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Old
06-16-2012, 11:03 AM
  #51
GoHardSports
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrLegend28 View Post
some could argue Tommy John is good for a pitcher. They take a tendon which is stronger, from your thigh and attached it to your elbow essentially making it stronger than before.

Strasburg has TJ his 1st season in the bigs and now he is top 5 SP's in the game.
This. Some pitchers have even come back from TJ surgery throwing harder than before the surgery. And Jason Frasor is one pitcher I know that has had 2 Tommy Johns and is still pretty good.

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Old
06-16-2012, 11:27 AM
  #52
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You basically have to use Villaneuva as a starter now. He's their best potential starter they have that's ready. So Cecil, Villaneuva and who? I don't think any of their other potential starters can do the job.

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Old
06-16-2012, 11:50 AM
  #53
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Perhaps Jenkins and Carreno are thrown into the ring and possibly even McGuire (Despite his poor season so far)

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Old
06-16-2012, 12:00 PM
  #54
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Maybe Scott Richmond?

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Old
06-16-2012, 12:02 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shaner89 View Post
Drabeks career is over

Tommy John surgery to be had

This organization is ****ed. McGowan, Drabek, santos, who's next to end there career
Drabek's career is not over even if he has to have TJ. And since when was Santos even in this discussion?

C'mon, it's like you purposely say the most outrageously panicky things possible to generate responses.

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06-16-2012, 12:04 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TorontoMarleauLeafs View Post
Drabek's career isnt over. Lots of pitchers undergo Tommy John and come back to have great careers. There have even been reports that players sometimes come back with better velocity than before their injury. Frasor has had 2 Tommy John's and look at how long his career has been going.

McGowan and Santos have had a ton of setbacks, but neither have called it quits. Especially Santos, why the hell would he retire now? You're just being pessimistic.
Yes, a lots of pitchers come back better after TJ but after a 2nd one, the success rate declines by quite a bit. His career isn't over but you have to wonder if he can be a starter now (assuming he even has a TJ which isn't a sure thing right now).

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrLegend28 View Post
some could argue Tommy John is
good for a pitcher. They take a tendon which is stronger, from your thigh and attached it to your elbow essentially making it stronger than before.

Strasburg has TJ his 1st season in the bigs and now he is top 5 SP's in the game.
One is good, two is bad.

Strasburg isn't a great example either as he didn't have two and he was pitching just as well before the injury.

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Old
06-16-2012, 12:16 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by TorontoMarleauLeafs View Post
Maybe Scott Richmond?
Please no. He's terrible.

I'd rather use Carreno. Even though they likely see him as a reliever.

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Old
06-16-2012, 12:20 PM
  #58
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Javier Avendano came out of the Pen last night for Vancouver. I thought he was going down to get converted to a starter?

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Old
06-16-2012, 02:03 PM
  #59
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ESPN bit about the injuries

http://espn.go.com/blog/sweetspot/po...-for-blue-jays

edit: injuries to the pitching staff. Should've been clearer.


Last edited by The Nemesis: 06-16-2012 at 03:32 PM.
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Old
06-16-2012, 02:06 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcollins View Post
Javier Avendano came out of the Pen last night for Vancouver. I thought he was going down to get converted to a starter?
He still might. They may need to stretch him out a bit though.

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06-16-2012, 04:00 PM
  #61
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http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/yan...-future-yankee

Kid's in the majors for less than half a season and the New York Yankees-centric media is already salivating over the "inevitable" acquistion of Bryce Harper by the Yankees. and people wonder why there's so much dislike for the Yanks (and no, it's not "jealousy")

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06-16-2012, 04:06 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Nemesis View Post


http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/yan...-future-yankee

Kid's in the majors for less than half a season and the New York Yankees-centric media is already salivating over the "inevitable" acquistion of Bryce Harper by the Yankees. and people wonder why there's so much dislike for the Yanks (and no, it's not "jealousy")
Just like it was inevitable that Joey Votto would become a BlueJay once he hit Free Agency. Good grief, dream on New York.

---------------------

I know it was only a few days ago but does anyone know if Stilson has made an appearance for NH?

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Old
06-16-2012, 04:16 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Tootoo Train View Post
Just like it was inevitable that Joey Votto would become a BlueJay once he hit Free Agency. Good grief, dream on New York.

---------------------

I know it was only a few days ago but does anyone know if Stilson has made an appearance for NH?
Not yet but he'll start soon in NH. He just got promoted.

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Old
06-16-2012, 04:33 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodman19 View Post
Perhaps Jenkins and Carreno are thrown into the ring and possibly even McGuire (Despite his poor season so far)
Carreno is pitching pretty poorly as well this year if I'm thinking of the right guy. Same with Jenkins come to think of it.

