This would all be a moo point (it's like a cows opinion ) if Staal had shown he could play wing in Bylsma's system. He never really got that shot though. If he could play wing as well as center, then I'd be all for giving him $6M+.
I don't understand this logic. His level of play at center already dictates nearly $6M.
Again, I don't understand this. As a last resort deal, sure, but why would anyone be happy with that package for Staal? Setoguchi is a massive gamble to return to a form that wasn't even all-world anyway, and I couldn't really give a damn less about Clutterbuck and the 7th. That package does not make us a better team, barring we sign Parise or Suter in free agency.
Because I think that's the similar package which was traded for Burns, maybe a bit better.
And we're not getting the best player in the deal, unless we are adding to Staal.
I don't understand this logic. His level of play at center already dictates nearly $6M.
Pretty simple actually. If Staal is playing 3C, we still need to pay a top 6 wing. If Staal is playing top 6 wing, we still have to pay a 3C. a 3C is going to get payed less than a top 6 wing.
dumping Martin alone does that, not sure why people keep mentioning trading TK. not like we have a bunch of guys that can take his place lol.
if moving TK allows us to get a 2nd top 6 wing, we have Dupuis to take his place. That's an all around upgrade. I'm thinking of a scenario where we do something like move Martin for Malone and then sign Ray Whitney or something. If we have to move TK to make that work, I'd do it for sure. If we're signing Parise I expect Dupuis to stay in the top 6, and then I agree with you.
if moving TK allows us to get a 2nd top 6 wing, we have Dupuis to take his place. That's an all around upgrade. I'm thinking of a scenario where we do something like move Martin for Malone and then sign Ray Whitney or something. If we have to move TK to make that work, I'd do it for sure. If we're signing Parise I expect Dupuis to stay in the top 6, and then I agree with you.
Pretty simple actually. If Staal is playing 3C, we still need to pay a top 6 wing. If Staal is playing top 6 wing, we still have to pay a 3C. a 3C is going to get payed less than a top 6 wing.
if you talk about slotting, then yes. But let's be realistic, Staal isn't a 3C. He's very easily a top 6 player. It's just here that he is put in that role. His level of play already dictates the $6M figure....
I can't tell you what is gonna happen. I don't know what Shero should do. I really don't know if Staal really owes us anything. All I know is that the idea of him not being a Penguin is heartbreaking. Just awful.
if you talk about slotting, then yes. But let's be realistic, Staal isn't a 3C. He's very easily a top 6 player. It's just here that he is put in that role. His level of play already dictates the $6M figure....
except he is slotted at 3C. Which makes it harder to pay him that much money because it takes money away from the top 6 wings. You can't just pretend he isn't a 3C here. When he produces like he did last year while playing 3C, I will change my mind.
He absolutely deserves 6M. But it's hard to justify paying him that to play 3rd line center.
assuming the cap goes up at least a little bit, yes it does. Tk is a good hockey player. He is replaceable though.
ya i in no way meant TK isn't replaceable, just makes no sense to trade him then sign someone comparable(for similar money)
Zach Parise ($7.000m) / Sidney Crosby ($8.700m) / Pascal Dupuis ($1.500m)
Chris Kunitz ($3.725m) / Evgeni Malkin ($8.700m) / James Neal ($5.000m)
Matt Cooke ($1.800m) / Jordan Staal ($4.000m) / Tyler Kennedy ($2.000m)
Dustin Jeffrey ($0.575m) / Joe Vitale ($0.550m) / Eric Tangradi ($0.726m)
Craig Adams ($0.675m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Brooks Orpik ($3.750m) / Kris Letang ($3.500m)
Matt Niskanen ($2.250m) / Zbynek Michalek ($4.000m)
Brian Strait ($0.605m) / Deryk Engelland ($0.567m)
Robert Bortuzzo ($0.578m) /
GOALTENDERS
Marc-Andre Fleury ($5.000m)
Tomas Vokoun ($2.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $70,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $67,200,167; BONUSES: $0
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $3,099,833
if the cap is actually that high we are fine to sign Parise, but if the cap goes down it wouldn't make sense to go after Parise anyway, unless we trade Staal &/or TK
ya i in no way meant TK isn't replaceable, just makes no sense to trade him then sign someone comparable(for similar money)
Zach Parise ($7.000m) / Sidney Crosby ($8.700m) / Pascal Dupuis ($1.500m)
Chris Kunitz ($3.725m) / Evgeni Malkin ($8.700m) / James Neal ($5.000m)
Matt Cooke ($1.800m) / Jordan Staal ($4.000m) / Tyler Kennedy ($2.000m)
Dustin Jeffrey ($0.575m) / Joe Vitale ($0.550m) / Eric Tangradi ($0.726m)
Craig Adams ($0.675m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Brooks Orpik ($3.750m) / Kris Letang ($3.500m)
Matt Niskanen ($2.250m) / Zbynek Michalek ($4.000m)
Brian Strait ($0.605m) / Deryk Engelland ($0.567m)
Robert Bortuzzo ($0.578m) /
GOALTENDERS
Marc-Andre Fleury ($5.000m)
Tomas Vokoun ($2.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $70,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $67,200,167; BONUSES: $0
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $3,099,833
if the cap is actually that high we are fine to sign Parise, but if the cap goes down it wouldn't make sense to go after Parise anyway, unless we trade Staal &/or TK
agreed. Though as I've said a few times, I would have no problem moving either or both of them to make room for Parise.
ya same here, unless the Cap goes down, then i don't see how we could sign Parise at all.
if the cap actually goes down, ya you're probably right. If it goes up, even less than Capgeek is prediction, then I still think its fine. I doubt we get Parise either way. But its fun
assuming the cap goes up at least a little bit, yes it does. Tk is a good hockey player. He is replaceable though.
No one knows what the cap will be at since it will be under a completely new CBA. The reported ~70mil is if they go by current CBA standards and that is not going to be what goes forward.
if the cap actually goes down, ya you're probably right. If it goes up, even less than Capgeek is prediction, then I still think its fine. I doubt we get Parise either way. But its fun
) if Staal had shown he could play wing in Bylsma's system. He never really got that shot though. If he could play wing as well as center, then I'd be all for giving him $6M+.
