So not only did I find the quote where you express your satisfaction about signing Martin on the day it happened (something you claim you were not), because with him and Michalek we would have a top 3 defence (something you claimed you never said), we also have the one from this week where you declared yourself pissed he was signed rather than signing Ray Whitney...(and I am supposed to infer that 'pissed' means.... something else than pissed.... and was only relative to a potential Whitney signing?
You ask a lot me in terms of benign and thorough reading of your arguments and the thoughts behind them then. Slightly more than you will offer the other way around, I might add. And taking you at your word makes me a liar....
Those are lofty context demands from a guy who stubbornly insist - despite a now near infinite number of requests for more than one very unusual example corroborating the whole notion that we're actually debating - that:
Unreal how you twist things.
The piss poor way you phrased your statement made it seem as if I said the Pens had a top three defense and didn't need to sign Martin. When people lie, it's hard to follow what they are trying to convey. So perhaps don't make things up if you want a legit answer back.
Also, that is your evidence I "repeatedly" shunned the Martin signing? Oh nos... I was mad for all of an hour or so they didn't sign Whitney and signed Martin instead... You really nailed me good bro!
How many times in this thread alone did I say I prefered Whitney, was upset for a bit they missed out on him, read what guys like Cole wrote, then changed my mind because they made very valid points about the rarity of finding top four blueliners without giving up assets?
It took me reading about half a dozen of their pro Martin posts, then the lightbulb went on. You assume I pouted for days, like perhaps you did?
It also took me about an hour to get over drafting Despres instead of Ferraro when I reasoned it out. I don't sit around whining about things out of my control, perhaps that is your style, not mine.
Of course the proof is all there as you readily admitted you recall me along with yourself, Jags and others pulling for Whitney. Then when Martin was signed, I supported it, because Cole especially convinced me it was the best move. I can't be anymore crystal clear in my explanation, yet somehow you still can't connect the dots (obviously not your strong suit).
Which brings us back to the point where you claimed I "repeatedly" went on about Martin being a bad signing this year, yet you admit below I have been supporting him.
Derp. You got caught in a lie.
And yep, let's get back to talking about DP... I have no clue why you decided to steer our debate towards Martin, Letestu and lies.
Last edited by Mr Jiggyfly: 06-28-2012 at 01:44 PM.
The Tarasenko/Rundblad "proof" is just a terrible argument.
Rundblad was traded for a draft pick, not "the best prospect in the world" despite how many times Jiggy wants to say it. The fact that the pick turned out great has no bearing on the value of the pick when the trade was made. The Blues could have just as easily drafted Watson or Hishon and you wouldn't even have our one "example".
That's like saying 171st overall picks are worth the moon because Dats was taken 171st.
The Tarasenko/Rundblad "proof" is just a terrible argument.
Rundblad was traded for a draft pick, not "the best prospect in the world" despite how many times Jiggy wants to say it. The fact that the pick turned out great has no bearing on the value of the pick when the trade was made. The Blues could have just as easily drafted Watson or Hishon and you wouldn't even have our one "example".
That's like saying 171st overall picks are worth the moon because Dats was taken 171st.
If you like to play what if games, sure.
Or we could just use the facts:
Ott was on the board, the Blues used their blueline asset who never played in the NHL to move into that slot, then took Tarasenko who is now the best fwd prospect in the NHL. That is the player they wanted and their blueline asset got him. Period.
It happened. It's documented. There is no fantasy what if the Blues did this game... That is exactly what they did.
Now if you want to argue there is a better fwd prospect out there, knock yourself out ( but I disagree).
Thanks for the links but the way they've set those posts up is not too user-friendly. The second two posts you've provided seem to be summary posts, that link to each other and a bunch of other stuff ... but not the actual lists. I clicked through about 5 different things and still haven't found the actual rankings.
Do you have the links to the URL that contains the actual listing of players top to bottom? Thanks in advance. I know readers will appreciate not having to click through a bunch of summary posts and SEO posts.
Last edited by Chancellor Vitale: 06-30-2012 at 11:20 AM.
After doing a ton of reading on the guy, I personally liken Pouliot to Duncan Keith. Keith when he was drafted didn't even have Pouliot's size, and had the exact same pro's and con's about his game at the same age. I think Pouliot will be a much better player on the powerplay, but I don't think he'll have that sort of pissed off demeanor that Keith can play with from time to time.
Thanks for the links but the way they've set those posts up is not too user-friendly. The second two posts you've provided seem to be summary posts, that link to each other and a bunch of other stuff ... but not the actual lists. I clicked through about 5 different things and still haven't found the actual rankings.
Do you have the links to the URL that contains the actual listing of players top to bottom? Thanks in advance. I know readers will appreciate not having to click through a bunch of summary posts and SEO posts.
Not sure where you're looking in the posts. You simply have to scroll down in the respective post and the rankings are right there for ya.
At least for me, there have been several times on several different days where the lists don't load. I can see the data sheet outline, but no data is filled in.
Given that we're 14 games into the season for the Portland Winterhawks and many are keeping a keen eye on Seth Jones (potentially the 1st overall pick in 2013), have any of you noticed how Derrick Pouliot is playing?
Expectations are quite high for Derrick (in Pittsburgh at least, given where he was chosen and what he cost us). Its his 3rd season in the WHL and although he's only 10 months older than Seth, I wonder how they are playing in comparison. Derrick has slowed down as soon as Seth started to pick up his game. Weird...
His numbers ain't to shabby and apparently he's picked up his physical game which is nice to hear. However, I just wish his offensive numebrs were higher given its his 3rd year for Portland and the fact that he's a little more 1 dimensional than the other Ds available in his draft class.
Any insight on Derrick would be greatly appreciated.
