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Roster Thoughts and Offseason Speculation for the 2012-2013 Season II

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06-28-2012, 12:14 AM
  #1
KingLB
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Roster Thoughts and Offseason Speculation for the 2012-2013 Season II

You guys are missing a really really typical DL move...

Brad Boyes on a 2 yr deal...fits the Kings system real well, only problem is he is a RW.

Now close this thread so nobody can dispute me

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06-28-2012, 01:14 AM
  #2
Jason Lewis
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Originally Posted by Martyros View Post
Except Penner atleast showed up to when it mattered most. Semin doesn't even try most of the time.
And he's got 3 30 goal seasons in 6 full seasons.

If he does that whilst not trying.....



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06-28-2012, 01:35 AM
  #3
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And he's got 3 30 goal seasons in 6 full seasons.

If he does that whilst not trying.....


exactly. He can be a great player if he only felt like putting in the effort; look how far those 30 goal seasons have gotten the Capitals.

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06-28-2012, 01:53 AM
  #4
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The less russians, the better. I would pass.

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06-28-2012, 02:05 AM
  #5
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Don't know where else to put this but the Dennis Wideman contract has to be one of the worst contracts handed out in the post lockout NHL.

DiPietro, Redden, Leino, Smyth, Campbell don't hold a candle to this one.

Calgary is being run into the ground, reminds me of the Kings in the mid 90's before DT took over. I realize they don't want to rebuild with Iginla there, but they are doing him a dis-service by keeping him there, send him to a contender and let him try and win a cup and just start over.

Look at their draft history since 03 when they took Phaneuf.

04- Kris Chucko - Bust, forced to retire
05- Matt Pelech - Bust
06- Leland Irving - Huge disappointment
07- Mikael Backlund - Huge disappointment
08- Greg Nemisz -disapointment
09- Tim Erixon - Traded
11- Sven Bartschi - The saving grace, future star
12- Mark Jankowski- Time will tell. Usually these reach picks fizzle as Kings fans know.

What a train wreck in cowtown. I love Sutter, but man I hope the Kings told him to play a round of golf or go to Disneyland on draft day

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06-28-2012, 02:12 AM
  #6
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The less russians, the better. I would pass.
Oh cmon now

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06-28-2012, 02:13 AM
  #7
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So if we lose Penner what do we do?

Who would we sign?

If we can't sign anyone, who do we bring up?

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06-28-2012, 02:22 AM
  #8
Herby
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Oh cmon now
I agree. I think that comment was a bit ridiculous.

When was the last time the Kings had a difficult Eastern European player. Khristich (who was Ukrainian) comes to mind, I can't think of anyone else who caused problems off the top of my head.

Most of the jerks on this team in the post-lockout years have been Canadian's. Blake, Cloutier, Smyth and Avery weren't born in Moscow or Vladivostok, just saying.

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06-28-2012, 02:59 AM
  #9
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Coyotes Fan In Peace

First off, a huge congratulations to you guys and your first ever Stanley Cup. I'm originally from Arizona, but now I'm a resident of Torrance, CA (by Hermosa Beach) and it was very cool to see.

Now, i know we've built quite the rivalry between us seeing as this year, we seemed to get a bit nasty with each other, but i have a few questions. I know a lot if you were not too fond of Doan, while i love the guy, if your feelings for him are anything close to the way i feel about Brown i completely understand but there is a big chance he doesnt sign with us due to our ownership ********. It's complete ******** and itwas has been messing with our heads for years now. We may see our biggest repercussion in less than a week if Doan ends up leaving. With that said, Doan wants a cup, and he wants to stay close to the area...who better than the Kings if he has to leave...right? I guess what I'm asking is, how would you guys feel if you signed him? And after this year, do you think Lombardi would? Maybe why he hasn't really hinted at signing Penner?

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06-28-2012, 03:02 AM
  #10
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Originally Posted by rabbit3119 View Post
First off, a huge congratulations to you guys and your first ever Stanley Cup. I'm originally from Arizona, but now I'm a resident of Torrance, CA (by Hermosa Beach) and it was very cool to see.

Now, i know we've built quite the rivalry between us seeing as this year, we seemed to get a bit nasty with each other, but i have a few questions. I know a lot if you were not too fond of Doan, while i love the guy, if your feelings for him are anything close to the way i feel about Brown i completely understand but there is a big chance he doesnt sign with us due to our ownership ********. It's complete ******** and itwas has been messing with our heads for years now. We may see our biggest repercussion in less than a week if Doan ends up leaving. With that said, Doan wants a cup, and he wants to stay close to the area...who better than the Kings if he has to leave...right? I guess what I'm asking is, how would you guys feel if you signed him? And after this year, do you think Lombardi would? Maybe why he hasn't really hinted at signing Penner?
If you check out the offseason discussion thread there is plenty in there about potentially signing Doan.

