HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Philadelphia Flyers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Offseason Thread 2012 II: Offseason Harder

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-16-2012, 11:14 AM
  #301
Jack de la Hoya
Registered User
 
Jack de la Hoya's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Texas
Country: United States
Posts: 13,761
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
I'd rather deal JVR for Kane instead of Schenn or Cooter.
So would I, but Winnipeg would almost certainly pass.

Jack de la Hoya is online now  
Old
06-16-2012, 11:34 AM
  #302
RespectTheCouts
He Eats Souls
 
RespectTheCouts's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 5,126
vCash: 500
The offense is fine, more than fine the Flyers need to build up the D corps, I say eff it and gun for Weber, Suter is fools gold, landing Weber should be the #1 thing Homer is trying to figure out, everyone is on the table minus Giroux for me

RespectTheCouts is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 11:43 AM
  #303
DrinkFightFlyers
Grave Before Shave
 
DrinkFightFlyers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,866
vCash: 50
Send a message via AIM to DrinkFightFlyers
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
So would I, but Winnipeg would almost certainly pass.
Yeah, I think I would pass on a deal for Kane. If we can keep Cooter and Schenn and somehow come away with Nash, that would be good for me. If we have to give up one of those two I don't think I would deal for a forward. Now for Weber...

Quote:
Originally Posted by RespectTheMajor View Post
The offense is fine, more than fine the Flyers need to build up the D corps, I say eff it and gun for Weber, Suter is fools gold, landing Weber should be the #1 thing Homer is trying to figure out, everyone is on the table minus Giroux for me
I agree. Hopefully he's burning the midnight oil talking to Poile and offering him anything/everything we have to offer. Plus Jody Shelley.

DrinkFightFlyers is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 11:47 AM
  #304
Flyotes
DownieFaceSoftener
 
Flyotes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 5,113
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
The Rangers (fans) have been trying to peddle Dubinksy, Anisimov, Christian Thomas and J. T. Miller / or Tim Erixon for six months.

If I'm Columbus, that's a pretty easy pass.
If this is true Howson should be insulted.

Flyotes is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 11:50 AM
  #305
kudymen
4, 15, 38 and 63
 
kudymen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Atlanta (Decatur)
Country: Czech_ Republic
Posts: 3,304
vCash: 500


I wasn't sure where to put it but I thought some of you would love this picture (although there are 2 Pens in it ). I found it today on facebook, one of the most awesome pics I've seen in a while.

kudymen is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 11:57 AM
  #306
Krishna
Registered User
 
Krishna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Country: Canada
Posts: 82,085
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
Again, I don't necessarily think that's exhorbitant as a negotiating position.

The Rangers (fans) have been trying to peddle Dubinksy, Anisimov, Christian Thomas and J. T. Miller / or Tim Erixon for six months.

If I'm Columbus, that's a pretty easy pass.

It depends on their definition of "quality" player.

If that is true, though, it suggests Columbus will not accept draft picks instead of prospects. That would put us out of the Nash sweepstakes--for better or worse. Our prospect pool simply can't compete with most of the other suitors--all the good young players are already in the NHL.
Dubinsky is on a contract similar to JVR but with out all of the potential.. 4.2m for 34 points is terrible..

Anisimov has been well below expectations..

Thomas and Miller I don't know much about

Columbus probably doesn't want Erixon to pull the crap that he did in Calgary

Krishna is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 12:11 PM
  #307
DrinkFightFlyers
Grave Before Shave
 
DrinkFightFlyers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,866
vCash: 50
Send a message via AIM to DrinkFightFlyers
Quote:
Originally Posted by kudymen View Post


I wasn't sure where to put it but I thought some of you would love this picture (although there are 2 Pens in it ). I found it today on facebook, one of the most awesome pics I've seen in a while.
Bure, Gretzky, Selanne, Jagr, Lemiuex, Lindross, and I'm guessing his dad?

DrinkFightFlyers is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 12:12 PM
  #308
Jack de la Hoya
Registered User
 
Jack de la Hoya's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Texas
Country: United States
Posts: 13,761
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
Bure, Gretzky, Selanne, Jagr, Lemiuex, Lindross, and I'm guessing his dad?
It's Kariya, not Selanne--and I'm fairly certain that's Gordie Howe, no?

(The picture quality isn't very good, and my screen is a bit small...)

Jack de la Hoya is online now  
Old
06-16-2012, 12:13 PM
  #309
Flyotes
DownieFaceSoftener
 
Flyotes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 5,113
vCash: 500
Looks like Howe.

Flyotes is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 12:18 PM
  #310
kudymen
4, 15, 38 and 63
 
kudymen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Atlanta (Decatur)
Country: Czech_ Republic
Posts: 3,304
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
Bure, Gretzky, Selanne, Jagr, Lemiuex, Lindross, and I'm guessing his dad?
Jeh82 and DownieFaceSoftener are right, it's Gordie Howe. Too much awesome for one pic.

