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Derrick Pouliot | Defenseman | Portland (WHL) | 1st Round, 8th overall

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Old
06-23-2012, 12:18 AM
  #76
Big McLargehuge
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sniugneP View Post
The fact Forsberg dropped to 11th was very telling. They must have saw something they don't like.
That's often true, and I have to hope that it will be...but it's far from a guarantee in the NHL Draft.

Sliders in the first round of the NHL Draft the past decade have a decent record...the best examples being Kopitar and Getzlaf. It's when guys slide into the 2nd or later rounds that the questions tend to become legitimized.

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Old
06-23-2012, 12:20 AM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Ragamuffin Gunner View Post
Des was projected to go much higher and fell to 30th. Ya ppl wanted Ferraro buy Des was ranked higher.

Morrow was projected to be a 3rd rounder but Ray took a flyer on him at 23. Many Gms go off the boars after the first 15 picks or so and 23rd isn't that high of a percentage to get a stud so if Morrow flops it's not that big of a deal.

Pouliot was projected to be picked 15th or higher and was picked at 8th. Not to mention there was the 3rd ranked player still on the board who is a right handed RW with huge offensive upside, which is exactly what the Pend need. A top 10 pick HAS to workout or else it's a horrible pick. There's a Hickey or Skille or Brule every draft, and if Pouliot is that player the Staal trade is going to be terrible.

Reaching at 23 or 30 isn't nearly the same a reaching at 8. If Pouliot doesn't pan out and/or Forsberg does Pen s fans are going to regret this pick for years, IMO. That and the fact that the Caps 1st line in 3 years just might be Ovechkin - Backstrom - Forsberg.

Also, if Pouliot flops people are going to be 2nd guessing Shero's pick for ever, had he taken Fors and he flopped people would have at least known that he was BPA.
Morrow was projected in the first round the whole year.

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06-23-2012, 12:32 AM
  #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Jiggyfly View Post
People just never see the big picture, it's a shame, really.

There is a reason Forsberg slipped.

When will people learn to trust the Pens scouts with blueliners?

Despres... Crying, whining...

Morrow.... Crying, whining...

Harrington... Crying... Whining...

Now the same people who were whining are suddenly bragging about these guys.

When will people learn?
So because it looks like three of RS's picks will turn out we're not allowed to question his decision to reach for yet another Dman?

I guess I did learn something!

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06-23-2012, 12:33 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by KareemTrustfund View Post
Morrow was projected in the first round the whole year.
Was he? I only checked one place and id said he was goi in the 3rd. If he was projected to be a 1st rounder it helps my argument even more that Shero pretty much picked BPA with Des and Morrow. Not so much with Pouliot.

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06-23-2012, 12:40 AM
  #80
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Every team have different rankings on prospects. Pens probably ranked Pouliot higher than players you wanted.

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06-23-2012, 12:41 AM
  #81
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Originally Posted by Ragamuffin Gunner View Post
So because it looks like three of RS's picks will turn out we're not allowed to question his decision to reach for yet another Dman?

I guess I did learn something!
You can think whatever you like my man; just like I think its funny there are people who don't watch these players and don't know dick except what they read, then whine because the guy who sounds great on paper, isn't the pick.

How many times does it have to be said that team rankings and public scouting rankings are usually vastly different?

I trust the scouts who get paid good money to do their job.

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06-23-2012, 12:42 AM
  #82
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For the record, I don't really have a problem with the Pouliot pick. He sounds like a keeper. Him being selected wouldn't have bothered me like us taking Tom Wilson or Colton Sissons that high would have. I just think adding an elite forward prospect to our system in Forsberg makes more sense for this organization going forward, given the lack of real quality among our forward prospects. This is especially true since we landed an elite defense prospect in Maatta later on anyway.

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06-23-2012, 12:42 AM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragamuffin Gunner View Post
Was he? I only checked one place and id said he was goi in the 3rd. If he was projected to be a 1st rounder it helps my argument even more that Shero pretty much picked BPA with Des and Morrow. Not so much with Pouliot.
For some reason, i wanna say Morrow was all over the place depending on which list you were reading. Can't remember him being a 3rd rounder but i think i saw him with a second round ranking in a couple places ...

