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How did your country do at the 2012 draft?

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Old
06-23-2012, 09:52 PM
  #26
bp spec
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Sweden had a bit of a down year. We've been spoiled with a lot of 1st rounders over the last few years. But I'm sure we'll rebound.

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06-23-2012, 10:23 PM
  #27
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Other than the fact that it was much weaker than usual and had a defensive flavour, the draft was par for the course.

Canadians dominated the early 1st round (Top 10) altho there were more Europeans than in recent years.
There were 13 Canadians - most years there are about 16 or 17

For 3 of the last 4 years (minus 2010), the U.S. averaged 5 first round picks - mostly late in the round.
This year there was 6 and 4 came after pick 25.

At the end of the day, Canadians made up (just) under 50% of the draft picks, the U.S. 25%, Europe 25%. Again, par for the course.

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06-23-2012, 11:04 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by KevyD View Post
Other than the fact that it was much weaker than usual and had a defensive flavour, the draft was par for the course.

Canadians dominated the early 1st round (Top 10) altho there were more Europeans than in recent years.
There were 13 Canadians - most years there are about 16 or 17

For 3 of the last 4 years (minus 2010), the U.S. averaged 5 first round picks - mostly late in the round.
This year there was 6 and 4 came after pick 25.

At the end of the day, Canadians made up (just) under 50% of the draft picks, the U.S. 25%, Europe 25%. Again, par for the course.
Actually 14 first rounders. Would have liked a few highend Canadian forwards, but overall not bad.

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06-24-2012, 06:52 AM
  #29
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Can get worse than my country did. But I guess next year will be an up year for us no matter what now.

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06-24-2012, 06:53 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by slovakiasnextone View Post
Can get worse than my country did. But I guess next year will be an up year for us no matter what now.
Wow no draftees,how come? is it because slovakian hockey is in downfall or what?

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06-24-2012, 06:56 AM
  #31
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Poor, as expected..

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06-24-2012, 06:58 AM
  #32
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Wow no draftees,how come? is it because slovakian hockey is in downfall or what?
It´s a long story and a big combination of factors, but I think the reason why there were absolutely no players drafted this year is a really weak year for our players (from what I can remember even in our junior leagues quite a lot of the younger 1995 players have been better than most 1994 for a few seasons now), I mean in the last three drafts we constantly had at least two players drafted and everythign so far seems to suggest that we´ll go back to that next year once again.

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06-24-2012, 06:59 AM
  #33
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Only 1 forward taken. 9 players in total. Not very well.

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06-24-2012, 07:02 AM
  #34
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06-24-2012, 07:03 AM
  #35
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Only 1 forward taken. 9 players in total. Not very well.
Can we trade a forward for one of your dmen pls?

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06-24-2012, 07:04 AM
  #36
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Nathan Walker (Australia) goes undrafted.

Yeah.

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06-24-2012, 07:10 AM
  #37
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Nathan Walker (Australia) goes undrafted.

Yeah.
Aww man i really wanted him to get drafted,would have been so cool to see an australian even comming close to NHL.

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06-24-2012, 09:50 AM
  #38
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Compared to that ******** we had to take from 2006 to 2009

it's a fantastic draft for the Finns

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06-24-2012, 10:03 AM
  #39
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not sure if there were any Swiss posters who posted, but I dont remember seeing many if any Swiss kids taken at this draft...kind of odd as there has been some pretty highly ranked ones the past few years...

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06-24-2012, 10:21 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by AmericanDream View Post
not sure if there were any Swiss posters who posted, but I dont remember seeing many if any Swiss kids taken at this draft...kind of odd as there has been some pretty highly ranked ones the past few years...
Bertchy and Richard as well as Bozon if you count him were drafted, though I can't recall where and when.

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06-24-2012, 10:48 AM
  #41
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Bertchy and Richard as well as Bozon if you count him were drafted, though I can't recall where and when.
Bozon represents France in hockey, so it makes no sense to count him as Swiss even though he used to play there.

Richard went I think in Round 2 and Bertschy in Round 5. It was a pretty succesful draft for the Swiss.

