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Sens re-sign Erik Karlsson (7 years, $6.5M cap hit)

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Old
06-20-2012, 09:07 AM
  #451
ChocolateLeclaire
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Originally Posted by WarriorofTime View Post
You're comparing him to a lot of bad contracts. Being a better contract than Dion Phaneuf means nothing. This isn't a "steal" or anything like that until he puts up 2 more seasons like this. As of now it's a normal superstar RFA contract. Ryan Suter is a 2 way force. He'll be fine. Karlsson's defense needs to improve. Paul Coffey got traded a lot remember and his teams usually didn't get any worse after doing so.
Yes, but the teams he got traded TO usually ended up a lot better so that pretty much negates the value in that ridiculous comment.

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06-20-2012, 09:11 AM
  #452
Ismellofhockey
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Originally Posted by thadd View Post
Well I'm an Oil fan. Explain that.
I could, at length, but I'd get cracked over the head by a mod.

Subban is a great player, if he develops properly, he could be able to dominate a game in more ways than Karlsson, though Karlsson will always have the edge offensively. But at this time, Karlsson has overtaken Subban by a fair margin. You don't see Subban's name on the Norris nomination list.

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06-20-2012, 09:11 AM
  #453
IME
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Originally Posted by JackBauer View Post
I'd love for people to explain what the "big risk" is or how the Sens "overpaid"

Campbell 7.1
Doughty 7.0
Chara 6.9
J-Bo 6.7
Boyle 6.7
Phaneuf 6.5
Karlsson 6.5
Timmonen 6.3
Seabrok 5.8
Burns 5.8
Keith 5.5
Wisniewski 5.5
.
Your numbers show the big risk. J-Bo, Phaneuf, and Campbell all regressed heavily after receiving their first large contract. Chara had already made a name for himself, and the jury is still out on Doughty being able to sustain his numbers. That's the risk.

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06-20-2012, 09:16 AM
  #454
JackBauer
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Originally Posted by IME View Post
Your numbers show the big risk. J-Bo, Phaneuf, and Campbell all regressed heavily after receiving their first large contract. Chara had already made a name for himself, and the jury is still out on Doughty being able to sustain his numbers. That's the risk.
I would argue that contracts handed out at the UFA level are riskier. Karlsson/Doughty are 21 and have a ton of upside still to fulfill.

The biggest difference is that Karlsson and Doughty are staying in the system they are comfortable with a starred in. Systems that obviously suit their level of play. The guys you listed above all changed teams. Chara is the only guy I can think of who moved teams and kept playing at his all-world level.

Sports is literred with big-name guys that signed huge contracts and left, only to be shells of what they were. There's a much higher chance of continued success if you sign and stay.

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06-20-2012, 10:14 AM
  #455
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He got paid what he's supposed to get paid, everyone is happy. Ottawa likes to treat their players well and not nickel and dime everyone, especially your most important player going forward. I'm pretty sure were known as having a standup management team who are fair, and well respected among players and agents alike.

Fans are way too obsessed with salaries, were not a cap team, and the contract in no way hurts our roster or cap. Hell he makes less than 10% of our cap space if the newest cap figure is said to be true and continues with the new CBA.

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06-20-2012, 10:47 AM
  #456
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Originally Posted by Security Guard Chang View Post
Good thing hes the best dman at taking away the puck too , which leads to the other team struggling to clear their end wgen karlsson is on the ice . The best defence is having the puck all the time
Yep. The Red Wings are kinda the best team of the last decade and more and they're built on this philosophy. Now, I get that Karlsson obviously won't have the puck ALL the time, but when he doesn't he has shown he is an above average defensive player. Again, he was 1st among defensemen and 12th overall in the NHL in takeaways. A takeaway happens when you don't have the puck and you retrieve it from a player on the opposing team. I fail to see how this is not defense.

He still has some work to do in his zone, to be sure. Remember, most defensemen don't peak as far as defense is concerned until later in their 20's. That's the beauty of it. Karlsson is only 21 and has so much more in store. Other fans can gripe about it all they want, I'm damn happy to have the guy locked in for another 7 years.

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06-20-2012, 11:11 AM
  #457
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Good contract for the Sens. Will be tough for him to match this year's stats, but he will be a solid offensive threat from the back end for years to come.

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06-20-2012, 11:23 AM
  #458
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good deal for both sides. while karlsson may not be a stud in the defensive zone, guys like him, campbell, boyle, etc. make up for that by their ability to turn and get to dump ins as well as skate the puck outta trouble, thus negating the other teams time in the offensive zone.

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06-20-2012, 11:24 AM
  #459
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterSidorkiewicz View Post
He got paid what he's supposed to get paid, everyone is happy. Ottawa likes to treat their players well and not nickel and dime everyone, especially your most important player going forward. I'm pretty sure were known as having a standup management team who are fair, and well respected among players and agents alike.

Fans are way too obsessed with salaries, were not a cap team, and the contract in no way hurts our roster or cap. Hell he makes less than 10% of our cap space if the newest cap figure is said to be true and continues with the new CBA.
Yup. Good player signed to a good contract. There's always risk to these contracts, but, any GM would want their franchise player locked in like this, especially as Alfie contemplates retirement.

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06-20-2012, 01:45 PM
  #460
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Originally Posted by JackBauer View Post
He put up 45 points as a 20 yr old. That would have put him top 12 in scoring for a d-man last season. And still more than guys like Phaneuf and Timmonen (not to mention Doughty).