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06-23-2012, 12:46 AM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Jiggyfly View Post
You can think whatever you like my man; just like I think its funny there are people who don't watch these players and don't know dick except what they read, then whine because the guy who sounds great on paper, isn't the pick.

How many times does it have to be said that team rankings and public scouting rankings are usually vastly different?

I trust the scouts who get paid good money to do their job.
Not to mention that drafts are by definition an educated crapshoot anyway. It's fun to be a fan an get emotionally involved, but getting too high or low over virtually any pick outside of a Crosby level phenom pretty much defies logic.

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06-23-2012, 12:54 AM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Jiggyfly View Post
You can think whatever you like my man; just like I think its funny there are people who don't watch these players and don't know dick except what they read, then whine because the guy who sounds great on paper, isn't the pick.

How many times does it have to be said that team rankings and public scouting rankings are usually vastly different?

I trust the scouts who get paid good money to do their job.
Honest question:

Do you like the pick because you personally think Pouliot is going to be a better player than Forsberg or do you like the pick because you trust in Shero?

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06-23-2012, 12:56 AM
  #86
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Honest question:

Have you watch Pouliot or Forsberg play? Or you go by scouting reports?


That's why we have scouts.

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06-23-2012, 01:04 AM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragamuffin Gunner View Post
Honest question:

Do you like the pick because you personally think Pouliot is going to be a better player than Forsberg or do you like the pick because you trust in Shero?
Offensive blueliners who can control the game like DP, are more valuable than wingers. That simple for me.

Shero knows what's up as do his scouts.

I wanted this badly... I talked last week about this org going all out on blueliners. Build the best farm in the league of the most valuable commodity in the league, and Shero did exactly what I dreamed of.

They added three more highly touted prospects to an already deep group. The possibilities for what Shero can do now with this farm of blueliners is almost limitless.

I'm excited as ****.

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06-23-2012, 01:21 AM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Jiggyfly View Post
Offensive blueliners who can control the game like DP, are more valuable than wingers. That simple for me.

Shero knows what's up as do his scouts.

I wanted this badly... I talked last week about this org going all out on blueliners. Build the best farm in the league of the most valuable commodity in the league, and Shero did exactly what I dreamed of.

They added three more highly touted prospects to an already deep group. The possibilities for what Shero can do now with this farm of blueliners is almost limitless.

I'm excited as ****.
That's fine and you very well could be right. I just don't like the idea of drafting a player just to trade him later to fill a hole, which this feels like. Especially with a right handed winger with huge upside still on the board, which is a definite hole in this org.

Pens have sick D depth and almost no O depth. Drafting Forsberg would help the org more than Pouliot will, IMO.

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06-23-2012, 01:31 AM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Jiggyfly View Post
Offensive blueliners who can control the game like DP, are more valuable than wingers. That simple for me.

Shero knows what's up as do his scouts.

I wanted this badly... I talked last week about this org going all out on blueliners. Build the best farm in the league of the most valuable commodity in the league, and Shero did exactly what I dreamed of.

They added three more highly touted prospects to an already deep group. The possibilities for what Shero can do now with this farm of blueliners is almost limitless.

I'm excited as ****.
Okay so you pretty much just wanted us to stockpile more D. So would you have been upset if they drafted Forsberg instead of Pouliot and if so wouldn't that make you a whiner? I don't totally disagree with what you're saying but I also don't see how you can dismiss everyone that wanted Forsberg (or any of the top forward prospects available) as being "whiners" either. I agree with Ragamuffin, the Pens are thin when it comes to forward prospects and we both wanted them to address the issue at the draft. You obviously think differently and that's cool but why not lay off the whole "if you don't agree with the pick, you're a crybaby" routine. I'd say you have a pretty good point, D is valuable but legit top 6 wingers don't grow on trees either. It would be nice to have some in our system. That's all people are trying to say really.