Let's just say there isn't much of a grey area when it comes to Doan. Some are very for it, some are very against it.

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06-28-2012, 03:16 AM
  #11
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id be all for it, he seems like a great fit in our system as well. However, I am pretty sure the Stoll re-signing put an end to any of our hopes at a major free agent signing.

With Stoll locked into the 3rd line center spot at 3.25, it keeps Carter on the wing, making it very tough for me to see how this organization could justify a multi year committment to a 5 mil winger right now.

Too many wings here already and a couple key players due for huge raises in the next couple years... mainly Brown *I believe we have 2 more cheap years of Brown) and Quick. Unless Doan would be willing to sign for no more then 2 years (which he might) Its tough to see why we would do this.

That being said if we could pull it off on the right term and still continue to keep our young players here I would be all for it.

Doan would likeley slot into our second line. Meaning we would be committing about 16 mil to a second line... Can't see that happenning.

I'm not concerned about Chemistry with Doan though. I think that argument is silly. Might be awkward for the first couple days but a player like Doan plays hard and to win and everyone would love to have a guy like that on their team even if they had some bad blood when playing against each other. These guys are professionals and I can't see them holding a grudge if they played together.

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06-28-2012, 03:32 AM
  #12
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North American Hockey Media lves to put the microscope on Russians. I think Semin is probably undervalued and is going tobe a steal for whoever signs him. I cant see that being us though. Also not sure if his game would traslate well to our system.

If we were to spend big on a FA Winger might as well be Doan (1-2years) or figure out a way to get Parise on a contract that doesn't inhibit our ability to pay Quick and Brown when th time comes.

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06-28-2012, 03:45 AM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingKopitar11 View Post
So if we lose Penner what do we do?

Who would we sign?

If we can't sign anyone, who do we bring up?
No one. We're fine.

Brown - Kopitar - Williams
Gagne - Richards - Carter
King - Stoll - Lewis
Clifford - Fraser - Nolan
Richardson, Westgarth

Scuderi - Doughty
Mitchell - Voynov
Martinez - Greene

Quick
Bernier

What's wrong with that? If Gagne gets injured, bump King up to the second line and have Richardson replace him on that third line. You could also give Clifford or Richardson a try on that second line and call up a guy like Clune if you really need to for fourth line duty.

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06-28-2012, 03:49 AM
  #14
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Originally Posted by markisonfire View Post
No one. We're fine.

Brown - Kopitar - Williams
Gagne - Richards - Carter
King - Stoll - Lewis
Clifford - Fraser - Nolan
Richardson, Westgarth

Scuderi - Doughty
Mitchell - Voynov
Martinez - Greene

Quick
Bernier

What's wrong with that? If Gagne gets injured, bump King up to the second line and have Richardson replace him on that third line. You could also give Clifford or Richardson a try on that second line and call up a guy like Clune if you really need to for fourth line duty.
That line-up will never win anything....

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06-28-2012, 04:24 AM
  #15
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Originally Posted by markisonfire View Post
No one. We're fine.

Brown - Kopitar - Williams
Gagne - Richards - Carter
King - Stoll - Lewis
Clifford - Fraser - Nolan
Richardson, Westgarth

Scuderi - Doughty
Mitchell - Voynov
Martinez - Greene

Quick
Bernier

What's wrong with that? If Gagne gets injured, bump King up to the second line and have Richardson replace him on that third line. You could also give Clifford or Richardson a try on that second line and call up a guy like Clune if you really need to for fourth line duty.
Don't get me wrong and much as I like the young guys. Having a guy like Richardson come in for a top 6 scares me. It wouldn't hurt signing another guy.

I like king. But I'm not gonna put my money on a guy like King replacing gagne. King is big gagne is talented. Big difference

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06-28-2012, 04:54 AM
  #16
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Ha. I love how a lineup featuring Gagne in place of Penner as the sole difference of the squad that JUST WON A CUP "will never win anything."

Yeah, that King-Stoll-Lewis third line. So bad. How about that revolving door of a fourth line in Richardson/Clifford/Fraser/Nolan. None of those guys did anything significant in our Cup run.

Some of you guys need to step away from the computer for a bit. I know we're Kings fans and we're used to going into every offseason with a myriad of different opinions and ideas on changing our roster to make it better, but stop. Scuderi is NOT getting traded. Doan is NOT signing here. We don't need to trade Martinez or Voynov to make room for Suter.