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06-24-2012, 11:04 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Rabid Ranger View Post
I think the U.S. stayed to form in recent years (national allegiance questions aside )

* 6 first round draft picks
* 9 second round draft picks
* 57 draft picks overall (+/- 1 or 2, I was going by NHL.com)

The USNTDP was well-represented as usual.
I still feel this is a pretty weak draft year for the US despite the fact there were more first rounders than expected. The difference between a guy picked between 20 and 30 and a guy picked between 30 and 40 is usually pretty negligible and we could have very easily ended up with only one US developed player taken in the first round.

I'm thrilled that Galchenyuk wants to play for the US but the fact remains that he's not a product of our development system and that means we still haven't produced a top ten caliber forward since the '07 draft (Wilson was developed by Canada). That's a major problem for a nation that wants to be considered elite and at this point I'd gladly trade in a whole bunch of our quality second/third line types for just a handful of elite talent.

We've got a huge number of kids playing hockey in this country and the results just don't match up with the numbers and all the resources we have at our disposal. Things really need to start turning around because I don't see the next Parise, Kessel, Ryan or Kane on the horizon with certainty right now. USA Hockey's ADM initiative doesn't seem to be meeting universal acceptance which is unfortunate because I think the thought behind it is pretty sound. If we could have the same relative level of success with the principles that the Swedes have had then we could very well propel US hockey forward a good deal.

That's my rant for the day.

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06-24-2012, 12:44 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by cagney View Post
I still feel this is a pretty weak draft year for the US despite the fact there were more first rounders than expected. The difference between a guy picked between 20 and 30 and a guy picked between 30 and 40 is usually pretty negligible and we could have very easily ended up with only one US developed player taken in the first round.

I'm thrilled that Galchenyuk wants to play for the US but the fact remains that he's not a product of our development system and that means we still haven't produced a top ten caliber forward since the '07 draft (Wilson was developed by Canada). That's a major problem for a nation that wants to be considered elite and at this point I'd gladly trade in a whole bunch of our quality second/third line types for just a handful of elite talent.

We've got a huge number of kids playing hockey in this country and the results just don't match up with the numbers and all the resources we have at our disposal. Things really need to start turning around because I don't see the next Parise, Kessel, Ryan or Kane on the horizon with certainty right now. USA Hockey's ADM initiative doesn't seem to be meeting universal acceptance which is unfortunate because I think the thought behind it is pretty sound. If we could have the same relative level of success with the principles that the Swedes have had then we could very well propel US hockey forward a good deal.

That's my rant for the day.
Interesting post... Perhaps a glass is half empty viewpoint but not totally without merit and it got me to do a little digging.

I think to add to your point, at the risk of going totally off topic, one thing stands out. As both raw numbers and as a percentage more Americans are playing in the NHL than ever before but the numbers that are in say the top 25, 50, 100 & 200 of the scoring race is pretty much stagnate when compared to a decade ago. Obviously scoring/points isn't everything but I think we can all agree that it is pretty importantant when talking about high end/skilled players.

2011-2012 Season

Total Skaters: 894
American Skaters: 219
% of American Skaters: 24.5

Americans in the Top...
25: 3
50: 8
100: 18
200: 34

2001-2002 Season

Total Skaters: 874
American Skaters: 139
% of American Skaters: 15.9

Americans in the Top...
25: 3
50: 10
100: 16
200: 30

So the increase in the quantity of American talent playing in the NHL has been pretty impressive but it really doesn't seem to have resulted in an increase of high end quality.

I guess it would be fair to point out that I'm comparing this current group of American players to probably at this point the most impressive generation of American players who had their prime from the early 90's up to the lockout.


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Old
06-24-2012, 02:18 PM
  #44
cagney
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Originally Posted by CoolForumNamePending View Post
Interesting post... Perhaps a glass is half empty viewpoint but not totally without merit and it got me to do a little digging.