Edit - And yup on Kariya as well. Although they were twins with Teemu in their Anaheim days

kudymen is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 12:21 PM
  #311
DrinkFightFlyers
Grave Before Shave
 
DrinkFightFlyers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,866
vCash: 50
Send a message via AIM to DrinkFightFlyers
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
It's Kariya, not Selanne--and I'm fairly certain that's Gordie Howe, no?

(The picture quality isn't very good, and my screen is a bit small...)
Quote:
Originally Posted by DownieFaceSoftener View Post
Looks like Howe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kudymen View Post
Jeh82 and DownieFaceSoftener are right, it's Gordie Howe. Too much awesome for one pic.

Edit - And yup on Kariya as well. Although they were twins with Teemu in their Anaheim days
Howe it is, then! You guys sure that is Kariya? Gonna sound racist but he doesn't look Asian enough. That's why I went with Selanne.

DrinkFightFlyers is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 12:22 PM
  #312
Krishna
Registered User
 
Krishna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Country: Canada
Posts: 82,085
vCash: 500
Yeah, it's kariya.. It was up on ****** last week

Krishna is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 12:25 PM
  #313
Jack de la Hoya
Registered User
 
Jack de la Hoya's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Texas
Country: United States
Posts: 13,761
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
Howe it is, then! You guys sure that is Kariya? Gonna sound racist but he doesn't look Asian enough. That's why I went with Selanne.
...there's several things wrong with this post.

Jack de la Hoya is online now  
Old
06-16-2012, 12:29 PM
  #314
DrinkFightFlyers
Grave Before Shave
 
DrinkFightFlyers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,866
vCash: 50
Send a message via AIM to DrinkFightFlyers
Quote:
Originally Posted by Krishna View Post
Yeah, it's kariya.. It was up on ****** last week
Fair enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
...there's several things wrong with this post.
Several?

DrinkFightFlyers is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 12:34 PM
  #315
Jack de la Hoya
Registered User
 
Jack de la Hoya's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Texas
Country: United States
Posts: 13,761
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post

Several?
I've watched Teemu since he came into the league, and never has it occurred to me that he might be the least-bit Asian in his heritage...so suggesting that somehow he and Kariya were on a spectrum of "Asian-ness" was funny to me.

Anyway, it's a grainy (but awesome) picture--so the mistake is understandable.

Jack de la Hoya is online now  
Old
06-16-2012, 12:40 PM
  #316
DrinkFightFlyers
Grave Before Shave
 
DrinkFightFlyers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,866
vCash: 50
Send a message via AIM to DrinkFightFlyers
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
I've watched Teemu since he came into the league, and never has it occurred to me that he might be the least-bit Asian in his heritage...so suggesting that somehow he and Kariya were on a spectrum of "Asian-ness" was funny to me.

Anyway, it's a grainy (but awesome) picture--so the mistake is understandable.
No I was saying the guy in the picture didn't look Asian-enough to be Paul Kariya so I thought it was Selanne. Had nothing to do with Selanne looking Asian. The guy in the picture doesn't look Asian so I figured it was not Kariya. Haha.

DrinkFightFlyers is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 12:43 PM
  #317
GoneFullHextall
Fire Berube
 
GoneFullHextall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Somewhere in NH
Country: United States
Posts: 32,253
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kudymen View Post


I wasn't sure where to put it but I thought some of you would love this picture (although there are 2 Pens in it ). I found it today on facebook, one of the most awesome pics I've seen in a while.
that photo came from this tv ad for the NHL. "pond of dreams"


GoneFullHextall is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 01:23 PM
  #318
JABEE
Registered User
 
JABEE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 1,614
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
Bure, Gretzky, Selanne, Jagr, Lemiuex, Lindross, and I'm guessing his dad?
Mr Hockey

JABEE is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 01:58 PM
  #319
sobrien
RAFFLCOPTER
 
sobrien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: South Jersey
Country: United States
Posts: 6,868
vCash: 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
So would I, but Winnipeg would almost certainly pass.
I'm not sure. Neither have really met their potential yet. I'm not sure what Kane's ceiling is, but isn't JvR's offensive potential higher? Kane is a more complete player from what I know (much more physical) and doesn't have as bad of an injury history. I think JvR for Kane isn't too far off.

sobrien is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 02:10 PM
  #320
Jack de la Hoya
Registered User
 
Jack de la Hoya's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Texas
Country: United States
Posts: 13,761
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by sobrien View Post
I'm not sure. Neither have really met their potential yet. I'm not sure what Kane's ceiling is, but isn't JvR's offensive potential higher? Kane is a more complete player from what I know (much more physical) and doesn't have as bad of an injury history. I think JvR for Kane isn't too far off.
I think Kane's (offensive) potential is higher than JVR's--but I could see a case being made the other way.

