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"With the 20th pick, the Philadelphia Flyers selects..."

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Old
06-18-2012, 02:45 PM
  #176
CharlieGirl
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Drafting Tom Wilson at 20 is just about the only stupid thing we can do at the draft.
There is no limit to the number of stupid things Homer can do at the draft. And July 1.

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06-18-2012, 03:04 PM
  #177
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
I'd be very upset if they don't draft a defenseman in the first round unless there is some sort of backup plan (i.e. Weber, Schenn, J-Bo, etc).
So you are expecting our first rounder to jump straight into the NHL lineup? Whether they acquire an NHL d-man or not, should have no barring on the selection. You take the best player.

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06-18-2012, 03:11 PM
  #178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYguy3911 View Post
So you are expecting our first rounder to jump straight into the NHL lineup? Whether they acquire an NHL d-man or not, should have no barring on the selection. You take the best player.
I think the best player thing can get over-stated a bit.

Let me give you a hypothetical:

On the Flyers big board, Gaunce is #18 and Koekkoek is #19. A few teams go off the board, and both are there at 20. They are basically a wash in terms of talent, in the team's eyes, but Gaunce is a bit closer to the NHL and holds a modest advantage?

Would you want the team to take Gaunce?

I would hope that organizational need plays at least a modest role. I don't want them to reach based on position, but I don't think it makes sense to completely ignore need either.


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Old
06-18-2012, 03:27 PM
  #179
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
I think the best player thing can get over-stated a bit.

Let me give you a hypothetical:

On the Flyers big board, Gaunce is #18 and Koekkoek is #19. A few teams go off the board, and both are there at 20. They are basically a wash in terms of talent, in the team's eyes, but Gaunce is a bit closer to the NHL and holds a modest advantage?

Would you want the team to take Gaunce?

I would hope that organizational need plays at least a modest role. I don't want them to reach based on position, but I don't think it makes sense to completely ignore need either.

That wasn't really my point. My point was you aren't getting an impact guy at #20 so that should be independent of potential NHL signings/trades.

I truly believe you take the best player. A lot can change by the time that pick is NHL ready. Now maybe you recognize a hole in the organization and factor that into your rankings and address that at the draft, but generally you should take the best player regardless of position. You want value. That player might even be dealt to help fill a need as we have seen.

This isn't the NFL or NBA. Most of these guys are 3-4 years away from making an impact. A lot can change in that time frame.

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06-18-2012, 03:36 PM
  #180
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I hope koekkoek is there, my third favorite in the draft

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06-18-2012, 04:05 PM
  #181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
I think the best player thing can get over-stated a bit.

Let me give you a hypothetical:

On the Flyers big board, Gaunce is #18 and Koekkoek is #19. A few teams go off the board, and both are there at 20. They are basically a wash in terms of talent, in the team's eyes, but Gaunce is a bit closer to the NHL and holds a modest advantage?

Would you want the team to take Gaunce?

I would hope that organizational need plays at least a modest role. I don't want them to reach based on position, but I don't think it makes sense to completely ignore need either.

Organizational need is over stated. We lack quality forwards and defenders in the system.

Our biggest need is defense on the NHl squad, but you don't use the draft to fill your current holes on the roster.

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06-18-2012, 04:54 PM
  #182
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I did not start the whole Downie comparison as a way of comparing the style of play, but rather the fact that the Flyers have in the past gone with a guy they want over BPA. Downie was projected in the mock drafts to be a third rounder I believe.

For the most part and Downie included I feel this team has drafted VERY well in the first round so I trust whomever Homer picks. Especially if its Matta. I really like him.

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Old
06-18-2012, 05:38 PM
  #183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jd2210 View Post
I did not start the whole Downie comparison as a way of comparing the style of play, but rather the fact that the Flyers have in the past gone with a guy they want over BPA. Downie was projected in the mock drafts to be a third rounder I believe.

For the most part and Downie included I feel this team has drafted VERY well in the first round so I trust whomever Homer picks. Especially if its Matta. I really like him.
And I would argue Downie was not a reach based on his performance.

