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Pittsburgh Interested in Ryan Suter's Rights

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Old
06-24-2012, 09:03 PM
  #101
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Originally Posted by SinfulCobraZ View Post
I thought about it and considering our glaring need for a winger for Sid, I think we sign Parise but instead of Suter we go for Shultz. He's got great potential and has what it takes to become a top pairing guy. He will be cheaper and better for the future when we need to extend Malkin and Letang. The only problem I would think Shultz would have is not being able to play with Gardiner but I think he'd take the cup chance over Gardiner....?
I'd rather sign Parise also. The D was good most of the tear just took a **** in the playoffs. I just can't stop thinking about Sid and Zach playing together!!!! Please Ray get this done!!

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06-24-2012, 09:45 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Ragamuffin Gunner View Post
So you went from:

"You can't sign Suter!!!!'
to
"You can't trade martin!!!!"
to
"You can't re-sign your guys after their ELCs!!!"

Pens should prolly just forfeit the season.
Actually I didn't go from anything.

I said you couldn't sign Suter because you would literally be cap screwed, and you will be. Around $64M with seven players still unsigned. That's AFTER you trade Martin to whoever's stupid enough to take him (And he can rule out eight teams) and you still have to take into account that the cap is more that likely going down, likely by a minimum of $3-4M. Then add in the fact that you'll have to raise any prospects in a few years.

Those reasons still stand, I'm just piling on others. But do continue to trick yourself into the idea that you've actually found a way to get both of them.

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06-24-2012, 10:19 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
Actually I didn't go from anything.

I said you couldn't sign Suter because you would literally be cap screwed, and you will be. Around $64M with seven players still unsigned. That's AFTER you trade Martin to whoever's stupid enough to take him (And he can rule out eight teams) and you still have to take into account that the cap is more that likely going down, likely by a minimum of $3-4M. Then add in the fact that you'll have to raise any prospects in a few years.

Those reasons still stand, I'm just piling on others. But do continue to trick yourself into the idea that you've actually found a way to get both of them.
... and when has the Pens cap situation ever been "screwed" ?

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06-24-2012, 11:03 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
Actually I didn't go from anything.

I said you couldn't sign Suter because you would literally be cap screwed, and you will be. Around $64M with seven players still unsigned. That's AFTER you trade Martin to whoever's stupid enough to take him (And he can rule out eight teams) and you still have to take into account that the cap is more that likely going down, likely by a minimum of $3-4M. Then add in the fact that you'll have to raise any prospects in a few years.

Those reasons still stand, I'm just piling on others. But do continue to trick yourself into the idea that you've actually found a way to get both of them.
The only reason I see here is that you are a Wings fan because I haven't seen any other team's fans so "worried" about OUR cap situation.

Also, look a few pages back and collect info from various other educated posts by other Pens fans for what our cap situation is like and why we wouldn't be in trouble so I don't have to spend my time typing it up all over again. Also, just to assure you, we aren't guaranteed to sign both or either of them so there's no need to worry.

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06-24-2012, 11:24 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by Superunknown94 View Post
... and when has the Pens cap situation ever been "screwed" ?
When did I said it has been? I said it will be.

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06-24-2012, 11:25 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
Actually I didn't go from anything.

I said you couldn't sign Suter because you would literally be cap screwed, and you will be. Around $64M with seven players still unsigned. That's AFTER you trade Martin to whoever's stupid enough to take him (And he can rule out eight teams) and you still have to take into account that the cap is more that likely going down, likely by a minimum of $3-4M. Then add in the fact that you'll have to raise any prospects in a few years.

Those reasons still stand, I'm just piling on others. But do continue to trick yourself into the idea that you've actually found a way to get both of them.
I'm so glad that a Wings fan is so concerned with the Pens cap situation.

Thank you for your wonderful insight.

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06-24-2012, 11:29 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by Ragamuffin Gunner View Post
I'm so glad that a Wings fan is so concerned with the Pens cap situation.

Thank you for your wonderful insight.
Somebody's gotta analyze it, because you clearly didn't.

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06-24-2012, 11:53 PM
  #108
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People are getting so upset at the prospect of us getting the top UFAs.

Worry about your own team and your own problems, Wings fans. Like trying to convince somebody like Suter or Parise to come to an aging team.

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06-24-2012, 11:59 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by Zbynek View Post
Like trying to convince somebody like Suter or Parise to come to an aging* team.
*With one player over 33.

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06-25-2012, 12:08 AM
  #110
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*With one player over 33.
People haven't quite put together what the whole Lidstrom and Homer leaving will do to the favorite Wings put down. Z, Datsyuk, Franzen and Kronwall are all on the wrong side of 30 but have good years left and considerable tread on their tires considering they came to the league and longer schedules later than most prospects/players.

