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Old
06-17-2012, 01:50 AM
  #26
Reimer
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You're comparing driving ability and comic books to being a raging psychopath capable of killing three coworkers. I can only shake my head at that.

I know many people my own age, including myself, whose maturity level far exceeds what is "expected" at the age of 21. Don't kid yourself. Age is just a number at this point.

The fact that you are insistent on blaming his age for this tragedy is nothing but a display of shameful ignorance. Look at statistics over time. Older people are just as capable of committing the same atrocities.
I think you're completely missing his point. He's not saying it's the sole factor. You are taking too much of an exception because you are 21 and feel you are mature beyond your years. The point Replacement is trying to make is that I'm sure we can both agree that even though you feel you are mature now we can probably agree that you will be even more mature 10-20 years from now.

I know a member of the EPS who started recruitment class at the age of 19, yes there are exceptions to every rule, but in this case maturity at a young age is the exception not the rule. A person shouldn't solely be turned away due to age but it should be one thing to trigger a further review of the applicant. For example lets say a 21 year old and a 35 year old tested exactly the same for a position with G4S, who do you think they are going to take? Likely the older candidate.

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06-17-2012, 02:54 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Reimer View Post
Well one consolation might be that the head of the Edmonton Max happens to be the father of one of the victims.


Also wanted to clear up some facts from what I know of this entire incident. Apparently the company's employees had complained about Travis for several incidents, one being what he had posted on social media websites and a few other work related incidents. Travis was set to be released from his position the next morning, however he still had access to his locker(vest, gun, etc.). Travis caught wind of this and apparently wasn't even scheduled to be on shift that night and thus caught the team even further off guard.

Travis also had a very heated argument with his mother that evening about money that he owed her for his truck. He left the house in a rage all pissed off that night and told her that he would get her money.

Not that it really matters to the overall case but Travis was caught with a lot of cash at the American border. This was after he had stopped and left random amounts of cash in friends mailboxes.

I see the Journals website says he was found with $330k in cash but I am told that the number isn't correct as I've stated above.
If all that is true then this entire incident is just messed up. There are no words.

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Last edited by Cloned: 06-17-2012 at 02:13 PM.
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Old
06-17-2012, 04:28 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Reimer View Post
I think you're completely missing his point. He's not saying it's the sole factor. You are taking too much of an exception because you are 21 and feel you are mature beyond your years. The point Replacement is trying to make is that I'm sure we can both agree that even though you feel you are mature now we can probably agree that you will be even more mature 10-20 years from now.

I know a member of the EPS who started recruitment class at the age of 19, yes there are exceptions to every rule, but in this case maturity at a young age is the exception not the rule. A person shouldn't solely be turned away due to age but it should be one thing to trigger a further review of the applicant. For example lets say a 21 year old and a 35 year old tested exactly the same for a position with G4S, who do you think they are going to take? Likely the older candidate.
I somehow doubt that a 35 year old in their prime working years is going to take an entry level security position.

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06-17-2012, 11:04 AM
  #29
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I somehow doubt that a 35 year old in their prime working years is going to take an entry level security position.
You'd be surprised, everyone in this world is at different stages of their lives/careers. If the guy worked in an entirely different profession and wanted to get into security he would have no choice.

Regardless that really didn't have much to do with what I posted.

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06-17-2012, 11:08 AM
  #30
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If all that is true then this entire incident is just messed up. There are no words.
Yes he was clearly a disturbed individual but that was already made evident by the posts to his social media accounts.

There is some joke article on the Suns website by a criminologist who claims this was all brought on bullying. Sounds like he is trying to come up with a defence for Travis to use in court and try to get off on the unstable and mentally ill crap.

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06-17-2012, 11:14 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reimer View Post
Also wanted to clear up some facts from what I know of this entire incident. Apparently the company's employees had complained about Travis for several incidents, one being what he had posted on social media websites and a few other work related incidents. Travis was set to be released from his position the next morning, however he still had access to his locker(vest, gun, etc.). Travis caught wind of this and apparently wasn't even scheduled to be on shift that night and thus caught the team even further off guard.

Travis also had a very heated argument with his mother that evening about money that he owed her for his truck. He left the house in a rage all pissed off that night and told her that he would get her money.
Do you have some insider information? I've combed through all of the news articles since the Hub shooting and have not heard about Travis being on the verge of getting fired.