Look at the last 3 forwards drafted out of juniors with the 29 pick.

Nicklas Jensen (2011) - .95 ppg
Emerson Etem (2010) - .90 ppg
Carter Ashton (2009) - .71 pgg

Compare that to Downie and Wilson.

Downie (2005) - 1.20 ppg
Wilson (2012) - .55 ppg

Downie was clearly better than the average talent found at 29.
Wilson, on the other hand, is much worse. He is clearly not a first round talent based on his skill level.

I generally trust the Flyers when they make a selection in the first round (keep in mind they haven't used many first round picks under Holmgren), but I will question them if they take Wilson.

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Old
06-18-2012, 07:01 PM
  #184
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McKenzie Top 30:

Quote:
1. RW Nail Yakupov, Sarnia Sting (OHL)
2. D Ryan Murray, Everett Silvertips (WHL)
3. LW Filip Forsberg, Leksands (SEL)
4. D Griffin Reinhart, Edmonton (WHL)
5. C Alex Galchenyuk, Sarnia (OHL)
6. D Mathew Dumba, Red Deer, (WHL)
7. RW Teuvo Terravainen, Jokerit (SM-Liiga)
8. D Morgan Reilly, Moose Jaw (WHL)
9. D Jacob Trouba, USA-U18 (USHL)
10. D Olli Maata, London (OHL)
11. C Radek Faksa, Kitchener (OHL)
12. C Mikhail Grigorenko, Quebec (QMJHL)
13. C Zemgus Girgensons, Dubuque (USHL)
14. D Cody Ceci, Ottawa (OHL)
15. D Hampus Lindholm, Rogle Jr. (SWE)
16. D Slater Koekkoek, Peterborough (OHL)
17. D Derrick Pouliot, Portland (WHL)
18. RW Tom Wilson, Plymouth (OHL)
19. C Tomas Hertl, Slavia Praha (CZE)
20. C Brendan Gaunce, Belleville (OHL)
21. D Matt Finn, Guelph (OHL)
22. D Brady Skjei, USA-U18 (USHL)
23. C Stefan Matteau, USA-U18 (USHL)
24. G Andrei Vasilevski, Ufa Tolpar (RUS)
25. G Malcom Subban, Belleville (OHL)
26. D Michael Matheson, Dubuque (USHL)
27. RW Sebastien Collberg, Frolunda (SEL)
28. C Scott Laughton, Oshawa (OHL)
29. LW Tanner Pearson, Barrie (OHL)
30. LW Phillip Di Giuseppe, Michigan (CCHA)

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Old
06-18-2012, 07:57 PM
  #185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
McKenzie Top 30:
Hmmmm no pokka

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Old
06-18-2012, 08:41 PM
  #186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giroux 4 MVP View Post
Hmmmm no pokka
He's #31. http://www.tsn.ca/draftcentre/feature/?id=9828 (top 60).

McKenzie's list is usually a pretty good indication of where guys will fall as he compiles his list directly from NHL scouts.

If we stay where we are and the consensus is taken, I like Matheson. He's not overly big, but he's a tremendous skater and can provide some offense. He's a guy that I thought would be a second rounder, but it seems like a guy on the rise. Headed to BC next year, but Moncton (QMJHL) is a possibility.

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Old
06-18-2012, 09:04 PM
  #187
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I've seen a couple mock drafts that have us taking a kid named Dalton Thrower from Saskatoon. Never heard of him before I seen these mock drafts and McKenzie has him ranked 39th.

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06-18-2012, 09:12 PM
  #188
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I want Olli Maatta.

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06-18-2012, 09:21 PM
  #189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by healthyscratch View Post
I've seen a couple mock drafts that have us taking a kid named Dalton Thrower from Saskatoon. Never heard of him before I seen these mock drafts and McKenzie has him ranked 39th.
He's a nice player, but I think their are guys likely there at #20 with higher upside.

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06-18-2012, 09:31 PM
  #190
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Interesting that Collberg is sliding. Not a need at all, but he'll be very good value for someone in the 20s if he gets there. Tremendous speed and skill... smallish size.

