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Ryan hopes to be traded to Flyers

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Old
06-24-2012, 07:10 PM
  #226
ayshplaysh
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I would honestly prefer not moving for Ryan, losing Jagr isn't going to create as big a hole as people must think it will, this team had the 3rd most goals scored last year, why are we worried about obtaining a winger like Ryan? If it comes at the cost of our core, Giroux, Schenn, Couturier, or Coburn, then no we shouldn't make any move for him.

The most we should offer is two of Voracek, Meszaros, Read, with a pick and prospect, anymore then that and we're doing more damage then we are good.

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06-24-2012, 07:18 PM
  #227
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I'd be extremely disappointed if Coburn is dealt.


On top of that, we REALLY need to stop dealing players who agree to extensions with us. We might as well say "we appreciate your loyalty, now go play somewhere else"

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06-24-2012, 07:21 PM
  #228
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I would NOT trade Coburn. The most I would do is Voracek, Meszaros, 2013 1st and 2013 2nd/3rd

Sign Suter for 7 years, 52 million

Sign Gaustad for 3 years, 3.75 million

Sign Biron for 2 years, 2.15 million

CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Brayden*Schenn ($3.110m) / Claude*Giroux ($3.750m) / Bobby*Ryan ($5.100m)
Scott*Hartnell ($4.200m) / Danny*Briere ($6.500m) / Matt*Read ($0.900m)
Wayne*Simmonds ($1.750m) / Sean*Couturier ($1.375m) / Eric*Wellwood ($0.580m)
Zac*Rinaldo ($0.544m) / Paul*Gaustad ($1.250m) / Maxime*Talbot ($1.750m)
DEFENSEMEN
Braydon*Coburn ($4.500m) / Ryan*Suter ($7.400m)
Luke*Schenn ($3.600m) / Kimmo*Timonen ($6.333m)
Nicklas*Grossmann ($3.500m) / Andreas*Lilja ($0.738m)
Erik*Gustafsson ($0.975m) /
GOALTENDERS
Ilya*Bryzgalov ($5.667m)
Martin*Biron ($1.075m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $70,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,596,944; BONUSES: $2,705,000
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $8,408,056

This also leaves open the cap space to potentially sign a guy like Parise or Semin, or Jagr.


Last edited by orange is better: 06-24-2012 at 07:46 PM.
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06-24-2012, 07:30 PM
  #229
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orange is better View Post
I would NOT trade Coburn. The most I would do is Voracek, Meszaros, 2013 1st and 2013 2nd/3rd
i think meszaros had a bad year like schenn but with him being paired up with grossman and schenn with timms would make them solid, with mab and a cheaper descent defensemen, i dont like coburn, he doesnt hit, doesnt have a good shot, get's lost when goals were scored against, if you look at his +- stats, he's not that good defensively and he's just matt carle with a bigger body.

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06-24-2012, 07:30 PM
  #230
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orange is better View Post
I would NOT trade Coburn. The most I would do is Voracek, Meszaros, 2013 1st and 2013 2nd/3rd
Why do we even want to give up this much for a player who didn't even hit 60 points last year?

I understand Ryan's talent level, but I think we are talking about offering too much. It might be correct in value, but not what is right for this team.

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06-24-2012, 07:57 PM
  #231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toughfighter83 View Post
i think meszaros had a bad year like schenn but with him being paired up with grossman and schenn with timms would make them solid, with mab and a cheaper descent defensemen, i dont like coburn, he doesnt hit, doesnt have a good shot, get's lost when goals were scored against, if you look at his +- stats, he's not that good defensively and he's just matt carle with a bigger body.
Coburn comes alive in the playoffs and when paired with Grossmann they form our best shut down d-pairing on the team by far.

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06-24-2012, 08:06 PM
  #232
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toughfighter83 View Post
i think meszaros had a bad year like schenn but with him being paired up with grossman and schenn with timms would make them solid, with mab and a cheaper descent defensemen, i dont like coburn, he doesnt hit, doesnt have a good shot, get's lost when goals were scored against, if you look at his +- stats, he's not that good defensively and he's just matt carle with a bigger body.
Whomp whomp

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06-24-2012, 08:12 PM
  #233
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RIPRichardsCarter View Post
Why do we even want to give up this much for a player who didn't even hit 60 points last year?