Some of the stuff on this board melts my brain. We could very well become the first team since the lockout to ice literally the same exact lineup on opening night that won a Cup the prior year. And that's not good enough?! This is madness.

Maybe Dean lures Parise here. Maybe we look at a short term deal on a guy like Whitney. But any further speculation not only crosses the line of "stretching the truth" but walks headfirst into "making up crap."

Sit back and wait for the Quick extension. That's about the biggest move we're making this offseason.

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06-28-2012, 07:25 AM
  #17
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All I'm saying is, if Ryan Smyth doesn't demand a trade the Kings don't win a cup. It's as simple as that.
Except he did, and it worked out well for all parties involved. That doesn;t make trading for him a mistake. Every single argument you've used is a "what if" or hypothetical situation... You hate Smyth. I get it. Heck like I said I hate Smyth, but trading for him wasn't a disasterous mistake anywhere near trading for Cloutier, or signing Preissing, or some of DL's other moves were.

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06-28-2012, 07:28 AM
  #18
INGLEWOOD JACK
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Oh cmon now
Russians are fine as support players. In general, Russian superstars don't have a track record leading their teams the Cup (Datsyuk and maybe Malkin being the exceptions).

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06-28-2012, 07:46 AM
  #19
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Quote:
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Sure it is. Your bringing in a player on the wrong side of his 30's, and just using Ziggy's example, paying him a large sum of money to play hockey for 3 years. In Smyth's case it was 18.75 million, in Doan's it would be 15.




He sucked each season here after December. And did his veteran leadership ring through when he demanded a trade because his icetime was going to be cut and his next salary affected? And then on top of it lied to the fans, and went to EDM and said how it was nice to be back in a hockey market. ya he was a real positive force.



How can you honestly type that.

Did you enjoy the Stanley Cup run?
Did you enjoy the parade?

None of that happens if Smyth plays out the full three years like Lombardi intended when he originally made the trade. Anytime you make a trade that would have cost your team a championship that is a mistake, a blunder, whatever you want to call it. Trading for Smyth and then committing almost 20 million in valuable cap space for him over three years was a disaster. I'm happy Smyth's greed made it a two year disaster instead of a three year won and we were able to win the cup, but it was still a disaster.

Smyth is here, no Carter and certainly no Fraser. One guy was the glue guy on the 4th line, the other scored the biggest goal in team history.




This is BS.

Just like Smyth a player who rarely crossed into the defensive zone supposedly made Kopitar into a two-way force.

How could a player who couldn't even make it up and down the ice at the end of the season influence the playoff runs of Brown and Kopitar, it's a load of trash. It would be like giving LaBarbera credit for Quick's development or saying Peter Harrold made Drew Doughty the player he is today. Make sense? Neither does your comment.



$6.25 million for fourth in scoring and no shows after December every season isn't that bad?

Look, it's not even the two years I'm talking about. It was clearly the third year that made/would have made the Smyth deal one of the biggest blunders in team history. Because none of this magical run happens with him and his bloated cap hit and lack of production on the roster. That is why I am concerned with giving Doan a multi-year deal for $5 million. If he pulls a Smyth and sucks, or doesn't fit in for whatever reason, it handcuffs the Kings ability to make needed moves to improve the team.

They just had an epic run, keep the team together, reward Penner with a fair contract and give it another shot. Don't overpay for a guy on the wrong side of 35 who may or may not have issues with some of our core players.

The risk far outweighs the reward on this one. Just like it did on the Smyth deal.

Dean has said he learned from his blunders, I believe him and don't think he touches Doan unless its on a one year deal.
Herby,

It is a hypothetical situation that you are looking at there. And the premise that Carter would not have been acquired if Smyth was still there is pure speculation. Salary wise Carter would still be affordable at the deadline. The Kings were only on the hook for about 1 million dollars of Carters salary this past season – and most of that would have been offset by the departure of Jack Johnson. It was pretty much a wash salary wise.

IF you want to make the assumption of what would happen if Smyth had still been a King past the summer of I think the more likely scenario would be No Simon Gagne last summer. Since that is pretty much that vacant Left Wing spot that the Kings filled by signing Gagne. And, pure speculation again, but since the team would be different and the dynamics would be different with Smyth on the team – maybe the team doesn’t go into the months-long scoring funks. Maybe Murray doesn’t get fired. Maybe the Kings still acquire Carter. Maybe the Kings win the cup anyway. The team was moving in the right direction. On paper at least.

