just my opinion, and I'm not saying you'd be nuts to ask for more. The Flyers certainly have needs, but they just don't have a need for Nash's skills at that price and salary. Surely there would be other interested teams. Toronto maybe.

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Old
06-14-2012, 08:49 PM
  #362
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giroux tha Damaja View Post
Nash wants out.
Wrong. "Willing" is not the same as "eager".

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Old
06-14-2012, 08:58 PM
  #363
jonrazor12
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Originally Posted by Giroux tha Damaja View Post
This sounds like someone trying to put a nice spin on Rick Nash asking for a trade. If it were up to me (which of course it isn't), I wouldn't be willing to part with more than two of the three assets you asked for, unless one of them was the first, in which case I might throw in another pick. That's just my opinion, and I'm not saying you'd be nuts to ask for more. The Flyers certainly have needs, but they just don't have a need for Nash's skills at that price and salary. Surely there would be other interested teams. Toronto maybe.

Like I said earlier, phi does not need Nash.

Im not saying they would give up that package for Nash. I'm saying clb will not take less.

I actually see only a handful of teams being solid trading partners with clb for Nash.

STL, OTT, and NYI. TOR could be a fit but they need a center first. But it Burke so who knows.

The first three teams have the assets to acquire someone like Nash without gutting their current squad.

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Old
06-14-2012, 09:13 PM
  #364
Giroux tha Damaja
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
Wrong. "Willing" is not the same as "eager".
Didn't Howson have a press conference after the trade deadline where he came right out and said "Rick Nash asked for a trade". That's pretty cut and dried, unless I'm delusional?

EDIT: "He approached us and asked us to consider trading him." - Scott Howson

That was right after the trade deadline. Dude asked for a trade. Like I said, Nash wants out. You can sugar coat it with gentle language all you want, but it's crystal clear. You don't risk going to your boss suggesting a change a scenery unless your mind is made up. And Howson certainly doesn't want someone playing for him who's heart is clearly not in Columbus anymore. Any other perspective than this just seems like willful denial. Howson can dress it up as diplomatically an tactfully as he wants, it is what it is.


Last edited by Giroux tha Damaja: 06-14-2012 at 09:20 PM.
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Old
06-14-2012, 09:18 PM
  #365
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JVR does NOT need hip surgery "cue the trade rumors"

Dreger reports that JVR does not need hip surgery (Eskin must be full of it) and will be ready for training camp.

Does this increase his value?

Trade coming to CBJ?


Also:

Aaron Portzline, a writer for CBJ stated the following on twitter:

http://cl.ly/3N0M2M411l0Q0F0F1D1c/Sc...11.23%20PM.png

Aaron Portzline ‏@Aportzline
Many have asked about #CBJ - #Flyers rumors. Could Nash be traded to Philly? Absolutely. Could/would James VanRiemsdyk be part of return?

Aaron Portzline ‏@Aportzline
Absolutely. But was told earlier this week - and TSN confirmed it tonight - that Van Riemsdyk was NOT delaying surgery to avoid being traded



Okay, so if a writer for CBJ is being told anything by a source regarding JVR of the Flyers not holding up a trade to the CBJ because of a surgery, doesn't that sort of indicate that there is something there linking CBJ and JVR?

Why else would he be told that JVR isn't delaying a trade to the Blue Jackets...


Interesting, I think.


Last edited by Frodo Baggins: 06-14-2012 at 10:18 PM. Reason: More information
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Old
06-14-2012, 09:19 PM
  #366
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For the love of God, I hope Nash is moved soon. It's starting to feel like Kaberle 2.0.

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06-14-2012, 09:22 PM
  #367
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For the love of God, I hope Nash is moved soon. It's starting to feel like Kaberle 2.0.
Aye, such is the nature of these boards, no?

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06-14-2012, 09:22 PM
  #368
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Originally Posted by Rivet52 View Post
For the love of God, I hope Nash is moved soon. It's starting to feel like Kaberle 2.0.
1 week to go.

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Old
06-14-2012, 09:23 PM
  #369
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Originally Posted by Rivet52 View Post
For the love of God, I hope Nash is moved soon. It's starting to feel like Kaberle 2.0.
Nah feels nothing like that

Kaberle drama dragged on for many years/trade deadlines

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06-14-2012, 09:25 PM
  #370
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So his hip just... magically got better? Just in time for July 1st?

I see what you did there, Holmgren.

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Old
06-14-2012, 09:26 PM
  #371
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Originally Posted by Gagne Come Back View Post
So his hip just... magically got better? Just in time for July 1st?

I see what you did there, Holmgren.
The gm would make sure the trade is pending physical. I'm not sure if all trades are pending physical as it is anyways.

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Old
06-14-2012, 09:28 PM
  #372
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Eskin full of it?

you don't say.

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Old
06-14-2012, 09:28 PM
  #373
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Nah feels nothing like that

Kaberle drama dragged on for many years/trade deadlines
That's true. Man, I remember all that. What was it, like three years and at least two deadlines and offseasons?

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Old
06-14-2012, 09:31 PM
  #374
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Nah feels nothing like that

Kaberle drama dragged on for many years/trade deadlines
And Nash is much more valuable and younger than Kaberle at this point.

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Old
06-14-2012, 09:44 PM
  #375
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Jvr for lou... Give Briz some under the table $ to go and play in KHL. Free up his cap hit if he goes I believe.

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