I understand Ryan's talent level, but I think we are talking about offering too much. It might be correct in value, but not what is right for this team.
That's how I feel about it. He played with Getzlaf and Perry and scored 60 points. Him and Giroux could be great but I don't think he offsets what we would be losing mainly on the backend. He would be great in the orange and black and I'm a big fan of his but without JVR to move its just not in the cards IMO.

To me you try and throw money at Suter first, maybe he will change his mind by July 1st is those rumors were true, then try Parise, if not then look to replace Jagr's spot if hes not interested in returning or a similar free agent piece out there.

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06-24-2012, 08:21 PM
  #234
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I'm in no way saying this will happen, but just imagine if something like this came into being...

CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Bobby Ryan ($5.100m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Zach Parise ($7.200m)
Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Danny Briere ($6.500m)
Wayne Simmonds ($1.750m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Tom Sestito ($0.750m) / Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Eric Wellwood ($0.580m)
Zac Rinaldo ($0.544m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Matt Carle ($4.550m)
Braydon Coburn ($4.500m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Milan Jurcina ($2.600m) / Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m)
Andreas Lilja ($0.738m) /
GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.667m)
Michael Leighton ($0.800m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $70,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $69,796,944; BONUSES: $2,705,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $503,056

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06-24-2012, 08:33 PM
  #235
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orange is better View Post
I would NOT trade Coburn. The most I would do is Voracek, Meszaros, 2013 1st and 2013 2nd/3rd

Sign Suter for 7 years, 52 million

Sign Gaustad for 3 years, 3.75 million

Sign Biron for 2 years, 2.15 million

CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Brayden*Schenn ($3.110m) / Claude*Giroux ($3.750m) / Bobby*Ryan ($5.100m)
Scott*Hartnell ($4.200m) / Danny*Briere ($6.500m) / Matt*Read ($0.900m)
Wayne*Simmonds ($1.750m) / Sean*Couturier ($1.375m) / Eric*Wellwood ($0.580m)
Zac*Rinaldo ($0.544m) / Paul*Gaustad ($1.250m) / Maxime*Talbot ($1.750m)
DEFENSEMEN
Braydon*Coburn ($4.500m) / Ryan*Suter ($7.400m)
Luke*Schenn ($3.600m) / Kimmo*Timonen ($6.333m)
Nicklas*Grossmann ($3.500m) / Andreas*Lilja ($0.738m)
Erik*Gustafsson ($0.975m) /
GOALTENDERS
Ilya*Bryzgalov ($5.667m)
Martin*Biron ($1.075m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $70,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,596,944; BONUSES: $2,705,000
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $8,408,056

This also leaves open the cap space to potentially sign a guy like Parise or Semin, or Jagr.

I see 0% chance Suter comes here.

I see 0% chance Gaustad signs for that little and is happy playing on the 4th line.

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06-24-2012, 08:37 PM
  #236
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Originally Posted by sobrien View Post
I see 0% chance Suter comes here.

I see 0% chance Gaustad signs for that little and is happy playing on the 4th line.
I don't think suter will sign here either, but it's worth throwing at him as much as we can afford to, because allegedly, the rumors about him not wanting to play in the east were exaggerated.

Also, I'm not too familiar with Gaustads previous contracts or what he's valued to go for on July 1st. Who would you suggest for a faceoff specialist 4th line guy with some size?

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06-24-2012, 08:42 PM
  #237
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sobrien View Post
I see 0% chance Suter comes here.

I see 0% chance Gaustad signs for that little and is happy playing on the 4th line.
I also agree that Suter won't come here. I see him going to Pitt before here.

I thought Gaustad was a fourth line player that will take key face offs and play on the pk? I agree though that he wouldn't take that little of a contract. He is the top player I want for the fourth line center this off season. Bring in him and Ott to round out the bottom six.

