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Flyers interested in Ducks pick - Lavoie

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Old
06-22-2012, 02:33 PM
  #101
Unagi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheKingPin View Post
Schenn jvr and a first for

Ryan 1st in 12 and 13



Terrible.

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Old
06-22-2012, 02:34 PM
  #102
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To get Ryan is going to cost enough but to get the 6th Overall will add even more. I doubt any team could get both so it'd be one or the other. Prioritizing would be the best thing to do. Ryan or the 6th?

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06-22-2012, 02:35 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by DuckNoire View Post
Okay what would the Ducks have to add to get Schenn with the 6th OV?
Value wise? Probably something like a 2nd or a decent (but not top-end) prospect.

But I really don't think the Flyers will do that.

In other words, I can see them sending JVR or Voracek to Anaheim in a deal for the 6th, but I can only see Schenn going if Ryan is coming back (either in a Schenn + x + y for Ryan deal, or a Schenn + x + y + z for Ryan and the 6th)

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06-22-2012, 02:37 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
Value wise? Probably something like a 2nd or a decent (but not top-end) prospect.

But I really don't think the Flyers will do that.

In other words, I can see them sending JVR or Voracek to Anaheim in a deal for the 6th, but I can only see Schenn going if Ryan is coming back (either in a Schenn + x + y for Ryan deal, or a Schenn + x + y + z for Ryan and the 6th)

Hm...yeah I really don't think we will see a Ryan + 6th OV trade.


And if JvR is in play for that pick, Burke would be up Homer's grill in no time

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Old
06-22-2012, 02:37 PM
  #105
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JVR our first and the t newly acquired 2nd for Ryan
Then I take Schenn and the newly acquired 4th for Yandle.
Then I fold up shop and get juiced because we have done really well

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Old
06-22-2012, 02:39 PM
  #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by facts View Post
take out schenn and add read or cousins instead
Sure. And Ducks will add Perry too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
You realize that you could make the exact same argument for the Flyers, right?

In fact, you could probably argue that Anaheim's need for a young, high-end 2C outweighs the Flyers need for a top-line winger.

Everybody always wants an overpayment. Both sides want to win the trade.

It is more productive here to focus on identifying fair value to both sides, rather than figuring out which side deserves more of an overpayment.
Rumour is Flyers want Duck's pick. Duck's aren't shopping their pick. That's where he's coming from.

And no, I'm not implying Schenn or Couturier straight up for 6th.

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Old
06-22-2012, 02:39 PM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sh0otnSc0re View Post
Most ANA fans keep saying Schenn or Couts have to be involved in the deal. That's what I'm getting it from.
Here's a hint... Quote them.

I'd personally trade the pick for Voracek or JVR. But I'd be ecstatic if the Ducks added a prospect or their 2nd round pick and landed Schenn.

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Old
06-22-2012, 02:41 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by Schenn10 View Post
The risk is really all on the Flyers on this. If JvR fulfills his potential, he basically becomes Bobby Ryan, which would make the trade

Bobby Ryan + Brayden Schenn + 20th for Bobby Ryan + 6th

Obviously there is the chance JvR never fulfills that potential but the trade still isnt horrible is JvR produces 50 pts a year, and you get Brayden Schenn and a later 1st, and thats the absolute worst case that can happen for the ducks.
It's not a bad deal for either team really.

Philly upgrades JVR to Ryan.

Using Schenn they get the 6th overall to presumably grab a top dman prospect to build their defense around in the future.

Anaheim gets a worse Ryan replacement but one with potential to improve. They also get the 2nd line center to build around for the future, something they have significant need of. Presumably they don't feel that the player(s) available at 6th fit their needs. They move back to 20th and get a still decent player with potential.

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Old
06-22-2012, 02:41 PM
  #109
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Quote:

- JvR


-5th OV
- 35th OV

----------------------------------------

- Ryan


- Schenn
- Simmons
- 35th OV
(- PHI 2nd rounder 2013)
What about that?

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Old
06-22-2012, 02:41 PM
  #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zapp Brannigan View Post
Sure. And Ducks will add Perry too.


Rumour is Flyers want Duck's pick. Duck's aren't shopping their pick. That's where he's coming from.
Rumor is the Ducks want Schenn. The Flyers aren't shopping Schenn.

Rumor is the Ducks are "shopping" [by which I really meant, listening to offers for] Ryan, etc.

Again, it goes both ways, and it is sort of fruitless debate--who wants to make the trade more, etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckNoire View Post
What about that?
Setting aside the JVR-to-TML thing--which been addressed elsewhere, I really don't see the Flyers moving a return that exceeds what they got for Richards (Schenn, Simmonds, 2nd) for Ryan--particularly considering that Simmonds value has improved since last June.

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06-22-2012, 02:43 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by DuckNoire View Post


Terrible.
Flyers could add read

Jvr and schenn when healty have played great and easily are top 6 players.

Ryan is a good player but had really one very impressive season.

But hey if you want to take a chance and get the next Wilson or bodekar or filatov potentially go for it. I'm pretty sure jvr and schenn could equal Ryan at given the chance

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Old
06-22-2012, 02:46 PM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckNoire View Post
What about that?
JVR for 5th overall is interesting. I'm not ok with giving up more for Ryan then The Flyers got for Richards.

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Old
06-22-2012, 02:46 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by DuckNoire View Post
What about that?
I'd rather not as a Leafs fan.

That leaves us with no pick until the 5th round. And to be honest with his injury troubles, thats a big risk to give up the 5th and our 35th.

I'd consider it for just the 5th overall, but even then would probably say no.