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Old
06-17-2012, 11:19 AM
  #32
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Originally Posted by PACKY D ELEPHANT View Post
I somehow doubt that a 35 year old in their prime working years is going to take an entry level security position.
The point is its one thing to take an entry level position as a welder or junior accountant. But would you trust millions of dollars being handled everyday by a 21 year old with a sidearm? A guy who lived with his mom, got her help to buy a shiny new truck, and is obsessed with Gears of War?

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Old
06-17-2012, 11:38 AM
  #33
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Do you have some insider information? I've combed through all of the news articles since the Hub shooting and have not heard about Travis being on the verge of getting fired.
Yes all of the info that I've posted is coming from a member of the EPS.

It also saddens me to know more about the 4th victim. I'm really pulling for them and hope everything will be okay but it's not sounding good.

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Old
06-17-2012, 12:16 PM
  #34
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Any bass players in here? I'm looking at purchasing an ESP Viper 54 bass. It's had good reviews for the price range (~ $350). If anyone knows anything regarding this bass guitar or an alternate in the same price range, let me know either here or via PM please.

Thanks guys.

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Old
06-17-2012, 01:50 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by North Guy View Post
The point is its one thing to take an entry level position as a welder or junior accountant. But would you trust millions of dollars being handled everyday by a 21 year old with a sidearm? A guy who lived with his mom, got her help to buy a shiny new truck, and is obsessed with Gears of War?
My point is, is that that there was probably more 21 years olds for the position than 35 year olds

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06-17-2012, 04:14 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Reimer View Post
Well one consolation might be that the head of the Edmonton Max happens to be the father of one of the victims.


Also wanted to clear up some facts from what I know of this entire incident. Apparently the company's employees had complained about Travis for several incidents, one being what he had posted on social media websites and a few other work related incidents. Travis was set to be released from his position the next morning, however he still had access to his locker(vest, gun, etc.). Travis caught wind of this and apparently wasn't even scheduled to be on shift that night and thus caught the team even further off guard.

Travis also had a very heated argument with his mother that evening about money that he owed her for his truck. He left the house in a rage all pissed off that night and told her that he would get her money.

Not that it really matters to the overall case but Travis was caught with a lot of cash at the American border. This was after he had stopped and left random amounts of cash in friends mailboxes.

I see the Journals website says he was found with $330k in cash but I would think it's more than that.
Caught wind of him about to be fired? That is a major gaff in that type of work and that is why once a decision is made to remove an employee from any job they are usually escorted off the premises immediately.

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Old
06-17-2012, 04:26 PM
  #37
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Any good tuner shops in Edmonton? I'm looking for parts for 2008 Evo X?

Thx in advance.

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Old
06-17-2012, 05:29 PM
  #38
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Normally don't post videos of other comics anywhere but this was one of those moments where setting worked perfectly. My comedy partner Liam Creswick and I did a show at Happy Harbour Comics last month, nerdy humor + nerdy audience = an interestingly funny show


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Old
06-17-2012, 07:03 PM
  #39
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I consider myself a very liberal person, someone who likes to put their faith in people and believes that in potentially bad/vulnerable situations, the humanity and good morals (even if they're burried deep down) of others will shine through. I like to think at our core we are all good, reasonable human beings. But the case of this Baumgartner kid makes me think the death penalty would be appropriate, 21 or not. I dont know how one can believe this sort of individual can be rehabilitated.


Last edited by Philly85: 06-17-2012 at 07:11 PM.
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Old
06-17-2012, 07:10 PM
  #40
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Caught wind of him about to be fired? That is a major gaff in that type of work and that is why once a decision is made to remove an employee from any job they are usually escorted off the premises immediately.
Yeah I don't know how he caught wind of it, but I'm sure the plan would have been to axe him when he was to come onto shift the ensuing morning. However you're right, it should have been dealt with in a swifter manner I.e. Restricting access to his work locker. One things for sure is that I can bet that G4S will be changing their hiring and dismissal policies.

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Old
06-17-2012, 07:13 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Philly85 View Post
I consider myself a very liberal person, someone who likes to put their faith in people and believes that in potentially bad/vulnerable situations, the humanity and good morals (even if they're burried deep down) of others will shine through. I like to think at our core we are all good, reasonable human beings. But the case of this Baumgartner kid makes me think the death penalty would be appropriate, 21 or not. I dont know how one can believe this sort of individual can be rehabilitated.
Fair comment, clearly he didn't commit the act for the basis of stealing money. Just a first grade **** pump.

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06-17-2012, 10:04 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Reimer View Post
I think you're completely missing his point. He's not saying it's the sole factor. You are taking too much of an exception because you are 21 and feel you are mature beyond your years. The point Replacement is trying to make is that I'm sure we can both agree that even though you feel you are mature now we can probably agree that you will be even more mature 10-20 years from now.

