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Old
06-17-2012, 01:29 AM
  #876
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Originally Posted by GKJ View Post
One of the reasons it's in decline is because he took on the third line center role.

He was never expected to be a point-per-game player, so getting an 80-point season out of his was a bonus.

Also, not sure how you dispute the numbers I used were wrong:

Is Mike Richards not behind Briere, Carter, and Giroux on this list? How is he 2nd among forwards when he wasn't even 2nd among centers?

http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_time_...9+11+13+15+17#


Did he not have the hardest QoC, with only Nodl and Versteeg on the plus-side?

http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_stati...2+13+14+15+16#


And he was the highest in 2009-10 in part because he started with Stevens and finished with Lavy, as Giroux had not moved far enough up the depth chart. They, again, needed him to take the tougher assignments and keep them away from Briere and Giroux. His zone starts were only better than that of the 4th line of Powe-Betts-Lappy. In 2010, Briere was being used as a winger, but eventually moved back over which bumped everyone else down (and then Carter got hurt late in the season). That's the year you can say the 2nd and 3rd lines were interchangeable because both Giroux and Richards had someone on their line who didn't belong there.
I was using a different source that disputed that so I could have been wrong. I always thought NHL.com's stat lines were accurate, but I don't know. They had him listed as what I said.

After Richard's two PPG seasons, I rarely saw anybody saying that it was a bonus. Most people expected him to hover right around that average for most of his career. In 2010, he was definitely used as the first line center and primary scoring line despite putting up average numbers compared to the previous seasons. In 2011 it changed. It was partly due to Giroux passing him on the depth chart, but it was also because his offensive game was in decline. I don't see how you can dispute that. He changed his role on the team, partly because it was a need, but also because he could no longer be counted on to be the go to go guy on offense. He was in a similar situation in LA this year, but nobody brings that up.

Actually, I just looked at that more in depth. The stat you have there is Time on Ice. That's different from Time on Ice average. It may still work out, but that's not what you were using in earlier posts.

2011
http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.h...ewName=summary

2010
http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.h...ewName=summary


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06-17-2012, 01:31 AM
  #877
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Coming out of the draft, Richards was never anticipated to be a top-line center. And with Primeau still around, and Forsberg eventually entering the fold, it wasn't needed.

In 08-09, Stevens wanted him to, but he also had to be, Briere got hurt.

And you were likely using nhl.com's total TOI per game, I was only using 5 v 5.

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06-17-2012, 01:51 AM
  #878
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Coming out of the draft, Richards was never anticipated to be a top-line center. And with Primeau still around, and Forsberg eventually entering the fold, it wasn't needed.

In 08-09, Stevens wanted him to, but he also had to be, Briere got hurt.

And you were likely using nhl.com's total TOI per game, I was only using 5 v 5.
Expectations change once you accomplish something. After he accomplished it for two seasons, it became what was he supposed to do on a yearly basis. If your capable of it, there's no reason not to maximize your potential.

Ah, you're right. That accounts for the difference because of the amount of time Richards spent on special teams. Regardless, his time didn't drop enough in 5v5 to justify a twenty point drop in production over the course of a season. I still believe his role changed as a result of his offensive game declining, not solely because he was asked to take on a more defensive-oriented game plan. I understand that he battled through injuries those years, but that could also be why his game has taken a step back in production. It also doesn't explain why he was used in a similar role in LA this year, because from what I heard, he was relatively healthy going into the playoffs after he recovered from his concussion.

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06-17-2012, 10:14 AM
  #879
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The trades were wake-up calls for both Richards and Carter IMO. They were starting to become a bit complacent. I think Snider was correct in saying he felt the team wasn't growing. They kind of peaked. The Boston debacle didn't help. Richards and Carter needed to move on and get out of their comfort zones and so did the Flyers (move on). The wake-up call worked obviously.....it was good for them to both get a kick in the rear and now they are better for it. Eventually so will the Flyers provided they make the next necessary steps...

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06-17-2012, 11:36 AM
  #880
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Expectations change once you accomplish something. After he accomplished it for two seasons, it became what was he supposed to do on a yearly basis. If your capable of it, there's no reason not to maximize your potential.
That's because people have stupid, unquantifiable expectations. Richards faced much harder competition because he was playing against top lines. Since he was able to after Briere came back. Richards' QoC and Corsi QoC both skyrocketed in 09-10 from 08-09. He wasn't put in a position to be an 80-point player.