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Old
06-22-2012, 02:47 PM
  #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schenn10 View Post
The risk is really all on the Flyers on this. If JvR fulfills his potential, he basically becomes Bobby Ryan, which would make the trade

Bobby Ryan + Brayden Schenn + 20th for Bobby Ryan + 6th

Obviously there is the chance JvR never fulfills that potential but the trade still isnt horrible is JvR produces 50 pts a year, and you get Brayden Schenn and a later 1st, and thats the absolute worst case that can happen for the ducks.
You've got it backwards. Anaheim is trading the guaranteed 30 goals guy. Philly is trading the grossly overpaid wing they HOPE will eventually turn into the guaranteed 30 goals guy and the 18 point center they HOPE will turn into a top 2-way center. All the risk is on the whoever has to count on the kids to actually live up to their potential. If they do, that team wins the trade. Philly is the team getting the low risk here - they know they're getting a 1st line player out of the deal, maybe 2 (or 1+ top pairing D) if the 6th pans out . Anaheim is hoping for a 1C + 1W, expecting a 2C + 2W, and actually getting a 3C + 2W, plus hoping the draft pick becomes a 2-3rd liner.

The worst case scenario is that JVR has continued hip issues and is out of the league in a few years. And considering he's yet to crest 40 it's pretty silly to say his worst case scenario is 50.

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06-22-2012, 02:50 PM
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheKingPin View Post
Flyers could add read

Jvr and schenn when healty have played great and easily are top 6 players.

Ryan is a good player but had really one very impressive season.

But hey if you want to take a chance and get the next Wilson or bodekar or filatov potentially go for it. I'm pretty sure jvr and schenn could equal Ryan at given the chance
And one of the few current NHLers that has had four straight 30 goal seasons and he's one of like two that are under 25 that did it.

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06-22-2012, 02:54 PM
  #116
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Originally Posted by TheFinnishKulemin View Post
And one of the few current NHLers that has had four straight 30 goal seasons and he's one of like two that are under 25 that did it.
Like I said good player. I myself am very fine with schenn and jvr as I think they together are worth more than ryan or equal in a few years.

And much like Gs contract jvrs could be amazing.

I want that first for a stud dman but no way blow more on Ryan. When we have cheap labor that could boom here

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Old
06-22-2012, 02:58 PM
  #117
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- Voracek
- Schenn
- Gustafsson
- 20th OV


- Ryan
- 6th OV

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06-22-2012, 03:00 PM
  #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingscup View Post

- Voracek
- Schenn
- Gustafsson
- 20th OV


- Ryan
- 6th OV
No from Philly. No Voracek and Schenn.

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Old
06-22-2012, 03:01 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by Sh0otnSc0re View Post
No from Philly. No Voracek and Schenn.
I really don't think Schenn is going to be involved either way. I could see Voracek being used to move into the top 10, but all reports have stated that Homer doesn't want to part with Schenn or Couturier.

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Old
06-22-2012, 03:01 PM
  #120
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Originally Posted by TheKingPin View Post
Like I said good player. I myself am very fine with schenn and jvr as I think they together are worth more than ryan or equal in a few years.

And much like Gs contract jvrs could be amazing.

I want that first for a stud dman but no way blow more on Ryan. When we have cheap labor that could boom here

Maybe - maybe not. We can only so much rely on projections. However the facts are Ryan had multiple 30 goal season and has no injuries. JvR could be as good as Ryan...but maybe he will suffer so much from his recent injuries that he only becomes a decent 3rd liner.

Same for Schenn. Who knows how he will develop. Maybe he will be the next Giroux. Maybe he will just be the next Andrew Cogliano.


As I said - what is known NOW is that Ryan is better than anyone of those guys. So stop lowballing us. If you don't like the pricetag - don't do the deal.

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Old
06-22-2012, 03:01 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by phillyflyerfan1992 View Post
Wouldn't be surprised if they're going hard after Ryan+6th overall. Heard rumblings of it yesterday and Flyers REALLY like Bobby Ryan (since '05, Clarkie wanted him bad).

Pooling assets like Voracek, JVR, mid to late firsts and 2nd rounders to grab B. Ryan like Matt Dumba would be excellent.
yeah thats great for the flyers isn't it? to bad its not for Anaheim

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06-22-2012, 03:03 PM
  #122
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Originally Posted by DuckNoire View Post
Maybe - maybe not. We can only so much rely on projections. However the facts are Ryan had multiple 30 goal season and has no injuries. JvR could be as good as Ryan...but maybe he will suffer so much from his recent injuries that he only becomes a decent 3rd liner.

Same for Schenn. Who knows how he will develop. Maybe he will be the next Giroux. Maybe he will just be the next Andrew Cogliano.


As I said - what is known NOW is that Ryan is better than anyone of those guys. So stop lowballing us. If you don't like the pricetag - don't do the deal.
The guy's just giving you his own personal opinion, not commenting on trade value.

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Old
06-22-2012, 03:04 PM
  #123
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Originally Posted by NitHeel View Post
The guy's just giving you his own personal opinion, not commenting on trade value.
I quoted his post, but it was addressed to the majority of Flyers fans posting here.

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Old
06-22-2012, 03:06 PM
  #124
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Originally Posted by Sh0otnSc0re View Post
No from Philly. No Voracek and Schenn.
I am with you here. To me Schenn is a keeper.

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Old
06-22-2012, 03:06 PM
  #125
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Originally Posted by DuckNoire View Post
I quoted his post, but it was addressed to the majority of Flyers fans posting here.
I think most of the Flyers fans here realize that. We would like Bobby Ryan, but we realize we don't need him. Most of us would much rather try to trade into the top 10 and draft a high upside defenseman. Thus the interest in the 6th.

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