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06-18-2012, 09:32 PM
  #191
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Any indication on what the Flyers think of Skjei? I really like him Koekkoek. I would also love to get a 2nd (trade Bob?) and draft Matteau. I think he'll drop because I keep reading scouts think he takes too many selfish penalties.

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06-18-2012, 10:30 PM
  #192
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Originally Posted by lancer247 View Post
Any indication on what the Flyers think of Skjei? I really like him Koekkoek. I would also love to get a 2nd (trade Bob?) and draft Matteau. I think he'll drop because I keep reading scouts think he takes too many selfish penalties.
First off if Mattheau does that I wouldn't want him, second of all I pray they move bob now cause he needs to get more time and not just get thrown into the fire after bryz let's in 3 crappy goals and gets pulled, third of all, my favorite defencemen in this draft are Ceci, Trouba, Koekkoek, these guys are my first choices although all 3 probably won't be there when we draft, Skjel is a good prospect but something about him bothers me idk, I wouldn't mind drafting him at 20 I suppose, my thing is what if a forward that is suppose to go like around 12 drops to us.....what do we do

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06-18-2012, 10:54 PM
  #193
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYguy3911 View Post
He's #31. http://www.tsn.ca/draftcentre/feature/?id=9828 (top 60).

McKenzie's list is usually a pretty good indication of where guys will fall as he compiles his list directly from NHL scouts.

If we stay where we are and the consensus is taken, I like Matheson. He's not overly big, but he's a tremendous skater and can provide some offense. He's a guy that I thought would be a second rounder, but it seems like a guy on the rise. Headed to BC next year, but Moncton (QMJHL) is a possibility.
Surprised hyka isn't even in top 60

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06-18-2012, 11:12 PM
  #194
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Man I am going to cry if they take Wilson over someone like Hertl.

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06-19-2012, 12:13 AM
  #195
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Originally Posted by Libertine View Post
Man I am going to cry if they take Wilson over someone like Hertl.
Going to cry if we pass on a good looking Dman unless someone falls like crazy

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06-19-2012, 12:30 AM
  #196
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Heard Malcolm Subban was 12 for 12 in shootout attempts. Might be something to consider

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06-19-2012, 12:39 AM
  #197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYguy3911 View Post
Heard Malcolm Subban was 12 for 12 in shootout attempts. Might be something to consider
Malcom Subban needs to go to Ottawa. Or Toronto. that would be the troll job of the draft.

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06-19-2012, 05:56 AM
  #198
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I know our D man pool is horrible, but is anyone else intrigued by the possibility of Malcolm Subban?

I think that he possess many characteristics that could make him a special goalie.

So far im ok with drafing Subban, Skjei, Koekkoek, pouliot...who i want the most, and Finn.

Out of those guys, anyone really stand out?

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06-19-2012, 07:08 AM
  #199
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYguy3911 View Post
So you are expecting our first rounder to jump straight into the NHL lineup? Whether they acquire an NHL d-man or not, should have no barring on the selection. You take the best player.
In fairness, no one expected Couturier to make the line up last year (too thin, needed more muscle, skating wasn't up to par, etc......). I think it depends on what said player brings to the table. A guy like Hampus Lindholm probably could make the jump to the NHL simply because of the fact that he's physically ready to make the jump.

It really depends on who the Flyers draft. Personally, I don't think who ever they draft will be ready this year. If Koekkoek didn't hurt his shoulder, he might have been able to make the jump. However, he missed way too much time this past season and going back to junior for another year would do a world of good for him.

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06-19-2012, 10:11 AM
  #200
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jtown View Post
I know our D man pool is horrible, but is anyone else intrigued by the possibility of Malcolm Subban?

I think that he possess many characteristics that could make him a special goalie.

So far im ok with drafing Subban, Skjei, Koekkoek, pouliot...who i want the most, and Finn.

Out of those guys, anyone really stand out?
I am in the minority in that I don't care if they draft a defenseman or not. I would prefer it if they didn't draft a goalie in the first, but it won't be because they didn't draft a defender. They will fix their need on defense through free agency or trade. I find the whole we must draft defense thing a little silly.

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