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06-24-2012, 08:42 PM
  #238
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Originally Posted by toughfighter83 View Post
i think meszaros had a bad year like schenn but with him being paired up with grossman and schenn with timms would make them solid, with mab and a cheaper descent defensemen, i dont like coburn, he doesnt hit, doesnt have a good shot, get's lost when goals were scored against, if you look at his +- stats, he's not that good defensively and he's just matt carle with a bigger body.
Respectfully i disagree with your Coburn thoughts....He and Grossman together were really a thing of beauty to watch even though they only played together for such a short time..Coburn like Briere is a SOLID playoff performer in my opinion.I will agree that during the season he has his moments of not being physical enough, but do we really know if he is not ailing at times during the long season ?

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06-24-2012, 08:43 PM
  #239
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orange is better View Post
I don't think suter will sign here either, but it's worth throwing at him as much as we can afford to, because allegedly, the rumors about him not wanting to play in the east were exaggerated.

Also, I'm not too familiar with Gaustads previous contracts or what he's valued to go for on July 1st. Who would you suggest for a faceoff specialist 4th line guy with some size?

Nobody. We have plenty of forwards, and a couple of nice bottom six guys to use there. You don't need one of those guys to win. Wellwood, Couturier and Talbot, that's who I would suggest.

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06-24-2012, 08:46 PM
  #240
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giroux tha Damaja View Post
Nobody. We have plenty of forwards, and a couple of nice bottom six guys to use there. You don't need one of those guys to win. Wellwood, Couturier and Talbot, that's who I would suggest.
I would much rather move Talbot to wing where he is better suited and get a good fourth line center to win key faceoffs for this team. Gaustad would be perfect but would cost in the 2.5 range. Wellwood will have a hard time making the team and Couts I am hoping will win the 2nd or 3rd line center duties.

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06-24-2012, 08:46 PM
  #241
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Originally Posted by Giroux tha Damaja View Post
Nobody. We have plenty of forwards, and a couple of nice bottom six guys to use there. You don't need one of those guys to win. Wellwood, Couturier and Talbot, that's who I would suggest.
I disagree. I dont want couturier playing on the 4th line again. Talbot
Is OK in the circle but not good enough, and Wellwood is completely inexperienced in the role. I'd rather have a veteran faceoff guy who has been in the position before, and move talbot to the 4th line wing.

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06-24-2012, 08:47 PM
  #242
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SgtJoseph View Post
Respectfully i disagree with your Coburn thoughts....He and Grossman together were really a thing of beauty to watch even though they only played together for such a short time..Coburn like Briere is a SOLID playoff performer in my opinion. I will agree that during the season he has his moments of not being physical enough, but do we really know if he is not ailing at times during the long season ?
He's missed two games in his last three seasons (8 games in his last five years). He's certainly played through a lot of little things. On top of that he's been playing 20+ minutes a night for all of those games for a long time now. I would be surprised if he's not pacing himself somewhat. All I know is, when **** gets real, his game wakes up. I love angry/play-off Coburn.


Last edited by Giroux tha Damaja: 06-24-2012 at 09:16 PM. Reason: fixed a double negative
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06-24-2012, 08:47 PM
  #243
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Originally Posted by orange is better View Post
I don't think suter will sign here either, but it's worth throwing at him as much as we can afford to, because allegedly, the rumors about him not wanting to play in the east were exaggerated.

Also, I'm not too familiar with Gaustads previous contracts or what he's valued to go for on July 1st. Who would you suggest for a faceoff specialist 4th line guy with some size?

He has had similar ice time and production to Manny Malhotra over his career. Malhotra signed for 3 years and $7.5 M in 2010.

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06-24-2012, 08:49 PM
  #244
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Originally Posted by orange is better View Post
I don't think suter will sign here either, but it's worth throwing at him as much as we can afford to, because allegedly, the rumors about him not wanting to play in the east were exaggerated.

Also, I'm not too familiar with Gaustads previous contracts or what he's valued to go for on July 1st. Who would you suggest for a faceoff specialist 4th line guy with some size?
Not overly worried about size or faceoff specialists. But McClement, Moore, Mitchell for Centers, or Prust if we keep Talbot at 4C. Moore was 19th in faceoffs, McClement 44th, Mitchell a bit lower...though he can fly. McClement has SOME size, and Moore is a vet who steps it up when it counts. All of them PK.