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Ah, you're right. That accounts for the difference because of the amount of time Richards spent on special teams. Regardless, his time didn't drop enough in 5v5 to justify a twenty point drop in production over the course of a season. I still believe his role changed as a result of his offensive game declining, not solely because he was asked to take on a more defensive-oriented game plan. I understand that he battled through injuries those years, but that could also be why his game has taken a step back in production. It also doesn't explain why he was used in a similar role in LA this year, because from what I heard, he was relatively healthy going into the playoffs after he recovered from his concussion.
Ok, he had an 18 point drop from 2009 to 2010. I've already established that Richards had harder competition to shut down defensively since Briere returned to the lineup full time. He also had a 7-point drop in shorthanded points, going from 9 to 2, so there's a third of your total.

There was also the fact that the whole team on a whole had a bad season resulting in the coaching change. Contrary to the belief of some ignorant fools on here, the Flyers moved away from John Stevens Pond Hockey, because in 2010 only Arron Asham (!) had was over 2 ES P/60 in 09-10 (under Stevens we had 5 players who were over it, one of which was traded for Pronger, and Richards was just under 2 in spite of a career-best production).

The drop in production with the Kings wasn't a Richards thing, it was a Kings thing until they hired Sutter. Everyone's production was down, some only slightly (Kopitar, Williams), some dramatically (Richards, Gagne before getting hurt, Penner, Doughty, Stoll especially). There are reasons of course.

Then we have these:

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Originally Posted by Coutsiephan View Post
The trades were wake-up calls for both Richards and Carter IMO. They were starting to become a bit complacent. I think Snider was correct in saying he felt the team wasn't growing. They kind of peaked. The Boston debacle didn't help. Richards and Carter needed to move on and get out of their comfort zones and so did the Flyers (move on). The wake-up call worked obviously.....it was good for them to both get a kick in the rear and now they are better for it. Eventually so will the Flyers provided they make the next necessary steps...
...who refuse to acknowledge some of the injuries the team tried to play through, the year after the team lost in the Finals. And history shows that every team who are not the Gretzky Oilers or Crosby Penguins bounce back to miss the playoffs as often as they make it back to the 2nd round.

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06-17-2012, 05:19 PM
  #881
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Originally Posted by GKJ View Post
That's because people have stupid, unquantifiable expectations. Richards faced much harder competition because he was playing against top lines. Since he was able to after Briere came back. Richards' QoC and Corsi QoC both skyrocketed in 09-10 from 08-09. He wasn't put in a position to be an 80-point player.



Ok, he had an 18 point drop from 2009 to 2010. I've already established that Richards had harder competition to shut down defensively since Briere returned to the lineup full time. He also had a 7-point drop in shorthanded points, going from 9 to 2, so there's a third of your total.

There was also the fact that the whole team on a whole had a bad season resulting in the coaching change. Contrary to the belief of some ignorant fools on here, the Flyers moved away from John Stevens Pond Hockey, because in 2010 only Arron Asham (!) had was over 2 ES P/60 in 09-10 (under Stevens we had 5 players who were over it, one of which was traded for Pronger, and Richards was just under 2 in spite of a career-best production).

The drop in production with the Kings wasn't a Richards thing, it was a Kings thing until they hired Sutter. Everyone's production was down, some only slightly (Kopitar, Williams), some dramatically (Richards, Gagne before getting hurt, Penner, Doughty, Stoll especially). There are reasons of course.

Then we have these:



...who refuse to acknowledge some of the injuries the team tried to play through, the year after the team lost in the Finals. And history shows that every team who are not the Gretzky Oilers or Crosby Penguins bounce back to miss the playoffs as often as they make it back to the 2nd round.
god i hate your avatar. i love hextall but it aint right. that's another teams cup. damn. stop it.

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06-17-2012, 05:20 PM
  #882
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god i hate your avatar. i love hextall but it aint right. that's another teams cup. damn. stop it.
It's going to be OK.

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06-17-2012, 07:14 PM
  #883
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I'm going to offer my opinion as an unbiased poster who is a Flames/Flyers/Kings fan. Don't take anything I say as Flyer bashing or be offended.

As of right now the Flyers are the clear losers of both trades. Don't get me wrong the Flyers picked up a number of good solid young players and assets and it could pay off in the near future. However, both players were essential in the cup run. Don't try to tell me either that the carter trade was a huge win for the Flyers... he ended up scoring the game winning goal of the Stanley Cup playoffs so give him credit where it's due... he proved everyone wrong. At the end of the day the only thing that matters is winning the cup .