If memory serves (but it rarely does), I seem to recall that even before Smyth requested a trade to Edmonton there was talk about trading, waiving or possibly buying out Smyth. For salary cap reasons. So he might have been gone – one way or the other – anyway. Maybe it was all fan-speculation though.

If we have to go down ”Speculation Road” who knows what would have happened if the Kings did not acquire Smyth in the first place. Maybe the 2010 season doesn’t happen, the Kings dont make the playoffs. The Kids don’t learn how to win consistently, Lombardi is fired, the next GM decides to start from scratch and trades away Kopitar … and the whole ”rebuild” goes a different direction …

In the end, we can’t know what would have happened. But what we do know is – the Los Angeles Kings won the damn Stanley Cup !!!. And I think winning the Stanley Cup absolves the General Manager from just about every bad move he has made. Since, the moves have been a part of the path that lead the team to the finals and glory. Every twist and turn, bumps in the road is a part of the journey. And if you dont hit those bumps or makes an odd turn – maybe things happen differently somewhere down the line which would possibly lead the team in a very different direction to a different place. I always liked how Lombardi did the rebuild, accumulated assets. I had my doubts if he was the right man to push the team over the top. Mike Richards gave me faith that he DID have the balls to make the big move. I wasn't wild about the Carter move, and I actually dont think that line played consistently well. Too many chances against. But in the end it was all worth it. The Stanley Cup.

For me, what it boils down to, it doesn’t matter HOW they got here. The important thing is they actually got there. The Stanley Cup.

No need to wallow in past mistakes. Or even theoretical ones.

Did I mention, the Stanley Cup ? Smile and be happy


Last edited by Inner Turbulence: 06-28-2012 at 09:00 AM.
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Old
06-28-2012, 08:41 AM
  #20
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I really hope that we make a push for either of Doan or Whitney. Doan should be plan A and Whitney B. I'm not sure about Gagne because of his recent history of injuries.

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06-28-2012, 08:44 AM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rabbit3119 View Post
. With that said, Doan wants a cup, and he wants to stay close to the area...who better than the Kings if he has to leave...right?
Right!

Quote:
Originally Posted by rabbit3119 View Post
.
I guess what I'm asking is, how would you guys feel if you signed him?



Quote:
Originally Posted by rabbit3119 View Post
. And after this year, do you think Lombardi would?
Yes!

Quote:
Originally Posted by rabbit3119 View Post
.Maybe why he hasn't really hinted at signing Penner?
Maybe!

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06-28-2012, 09:15 AM
  #22
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I like king. But I'm not gonna put my money on a guy like King replacing gagne. King is big gagne is talented. Big difference
That 2nd line was at it's best when one of Penner or King was skating with Richards and Carter. Gagne (the very brief amount of time he was there) didn't bring much. I think that line works better with a big body digging pucks out of the corner for the other two. There also is all the health concerns with Gagnebeing unable to hold up over a full season. If someone is added to the roster I'd rather see it be Stempniak, Huselius, Boyes, or Semin as a replacement for Gagne and King replacing Nolan on the fourth line. Loki would be my first choice to replace Gagne but that gets into the whole Loki struggles at wing debate.

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06-28-2012, 09:18 AM
  #23
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Originally Posted by KingKopitar11 View Post
Don't get me wrong and much as I like the young guys. Having a guy like Richardson come in for a top 6 scares me. It wouldn't hurt signing another guy.

I like king. But I'm not gonna put my money on a guy like King replacing gagne. King is big gagne is talented. Big difference
It may not hurt, but there is a limit to how many guys you can have on a team. That's why right now, Penner might just be the odd man out.

If Gagne is ready to start another season(and if there's no news by Sunday, I would guess he'll be back), he's in the mix on the top 2 lines. If he gets hurt, you deal with it then. It's just not possible to have established NHL player after established NHL player in case someone gets hurt. Not enough contract spots or roster spots for that to happen.

If you get Parise, you make room for him. If you get Suter, you make room for him. Neither guy is going anywhere near LA though, so it doesn't matter.

It's an interesting situation. Lombardi has never been inactive at this time of year as GM of the Kings. Maybe not always done what people wanted him to, but he's never not added someone new. On the other hand, he's never had the defending champs before. Then you get into the abstract question of whether you keep a championship team together, or change a few guys just to do it.

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06-28-2012, 11:20 AM
  #24
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I don't want anyone from that ****ing Coyotes team on the Kings. F Shane Doan, hope he retires Cupless.

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06-28-2012, 11:29 AM
  #25
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Crosby's next contract is going to be $104.4 million over 12 years (can't sign until July 1st). The same $8.7 cap hit as his current contract. May be less if there is another salary roll back.

per LeBrun (from Crosby's agent)

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