HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Vancouver Canucks
Notices

Zack Kassian and Overcoming Adversity

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-26-2012, 08:39 PM
  #76
CanaFan
Registered User
 
CanaFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,520
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Swartzwelder View Post
How people can say that Kassian "dominated" the AHL, or has nothing left to prove there, i just dont know.

His stats were: 30GP 15G 11A 26Pts

"domination" would be 1.2 Pts/GP or higher, not .86

Small sample size notwithstanding, .5 GPG and .86 PPG as a 20 year old in the AHL is pretty much "dominating". That said, I think he *could* benefit from a full season just to gain confidence and continue to develop his game. My fear is a full season on AV's 4th line will pretty much end his progression and we'll develop a 4th line grinder instead of a top 6 power forward.

CanaFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 08:43 PM
  #77
pitseleh
Registered User
 
pitseleh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,643
vCash: 500
Logan Couture is the only 20 year old AHL rookie to hit 1.2 PPG in 30+ games in the last five seasons.

pitseleh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 08:53 PM
  #78
RobertKron
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 8,603
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by pitseleh View Post
Logan Couture is the only 20 year old AHL rookie to hit 1.2 PPG in 30+ games in the last five seasons.
Unrelatedly, is there a site with AHL stats that you can search through handily for stuff like this, or did you do this the long way? The AHL site's stats section is obnoxious.

RobertKron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 08:54 PM
  #79
pitseleh
Registered User
 
pitseleh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,643
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MW View Post
Unrelatedly, is there a site with AHL stats that you can search through handily for stuff like this, or did you do this the long way? The AHL site's stats section is obnoxious.
I went the long way - fortunately you can separate out rookies which made it pretty easy to check.

pitseleh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 09:00 PM
  #80
RobertKron
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 8,603
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by pitseleh View Post
I went the long way - fortunately you can separate out rookies which made it pretty easy to check.
Ah, good call.

RobertKron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 09:13 PM
  #81
BomChikaBulin
Registered User
 
BomChikaBulin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 256
vCash: 500
In regards to fighting, I definitely don't think he'll end up being the type of player to fight everything that moves, just because he can. We saw him last year turn down fights that could have possibly swung some momentum in the other teams favour, while we were up, and made the smart choice to not engage. In that sense, I think he's very smart in realizing when to fight or not.

BomChikaBulin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 09:15 PM
  #82
John Swartzwelder
MOAR TUFFNESS!!!1
 
John Swartzwelder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Victoria, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,359
vCash: 50
What does age/rookie status have to do with domination? a level of play is a level of play, 15 years old or 55 years old.

John Swartzwelder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 09:19 PM
  #83
CanaFan
Registered User
 
CanaFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,520
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Swartzwelder View Post
What does age/rookie status have to do with domination? a level of play is a level of play, 15 years old or 55 years old.

Nah, not really. A 20 y/o putting up a PPG is "dominating" much more than a 30 y/o putting up the same PPG, at least in the context of using it as an indicator of future NHL upside. Now in the "dominating is dominating is dominating" context, then technically you are correct but that isn't really what people are talking about here ...

CanaFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 09:55 PM
  #84
RobertKron
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 8,603
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Swartzwelder View Post
What does age/rookie status have to do with domination? a level of play is a level of play, 15 years old or 55 years old.
Because a 29 year old career AHL is already a finished product, often one that plays a game better suited to the AHL than the NHL.

A 20 year old rookie that is scoring .5GPG and doesn't have any really big holes in his game isn't going to pick up much more at the AHL level aside from how to score more goals against AHL players. You bump him up so he can continue along a proper development curve.

You wouldn't claim that a draft-age kid putting up PPG numbers in the WHL and an overager doing the same are at the same level, would you? The overager has had a couple extra years to learn the way the league works, and also to grow into his body. This is why a lot of guys who put up those numbers at 17 are highly-touted, while guys who do the same at 20 are often labelled as the dreaded "good junior player."

RobertKron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 10:36 PM
  #85
B-rock
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 2,019
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Swartzwelder View Post
What does age/rookie status have to do with domination? a level of play is a level of play, 15 years old or 55 years old.
I'd say it has everything to do with it.

For a rookie to come into the AHL and score at pretty much a PPG clip is pretty impressive. It usually takes a player that comes into a higher league some time to adjust. Consider Kesler in his first season in the AHL didn't do much of anything points-wise. For Kassian to come in and score the way he did shows that he's very capable of playing at that level and that he doesn't need a lot more seasoning to make it to the next level.

I don't see how you don't come to that conclusion?

B-rock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 10:43 PM
  #86
RobertKron
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 8,603
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by B-rock View Post
I'd say it has everything to do with it.

For a rookie to come into the AHL and score at pretty much a PPG clip is pretty impressive. It usually takes a player that comes into a higher league some time to adjust. Consider Kesler in his first season in the AHL didn't do much of anything points-wise. For Kassian to come in and score the way he did shows that he's very capable of playing at that level and that he doesn't need a lot more seasoning to make it to the next level.

I don't see how you don't come to that conclusion?
To be fair to Kesler, he was even younger - but he still ended up getting brought up to the NHL.

RobertKron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 11:05 PM
  #87
Outside99*
Sedins off Kas
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,347
vCash: 796
Quote:
Originally Posted by B-rock View Post
He's not that raw. He put up a PPG as a rookie in the AHL and knows his way around his own end. He looks fine to me actually. Just has to learn how to balance aggression with scoring and how and when to pick his spots.

We're not talking about Grenier here.
sometimes the stats don't tell the whole story (ex Gragnani 7 points in the NHL playoffs). in the nhl games i saw, he did not look anywhere near the polish of an NHLer ie looked lost, imo.

Who compared Kassian with Grenier? That makes no sense at all.

Outside99* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-27-2012, 12:44 AM
  #88
B-rock
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 2,019
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Outside99 View Post
sometimes the stats don't tell the whole story (ex Gragnani 7 points in the NHL playoffs). in the nhl games i saw, he did not look anywhere near the polish of an NHLer ie looked lost, imo.

Who compared Kassian with Grenier? That makes no sense at all.
I'm not talking about his NHL stats. He looked fine as a rookie NHL player on a new team, traded near seasons end. Consider that it takes veteran players time to adjust to a new team when they get traded and Kassian looked fine. With a summer and pre-season to train and become more familiar with the team and everything that goes along with it, he'll adjust.

Actually it makes a lot of sense given that you said that Kassian looked "extremely raw." Extremely raw would be if a kid like Grenier were thrown into NHL action. Kassian has some adjustments to make to a new team, and a new level of hockey, but he didn't look like he didn't know how to play hockey out there. You're assertions that he looked "raw and lost" are way off base in my opinion.

B-rock is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:49 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.