As for Richards and Carter having a "reduced role" in L.A. I wouldn't agree with that. Yes, they felt less pressure because of various reasons. However, out of their forward core I would rank only Kopitar and Brown ahead of Richards and Carter as far as importance in the playoffs. When the Flyers went on their playoff run Briere was still ahead of Richards as far as offensive output and Giroux stepped up as well so he was somewhere in the top 3 for forwards. Carter was injureId for much of the playoffs so hard to blame him for that. The point is they aren't in a reduced role they have almost the exact same role they did with the Flyers.

The main difference is this... L.A. had the best goalie in the league this year while the Flyers had AHL calibre goaltending during its run. And it sickens me to see some people saying "well Richards and Carter weren't ever going to win with the Flyers" when Richards helped lead a team without a goalie to game 6 of the cup finals. Did everyone forget "the shift" against the Canadiens or Richards stepping up with momentum changing hits to bring the Flyers back against the Bruins? Some people must have short term memory if they think neither of the two could be leaders here.

As for Laviolette implenting "dry island" I don't agree with doing that either. If drinking had become a problem and players were hungover at practice or missing meetings then the team obviously should have suspended the players and warned them not to do it again. I live in Calgary and friends always have stories about seeing Bourque/Glencross/Kipper/Cammaleri/Phaneuf... you name it... getting absolutely plastered at a club or bar after their game. Again, it's the Flyers media hyping something up that never really was an issue to begin with.

And if Richards and Laviolette didn't see eye to eye maybe they should have had a meeting where they try to come to a middle ground. Richards has said after leaving to L.A. that the system the Flyers played made it tough to play 82 games a season so no wonder the team looked burned out halfway through the season after a long playoff run. Sutter never had a problem getting Richards or Carter to buy in to his system.

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06-17-2012, 08:19 PM
  #884
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It's going to be OK.
it's getting a little old aint it? let me just keep it goin a little longer...a cha cha cha

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06-17-2012, 08:22 PM
  #885
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I'm going to offer my opinion as an unbiased poster who is a Flames/Flyers/Kings fan. Don't take anything I say as Flyer bashing or be offended.

As of right now the Flyers are the clear losers of both trades. Don't get me wrong the Flyers picked up a number of good solid young players and assets and it could pay off in the near future. However, both players were essential in the cup run. Don't try to tell me either that the carter trade was a huge win for the Flyers... he ended up scoring the game winning goal of the Stanley Cup playoffs so give him credit where it's due... he proved everyone wrong. At the end of the day the only thing that matters is winning the cup .

As for Richards and Carter having a "reduced role" in L.A. I wouldn't agree with that. Yes, they felt less pressure because of various reasons. However, out of their forward core I would rank only Kopitar and Brown ahead of Richards and Carter as far as importance in the playoffs. When the Flyers went on their playoff run Briere was still ahead of Richards as far as offensive output and Giroux stepped up as well so he was somewhere in the top 3 for forwards. Carter was injureId for much of the playoffs so hard to blame him for that. The point is they aren't in a reduced role they have almost the exact same role they did with the Flyers.

The main difference is this... L.A. had the best goalie in the league this year while the Flyers had AHL calibre goaltending during its run. And it sickens me to see some people saying "well Richards and Carter weren't ever going to win with the Flyers" when Richards helped lead a team without a goalie to game 6 of the cup finals. Did everyone forget "the shift" against the Canadiens or Richards stepping up with momentum changing hits to bring the Flyers back against the Bruins? Some people must have short term memory if they think neither of the two could be leaders here.

As for Laviolette implenting "dry island" I don't agree with doing that either. If drinking had become a problem and players were hungover at practice or missing meetings then the team obviously should have suspended the players and warned them not to do it again. I live in Calgary and friends always have stories about seeing Bourque/Glencross/Kipper/Cammaleri/Phaneuf... you name it... getting absolutely plastered at a club or bar after their game. Again, it's the Flyers media hyping something up that never really was an issue to begin with.

And if Richards and Laviolette didn't see eye to eye maybe they should have had a meeting where they try to come to a middle ground. Richards has said after leaving to L.A. that the system the Flyers played made it tough to play 82 games a season so no wonder the team looked burned out halfway through the season after a long playoff run. Sutter never had a problem getting Richards or Carter to buy in to his system.
no offense but we all realize this. thanks for rubbing this in for the 8 millionth, 7 hundred and sixty fifth thousandth, six hundred and 78th time.but your still the man.