I think to add to your point, at the risk of going totally off topic, one thing stands out. As both raw numbers and as a percentage more Americans are playing in the NHL than ever before but the numbers that are in say the top 25, 50, 100 & 200 of the scoring race is pretty much stagnate when compared to a decade ago. Obviously scoring/points isn't everything but I think we can all agree that it is pretty importantant when talking about high end/skilled players.

2011-2012 Season

Total Skaters: 894
American Skaters: 219
% of American Skaters: 24.5

Americans in the Top...
25: 3
50: 8
100: 18
200: 34

2001-2002 Season

Total Skaters: 874
American Skaters: 139
% of American Skaters: 15.9

Americans in the Top...
25: 3
50: 10
100: 16
200: 30

So the increase in the quantity of American talent playing in the NHL has been pretty impressive but it really doesn't seem to have resulted in an increase of high end quality.

I guess it would be fair to point out that I'm comparing this current group of American players to probably at this point the most impressive generation of American players who had their prime from the early 90's up to the lockout.
Well I'm the resident pessimist among fans of US hockey but I think that my point is valid and what you're pointing out is cerainly an indicator of what I'm saying.

The big reason for the increase in American players in the league is the fact that many Europeans who'd be filling depth roles in the NHL are simply staying in Europe. The period between the years you've mentioned also happens to be a period where the first strong generation of US hockey players was nearing the end of their careers while a new group was coming up. The thing that worries me is that over the last few years the players coming up haven't matched either of the two great surges of US hockey players IMO. It's possible that this is just a down cycle but I'd like to see a future where the US can consistently put out the quality of players that are put out during peak years. I don't see why that shouldn't be possible considering what we have to work with.

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Old
06-24-2012, 02:25 PM
  #45
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Old
06-24-2012, 07:09 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by AmericanDream View Post
this draft might be another eye opener to many of the US kids that think going to the CHL is going to make them NHL stars or higher draft picks...

really not the case at all as many of the top US kids were the USNDP players, as well as USHL and US Highschoolers....

many of the kids that went to the CHL went much later then expected, or didnt get drafted at all in regards to Iafrate, Donnay, Corbett, Petaccio, etc...

those kids that spurn the USNDP, seem to be the ones that are regretting it at the draft...what they do after the draft is up to them, but again when you play for the USNDP, it seems you have a better chance at getting drafted and drafted higher then going to the CHL....

Samuelsson was a USNDP team member as well before going to the CHL....

kind of surprised Quentin Shore went unpicked as well...a few USNDP players did not get selected like Shore, Vatrano, Darcy, Koules, etc so it isnt a given to get picked, though I have no clue how Vatrano did not get picked
LOL, so many things wrong here.... Perhaps those players weren't good enough to be drafted? being that they moved to the best junior league in the world I would think they didn't stop developing or lack exposure. Perhaps the added exposure exploited weaknesses in their games teams didn't like.

Or,

Maybe,

It's,

All,

A big,

Conspiracy against the USNDP and all the NHL teams, Elvis, and the Aliens are in on it???

I think it's fair to say Samuelsson's value rose quite a bit after leaving the USNDP. and the other 3 leagues he played in before coming to the CHL.

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06-24-2012, 07:21 PM
  #47
AmericanDream
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LOL, so many things wrong here.... Perhaps those players weren't good enough to be drafted? being that they moved to the best junior league in the world I would think they didn't stop developing or lack exposure. Perhaps the added exposure exploited weaknesses in their games teams didn't like.

Or,

Maybe,

It's,

All,

A big,

Conspiracy against the USNDP and all the NHL teams, Elvis, and the Aliens are in on it???

I think it's fair to say Samuelsson's value rose quite a bit after leaving the USNDP. and the other 3 leagues he played in before coming to the CHL.
not really going to dignify much of your post, but many of those kids were highly touted US kids that were invited to USNDP tryouts....if some of them stayed and went to the USNDP, I think its a safe assumption that a kid like Iafrate would have been drafted by an NHL team...

the fact remains that people keep telling many of these kids and parents that the CHL is the better route, I am pointing out that by the numbers, that isnt really the case for many US kids... next year will be an even bigger test with the amount of US kids playing in the CHL...