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06-23-2012, 01:40 AM
  #90
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Our take on Pouliot:

Quote:
Pouliot is another slick, puck-moving defenseman who loves to start the breakout with his great outlet game. Pouliot is a strong skating defenseman with a smooth, powerful stride and isn’t afraid to rely on his skills to move the puck up ice. He displays a wide skating stride, is strong on his skates and has ability to get back into play if he pinches into the zone for a chance. He possesses the ability to log heavy minutes and not wear down from fatigue. He plays a pro-style game in Portland, controlling the pace of the game with his patience and poise.
More: http://futureconsiderations.ca/pouliot/

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06-23-2012, 01:57 AM
  #91
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Terrible pick, in my opinion. Like some have said, I think Shero's staff was high on him and were planning on taking him at 22, so they just tunnel-visioned and took him at 8.

I'd have been happy with Forsberg, regardless of why he fell. We need a blue-chip offensive prospect with near sure-fire upside. We are completely barren of that in our prospect pool, including Bennett, Tangradi and Kuhn. I don't think any of those three guys hold a candle to Forsberg's pedigree and upside in terms of pure offensive ability at an NHL level.

That all being said, I'd have been absolutely ecstatic with Trouba at 8. Orpik isn't going to be around for a whole lot longer, and we need a guy like Trouba in our system. He's a defenseman, yes, but he's one unlike any we have. Pouliot is just another in a long line of smallish, offensive defensemen. I just hate this pick, to be frank.

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06-23-2012, 03:02 AM
  #92
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Despite all the *****ing, has anyone bothered to realize that he fits the system?

Sure, he's a project, but his upside is tremendous. He's not even afraid to be physical as well.

He's got the perfect skillset that we need. So does Dumolin and Maata.

Everyone complains over not getting who they want, but the fact of the matter is, what does this team need?

Shero is taking the approach that they started in Nashville. Home grow your defense. That approach will work out perfectly.

3-4 years from now, this defense will be extremely talented, deep, and most importantly scary.

Mix that with a Crosby, Malkin, Neal, Parise, who are in their prime and BOOM!

Every hates it now, but they'll rescind the hate later on.

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06-23-2012, 04:40 AM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Dylonus View Post
Despite all the *****ing, has anyone bothered to realize that he fits the system?

Sure, he's a project, but his upside is tremendous. He's not even afraid to be physical as well.

He's got the perfect skillset that we need. So does Dumolin and Maata.

Everyone complains over not getting who they want, but the fact of the matter is, what does this team need?

Shero is taking the approach that they started in Nashville. Home grow your defense. That approach will work out perfectly.

3-4 years from now, this defense will be extremely talented, deep, and most importantly scary.

Mix that with a Crosby, Malkin, Neal, Parise, who are in their prime and BOOM!

Every hates it now, but they'll rescind the hate later on.
And what if said bolded player doesnt sign with the Penguins, we lose out on Nash and we lose out on Ryan? Then the Penguins gutted out 2 core players for Sutter. Thats a big downgrade.

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06-23-2012, 05:26 AM
  #94
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Ceci or Trouba were the men... Big RH Dmen....
We did get big Dmen with Dumoulin & Maatta. The Z trade also shows we made a commitment to go with Bortuzzo next year, who's another, huge Dman. I really wanted the Pens to add size on their D going forward, but they have in fact done that now.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragamuffin Gunner View Post
Des was projected to go much higher and fell to 30th. Ya ppl wanted Ferraro buy Des was ranked higher.

Morrow was projected to be a 3rd rounder but Ray took a flyer on him at 23. Many Gms go off the boars after the first 15 picks or so and 23rd isn't that high of a percentage to get a stud so if Morrow flops it's not that big of a deal.
http://www.tsn.ca/draftcentre/feature/?id=44970

Morrow was pretty much a consensus top 20 guy last year.