6.5M isn't that much. He's not even in the top 5 for highest paid defensemen, prior to Weber and Suter's new deals, which will be higher. So you are getting a top 5 dman in the league for a contract that is top 10.

If Karlsson's contract is a risk, then would you say Doughty's is as well?

Like I said in my above post, even if he takes a massive, massive step back and starts only putting up 50 points a year, the contract is still cheaper than a handful of other guys that are putting up less points and compares with others who are making slightly less.
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Originally Posted by Frank Drebin View Post
It's not. Those contracts are 5 years old. My guess is a guy like Suter gets 8 and Weber closer to 9 per.

In context: Grabovski gets 5.5 per; Plekanec 5.0 per. I know forwards/defense, but what's the better value, really?
That's your opinion and I respect it. I certainly don't share it though, in all due respect. I feel it's a huge risk.

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06-20-2012, 01:54 PM
  #461
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Originally Posted by Habsterix View Post
Fair enough. The guy has been in the league for 3 years. His best season prior to this year was 45 pts and -30. He had a splendid season last year. We know that NHL players have ups and downs. Seven years at a cap hit of $6.5M is comparable to what you give to guys like Lidstrom, Chara... The Rangers have a $6.5M defenseman playing in the minors. Not saying that he will be like Redden, but I find it to be early and risky to give him that length of contract at that amount. Again though, I could be wrong, but time will tell.
Why would you bring up Redden? At one point you're saying Karlsson is too young but Redden was sign at 31 years old. Was Redden too old to sign a contract?

Even if Karlsson goes on a slump and average 60pts, he will top the NHL scoring for defenseman for the next five years.

Gomez' contract must give you an horrible after taste in your mouth....

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Old
06-20-2012, 02:01 PM
  #462
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Good signing. A little risky no doubt but I have a feeling Karlsson will only get better.

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06-20-2012, 02:10 PM
  #463
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Only thing I can say is that this signing makes me feel better about the Doughty contract.

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06-20-2012, 02:42 PM
  #464
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Only thing I can say is that this signing makes me feel better about the Doughty contract.
Different players, both awesome, you should feel pretty good about the Doughty signing no matter what.

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06-20-2012, 04:11 PM
  #465
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Only thing I can say is that this signing makes me feel better about the Doughty contract.
You just won a Cup and he's a big reason why. He can suck it up fierce for the rest of his deal and it would STILL be worth it. Winning a Cup is PRICELESS.

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06-20-2012, 04:55 PM
  #466
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Great signing.

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06-20-2012, 04:58 PM
  #467
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Give this a month or two and a reasonable discussion can be had.

Right now, there's too many fans ecstatic he signed to contemplate much else.

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06-20-2012, 05:30 PM
  #468
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Karlsson's going to start dealing with the same things Doughty dealt with after his Norris nomination year. Going into next season, Karlsson will be a marked name on every teams' bulletin board before every game. Teams will scout him much harder, find his weaknesses, and coach to exploit them. He has snuck up on a lot of teams over the past couple of years, but that's over now. The entire league knows just how good he is and they'll react accordingly.

Just don't lose faith Sens fans. Doughty dealt with the same thing, had trouble adjusting, but eventually found his way. This contract will be worth it, in the long run.

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06-20-2012, 05:36 PM
  #469
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Originally Posted by Richie10 View Post
Karlsson's going to start dealing with the same things Doughty dealt with after his Norris nomination year. Going into next season, Karlsson will be a marked name on every teams' bulletin board before every game. Teams will scout him much harder, find his weaknesses, and coach to exploit them. He has snuck up on a lot of teams over the past couple of years, but that's over now. The entire league knows just how good he is and they'll react accordingly.

Just don't lose faith Sens fans. Doughty dealt with the same thing, had trouble adjusting, but eventually found his way. This contract will be worth it, in the long run.
I dont buy this. Teams are smarter than that. They dont wait until someone is nominated for a Norris.

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06-20-2012, 06:31 PM
  #470
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You can't really call contracts like this "good", especially after having just one stellar year. It was/is fair, that's it.

Be interesting to see if he can keep it up.

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06-20-2012, 06:34 PM
  #471
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How was his playoff performance...? Seems a bit high at 6.5M but he is a talent no doubt...probably will not get 78 pts again, but still an impressive young offensive Dman...

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Old
06-20-2012, 08:01 PM
  #472
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How was his playoff performance...? Seems a bit high at 6.5M but he is a talent no doubt...probably will not get 78 pts again, but still an impressive young offensive Dman...
Given that the NYR changed their game plan specifically to counter him, and he still created a lot of chances and played solid D, pretty good playoffs.

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06-20-2012, 11:55 PM
  #473
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Great signing.

This kid's going to be an absolute star, sooner rather than later.

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06-21-2012, 03:04 AM
  #474
Do Make Say Think
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I dont buy this. Teams are smarter than that. They dont wait until someone is nominated for a Norris.
Teams will put even more emphasis on Karlsson than they did before.
Moreso than winning the Norris, the way the Rangers played against Karlsson will have a lot of teams interested: they'll emulate the game plan and hope for similar results (Karlsson was far from dominant, but was still solid)

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06-21-2012, 03:40 AM
  #475
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Silly to expect that Karlsson will put up the same numbers but even more silly I think to believe that he'll just drop off the face of the earth.

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