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Offseason Thread III - Laughton all the way to the bank

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Old
06-29-2012, 02:14 PM
  #326
Broad Street Elite
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Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
Again, my preference is for Parise, but if we have the choice between throwing $5 million over 3-4 years on a 35+ contract for Doan, or $6.5 million for 3-4 years for Semin, the latter seems the wise course to me.
To me, that's a false choice though. Yes, we need a first line scorer. Yes, Semin could be that guy. That said, I am unwilling to throw an unreasonable contract his way just because he's all that's available. As I've said before, that's how you end up with bad contracts. I'd rather not sign a guy than overpay a guy like Semin.

6.5M per for 3 years would be the absolute limit on Semin for me. If he wanted a 4 or 5 year, it's going to need to lower the AAV of the contract.

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06-29-2012, 02:37 PM
  #327
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Originally Posted by Broad Street Elite View Post
To me, that's a false choice though. Yes, we need a first line scorer. Yes, Semin could be that guy. That said, I am unwilling to throw an unreasonable contract his way just because he's all that's available. As I've said before, that's how you end up with bad contracts. I'd rather not sign a guy than overpay a guy like Semin.

6.5M per for 3 years would be the absolute limit on Semin for me. If he wanted a 4 or 5 year, it's going to need to lower the AAV of the contract.
I really cannot imagine the Flyers going after Semin at any price. He is the antithesis of Flyers hockey. No heart. Lazy. Soft. Russian. Even if he were to take a discount to play here (which is not the case, I imagine), I just can't fathom a situation where Homer and Uncle Ed say, "Hey you know what? This Russian cat who can't play defense and doesn't give his all and fights like a teenage girl is just what this team is looking for. Let's sign him!"

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06-29-2012, 02:45 PM
  #328
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
I really cannot imagine the Flyers going after Semin at any price. He is the antithesis of Flyers hockey. No heart. Lazy. Soft. Russian. Even if he were to take a discount to play here (which is not the case, I imagine), I just can't fathom a situation where Homer and Uncle Ed say, "Hey you know what? This Russian cat who can't play defense and doesn't give his all and fights like a teenage girl is just what this team is looking for. Let's sign him!"
...ok, I'll acknowledge he can't fight.

But if his defensive deficiencies mean he can't be a Flyer, someone should show Danny B. the door.

Actually, I'll go further. In a hypothetical top-six of:

Semin-Giroux-Voracek
Hartnell-Briere-Simmonds

Semin is at worst 3rd best--behind Voracek and Giroux. He's actually a pretty good back-checker, if you watch Capitals games.

This notion that he doesn't care is pretty absurd: if you talk to Capitals fans, which, as a ex-patriated Flyers fan living in D.C. for six years, I've been blessed to do, they'll tell you that few players on that team are more affected by losing that Semin; he just has never been one to communicate with the press, and that, combined with stereotypes about Russian players, has perpetuated a mischaracterization of his playing style.

If his name was Alexander Smith, he'd be regarded as possessing average defensive abilities for a top-line scorer at worst.

That being said, I'm pretty sure most Flyers fans, and the bulk of the press corp, share your assumptions about Semin. For that reason alone, he probably wouldn't work out real well here.

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Old
06-29-2012, 02:47 PM
  #329
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
I really cannot imagine the Flyers going after Semin at any price. He is the antithesis of Flyers hockey. No heart. Lazy. Soft. Russian. Even if he were to take a discount to play here (which is not the case, I imagine), I just can't fathom a situation where Homer and Uncle Ed say, "Hey you know what? This Russian cat who can't play defense and doesn't give his all and fights like a teenage girl is just what this team is looking for. Let's sign him!"
Though I don't want him on the Flyers either, that's a bit of a strawman on Semin. He looked good in the playoffs and would (as others have said) be signed to snipe home Giroux's set-ups. That being half-heartedly offered as a rebuttal, I wouldn't want what he will be seeking given the holes in his game.

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Old
06-29-2012, 02:51 PM
  #330
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Sam Carchidi
Source: The #Flyers will push hard for free agents Zach Parise and Ryan Suter. The also have interest in Parenteau and Doan.Free agency starts at noon on Sunday, and the Penguins are believed to be the frontrunner for Parise.
Nothing new of course just putting it out there. I don't really like him but he is credible on the site.

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Old
06-29-2012, 03:16 PM
  #331
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Originally Posted by flyersfan9180 View Post
[url
Nothing new of course just putting it out there. I don't really like him but he is credible on the site.
He is a credible source if there is such a thing for the Flyers. Holmgren has done a great job of playing his cards close to the chest. I would expect a few surprises.

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06-29-2012, 03:16 PM
  #332
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
...ok, I'll acknowledge he can't fight.

But if his defensive deficiencies mean he can't be a Flyer, someone should show Danny B. the door.

Actually, I'll go further. In a hypothetical top-six of:

Semin-Giroux-Voracek
Hartnell-Briere-Simmonds

Semin is at worst 3rd best--behind Voracek and Giroux. He's actually a pretty good back-checker, if you watch Capitals games.