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06-17-2012, 09:50 PM
  #886
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Originally Posted by thaman8765678 View Post
I'm going to offer my opinion as an unbiased poster who is a Flames/Flyers/Kings fan. Don't take anything I say as Flyer bashing or be offended.

As of right now the Flyers are the clear losers of both trades. Don't get me wrong the Flyers picked up a number of good solid young players and assets and it could pay off in the near future. However, both players were essential in the cup run. Don't try to tell me either that the carter trade was a huge win for the Flyers... he ended up scoring the game winning goal of the Stanley Cup playoffs so give him credit where it's due... he proved everyone wrong. At the end of the day the only thing that matters is winning the cup ..


Stopped reading right there. If Richie and Carter were here, they wouldn't have won jack with the beat up defense/goaltending. We lost nothing trading those two so far (still high scoring) and possibly removed a bad work environment for the rest of the team. I don't care if they win the Cup next year, too. We did great with those trades because the deciding factor in the playoffs, as usual, was LA's goalie and NOT Richie/Carter (although Carter gets credit from me for his appearance for once in the playoffs.).

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06-17-2012, 10:20 PM
  #887
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And if Richards and Laviolette didn't see eye to eye maybe they should have had a meeting where they try to come to a middle ground. Richards has said after leaving to L.A. that the system the Flyers played made it tough to play 82 games a season so no wonder the team looked burned out halfway through the season after a long playoff run. Sutter never had a problem getting Richards or Carter to buy in to his system.
They did, hence why their relationship was characterized as a work in progress. Having said this, Richards may have a point about Lavi's style to some extent. He's definitely a demanding coach but given how lousy Stevens was in that regard and how even the players admitted their conditioning sucked with Stevens as well as their preparation, it was obviously a good move by Holmgren to get rid of Stevens and salvage the season which almost netted them a cup. It was not unlike LA having to fire vanilla Murray and then catching fire and riding their MVP goalie all the way to a cup victory. In fact, for at least half a season Lavi had total buy in from everybody including Richards and Carter although Carter was injured at key times during Lavi's tenure including last year's playoffs.

Sutter's situation is similar to Lavi's. His style is demanding as well and a whole season of Sutter is pretty tough as well for players. At some point he might not have the same buy in as he did for the 49+ games he coached LA. In Lavis case he got a reset of sorts with all the new players but I have my concerns going forward....


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06-17-2012, 10:25 PM
  #888
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Then we have these:



...who refuse to acknowledge some of the injuries the team tried to play through, the year after the team lost in the Finals. And history shows that every team who are not the Gretzky Oilers or Crosby Penguins bounce back to miss the playoffs as often as they make it back to the 2nd round.
Nope, there is no refutation on my part. Well aware of the injuries and take them into consideration thus not sure where you've even deduced this unreasonableness you are claiming. What I disagree with is overstating the injuries...

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06-17-2012, 10:47 PM
  #889
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god i hate your avatar. i love hextall but it aint right. that's another teams cup. damn. stop it.
Sorry man. LA has been my favorite team out west for over 10 years, independent of half of the team being ex-Flyers, so I guess you're just going to have to deal with it.

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Nope, there is no refutation on my part. Well aware of the injuries and take them into consideration thus not sure where you've even deduced this unreasonableness you are claiming. What I disagree with is overstating the injuries...
Pronger missed the start of last season because of an injury and then got more back injuries on top of that later in the season. The affects of a long run the previous season pretty much always spills over into the following season, along with the general mental fatigue (Ken Hitchcock is a huge believer in that). I've been over it numerous times in many threads here and outside the forum. You're welcome to look up the results of teams who lose in the Finals the previous year (and some who won). For the Flyers to get to the 2nd round exceeds the expectations of the trend since 1984.

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06-17-2012, 11:43 PM
  #890
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Stopped reading right there. If Richie and Carter were here, they wouldn't have won jack with the beat up defense/goaltending. We lost nothing trading those two so far (still high scoring) and possibly removed a bad work environment for the rest of the team. I don't care if they win the Cup next year, too. We did great with those trades because the deciding factor in the playoffs, as usual, was LA's goalie and NOT Richie/Carter (although Carter gets credit from me for his appearance for once in the playoffs.).
So the Flyers lost nothing by trading them? That's interesting I'm sure they could have helped defensively when the team was letting in over 3 goals against per game in the playoffs. Both are known for their stellar two way play and penalty killing ablities so to say the team lost nothing is absurd.