As for your Samuelsson post, you clearly do not follow these kids nor should you be commenting on them when your going to make a comment about his value rising after leaving the USNDP...he never reached the level he was with the USNDP (mid to high first round ranked) at any stop when he left the USNDP.... infact he almost fell of the radar completely when he went to play in Sweden...

give yourself a headshake....nah, I'll do it for you

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06-24-2012, 07:49 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by cagney View Post
I still feel this is a pretty weak draft year for the US despite the fact there were more first rounders than expected. The difference between a guy picked between 20 and 30 and a guy picked between 30 and 40 is usually pretty negligible and we could have very easily ended up with only one US developed player taken in the first round.

I'm thrilled that Galchenyuk wants to play for the US but the fact remains that he's not a product of our development system and that means we still haven't produced a top ten caliber forward since the '07 draft (Wilson was developed by Canada). That's a major problem for a nation that wants to be considered elite and at this point I'd gladly trade in a whole bunch of our quality second/third line types for just a handful of elite talent.

We've got a huge number of kids playing hockey in this country and the results just don't match up with the numbers and all the resources we have at our disposal. Things really need to start turning around because I don't see the next Parise, Kessel, Ryan or Kane on the horizon with certainty right now. USA Hockey's ADM initiative doesn't seem to be meeting universal acceptance which is unfortunate because I think the thought behind it is pretty sound. If we could have the same relative level of success with the principles that the Swedes have had then we could very well propel US hockey forward a good deal.

That's my rant for the day.
not sure I understand the bolded part.....

Trouba, Skjei, Schmaltz and Samuelsson spent their entire life in the US..... Matteau and Galy are the only 2 that didnt.... are you saying that the US would have only had Trouba and Galchenyuk as 1st round picks?? because otherwise, not really following you here

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06-24-2012, 08:10 PM
  #49
cagney
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not sure I understand the bolded part.....

Trouba, Skjei, Schmaltz and Samuelsson spent their entire life in the US..... Matteau and Galy are the only 2 that didnt.... are you saying that the US would have only had Trouba and Galchenyuk as 1st round picks?? because otherwise, not really following you here
My point is that the guys picked in those last parts of the first round are usually more equivalent in value to the guys taken in the second round than the guys taken in the first half of the first round. US hockey can pat itself on the back all it wants about how there were six Americans taken in the first round but when you look at the players and what their upside really is the picture is more bleak than it would seem at first glance. I look at the top players we've been producing for quite a few years now and in all but a few cases I see relatively limited upside. Perhaps you'd just consider it my opinion but there's a chance that within the next decade we could be looking at a lull like we experienced with the mid 70's to early 80's birth years.

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06-24-2012, 08:29 PM
  #50
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My point is that the guys picked in those last parts of the first round are usually more equivalent in value to the guys taken in the second round than the guys taken in the first half of the first round. US hockey can pat itself on the back all it wants about how there were six Americans taken in the first round but when you look at the players and what their upside really is the picture is more bleak than it would seem at first glance. I look at the top players we've been producing for quite a few years now and in all but a few cases I see relatively limited upside. Perhaps you'd just consider it my opinion but there's a chance that within the next decade we could be looking at a lull like we experienced with the mid 70's to early 80's birth years.
every draft since the 1990's, USA has usually had more players taken towards the end of the first round then the beginning..

the 2010 draft, arguably our best ever didnt even have a top 10 American picked....and most of those kids are panning out very nicely, including many second rounders. that draft is going to carry the US like the 2003 draft has....

I get overzealous with top 10 picks as well, I put too much emphasis on them and importance, but at the end of the day I dont really care where in the first round they go, just as long as we are getting top 30-45 picks... so many 1st rounders bust, even kids in the top 10, I am more then happy with having the Pavelski, Ryan Miller, Dustin Byfuglien's of the world...the ones that just make it to the NHL..but were picked in the later rounds

also to your last point, the 95 birth year on up is going to be our deepest pool of kids, possibly ever. I dont see what you are talking about happening as the growth of the game will be truly seen from those birth years, and starting in the 2013 draft we should have a number of top 15 picks


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