I know a member of the EPS who started recruitment class at the age of 19, yes there are exceptions to every rule, but in this case maturity at a young age is the exception not the rule. A person shouldn't solely be turned away due to age but it should be one thing to trigger a further review of the applicant. For example lets say a 21 year old and a 35 year old tested exactly the same for a position with G4S, who do you think they are going to take? Likely the older candidate.
Again, I find this extremely offensive. I'm one of the youngest workers at my job site (There's one who's 20, and a couple who are 21-23), and I can do my job just as well as any of my older co-workers. Age is just a number in the real world.

As for the other information you're posting, is this true?

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Old
06-17-2012, 10:12 PM
  #43
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Again, I find this extremely offensive. I'm one of the youngest workers at my job site (There's one who's 20, and a couple who are 21-23), and I can do my job just as well as any of my older co-workers. Age is just a number in the real world.

As for the other information you're posting, is this true?
Like I said I don't know why you're taking such an exception to these words. Once you gain more life experience then maybe one day you will understand. Again nothing against you, like I said I have no doubt you are mature beyond your years but that is simply the exception not the rule.

In fact I've known many people who have gone to try out for the EPS and they've been turned away and told to "get some more life experience."

As for the other information yes it is 100% the truth.

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Old
06-17-2012, 10:50 PM
  #44
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This has nothing to do with age. The guy's a Psychopath, plain and simple. Age doesn't make a diffrence in mental disorders.

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06-17-2012, 11:30 PM
  #45
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This has nothing to do with age. The guy's a Psychopath, plain and simple. Age doesn't make a diffrence in mental disorders.
No, but most commonly is discovered/occurs in late teens and early 20s.

I can see revisiting the concurrent vs consecutive sentences debate, but I thought we closed the book on capital punishment.

Didn't happen with cops being killed at Mayerthorpe, why should it happen now?

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Old
06-18-2012, 12:34 AM
  #46
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This has nothing to do with age. The guy's a Psychopath, plain and simple. Age doesn't make a diffrence in mental disorders.
Believe what you wish - the evidence does not support your stance.

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06-18-2012, 01:45 AM
  #47
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Was at the U when this happened, heard the pops and all. Pretty messed up stuff.

Glad they picked him up at borders.

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Old
06-18-2012, 04:12 AM
  #48
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This has nothing to do with age. The guy's a Psychopath, plain and simple. Age doesn't make a diffrence in mental disorders.
Well, Psychopathy is not even a widely recognized mental disorder. It's very vaguely defined, and diagnosis is not sanctioned or often supported.

Terms like sociopath are often thrown on people with Anti-Social Personality Disorder, which are not diagnosed in younger children. They'll often be diagnosed with other personality disorders, and develop into "sociopaths" as they enter young adult status, if they are diagnosed at all.

Regardless, you don't have to be either to kill people in cold blood, especially with money involved (well, depending on how broad of an interpretation of sociopath you subscribe too).

Quote:
Originally Posted by dustrock View Post
No, but most commonly is discovered/occurs in late teens and early 20s.

I can see revisiting the concurrent vs consecutive sentences debate, but I thought we closed the book on capital punishment.

Didn't happen with cops being killed at Mayerthorpe, why should it happen now?
It's pretty clearly a no-go within our charter of rights and freedoms.

Thankfully.


Last edited by SK13: 06-18-2012 at 04:29 AM.
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Old
06-18-2012, 08:39 AM
  #49
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Well one consolation might be that the head of the Edmonton Max happens to be the father of one of the victims.


Also wanted to clear up some facts from what I know of this entire incident. Apparently the company's employees had complained about Travis for several incidents, one being what he had posted on social media websites and a few other work related incidents. Travis was set to be released from his position the next morning, however he still had access to his locker(vest, gun, etc.). Travis caught wind of this and apparently wasn't even scheduled to be on shift that night and thus caught the team even further off guard.

Travis also had a very heated argument with his mother that evening about money that he owed her for his truck. He left the house in a rage all pissed off that night and told her that he would get her money.

Not that it really matters to the overall case but Travis was caught with a lot of cash at the American border. This was after he had stopped and left random amounts of cash in friends mailboxes.

I see the Journals website says he was found with $330k in cash but I would think it's more than that.
That mother is going to end up with some major issues.

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Old
06-18-2012, 09:26 AM
  #50
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Not that I wan't to interrupt this debate but has anyone ever gone 'geocaching'?

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