The deciding factor was not LA's goalie. It was a combination of stellar goaltending mixed with Sutter's defensive system and every player buying into it. Hockey is a team game and one player does not win the cup (although one player may lose the cup for a team.... see Leighton). And both were huge when they needed to be. Richards set the tone early game 1 against the Canucks and Carter came up with some huge goals throughout the playoffs. You take away either of those two players and the Kings do not win the cup end of story.

You can act like they won't be missed all you want but the truth hurts. If both were in the lineup healthy for the Flyers it might have made a difference. Philly was missing a shut down line. That is why we were giving up 2 or 3 goals every game against the other teams top players. Maybe Simmonds/Schenn/Voracek can provide as much offense than Richie and Carter could. However, their stellar defensive play and penalty killing were sorely missed in the playoffs.

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06-17-2012, 11:44 PM
  #891
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[QUOTE=GKJ;51029195]Sorry man. LA has been my favorite team out west for over 10 years, independent of half of the team being ex-Flyers, so I guess you're just going to have to deal with it.


i'm kidding with all that. and i of course i love hextall. Ironically they were my team too when they were really trendy and uncool to like em during the gretzky days. and now here i am *****in about people liken them when they actually have a legitimate reason too like winning the cup. oh well. i haven't been officially diagnosed by a psychiatrist yet but the one guy i went to just told me i was "nuts" and told me to get out.

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06-17-2012, 11:52 PM
  #892
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They did, hence why their relationship was characterized as a work in progress. Having said this, Richards may have a point about Lavi's style to some extent. He's definitely a demanding coach but given how lousy Stevens was in that regard and how even the players admitted their conditioning sucked with Stevens as well as their preparation, it was obviously a good move by Holmgren to get rid of Stevens and salvage the season which almost netted them a cup. It was not unlike LA having to fire vanilla Murray and then catching fire and riding their MVP goalie all the way to a cup victory. In fact, for at least half a season Lavi had total buy in from everybody including Richards and Carter although Carter was injured at key times during Lavi's tenure including last year's playoffs.

Sutter's situation is similar to Lavi's. His style is demanding as well and a whole season of Sutter is pretty tough as well for players. At some point he might not have the same buy in as he did for the 49+ games he coached LA. In Lavis case he got a reset of sorts with all the new players but I have my concerns going forward....
your makin some serious sense my man. i agree with all of this and i am also worried that lava's hardcoreness may be running thin. but where do you go from here? what if we finally brought in bobby clarke "the coach". I'm kid din but thad be crazy.

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06-18-2012, 12:12 AM
  #893
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no offense but we all realize this. thanks for rubbing this in for the 8 millionth, 7 hundred and sixty fifth thousandth, six hundred and 78th time.but your still the man.
I'm not rubbing it in I just wanted to give my opinion. It's a forum where people can debate what they think of the trade. Again, the Flyers have been one of my favorite teams for a while now and it just makes me mad when some people try to discredit what Richards and Carter brought to the team. Yes, the trade is done now but of course people will be speculating for years on what could have been... happens during every trade!

For all we know Schenn and Simmonds will lead to Flyers to the cup in the next few years and all will be forgotten... but you can't ignore that they won the cup.

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06-18-2012, 12:35 AM
  #894
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I am happy for all those players I saw come thru Manchester on winning the Cup. Every single one of them. If Carter and Richards helped them reach that goal then good.

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06-18-2012, 12:44 AM
  #895
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I'm not rubbing it in I just wanted to give my opinion. It's a forum where people can debate what they think of the trade. Again, the Flyers have been one of my favorite teams for a while now and it just makes me mad when some people try to discredit what Richards and Carter brought to the team. Yes, the trade is done now but of course people will be speculating for years on what could have been... happens during every trade!

For all we know Schenn and Simmonds will lead to Flyers to the cup in the next few years and all will be forgotten... but you can't ignore that they won the cup.
I dont understand this logic. How does LA winning the Cup have to do with how the Flyers fared in the trade?


I mean, the Blue Jackets could trade Rick Nash to Washington for Carlson, Kuznetsov, five 1st round picks. If the Caps win the Cup does that mean the Jackets lost the trade?


And this line of thinking makes even less sense when you understand the fact that the Flyers didnt even trade Carter to LA.

So basically, if Anaheim trades Bobby Ryan to NYI for Strome+Niederreiter, and then the Islanders trade Ryan to Vancouver for a 3rd round pick, and then Vancouver wins the Cup.

