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Old
06-27-2012, 04:07 AM
  #1
Bonzai12
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Patrick Wiercioch

Hey Sens fans!

Avs fan coming in peace - just checking up on one of my favorite DU guys - Patrick Wiercioch - to see where's he at in your plans this year. Do you see him having a good shot at a spot on your club this year??? He was pretty raw at DU but I felt like he was going to be legit in the NHL. Just needs some time to grow out a bit and nail down some fundamentals.

Thanks in advance and good luck to you guys in FA and the upcoming season.

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06-27-2012, 04:58 AM
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As of right now he's probably going head to head with prospect Mark Borowiecki for a spot on the left side. That could change with free agency though.

I think Boro would have the inside track but just guessing.

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06-27-2012, 05:02 AM
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Tuna99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonzai12 View Post
Hey Sens fans!

Avs fan coming in peace - just checking up on one of my favorite DU guys - Patrick Wiercioch - to see where's he at in your plans this year. Do you see him having a good shot at a spot on your club this year??? He was pretty raw at DU but I felt like he was going to be legit in the NHL. Just needs some time to grow out a bit and nail down some fundamentals.

Thanks in advance and good luck to you guys in FA and the upcoming season.
He hasn't developed as quickly as most of us thought, and he's been passed on the depth chart by other D prospects, this year is a make or break for him - if he doesn't see NHL action this year as at least the #7 call-up he probably won't amount to more then a Brendan Bell type who was an excellent AHL Dman but only an emergency injury fill in NHL player.

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06-27-2012, 06:44 AM
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He's been training in Ottawa this offseason with his good buddy Turris. I'm really hoping they both come out flying in training camp.

It would be a nice story if he could make it after his accident.

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06-27-2012, 07:05 AM
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I could see him spending maybe 2 more years in the AHL and then forcing the hand of the big club.

Ideally, that's the development path I'd like the sens to take with him. Similar to what they did with JOB. The kid has talent, but there's no point in dropping this kind of player into a bottom pairing role. I'd rather he learn to be dominant in the AHL first and fix the holes in his game.

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06-27-2012, 07:27 AM
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His injury and Binghamton's overall lousy season really stalled his development.

I'm also not convinced Kleinendorst was the best guy to be developing young talent in the AHL, no disrespect to the man but I am glad he moved on.

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06-27-2012, 07:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuna99 View Post
He hasn't developed as quickly as most of us thought, and he's been passed on the depth chart by other D prospects, this year is a make or break for him - if he doesn't see NHL action this year as at least the #7 call-up he probably won't amount to more then a Brendan Bell type who was an excellent AHL Dman but only an emergency injury fill in NHL player.
This. Most of us really don't know how we'll develop so we're just guessing. No question last year was a tough year but he's a guy that I can see going either way - pretty solid NHL regular or career high quality AHLer. I hope he takes the next step but it's a wild guess at this point.

If he doesn't make the team out of camp I think a normal reaction (for fans) would be to conclude he's just not going to be as good as we hoped a few years ago, but working with Luke Richardson could be a great experience for him. Luke was a pretty good dman in his day and knew how to play the position. He could be a great influence on him imo. I won't be giving up on him even if Borowiecki passes him in camp.

He's definitely talented, I think most of us would agree with that.

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Old
06-27-2012, 08:08 AM
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Seems like the kind of guy who has enough skill to play in the league, but it's taking him longer than anticipated to really find his stride. You watch him, and in a vacuum you say to yourself "man, this kid is ready", but then you see him play in the Binghamton system, and it's clear he's not making the best decisions on the ice.

I think this kid is a LOT closer to Matt Gilroy than a lot of fans want to admit: has the tools, but the toolbox is lacking, somewhat. He seems like a guy who is VERY hesitant to showcase his full skills. Maybe that had something to do with the system that Kleinendorst ran in Bingo? Maybe it didn't mesh with him?

I think the one thing that is a positive is that he definitely looked comfortable as an OTTAWA Senator, in his few games with us. More so than he ever did in the ~30 dozen Bingo games I've seen him play in. So it could indeed be a case of a guy who, to a degree, "plays to his competition": plays better against elite guys than he does against AHL-lifers and other NHL-bound rookies.

In any case, if Richardson can get some confidence in Weir, I think that would do wonders for the kid. That was his biggest weakness, IMO: a hesitancy to really play to his strengths.