Will be funny to see their average age next year. Face it over the last two seasons they have gotten rid of a bunch of very old players in Draper, Rafalski, Lidstrom, Homer, Ozzie all of which while still functional players really helped push that age number up considerably in the average.

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06-25-2012, 07:54 AM
  #111
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Listening live to Shero on WDVE in Pittsburgh

Just said he's not trading for any players rights. Period.

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06-25-2012, 08:03 AM
  #112
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Originally Posted by SuburbanRhythm View Post
Listening live to Shero on WDVE in Pittsburgh

Just said he's not trading for any players rights. Period.
and i don't think he should.

IMO, i'm not expecting anything huge from the Pens on Sunday. if they sign one of Parise or Suter, awesome. if not, well, at least i didn't get my hopes up.

also, IMO, i think Suter will sign with the Wings/Wild and Parise will either re-up with the Devils or sign to the other team among the Wings/Wild who doesn't land Parise. i don't think the Pens are gonna be among his top choices or among the top bidders salary-wise as people speculate but i really hope i'm wrong.

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06-25-2012, 08:08 AM
  #113
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And please don't judge pens fans from the absurd comments made by a select few...

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06-25-2012, 08:11 AM
  #114
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Originally Posted by SteelCitySaviour View Post
And please don't judge pens fans from the absurd comments made by a select few...
with this forum, though, it's hard to find someone who doesn't like the Pens who isn't hard on their fans.

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06-25-2012, 09:23 AM
  #115
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Originally Posted by SuburbanRhythm View Post
Listening live to Shero on WDVE in Pittsburgh

Just said he's not trading for any players rights. Period.
Yeah, and with what Poile would want for him it's not even close to being worth it.

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06-25-2012, 09:34 AM
  #116
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Originally Posted by Ragamuffin Gunner View Post
I'm so glad that a Wings fan is so concerned with the Pens cap situation.

Thank you for your wonderful insight.
By way of education of the masses on the Pens cap situation, here it is:

XXXXX-Crosby-Dupuis
Kunitz-Malkin-Neal
Cooke-Sutter-Kennedy
XXXXX-Vitale-Adams
Jeffrey

Orpik-Letang
Martin-XXXXX
XXXXX-Englland
XXXXX

Now, let's say, for the sake of argument, the Pens moved Paul Martin in a pure salary dump, which they would be able to do, from all accounts I've seen.

At that point, the Pens have almost 20 million in cap space.

Now, say they signed Suter and Parise for up to 15M combined.

Say they allocate 1.5M between their fourth line LW and their reserve D and then slot Simon Despres and Matt Niskanen in.

Uh oh, the Pens have the money to offer Suter and Parise each up to 7.5M per . . .

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06-25-2012, 09:35 AM
  #117
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Originally Posted by psupens View Post
and i don't think he should.

IMO, i'm not expecting anything huge from the Pens on Sunday. if they sign one of Parise or Suter, awesome. if not, well, at least i didn't get my hopes up.

also, IMO, i think Suter will sign with the Wings/Wild and Parise will either re-up with the Devils or sign to the other team among the Wings/Wild who doesn't land Parise. i don't think the Pens are gonna be among his top choices or among the top bidders salary-wise as people speculate but i really hope i'm wrong.
Nobody is going to touch what Minny will offer Parise. And, I suspect someone will offer Suter up to 8M. That said, the Pens can go north of 7M for either or both.

That doesn't mean EITHER will sign with the Pens. But, it's hardly a long shot.

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06-25-2012, 09:37 AM
  #118
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rut roh

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Old
06-25-2012, 11:02 AM
  #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KIRK View Post
By way of education of the masses on the Pens cap situation, here it is:

XXXXX-Crosby-Dupuis
Kunitz-Malkin-Neal
Cooke-Sutter-Kennedy
XXXXX-Vitale-Adams
Jeffrey

Orpik-Letang
Martin-XXXXX
XXXXX-Englland
XXXXX

Now, let's say, for the sake of argument, the Pens moved Paul Martin in a pure salary dump, which they would be able to do, from all accounts I've seen.

At that point, the Pens have almost 20 million in cap space.

Now, say they signed Suter and Parise for up to 15M combined.

Say they allocate 1.5M between their fourth line LW and their reserve D and then slot Simon Despres and Matt Niskanen in.

Uh oh, the Pens have the money to offer Suter and Parise each up to 7.5M per . . .
And say the CBA doesn't lower the cap and Letang and all of their prospects never plan on taking raises.

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06-25-2012, 11:18 AM
  #120
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Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
Actually I didn't go from anything.

