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Luongo XI - Luoraker (Mod warning #432)

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Old
06-16-2012, 06:49 PM
  #76
y2kcanucks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SexyJoffreyLupul View Post
who the hell is your forth defensemen anyways? all i hear is how salo, ballard and gragnani are terrible. i'm pretty sure gunnars is better than salo and grangs as well.
Gragnani isn't anywhere near our top 4.

Salo is a right side defenseman, Gunnarsson is a left side defenseman. Our left side d-men in our top 6 are Hamhuis, Edler and Ballard. On the right side we have Bieksa, and Tanev. Salo is a UFA.

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Old
06-16-2012, 06:56 PM
  #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Gragnani isn't anywhere near our top 4.

Salo is a right side defenseman, Gunnarsson is a left side defenseman. Our left side d-men in our top 6 are Hamhuis, Edler and Ballard. On the right side we have Bieksa, and Tanev. Salo is a UFA.
keep playing tanev then, he looks promising

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06-16-2012, 06:57 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Does not address Vancouver's needs. Pointless to destroy our opportunity to trade away one of our two elite goalies for scraps without addressing our team needs.
Kulimen=Physical top 6er
Schenn= Youth+Toughness, righty, potentially shutdown(something we need)
1st=Greater prospect depth.

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06-16-2012, 06:59 PM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SexyJoffreyLupul View Post
keep playing tanev then, he looks promising
He does. Lol.

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06-16-2012, 07:00 PM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SexyJoffreyLupul View Post
keep playing tanev then, he looks promising
Tanev is a right side defenseman, Gunnarsson is a left side defenseman. What don't you understand?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Kulimen=Physical top 6er
Schenn= Youth+Toughness, righty, potentially shutdown(something we need)
1st=Greater prospect depth.
If Kulemin is in our top 6 we are ****ed. The guy scored SEVEN goals last year. He's not better than what we have and should be nowhere near our top 6.

Schenn is a young shutdown defenseman who had problems shutting down other teams third and fourth liners last year. He's not a good defenseman.

1st round pick in 2012 from Toronto is what my target is. With Luongo on the Leafs, they become a playoff team. Not willing to risk it.

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06-16-2012, 07:02 PM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SexyJoffreyLupul View Post
keep playing tanev then, he looks promising
Sarcasm? Cause he actually does look promising.

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06-16-2012, 07:05 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post


If Kulemin is in our top 6 we are ****ed. The guy scored SEVEN goals last year. He's not better than what we have and should be nowhere near our top 6.

Schenn is a young shutdown defenseman who had problems shutting down other teams third and fourth liners last year. He's not a good defenseman.

1st round pick in 2012 from Toronto is what my target is. With Luongo on the Leafs, they become a playoff team. Not willing to risk it.
Find a better offer for Luongo from a member of an opposite fanbase tht addresses our needs. If such a thing exists, I would gladly take it. Until then we can only speculate.

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06-16-2012, 07:06 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
If Kulemin is in our top 6 we are ****ed. The guy scored SEVEN goals last year. He's not better than what we have and should be nowhere near our top 6.
.
Kulemin had 30 goals the year before, so um, ya...You don't know what your talking about.

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06-16-2012, 07:09 PM
  #84
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Colborne + Ashton + 2013 1st now can we stop this arguing?

Leafs keep their top players and don't subtract from their roster. Also keep their top prospect and 5th overall pick

Canucks get the youth and size Gillis wants and a 1st round pick that shouldd be around 15-20th.

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06-16-2012, 07:10 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DPyro View Post
Kulemin had 30 goals the year before, so um, ya...You don't know what your talking about.
Umm yeah actually I do. Kulemin scored 30 goals with an unsustainable 17% shooting percentage. Unless you're telling me he's one of the greatest goal scorers of all time, that won't happen again.

He's more of a 15 goal scorer. Doesn't help us.

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06-16-2012, 07:10 PM
  #86
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The thing is we have absolutely no idea what the price is for Luongo. Gillis said himself he's looking for the right deal. If there's 5 teams willing to pay something good for him then I'd like to think he can fetch a 1st in the 5-10 range, along with a quality roster player. If there's only 2 teams that are interested then I wouldn't be surprised that he only gets a mid-late 1st, an okay prospect, and a tweener.

I like to fantasize too about the possibility of Schneider fetching the 2nd oa or a player like Nash caliber, but that's just speculation. He might not even be worth more than a mid 1st pick and a top 6 winger with a fat cap hit.


Personally I think Schneider can definitely get a top 3-7 pick, IMO.

Can't wait till this is over.

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06-16-2012, 07:11 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Find a better offer for Luongo from a member of an opposite fanbase tht addresses our needs. If such a thing exists, I would gladly take it. Until then we can only speculate.
Couldnt care less what other fan bases will offer for Luongo. And if all Gillis can get for him are scraps then we should move Schneider for something valuable.

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Old
06-16-2012, 07:12 PM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DPyro View Post
Kulemin had 30 goals the year before, so um, ya...You don't know what your talking about.
Great! We'll give u Raymond for Lupul then! Raymond has a better ppg average the last 3 years compared to Kulemin and he actually has a major excuse for his decline this year

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06-16-2012, 07:13 PM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DPyro View Post
Kulemin had 30 goals the year before, so um, ya...You don't know what your talking about.
He shot a flukey 17%

Kessel shoots 11%
Malkin shoots 13%
Kovalchuk shoots 12%

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06-16-2012, 07:16 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
This.

If we're getting crap offers for Luongo, let's just trade Schneider for an elite player.
You think GM's will give an elite player for a backup goalie?

Maybe if it's Nash.

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Old
06-16-2012, 07:19 PM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kershaw View Post
You think GM's will give an elite player for a backup goalie?

