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I've seen nothing from Erik Johnson that says he should have been drafted first overall. What I have seen from him, is the kind of play that gets a former #1 overall pick traded early in his career for another defender who is arguably already better. He doesn't play physical for his size, he's not a good puck possession guy, he's not even Jack Johnson. I wouldn't trade Luke Schenn for him either.
All that said, kid's still young and not everyone is Erik Karlsson. He still has time to grow into the game, but I don't see him commanding anything monstrous in trade were he to get moved again, and I don't see him making elite $ on his next contract.
Then someone hasn't been watching him since he came over to the Avs. Shattenkirk, while excellent in his own right, is not "arguably better", unless you're only looking at Offensive Stats, and that would simply be because Shattenkirk is an offensive defensemen.
What fans of EVERY OTHER TEAM but the Avalanche don't seem to either understand or WANT to realize is that Shattenkirk was included in the deal because of Stefan Elliott and/or Tyson Barrie.
And I don't understand why fans of other teams can't realize that the Avs and Blues both got what they wanted out of this deal? I don't see them talking s**t on Stewart at this point, they all say that he's going to have a "bounce back" year, even though it had been widely speculated during his draft year and time with the Avs that he had work ethic issues, and we saw that this last year.
Originally the main centerpieces of the deal were Stewart+ for EJ+
I've seen nothing from Erik Johnson that says he should have been drafted first overall. What I have seen from him, is the kind of play that gets a former #1 overall pick traded early in his career for another defender who is arguably already better. He doesn't play physical for his size, he's not a good puck possession guy, he's not even Jack Johnson. I wouldn't trade Luke Schenn for him either.
All that said, kid's still young and not everyone is Erik Karlsson. He still has time to grow into the game, but I don't see him commanding anything monstrous in trade were he to get moved again, and I don't see him making elite $ on his next contract.
This is quite frankly one of the most outlandish claims I've ever seen on these boards. Kudos.
Then someone hasn't been watching him since he came over to the Avs. Shattenkirk, while excellent in his own right, is not "arguably better", unless you're only looking at Offensive Stats, and that would simply be because Shattenkirk is an offensive defensemen.
What fans of EVERY OTHER TEAM but the Avalanche don't seem to either understand or WANT to realize is that Shattenkirk was included in the deal because of Stefan Elliott and/or Tyson Barrie.
And I don't understand why fans of other teams can't realize that the Avs and Blues both got what they wanted out of this deal? I don't see them talking s**t on Stewart at this point, they all say that he's going to have a "bounce back" year, even though it had been widely speculated during his draft year and time with the Avs that he had work ethic issues, and we saw that this last year.
Originally the main centerpieces of the deal were Stewart+ for EJ+
The reason that Shattenkirk was included in the deal was because St Louis required him and Stewart to make the deal plausible. The deal was made because Elliott and Barrie were waiting in the minors and could conceivably take over.
EJ, during the second half of the season, was as good as Doughty or better. Doughty obviously stepped it up in the playoffs, but EJ was a top 10 defenseman towards the end of the season, and there's a lot of reasons to believe he can keep this up moving forward.
The reason that Shattenkirk was included in the deal was because St Louis required him and Stewart to make the deal plausible. The deal was made because Elliott and Barrie were waiting in the minors and could conceivably take over.
EJ, during the second half of the season, was as good as Doughty or better. Doughty obviously stepped it up in the playoffs, but EJ was a top 10 defenseman towards the end of the season, and there's a lot of reasons to believe he can keep this up moving forward.
Which is what I did mean, the Avs didn't hesitate to move Shattenkirk because of A) The caliber of the defenseman coming back, and B) Because they did have Elliott and/or Barrie who were up-and-coming.
This is quite frankly one of the most outlandish claims I've ever seen on these boards. Kudos.
You could have just claimed the whole post as outlandish and it would have worked too. (edit: Maybe Lonewolfe is right and its sarcasm)
I don't even know why this is a thread.
Quote:
"Last time I was restricted (in 2010 with the Blues), I let the negotiations get to me a little bit," said Johnson, 24, who completed his fifth year in the NHL and his second contract. "This time around, I'm experienced and I'll just let my agent handle it. But there's one thing I want to make clear to my agent: I want to be here for the long haul and I love what this group has to offer and everything this organization is all about. For me, it's a no-brainer to want to come back."