This notion that he doesn't care is pretty absurd: if you talk to Capitals fans, which, as a ex-patriated Flyers fan living in D.C. for six years, I've been blessed to do, they'll tell you that few players on that team are more affected by losing that Semin; he just has never been one to communicate with the press, and that, combined with stereotypes about Russian players, has perpetuated a mischaracterization of his playing style.

If his name was Alexander Smith, he'd be regarded as possessing average defensive abilities for a top-line scorer at worst.

That being said, I'm pretty sure most Flyers fans, and the bulk of the press corp, share your assumptions about Semin. For that reason alone, he probably wouldn't work out real well here.
Perhaps I just haven't seen enough Caps games, but from everything that I have heard and seen is that he doesn't go 100% all the time and has never been impressive defensively. The fact that he cares after a loss is different from giving it your all every shift. Again, maybe I just haven't seen him enough, but the things I have seen and the things I have read do not scream Flyers hockey. And while I understand that the Flyers don't have great defensive forwards, it is clear that they are trying to change that. Now if I am wrong and he really isn't as bad defensively and does give it his all 100% of the time, that is a different story. But I don't think the Flyers want another whiny, half-hearted, slacking, Russian on the team.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BernieParent View Post
Though I don't want him on the Flyers either, that's a bit of a strawman on Semin. He looked good in the playoffs and would (as others have said) be signed to snipe home Giroux's set-ups. That being half-heartedly offered as a rebuttal, I wouldn't want what he will be seeking given the holes in his game.
I never said he wasn't a good player just that he would not be a fit here.

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Old
06-29-2012, 03:19 PM
  #333
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyersfan9180 View Post
http://sulia.com/channel/philadelphi...source=twitter



Nothing new of course just putting it out there. I don't really like him but he is credible on the site.
I wonder if they will try to sign both or are just going hard after both in hopes of getting one. Getting both would be absurd (for any team).

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Old
06-29-2012, 03:20 PM
  #334
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
I never said he wasn't a good player just that he would not be a fit here.
I was generally agreeing with you, but thought your character description was a bit too extreme. This is the start of my response to you: Though I don't want him on the Flyers either.

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Old
06-29-2012, 04:02 PM
  #335
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
I wonder if they will try to sign both or are just going hard after both in hopes of getting one. Getting both would be absurd (for any team).
They could use a 1st line wing and a 1st pairing defenseman. I assume they (like several other teams) chase both.... basically throw **** against the wall and see what sticks.

They can make roster moves to accommodate either or both signings frankly. Looking back, adding Forsberg necessitated dealing Roenick... we dealt Gagne for Cap relief.

We have some wiggle room under the 77M to sign both now that Carle looks unlikely, but signing one or both might necessitate a trade (such as Mezsaros) for less than we might want.

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06-29-2012, 04:04 PM
  #336
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Originally Posted by flyersfan9180 View Post
http://sulia.com/channel/philadelphi...source=twitter



Nothing new of course just putting it out there. I don't really like him but he is credible on the site.
If no Parise, go DOAN. GO DOAN.

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Old
06-29-2012, 04:21 PM
  #337
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Any interest in Ryan Smyth, Krisitan Huselius, or Andrei Kostitysn?

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06-29-2012, 04:41 PM
  #338
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Originally Posted by KingForsberg View Post
Any interest in Ryan Smyth, Krisitan Huselius, or Andrei Kostitysn?

First 2, although I think Smyth is a lot of money.

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Old
06-29-2012, 04:45 PM
  #339
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I hope we sign Peter Mueller. And I hope he wears 88. Although it should be retired.

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Old
06-29-2012, 04:49 PM
  #340
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Originally Posted by KingForsberg View Post
I hope we sign Peter Mueller. And I hope he wears 88. Although it should be retired.
Haha, that would be interesting for sure.

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06-29-2012, 05:34 PM
  #341
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There are probably 20+ trades open to homer to clear salary should we sign these players.
I seriously doubt he is sitting on his hands all day.

And semin would be a great option for the right contract/price.

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06-29-2012, 05:40 PM
  #342
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Originally Posted by KingForsberg View Post
Any interest in Ryan Smyth, Krisitan Huselius, or Andrei Kostitysn?
Definitely not Kostitsyn. Another in the line of big-talent, little-heart forwards.

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Old
06-29-2012, 06:02 PM
  #343
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
I really cannot imagine the Flyers going after Semin at any price. He is the antithesis of Flyers hockey. No heart. Lazy. Soft. Russian. Even if he were to take a discount to play here (which is not the case, I imagine), I just can't fathom a situation where Homer and Uncle Ed say, "Hey you know what? This Russian cat who can't play defense and doesn't give his all and fights like a teenage girl is just what this team is looking for. Let's sign him!"
Wow, that's so far from the truth. Semin is a good defensive player and has no problem with back checking or anything like that. He's very coachable and he's a guy who's not afraid to get his nose dirty.