Regardless, Kane has progressed further and accomplished more than JVR--while being 2 years younger.

Perhaps the circumstances surrounding his (potential) exist would balance out some of the difference, and perhaps JVR's being under contract for the next half decade would help--but I doubt it. They have other wings--Ladd, Wheeler, Little (natural wing), Burmistrov (natural wing). I think they would want a center back, all things being equal...

I think he's a better target than Nash, though. He's likely to come at least somewhat cheaper in assets, and he'd leave 4+ million more in cap space.

Jack de la Hoya is online now  
Old
06-16-2012, 02:37 PM
  #321
toughfighter83*
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 563
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
I think Kane's (offensive) potential is higher than JVR's--but I could see a case being made the other way.

Regardless, Kane has progressed further and accomplished more than JVR--while being 2 years younger.

Perhaps the circumstances surrounding his (potential) exist would balance out some of the difference, and perhaps JVR's being under contract for the next half decade would help--but I doubt it. They have other wings--Ladd, Wheeler, Little (natural wing), Burmistrov (natural wing). I think they would want a center back, all things being equal...

I think he's a better target than Nash, though. He's likely to come at least somewhat cheaper in assets, and he'd leave 4+ million more in cap space.

can you give me some comparson stats? i mean if kane is better than jvr, i doubt the flyers will be looking at him unless nash goes somewhere else because he's the player high on the flyers list as now.

toughfighter83* is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 02:49 PM
  #322
Jack de la Hoya
Registered User
 
Jack de la Hoya's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Texas
Country: United States
Posts: 13,761
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by toughfighter83 View Post
can you give me some comparson stats? i mean if kane is better than jvr, i doubt the flyers will be looking at him unless nash goes somewhere else because he's the player high on the flyers list as now.
Well, for starts:

Van Riemsdyk

Quote:
2009-10 Philadelphia Flyers NHL 78 15 20 35 30
2010-11 Philadelphia Flyers NHL 75 21 19 40 35
2011-12 Philadelphia Flyers NHL 43 11 13 24 24
Kane
Quote:
2009-10 Atlanta Thrashers NHL 66 14 12 26 62
2010-11 Atlanta Thrashers NHL 73 19 24 43 68
2011-12 Winnipeg Jets NHL 74 30 27 57 53
But that really only tells part of the story.

Remember that JVR took two full seasons two reach the NHL after being drafted in 2007, while Kane went straight into the NHL in 2009. In other words, this past season, when Kane potted 30, is the equivalent in terms of draft-development to JVR's rookie season, when he scored 15.

Of course players develop at different rates...and JVR's presumed "break-out" season was riddled with injuries. Still, Kane is hardly done developing either.

Jack de la Hoya is online now  
Old
06-16-2012, 02:52 PM
  #323
Giroux tha Damaja
Registered User
 
Giroux tha Damaja's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Mount Holly, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 9,231
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Giroux tha Damaja
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
Well, for starts:

Van Riemsdyk



Kane


But that really only tells part of the story.

Remember that JVR took two full seasons two reach the NHL after being drafted in 2007, while Kane went straight into the NHL in 2009. In other words, this past season, when Kane potted 30, is the equivalent in terms of draft-development to JVR's rookie season, when he scored 15.

Of course players develop at different rates...and JVR's presumed "break-out" season was riddled with injuries. Still, Kane is hardly done developing either.
Same age doesn't mean same point in development. They've had similar time against NHL competition.

Giroux tha Damaja is offline  
Old
06-16-2012, 03:00 PM
  #324
Jack de la Hoya
Registered User
 
Jack de la Hoya's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Texas
Country: United States
Posts: 13,761
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Giroux tha Damaja View Post
Same age doesn't mean same point in development. They've had similar time against NHL competition.
Age is not the same as development, but it isn't not completely independent either, right?

I'm not sure if I understand your point.

Jack de la Hoya is online now  
Old
06-16-2012, 03:19 PM
  #325
CS
Bryzgalov's Blueline
 
CS's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Lumberton, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 14,005
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
Age is not the same as development, but it isn't not completely independent either, right?

I'm not sure if I understand your point.
His point is that the factor of when a player breaks into the NHL is fairly overrated on HFBoards. (Then again, what isn't?)

The truth is that unless forwards are a rare breed, their development pattern in the NHL is normally as follows regardless of age as long as they are not like 24 or up when they first make the NHL. (There will obviously be exceptions, but I could definitely go and find many like cases for this. Remember I am discussing your average 1st round forward selection.)

Year 1: limited production, limited role
Year 3: much better production, second line role
Year 5: production as a true NHL vet, major role within organization

Age does not necessarily determine anything other than when the player is ready for the NHL. Normally they all go through the same process of adjusting to the size and speed of the game.

On top of that, JVR is a powerforward which is something that in general takes longer to develop because his game style is based on a foundation where he is bigger and stronger than his opponents.

CS is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:06 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.