Given that we're 14 games into the season for the Portland Winterhawks and many are keeping a keen eye on Seth Jones (potentially the 1st overall pick in 2013), have any of you noticed how Derrick Pouliot is playing?
Expectations are quite high for Derrick (in Pittsburgh at least, given where he was chosen and what he cost us). Its his 3rd season in the WHL and although he's only 10 months older than Seth, I wonder how they are playing in comparison. Derrick has slowed down as soon as Seth started to pick up his game. Weird...
His numbers ain't to shabby and apparently he's picked up his physical game which is nice to hear. However, I just wish his offensive numebrs were higher given its his 3rd year for Portland and the fact that he's a little more 1 dimensional than the other Ds available in his draft class.
Any insight on Derrick would be greatly appreciated.
I havent seen a ton from him this season but the couple games I have watched he is a bit more scrappy than I originally thought. Although not overly physical, he is listed at just under 200lbs and is solid on his skates. Over his WHL career, he has actually been in a decent amount of fights and doesnt look terrrible when doing it.
Ill be at the Winterhawks/Giants game next Friday so Im looking forward to seeing how he plays.
I havent seen a ton from him this season but the couple games I have watched he is a bit more scrappy than I originally thought. Although not overly physical, he is listed at just under 200lbs and is solid on his skates. Over his WHL career, he has actually been in a decent amount of fights and doesnt look terrrible when doing it.
Ill be at the Winterhawks/Giants game next Friday so Im looking forward to seeing how he plays.
A poster (Renegade Stylings) in the prospects forum had this to say when I inquired about Pouliot in the Seth Jones thread:
I will say that I watched Portland a bunch early in the season and he was very good. Stood out a lot, made some great rushes and was much more physical than I ever saw from him.
The last couple viewings of Portland he hasn't been as noticeable to me. But with their talent on D it's pretty easy to get a bit lost in the shuffle. Still confident he will be a great pro and potentially an elite offensive D.
I watched him for the first time in the game against Everett last night. First thing that stuck out was his skating, which meant I didn't have to look for his number to recognize him later in the game. I thought he looked very good with the puck on his stick, I particularly liked his composure and play along the offensive blue line. Good passing and vision, had a nice assist on the last Winterhawks goal. His slap shot might need some work though. Seemed to shield the puck well with his body.
On the defensive side I was pleasantly surprised with his stick work, he broke up several one-on-ones and a two-on-one with poke-checks. However, I thought he looked a little reserved and at times almost disinterested while in his own zone, with a tendency to float a little. He also looked a little lost at times. Had one bad turnover in the defensive zone, standing still with the puck in the corner.
He played heavily on both PP and PK, but seemed to be rested late in the 3rd period when the game was out of hand.
it seems like Portland has 4 d-men capable of producing offense.. Besides Pouliot with 15 points, Rutkowski has 14 and Wotherspoon has 13, then there's draft-elligible Seth Jones with 10.
Not sure what that means for Pouliot's development, as he's probably still the go-to offensive guy on the back end this year.. But he's likely being required to play even more of a two-way game.
it seems like Portland has 4 d-men capable of producing offense.. Besides Pouliot with 15 points, Rutkowski has 14 and Wotherspoon has 13, then there's draft-elligible Seth Jones with 10.
Not sure what that means for Pouliot's development, as he's probably still the go-to offensive guy on the back end this year.. But he's likely being required to play even more of a two-way game.
By the way, Rutkowski was drafted by Colorado in the 5th Round (2010) became a UFA this summer and still unsigned. He's a veteran in the league and its pretty normal given his age (almost 2 years older than Derrick) and experience in the league. That skews things a little.
After doing a ton of reading on the guy, I personally liken Pouliot to Duncan Keith. Keith when he was drafted didn't even have Pouliot's size, and had the exact same pro's and con's about his game at the same age. I think Pouliot will be a much better player on the powerplay, but I don't think he'll have that sort of pissed off demeanor that Keith can play with from time to time.
Thats a good one but I think he's more of a natural passer than Keith and he can play a better physical game than Campbell. I'm hoping he can be something close to Zubov when he was in Dallas.
What ever anyone thinks of the pick kind of goes out the window. He's a Penguin now and IMO the Pens most skilled prospect.
Sureshot has said it best. We should make a Shero Drafting thread. Its pretty clear that its not the way the draft work out and more that the Pens go after skill on D.
I hate the philosophy but don't overly mind the players Shero has brought in so I'm in the middle. I actually haven't had a problem with a Pens draft since 09.
and Portland aren't as strong as they have been in previous years.
I wouldn't say they're weaker. They've actually started off stronger this year than the previous two seasons. Due to the roster turnover, Portland is playing stingier defense this year. Check out the team GAA. DP is definitely a part of that. He's scoring at similar clip fromlast season while focusing on his defensive zone coverage.
I wouldn't say they're weaker. They've actually started off stronger this year than the previous two seasons. Due to the roster turnover, Portland is playing stingier defense this year. Check out the team GAA. DP is definitely a part of that. He's scoring at similar clip fromlast season while focusing on his defensive zone coverage.
Thats a good one but I think he's more of a natural passer than Keith and he can play a better physical game than Campbell. I'm hoping he can be something close to Zubov when he was in Dallas.
What ever anyone thinks of the pick kind of goes out the window. He's a Penguin now and IMO the Pens most skilled prospect.
Sureshot has said it best. We should make a Shero Drafting thread. Its pretty clear that its not the way the draft work out and more that the Pens go after skill on D.
I hate the philosophy but don't overly mind the players Shero has brought in so I'm in the middle. I actually haven't had a problem with a Pens draft since 09.
I'm missing the Pouliot physical dimension, as I think for his size, Campbell can be a pretty physical player. Physically, I liken Pouliot more to a Gonchar, but I could be way off.