I'm not sure where or who you heard this from, but whoever told you that Semin has no heart, or is a floater or is a player that doesn't play defense is incorrect.

I think where most of these stories start has to do with his agent, Mark Gandler. Gandler is notorious for nitpicking at teams and trying to tell GMs how to do their job. I know Bobby Clarke was on the record as saying he would never sign or draft a Mark Gandler client because of all the problems Gandler caused him with Dimirty Yushkevich.

For me, that would probably be the reason the Flyers don't sign a guy like Semin. It certainly isn't from his play on the ice, especially when you consider that him, Joel Ward and Jeff Halpern, were the only Capital forwards to play more than 12 minutes a game and be plus players. So, you know he's doing something right on the defensive side. Of note, Semin was a +9 while averaging 16:47 of ice time per game.

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Old
06-29-2012, 06:38 PM
  #344
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Anyone think Markstrom from Florida may interest Flyers brass, in the event Luongo is dealt there? I am confident in Bryz, but like depth and and cover in case of injury.

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06-29-2012, 06:44 PM
  #345
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Anyone think Markstrom from Florida may interest Flyers brass, in the event Luongo is dealt there? I am confident in Bryz, but like depth and and cover in case of injury.
In general, I like Markstrom as a prospective goaltender, but Bob was, for all intents and purposes, dealt away because it was deemed unnecessary to have a young prospect with a sizeable cap hit lingering behind Bryz and the remaining 8 years of his contract. Markstrom would be more of the same. He has another year (ie, upcoming season) left on a $1.3 mil AAS contract.

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06-29-2012, 06:50 PM
  #346
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If we're talking bottom six forwards then I wouldn't mind Winnik or K. Wellwood.

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06-29-2012, 07:20 PM
  #347
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Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
I don't hate Semin--and I think he is misunderstood on these boards.

But I'd be shocked if he doesn't end up in Detroit--particularly if they miss on Parise.

I don't really think Detroit gets him - I could be wrong. I think they go all in for Suter.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Giroux tha Damaja View Post
I think You can move each of Voracek and Simmonds up a line. Or you could even move Read up to first line if you want more of a pure trigger man on Giroux's wing than Voracek and think Simmonds and Hartnell on the same line is a little redundant. Our hole is a third line winger, not a first IMO. If only Homer would have just trusted Gustaffson with some more responsibility and not traded JVR, that would be a disgusting line up.
I don't know. I'd be weary having Voracek on the top line, especially cause he particularly isn't the trigger man to shoot at will. Simmonds and Hartnell on the same line, COULD work but I'd be afraid to put my cards in that working consistently over the season. I also think Read has the trigger-awareness to play on the 1st line because he typically lets the shot go when he has too. But I don't know if he can play 82 games + playoffs on the top line.

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Originally Posted by Go For It View Post
Obviously, we aren't very likely to land Parise, but if Doan doesn't want to leave Phoenix, Semin is my first choice.
I wish we could get Parise or Doan, Semin really isn't terrible though. He's a shooter which is what we would need if they go with Hartnell/Giroux/xxxx.

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Any interest in Ryan Smyth, Krisitan Huselius, or Andrei Kostitysn?
Nope. Not from me at least.

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Old
06-29-2012, 09:07 PM
  #348
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In general, I like Markstrom as a prospective goaltender, but Bob was, for all intents and purposes, dealt away because it was deemed unnecessary to have a young prospect with a sizeable cap hit lingering behind Bryz and the remaining 8 years of his contract. Markstrom would be more of the same. He has another year (ie, upcoming season) left on a $1.3 mil AAS contract.
I agree to an extent with regard to the cap issue, but feel far more confident in markstrom's projection as a consistent starter than I ever was with bob's. So i may be able to eat the extra 400 g's for the prospect of a higher ceiling player and heir to Bryz in the event of injury (spiritual or physical). Just a thought.

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06-29-2012, 11:07 PM
  #349
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If we're talking bottom six forwards then I wouldn't mind Winnik or K. Wellwood.
I like Winnik. I would really like to see Gaustad. Homer tried to trade for him at the deadline so you know they have interest in him. Talbot - Gaustad - Wellwood would be an outstanding shutdown line.

How about Whitney/Jagr and Roszival (RHD)?

Hartnell - Giroux - Whitney/Jagr
Schenn - Briere - Simmonds
Read - Coots - Voracek
Talbot - Gaustad - Wellwood

Kimo - Schenn
Grossman - Coburn
Mez - Roszival

Bryz
Leighton

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Old
06-29-2012, 11:13 PM
  #350
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I actually think Semin could be VERY good on Girouxs wing with hartnell on the other side.

Hartnell-Giroux-Semin
Schenn-Briere-Voracek
Simmonds-Couturier-Read
Sestito-Talbot-Wellwood

Coburn-Grossmann
Schenn-Timonen
Meszaros-Garrison
Lilja/Bourdon/Gustafsson

Bryzgalov
Clemmensen

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