Maybe if it's Nash.
With what its reported Howson has been asking for Nash, there is no way Schneider is even close to enough.

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06-16-2012, 07:19 PM
  #92
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Maybe this has now reached thread 11 because there really isn't a good basis for a trade between Toronto and Vancouver for Luongo.

Vancouver already has a lot of depth. The need a player that can contribute now to fill a hole or a very good draft pick. Ideally one of those holes would be filled by a big top six scoring forward for the second line or a RH puck moving defenseman to pair with Elder.

The Leafs need their draft picks and upcoming young players as part of their rebuild. There isn't really a good match between what the Leafs are willing to give up and what Vancouver needs. Vancouver would only take a cap dump if the cap dump could contribute more than Luongo to the team, so significant other assets would need to be included or that player would need to be buried in the minors.

As far as Florida goes, it's been stated that Markstrom is going to be playing in the AHL next year. After that he could follow a similar development path to Schneider assuming that he does not have significant knee problems, particularly if Luongo only really intends to play 4 or 5 more seasons before retiring. Year 2 back-up to Luongo. Year 3 splitting starts. Year 4 starting the majority of games. A lot can happen in 4 years.

Also, for those that think having a Luongo/Schneider tandem would be the worse thing in the world next season, Boston were in a very similar situation with Rask/Thomas when Rask had supplanted Thomas from the starter's role a couple of seasons back. Seemed to work out ok for them.

If there's no market for Luongo, you move Schneider, if it will get you that big piece you need to add to a team to have a chance to win now. I rather move Schneider in a deal along with other assets to land someone like Nash who would be a huge addition to Vancouver's top 6 than to pick up a 2/3 liner or a bottom pairing defenseman for next season along with prospects that will not contribute immediately.

Finally, adding a #1 goaltender would make Toronto a more attractive team for certain free agents looking to compete now. Perhaps this isn't the off-season where this would have a big affect, but I'm sure the would have had a better shot at someone like Richards last season if they had a goaltender like Luongo, or perhaps someone like Getzlaf next year if he becomes a UFA.

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Old
06-16-2012, 07:21 PM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Couldnt care less what other fan bases will offer for Luongo. And if all Gillis can get for him are scraps then we should move Schneider for something valuable.
Well seeing as we can only speculate this among ourselves and leaf fans, then there's no real point in posting here if you don't care about their opinion. Sorry for sounding rude.

As for Kulimen, he's not a 30 goal scorer or a 7 goal scorer. He's a 15-20 goal scorer and adds much needed physicality to our roster. He fills a need. He may not be Rick Nash, but...

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06-16-2012, 07:29 PM
  #94
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If Leafs traded Kulemin to Vancouver, he would be one of the hardest working players on your team. Last season was an aberration and not the norm. A lot of things affected his confidence and he never really got it back. If you look at Macarthur's numbers, you'll see he had the same number of goals but his assists were down. Which means he set Kulemin up for a lot of goals. Kulemins shooting % would be between 13-15% and every year the quality of his shots has increased. He is good for 20-25 goals a year.

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06-16-2012, 07:34 PM
  #95
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i do not want to trade luongo unless we get something that helps us next year. in my opinion, only toronto has real interest in luongo which may be a problem. if toronto was the only team that was willing to take luongo and the canucks had to trade him, leafs could take the price down to a 7th. the thing is that the canucks do not have to trade luongo and can trade schneider, thus increasing the value of luongo even if only 1 team is interested.

i propose schneider + booth + raymond + 1st for Nash + 2nd. i will be much happier with this than trading luongo for scraps. also toronto is getting on my nerves with these threads (i know not all of you are bad) and it would be nice to see a few more years of a lottery TML team.

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06-16-2012, 07:35 PM
  #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DPyro View Post
If Leafs traded Kulemin to Vancouver, he would be one of the hardest working players on your team. Last season was an aberration and not the norm.
Kulemin is a good player but he's a tweener at best on a contender.

You have to realize Vancouver is a very good team, most Leafs would be slotted down a line or so.

Lupul -> 2nd line
Phaneuf -> 2nd pairing, #3/4 d-man
Grabovski -> 3rd line

Although some fans have unrealistic expectations for Luongo what we really need is an impact player for Kesler's wing or a RD.

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06-16-2012, 07:42 PM
  #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DPyro View Post
If Leafs traded Kulemin to Vancouver, he would be one of the hardest working players on your team. Last season was an aberration and not the norm. A lot of things affected his confidence and he never really got it back. If you look at Macarthur's numbers, you'll see he had the same number of goals but his assists were down. Which means he set Kulemin up for a lot of goals. Kulemins shooting % would be between 13-15% and every year the quality of his shots has increased. He is good for 20-25 goals a year.
So Kulemin is apparently on par with Stamkos in terms of shooting percentage? Apparently he's better than Kovalchuk? Not likely.

If we get Kulemin for Luongo its a massive massive failure on Gillis's part

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06-16-2012, 07:50 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Tanev is a right side defenseman, Gunnarsson is a left side defenseman. What don't you understand?



If Kulemin is in our top 6 we are ****ed. The guy scored SEVEN goals last year. He's not better than what we have and should be nowhere near our top 6.

Schenn is a young shutdown defenseman who had problems shutting down other teams third and fourth liners last year. He's not a good defenseman.

1st round pick in 2012 from Toronto is what my target is. With Luongo on the Leafs, they become a playoff team. Not willing to risk it.
Your eyes are crossed if that's your target.

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Old
06-16-2012, 07:57 PM
  #99
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The thread titles amuse me.

Still wouldn't be shocked if Schneider is actually dealt.

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06-16-2012, 07:58 PM
  #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jayball75 View Post
Your eyes are crossed if that's your target.
Nope. Just not willing to just give away an elite goalie to the Leafs for scraps.

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