Maybe some of the Bingo posters (Ski, Maindot, etc...) here can care to comment on my evaluation? Like I said, I'm basing my eval on the roughly 2 dozen or so games I've seen him in. Maybe someone who saw him for the full season can provide a more balanced appraisal.

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Old
06-27-2012, 08:16 AM
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Originally Posted by carsonscave View Post
His injury and Binghamton's overall lousy season really stalled his development.

I'm also not convinced Kleinendorst was the best guy to be developing young talent in the AHL, no disrespect to the man but I am glad he moved on.
Not sure how you could say this considering all the great, well prepared pros that came up to the Sens from Bingo which Kleinendorst helped develop. Not to mention that he got the majority of these guys AHL championship experience which is invaluable.

Zach Smith, Colin Greening, Eric Condra, Kaspars Daugavins, Mark Borowiecki, Jim O'Brien, Bobby Butler (at least initially) and Jared Cowen are all players who clearly were ready to play in the NHL after having spent their time under Kleinendorst's tutelage.

If you're one of those fans that thinks the Sens should have just rolled over for underperforming prospects like Filatov, Wiercioch and Lehner and catered to their every whim, then I don't know if you really understand "develpment". Some players need encouragement, others need a kick in the ass and in Lehner's case, some of his comments at the development camp demonstrate that the message Kleinendorst and the rest of Sens management had been trying to send has finally been received which should only help him when he inevitably becomes an NHLer.

Kleinendorst was a huge asset to the organization when it came to developing these kids the right way and they're lucky that they have guys like Richardson and Stirling there to take the reins. But it's silly to say that him leaving was a good thing.

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06-27-2012, 10:27 AM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BonkTastic View Post
Seems like the kind of guy who has enough skill to play in the league, but it's taking him longer than anticipated to really find his stride. You watch him, and in a vacuum you say to yourself "man, this kid is ready", but then you see him play in the Binghamton system, and it's clear he's not making the best decisions on the ice.

I think this kid is a LOT closer to Matt Gilroy than a lot of fans want to admit: has the tools, but the toolbox is lacking, somewhat. He seems like a guy who is VERY hesitant to showcase his full skills. Maybe that had something to do with the system that Kleinendorst ran in Bingo? Maybe it didn't mesh with him?

I think the one thing that is a positive is that he definitely looked comfortable as an OTTAWA Senator, in his few games with us. More so than he ever did in the ~30 dozen Bingo games I've seen him play in. So it could indeed be a case of a guy who, to a degree, "plays to his competition": plays better against elite guys than he does against AHL-lifers and other NHL-bound rookies.

In any case, if Richardson can get some confidence in Weir, I think that would do wonders for the kid. That was his biggest weakness, IMO: a hesitancy to really play to his strengths.

Maybe some of the Bingo posters (Ski, Maindot, etc...) here can care to comment on my evaluation? Like I said, I'm basing my eval on the roughly 2 dozen or so games I've seen him in. Maybe someone who saw him for the full season can provide a more balanced appraisal.
I think you are pretty much dead on. I've been tough on Wiercioch and frankly he is terrible annoying to watch play in Binghamton. You said it perfect, he's hesitant. He holds the puck WAY too long in some cases and lets the open lane disappear before making a bad pass/decision and creating a turnover. It's so frustrating to watch. He also doesn't seem to trust his shot and looks to pass first. Granted this could have been KK's system and he was "doing what he was told." But for the love of God the guy does have the skills and could be a very good offensive d-man.

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06-27-2012, 10:35 AM
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Sounds like confidence issues...

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06-27-2012, 10:40 AM
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I liked him ever since we made the pick, but he hasn't come along as quickly as we would have hoped. Right now, he's going neck and neck with Boro for a spot on the third pairing, but the free agency or trade market could bump them both to Bingo for another year. Only time will tell.

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06-27-2012, 11:27 AM
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i remember kleinendorst (an awesome coach who all of the players seemed to love. we were lucky to have that guy!) saying at one point last year, he didn't know what he had to do to get patty to shoot the puck. He said he just wouldn't shoot the damn puck! this was when they were losing a bunch in a row and kleinendorst was obviously getting frustrated too.

I agree with bonktastic's post. I liked him for his ottawa games. Haven't seen enough of his bingo games to judge, but it might just be a confidence thing. If he's gotten bigger and stronger this off season that will def. help. Seems to me he needs to be more aggressive in general.