I said you couldn't sign Suter because you would literally be cap screwed, and you will be. Around $64M with seven players still unsigned. That's AFTER you trade Martin to whoever's stupid enough to take him (And he can rule out eight teams) and you still have to take into account that the cap is more that likely going down, likely by a minimum of $3-4M. Then add in the fact that you'll have to raise any prospects in a few years.

Those reasons still stand, I'm just piling on others. But do continue to trick yourself into the idea that you've actually found a way to get both of them.
We currently have $14,666,667 available in cap space. I personally think this all hinges on Martin being moved. If he is moved and possibly Kennedy as well that's at least $5m more freed-up. $7m if Kennedy leaves. But let's just say only Martin leaves. That gives up $19,666,667m to sign 6 players. $7m to both Parise and Suter leaves $5m for 4 players.

However, if we move players around and fit people in, we can get something like below;

Quote:
CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
James Neal ($5.000m) / Evgeni Malkin ($8.700m) / Pascal Dupuis ($1.500m)
Chris Kunitz ($3.725m) / Sidney Crosby ($8.700m) / Zach Parise ($7.000m)
Matt Cooke ($1.800m) / Brandon Sutter ($2.067m) / Tyler Kennedy ($2.000m)
Eric Tangradi ($0.726m) / Joe Vitale ($0.550m) / Arron Asham ($0.775m)
Craig Adams ($0.675m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Kris Letang ($3.500m) / Ryan Suter ($7.000m)
Brooks Orpik ($3.750m) / Matt Niskanen ($2.250m)
Deryk Engelland ($0.567m) / Simon Despres ($0.840m)
Brian Strait ($0.605m) /
GOALTENDERS
Marc-Andre Fleury ($5.000m)
Tomas Vokoun ($2.000m)
As Parise and Suter are likely to be long term deals we wouldn't have to worry about them for a while. Vokoun is on a two year contract, by then we may be able to promote one of our prospects meaning that $2m can go on Letang. With other players retiring etc, we'll be fine.

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06-25-2012, 11:18 AM
  #121
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Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
And say the CBA doesn't lower the cap and Letang and all of their prospects never plan on taking raises.
You act like those raises are gonna take place in the next few years. The Pens have enough time and players to move before that time comes.

Focus on Detroit ... we got this.

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06-25-2012, 11:23 AM
  #122
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You act like those raises are gonna take place in the next few years. The Pens have enough time and players to move before that time comes.

Focus on Detroit ... we got this.
The only raises we have to worry about in the next few years are Letang, Geno and Sid. If Sid takes the same as he does now due to his superstitions then Malkin will probably follow. Give Letang $2-$3m more and we're sorted.

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06-25-2012, 11:24 AM
  #123
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Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
And say the CBA doesn't lower the cap and Letang and all of their prospects never plan on taking raises.
Oh, they do. In two years, they'll need to come up with money for Letang and maybe one or two of those prospects.

Curiously, Orpik and Kunitz come off the books.

Then again, maybe three or four of those prospects need to get paid.

In that case, maybe they trade Letang if need be.

Take a really, really good look at how the Pens payroll projects out for the next few years and when certain contracts expire.

They can sign Suter and Parise to a combined 14.5M a year and their most immediate fear is that MAYBE they have to let Letang go in two years IF 3-4 of their A defensive prospects are bigger studs than they expect.

Maybe, next time, instead of going with a dim witted post and a smilie, you should try playing capologist to see if what I wrote was feasible. You might learn something. Then again, you might not.

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06-25-2012, 11:26 AM
  #124
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Originally Posted by Shrimper View Post
The only raises we have to worry about in the next few years are Letang, Geno and Sid. If Sid takes the same as he does now due to his superstitions then Malkin will probably follow. Give Letang $2-$3m more and we're sorted.
And, again, when Letang is due his raise (when Sutter also would be due), Orpik and Kunitz come off the books.

How to replace them. Well, you've got that half dozen A prospects who can play or will be assets that can be moved for young talented cheaper wingers.

Yeah, we're sorted. Only major fear is that in two years, then Pens might have so many good young defenseman looking at raises that we have to trade Letang. Wonder if we could get anything for him?

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06-25-2012, 11:31 AM
  #125
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Originally Posted by KIRK View Post
And, again, when Letang is due his raise (when Sutter also would be due), Orpik and Kunitz come off the books.

How to replace them. Well, you've got that half dozen A prospects who can play or will be assets that can be moved for young talented cheaper wingers.

Yeah, we're sorted. Only major fear is that in two years, then Pens might have so many good young defenseman looking at raises that we have to trade Letang. Wonder if we could get anything for him?
Don't think that fear will be realised as by then most of the current non-core players will be gone and replaced. Might be beneficial having so many D prospects to help us get a top 6 player.

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