Did the Ducks lose the trade?

See how that logic doesnt work?

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06-18-2012, 12:48 AM
  #896
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Originally Posted by thaman8765678 View Post
I'm going to offer my opinion as an unbiased poster who is a Flames/Flyers/Kings fan. Don't take anything I say as Flyer bashing or be offended.

As of right now the Flyers are the clear losers of both trades. Don't get me wrong the Flyers picked up a number of good solid young players and assets and it could pay off in the near future. However, both players were essential in the cup run. Don't try to tell me either that the carter trade was a huge win for the Flyers... he ended up scoring the game winning goal of the Stanley Cup playoffs so give him credit where it's due... he proved everyone wrong. At the end of the day the only thing that matters is winning the cup .

As for Richards and Carter having a "reduced role" in L.A. I wouldn't agree with that. Yes, they felt less pressure because of various reasons. However, out of their forward core I would rank only Kopitar and Brown ahead of Richards and Carter as far as importance in the playoffs. When the Flyers went on their playoff run Briere was still ahead of Richards as far as offensive output and Giroux stepped up as well so he was somewhere in the top 3 for forwards. Carter was injureId for much of the playoffs so hard to blame him for that. The point is they aren't in a reduced role they have almost the exact same role they did with the Flyers.

The main difference is this... L.A. had the best goalie in the league this year while the Flyers had AHL calibre goaltending during its run. And it sickens me to see some people saying "well Richards and Carter weren't ever going to win with the Flyers" when Richards helped lead a team without a goalie to game 6 of the cup finals. Did everyone forget "the shift" against the Canadiens or Richards stepping up with momentum changing hits to bring the Flyers back against the Bruins? Some people must have short term memory if they think neither of the two could be leaders here.

As for Laviolette implenting "dry island" I don't agree with doing that either. If drinking had become a problem and players were hungover at practice or missing meetings then the team obviously should have suspended the players and warned them not to do it again. I live in Calgary and friends always have stories about seeing Bourque/Glencross/Kipper/Cammaleri/Phaneuf... you name it... getting absolutely plastered at a club or bar after their game. Again, it's the Flyers media hyping something up that never really was an issue to begin with.

And if Richards and Laviolette didn't see eye to eye maybe they should have had a meeting where they try to come to a middle ground. Richards has said after leaving to L.A. that the system the Flyers played made it tough to play 82 games a season so no wonder the team looked burned out halfway through the season after a long playoff run. Sutter never had a problem getting Richards or Carter to buy in to his system.
I will tell you just that. We didn't trade Carter to the Kings for Jack Johnson and whatever else. We got the 8th Overall pick in last years draft, Voracek, and a 3rd last year. Couturier was ranked #1 for his draft year for a long time before he got mono and should not have fallen to us, but he did and now we have a Center that can completely eliminate ANY top player in the world. And in a division where the other teams have Crosby, Malkin, Gaborik, Tavares, Kovalchuk, Parise, Richards, it matters. On top of all that, he has tons of offensive potential as well, see "Hat-Trick, Stanley Cup Playoffs Edition". Then we go to Voracek who is a big, strong, fast winger with plenty of potential, and a better WINGER then Carter ever was here. He's defensively accountable and a good playmaker.

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06-19-2012, 09:27 PM
  #897
moosehead81
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Originally Posted by BrindamoursNose View Post
I don't care if they win the Cup next year, too.
Really?????

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06-20-2012, 08:24 AM
  #898
turkinaa
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Originally Posted by PALE PWNR View Post
I will tell you just that. We didn't trade Carter to the Kings for Jack Johnson and whatever else. We got the 8th Overall pick in last years draft, Voracek, and a 3rd last year. Couturier was ranked #1 for his draft year for a long time before he got mono and should not have fallen to us, but he did and now we have a Center that can completely eliminate ANY top player in the world. And in a division where the other teams have Crosby, Malkin, Gaborik, Tavares, Kovalchuk, Parise, Richards, it matters. On top of all that, he has tons of offensive potential as well, see "Hat-Trick, Stanley Cup Playoffs Edition". Then we go to Voracek who is a big, strong, fast winger with plenty of potential, and a better WINGER then Carter ever was here. He's defensively accountable and a good playmaker.
I would do that Carter trade any day of the week, I just don't think the Richards trade was needed and when you put both of them together and the outcome in LA ... well ... only time will tell on what we got from LA more so than CBJ.

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