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06-27-2012, 11:29 AM
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As of right now he's probably going head to head with prospect Mark Borowiecki for a spot on the left side. That could change with free agency though.

I think Boro would have the inside track but just guessing.
Pretty much this.

I think Wiercioch ends up in the AHL to start the season. Which isn't necessarily a bad thing.

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06-27-2012, 11:42 AM
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He left college early and has not been the same since.

His first year was "meh" but that is fairly standard to say. He did have 8 call up games and looked very confident. Which is odd because that was hardly the case for him in Bingo. (8gp, 0g 2a)

The next year he wasn't playing well which culminated in our old coach Kurt to say "Patty dont shoot" or "just wont shoot". On top of that Patty had a severe neck injury so its tough to say what will happen next.

This summer he has been working out with Kyle Turris (our 2nd line center) but its up in the air to see who makes it.

In all honesty i bet he makes it because our organization would want another test drive before they passed on him.

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06-27-2012, 01:53 PM
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Just can't see it happening. He was #4 in Bingo most of the year. His defensive part of the game has never been good and his offensive part was sporadic. You would think that you would need to excel at one.

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06-27-2012, 02:56 PM
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One word : patience

Something fans don't have a lot of. Wiercioch is only 21 y/o and D-men takes longer to develop

This guy was always going to be a long-term project and the Sens brass are fully aware of it, unlike the fans. The guy left College when he had 2 years left to do, years that he spent in the AHL/NHL. IMO, that's good for his development


I think he plays around 10 games in the NHL this year and become a regular next year. What he needs to do is really improve his overall strenght and put on some weight. All things will fall into place after that. And the fact that he is going to be in the hands of Richardson could be really good for him

Worse case scenario for him is he becomes a 3rd pairing offensive D-man in the NHL, the guy has a NHL skillet, just need to grow into his body and learn how to trust his instincts more.

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06-27-2012, 02:59 PM
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Not to sound like he isn't motivated, but hopefully with his buddy Turris on the big club it makes him push himself a little harder this offseason to try to get on the team.

A little extra weight lifting wouldn't hurt either of them

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06-27-2012, 05:19 PM
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Thanks guys

Wow I didn't hear about the puck to the throat. That story never really came back as a headline in Denver. That's too bad for him...

He is DEFINITELY a project. He looked great at DU and had the physical tools. When you guys drafted him, he was on a pretty stellar DU team. It probably hid a lot of the deficiencies he had as a player. He had a huge role on a team that was competing night in and night out. He probably can rise above in tough situations (he had some super important games he played in and was very effective), but like you guys said - he is really young and still learning a lot. Give him some time. He needs to mold an NHL body as well.

You guys hit it on the head that he's probably a long term project. I just thought maybe he was progressing quickly because I saw him up in Ottawa for a few stretches last year.

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06-27-2012, 05:53 PM
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he left college too early. Still a year away from making the NHL IMO.

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06-27-2012, 06:38 PM
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he left college too early. Still a year away from making the NHL IMO.
I was just about to say that, he is still young & left college in his softmore yr. It might of made more sense for him to stay there & bulk up but now that he is with Bingo & working out in Ottawa I think that will help him a lot. I hope he can break out this yr he has all the tools.

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06-27-2012, 07:38 PM
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One word : patience

Something fans don't have a lot of. Wiercioch is only 21 y/o and D-men takes longer to develop.
I don't think I've seen anybody give up on his quite yet. Ofcourse some of us are disappointed that he hasn't taken his game to the next level yet, but with Karlsson and Cowen making it big, we can afford the time.

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06-27-2012, 08:45 PM
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I guess I am in the minority here because I actually think Wiercioch is a pretty good prospect.

Passed on the depth chart by who exactly?

Gilroy?

I usually think Bonktastic is pretty much on the money, but I really don't see where you are coming from on this one.

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06-27-2012, 10:13 PM
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Generally I wait til prospects hit the 23yr old mark before I start thinking they're a bust.

Patty is still developing in a decent fashion. I'd like him to really take charge in Bingo this year as the go-to offensive guy, or make it straight from camp if he's really grown that much the past several months but I'm gonna say my first hope is a more realistic goal for him.

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06-27-2012, 10:31 PM
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I guess I am in the minority here because I actually think Wiercioch is a pretty good prospect.

Passed on the depth chart by who exactly?

Gilroy?


I usually think Bonktastic is pretty much on the money, but I really don't see where you are coming from on this one.
Borowiecki

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