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06-24-2012, 08:56 PM
  #245
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orange is better View Post
I disagree. I dont want couturier playing on the 4th line again. Talbot
Is OK in the circle but not good enough, and Wellwood is completely inexperienced in the role. I'd rather have a veteran faceoff guy who has been in the position before, and move talbot to the 4th line wing.
My point is that, while I agree with everything you're saying, you can't build the perfect team. The player that is a perfect fit for that role isn't on the team, and you don't need one of those guys in order to be successful. They've got enough forward talent. If anything I could see them maybe adding one vet guy like a Powe or Janik Hansen or something. Good wheels, unremarkable skill set, but hustles to get **** done. But I really don't think they need to go and get a specialist.

I understand where you're coming from, and think you've got a legit point, especially with how much the forward corp struggled to pull their weight defensively last year. But I think the problem needs to be addressed with time and coaching. They have young guys on the team right now who need to improve their defense but have shown some real ability at it. Improvement and maturity as a group is what I would count on if I were Holmgren, as opposed to addressing every deficit with a roster move. He's gotten a good blend of vets and young talent, and assembled a good coaching staff. Now leave the major moving pieces of the machine alone for a while and restrict the roster moves to minor maintenance. Let them gel.

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06-24-2012, 09:14 PM
  #246
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sobrien View Post
Not overly worried about size or faceoff specialists. But McClement, Moore, Mitchell for Centers, or Prust if we keep Talbot at 4C. Moore was 19th in faceoffs, McClement 44th, Mitchell a bit lower...though he can fly. McClement has SOME size, and Moore is a vet who steps it up when it counts. All of them PK.
I would love adding one of Dominic Moore or Sean Bergenhiem. Both of those guys are post season bad ***** that would add to the group of guys we already have who consistently up their game in Coburn, Briere, Giroux and Talbot.

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06-24-2012, 09:44 PM
  #247
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Originally Posted by flyersfan187 View Post
I also agree that Suter won't come here. I see him going to Pitt before here.
No matter how much it would be amazing if Suter and Parise would sign here and we could get Ryan, It is possible that Suter will either want to stay out west or sign with PIT - would could result in Parise signing where ever he signs. We might have to try to sign both to get either one which could easily result in overpaying for Ryan to make cap space (sounds like a Homer move).

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06-24-2012, 10:02 PM
  #248
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Originally Posted by Broad Street Elite View Post
Wait, you think Staal who refused to sign, was one year away from Free Agency, and who has been outscored by Ryan 249-178 over the last 4 seasons should command more than Ryan?

You do realize that Bobby Ryan is really, really good right and signed to an extremely reasonable deal for 3 more seasons, right?
Sure the Pens had less leverage with Staal, but considering how outspoken Ryan has been lately, the Ducks leverage is dwindling. Also, Ryan has been playing first line minutes for the past four years with two great players, Staal hasn't, but when Staal has played top six minutes the past two seasons while Crosby and Malkin were injured, Staal averaged the same points per game. Also, Staal is miles ahead defensively, and plays a more important position. Ryan's value is ridiculous right now.

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06-24-2012, 11:12 PM
  #249
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Sure the Pens had less leverage with Staal, but considering how outspoken Ryan has been lately, the Ducks leverage is dwindling. Also, Ryan has been playing first line minutes for the past four years with two great players, Staal hasn't, but when Staal has played top six minutes the past two seasons while Crosby and Malkin were injured, Staal averaged the same points per game. Also, Staal is miles ahead defensively, and plays a more important position. Ryan's value is ridiculous right now.
Staal essentially could only be traded to a couple teams in the whole league.... where his brother's played. Ryan, even if he could force a trade, would still be desired by at least a dozen teams.

Even if, as you claim, Staal is considerably better than Ryan, the contract situation levels or nearly levels that playing field. therefore, at worst, Ryan commands a similar value to Staal and, in my opinion, more of one because while their skillsets are considerably different, I think their overall talent (removing the contract factor) is probably reasonably similar with Ryan being a better offensive player and Staal being a better defensive player.

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06-24-2012, 11:16 PM
  #250
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Im sick of all this speculation. I really just want us to acquire him or not. Has there been any word about Murray meeting with him face to face like he said he would after the draft?

Also if Ryan gets traded, I feel it will be right before free agency begins or after the big boys sign where they sign. I fear this week will be slow for any Flyers news.

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