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Old
06-16-2012, 04:35 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by TorontoMarleauLeafs View Post
Maybe Scott Richmond?
I'd rather watch McCoy start then see Richmond up with the jays

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Old
06-16-2012, 04:41 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Nemesis View Post


http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/yan...-future-yankee

Kid's in the majors for less than half a season and the New York Yankees-centric media is already salivating over the "inevitable" acquistion of Bryce Harper by the Yankees. and people wonder why there's so much dislike for the Yanks (and no, it's not "jealousy")
By 2018. Good god. Taking about jumping the gun.

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Old
06-16-2012, 05:32 PM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Nemesis View Post


http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/yan...-future-yankee

Kid's in the majors for less than half a season and the New York Yankees-centric media is already salivating over the "inevitable" acquistion of Bryce Harper by the Yankees. and people wonder why there's so much dislike for the Yanks (and no, it's not "jealousy")


Just so stupid.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nasty Nazem View Post
Not yet but he'll start soon in NH. He just got promoted.
He starts tonight in NH.

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Old
06-16-2012, 05:49 PM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tootoo Train View Post
Just like it was inevitable that Joey Votto would become a BlueJay once he hit Free Agency. Good grief, dream on New York.

---------------------

I know it was only a few days ago but does anyone know if Stilson has made an appearance for NH?
He's starting tonight.

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Old
06-16-2012, 06:10 PM
  #69
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Speaking of the Yankees and Nats, the Nats got totally robbed. Tyler Moore slid in and was clearly safe at the plate, but was called out.

http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?co...38673&c_id=mlb

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Old
06-16-2012, 06:18 PM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swervin81 View Post
Speaking of the Yankees and Nats, the Nats got totally robbed. Tyler Moore slid in and was clearly safe at the plate, but was called out.

http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?co...38673&c_id=mlb
the first angle made it look tough. But the replay showed he was safe my by a mile

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Old
06-16-2012, 06:21 PM
  #71
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Well, beyond trading for a starter, anyone think Livan Hernandez is now destined to be a Jay? Veteran innings eater, even if just to protect from calling up a kid before he's ready?

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Old
06-16-2012, 06:42 PM
  #72
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Well, beyond trading for a starter, anyone think Livan Hernandez is now destined to be a Jay? Veteran innings eater, even if just to protect from calling up a kid before he's ready?
I liked Hernandez back in the day, but he's pretty awful now. ERA 20-25% higher than the league average for most of the last 5-6 years, WHIP usually in the 1.4 to 1.5 range, he's not a strikeout pitcher (never was really, but it's gotten worse) so a BB/K ratio that's 2ish or less isn't all that great, his fastball velocity has plummeted down to the low 80s, he's got no separation anymore between it and his change (5-7 MPH now, as his change velocity has remained fairly constant) and all of his pitches' effectiveness has dipped to either barely average (his slider) or below average. Browsing Fangraphs, his Pitch Values put him down in the Crawford/Corderpo/Igarashi tier, aka the "omg why is he in the game?" tier. Also he's only pitched 200 innings once in the last 5 years (counting this year, where he's not on pace for even 100 innings)

and since some people are allergic to hard data and basic math, just qualitatively I'll say that Hernandez is a shell of his former self. He's worn out and doesn't have the stuff anymore to get guys out on a consistent basis. Yeah he'll eat up innings maybe. Whether or not those innings are even worthwhile is another matter entirely.


and don't get me wrong, I used to love Hernandez. It may be a stupid reason, but on of my first full-time baseball games was All-Star Baseball 99 on the N64 and I had a killer rotation of essentially B-list star pitchers. Hernandez, Kevin Appier, the late Darryl Kile. Since then I've always had a soft spot for Hernandez and how effective he could be without necessarily being a lights-out starter.

also FWIW he'll have more value in the NL where the fact that he's got a half-decent bat for a pitcher actually means something.

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Old
06-16-2012, 06:51 PM
  #73
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Just so stupid.



He starts tonight in NH.
I think they can be pretty aggressive with Stilson.
He's gonna be 22 this season and is a college arm. Alvarez pitched around 95 innings last year between Dunedin and NH so I wouldnt be shocked one bit if Stilson is a september callup.

He's been solid so far in his debut at NH

4innings pitched
3 hits
0 runs
0 walks
1 striekout

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Old
06-16-2012, 07:19 PM
  #74
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I think they can be pretty aggressive with Stilson.
He's gonna be 22 this season and is a college arm. Alvarez pitched around 95 innings last year between Dunedin and NH so I wouldnt be shocked one bit if Stilson is a september callup.

He's been solid so far in his debut at NH

4innings pitched
3 hits
0 runs
0 walks
1 striekout
Finished 5ip, 3 hits, 0 runs, 2 K's

Really good first start

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Old
06-16-2012, 07:29 PM
  #75
Everlong
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Finished 5ip, 3 hits, 0 runs, 2 K's

Really good first start
That's awesome. Very interested in his progression.

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