As a Blues fan people really under rate EJ. EJ in general lacked consistency with the Blues as a young player missing a year of development that is to be expected. Anyone that has watched him play can tell he has all the tools to be a great defenseman. I would take EJ over Shattenkirk personally. If EJ could just get a little meaner I think he would also be better.
The Blues had Pietrangelo who made EJ expendable. If it was not for Pietrangelo's development into a top defenseman EJ would have never been traded.
The thing a lot of people don't realize is EJ is a really loyal player. He 100% did not want to get traded from a young bad Blues team. It was nothing against Colorado btw i think he has a loyalty to whatever franchise he plays for and as long as that team wants him he would like to stay with that team. Colorado is a young talented team. He's the cornerstone of their defense. Really why would he want to leave?
As a Blues fan people really under rate EJ. EJ in general lacked consistency with the Blues as a young player missing a year of development that is to be expected. Anyone that has watched him play can tell he has all the tools to be a great defenseman. I would take EJ over Shattenkirk personally. If EJ could just get a little meaner I think he would also be better.
The Blues had Pietrangelo who made EJ expendable. If it was not for Pietrangelo's development into a top defenseman EJ would have never been traded.
And this had to have been what Colordo was also thinking on their end when St. Louis requested Shattenkirk to be included, that they are confident that one of or both of Barrie/Elliott will be able to step into that role, so in order to acquire what they wanted, they felt confident in inlcuding him.
The Blues were patient with Pietrangelo's development, and it's paying off nicely for them.
I've seen nothing from Erik Johnson that says he should have been drafted first overall. What I have seen from him, is the kind of play that gets a former #1 overall pick traded early in his career for another defender who is arguably already better. He doesn't play physical for his size, he's not a good puck possession guy, he's not even Jack Johnson. I wouldn't trade Luke Schenn for him either.
All that said, kid's still young and not everyone is Erik Karlsson. He still has time to grow into the game, but I don't see him commanding anything monstrous in trade were he to get moved again, and I don't see him making elite $ on his next contract.
You sound like an independent voter that just got into politics the day of the election, and you think you know what you're talking about, but in the end you make yourself look foolish.
Although this may be unlikely. As we know, Philly could've gotten EJ for JVR anytime they chose but they decided to get Luke Schenn instead. This implies that JVR and Luke Schenn are equal in terms of value and both more valuable than EJ.
Perhaps EJ + 2nd rounder for Luke Schenn.
What do Flyers fans think?
Hehe...I used to think you could make equations like that but it really doesn't work. You need to use the Quadratic Formula for it to make any sense at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by HooliganX2
The thing a lot of people don't realize is EJ is a really loyal player. He 100% did not want to get traded from a young bad Blues team. It was nothing against Colorado btw i think he has a loyalty to whatever franchise he plays for and as long as that team wants him he would like to stay with that team. Colorado is a young talented team. He's the cornerstone of their defense. Really why would he want to leave?
A) Giroux is on the cover of NHL13!!
B) Their GM has a $10 haircut
It could be any of one of these factors that changes his mind set really.
Hehe...I used to think you could make equations like that but it really doesn't work. You need to use the Quadratic Formula for it to make any sense at all.
I've seen nothing from Erik Johnson that says he should have been drafted first overall. What I have seen from him, is the kind of play that gets a former #1 overall pick traded early in his career for another defender who is arguably already better. He doesn't play physical for his size, he's not a good puck possession guy, he's not even Jack Johnson. I wouldn't trade Luke Schenn for him either.
All that said, kid's still young and not everyone is Erik Karlsson. He still has time to grow into the game, but I don't see him commanding anything monstrous in trade were he to get moved again, and I don't see him making elite $ on his next contract.
He stepped things up in the physical department last season, and I completely disagree about his puck possession skills. He's very good carrying it out of his own zone, and his skating ability for a player his size is unparallelled across the league.
I actually have the stats to back up the physicality part:
Oct-Nov-Dec (35 games): 1 goal, 13 assists, -11, 78 SOG, 13 PIM, 47 BS, 47 hits Jan-Feb-Mar-Apr (38 games): 3 goals, 9 assists, +4, 77 SOG, 13 PIM, 47 BS, 76 hits
Even though almost everything else was identical, he stepped it up a bit physically, producing beneficial results in his own zone.
I don't know how good EJ will end up being, but I can confidently say he's better right now than Eric Brewer ever was, which alone makes him worth hanging onto long term.
I think you missed the point...as far as anyone can figure, he is allowed to sign right now. The claim that, as per the CBA, he has to wait until July 1 is what has everyone confused...