Anyway, there's one major factor people are also over-looking: yes, Forsberg or Teravainen may have fit the team's "needs" better, but they also have higher bust-potential. You can't afford to miss when you're picking that high. Even if Pouliot is was ranked a bit lower by some scouts, his upside is tremendous and he just might be a safer bet than either of those 2.

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06-23-2012, 05:40 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by KareemTrustfund View Post
Morrow was projected in the first round the whole year.
Yup... I don't get that post at all. I really wanted to hate going with D last year but IMO Morrow was easily BPA. Harrington too.

Can't say that I'm happy with 2 D picks in the first round but Matta and DP are high quality kids. I'm guessing the Pens mindset is that you can teach defense so use draft picks to aquire them... and you can't teach offense so trade or buy something proven.

Still have a problem with that insanely deep 2009 draft though.

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06-23-2012, 05:43 AM
  #96
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Originally Posted by Big McLargehuge View Post
I do feel almost sorry for Pouliot, though. Määttä is being universally praised right now, while Pouliot is being panned...and it has everything to do with their draft position. Had we drafted Määttä with the #8 pick and Pouliot with the #22 we'd be the happiest fan base in the world right now.
Exactly my thoughts !!!

In the end we did good IMO. Sure, I would want forward, but having Maatta at 22, it's all good for me..all good!

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06-23-2012, 05:51 AM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Big McLargehuge View Post
I do feel almost sorry for Pouliot, though. Määttä is being universally praised right now, while Pouliot is being panned...and it has everything to do with their draft position. Had we drafted Määttä with the #8 pick and Pouliot with the #22 we'd be the happiest fan base in the world right now.
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Exactly my thoughts !!!

In the end we did good IMO. Sure, I would want forward, but having Maatta at 22, it's all good for me..all good!
LOL, true.


And trust me guys: Maatta would have been an even bigger reach at #8. There's some big questionmarks to his game, though big upside, too.


If I'm upset about anything in this draft it's not getting Subban or Dansk. If I was Shero, I'd be getting on the horn with CLB/EDM/MTL and offer our 2nd + 3rd + 4th for one of their early 2nd rounders to get Dansk.

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06-23-2012, 06:03 AM
  #98
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LOL, true.


And trust me guys: Maatta would have been an even bigger reach at #8. There's some big questionmarks to his game, though big upside, too.


If I'm upset about anything in this draft it's not getting Subban or Dansk. If I was Shero, I'd be getting on the horn with CLB/EDM/MTL and offer our 2nd + 3rd + 4th for one of their early 2nd rounders to get Dansk.
2nded... I really like Dansk.

What do you think about Maatta's flaws? IMO they are correctable and a cleaner pro game will really help him out. I made a Kenny Jonsson comparison because his passing gets him out of trouble... even though he forces some plays right now.

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06-23-2012, 06:22 AM
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2nded... I really like Dansk.

What do you think about Maatta's flaws? IMO they are correctable and a cleaner pro game will really help him out. I made a Kenny Jonsson comparison because his passing gets him out of trouble... even though he forces some plays right now.
No way, Jonsson was like Lidstrom-lite. Brilliant hockey sense and silky smooth. Maatta has you thinking that way one minute, and then he'll make a blatantly obvious turnover. It's just that his passes so often get picked off, and he makes some predictably bad plays, so he's a bit of a high-risk player in that regard. Think 'Geno' when he's not focused and making dumb plays.

If Maatta can become more steady and make better, instinctual decisions and better reads on the ice, then we have a gem. It's just a matter of whether these things will come with developing good habbits with practice, or if he is just going to be a guy who always has those brain farts.

Again, given how highly he was thought of by some or in some areas of his game, there is a clear reason why he fell and why he wasn't very high on some people's lists (i.e. Button's, other teams picking before us). He was a very fair gamble at #22, but I would have been very unhappy with him at #8.

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06-23-2012, 06:24 AM
  #100
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This thread smacks of when people freaked out when we took Despres instead of Ferraro, Morrow instead of Puempel, and Harrington instead of pretty much anybody else. Some will never learn to trust the front office and scouting staff.

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