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Flames to go hard after Doan/Semin/Jagr

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Old
06-30-2012, 01:29 PM
  #101
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Losing a top line LW a second line LW a #2 defenseman and many of the depth players makes that rather difficult no?
I'm a habs fan and people like to use injuries as an excuse as to why they were terrible, but for the flames...'nah they just suck'

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06-30-2012, 01:32 PM
  #102
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I'm a habs fan and people like to use injuries as an excuse as to why they were terrible, but for the flames...'nah they just suck'
The player who the Habs signed and expected to be their number 1 d-man last year played less than 20 games and they were meaningless end of season games.

Their leading goal scorer the 2 seasons previous to this one missed 50 games, and was clearly playing through an injury when he was playing early on.

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06-30-2012, 01:32 PM
  #103
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I'm a habs fan and people like to use injuries as an excuse as to why they were terrible, but for the flames...'nah they just suck'
I don't like using the excuse but people seem to forgot the majority of these injuries happened at the same time meaning we were using a line and a half from the ahl plus an ahl defender and a whl player. I don't care how good your team is that is ****ing crippling.

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06-30-2012, 01:33 PM
  #104
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But even still...of course injuries played a role in the Habs demise (along with the coaching mismanagement and Gomez providing 11 points in 39 games) but whether that's true or not doesn't change the fact that they didn't have the depth to be able to withstand it.

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06-30-2012, 01:34 PM
  #105
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I don't like using the excuse but people seem to forgot the majority of these injuries happened at the same time meaning we were using a line and a half from the ahl plus an ahl defender and a whl player. I don't care how good your team is that is ****ing crippling.
Their number 1 center, their number 1 winger, their number 1 d-man and their starting goalie were all healthy.

Not a single injury occurred by a Flames player last year was anywhere near a "crippling" injury for a good team.

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06-30-2012, 01:35 PM
  #106
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Their number 1 center, their number 1 winger, their number 1 d-man and their starting goalie were all healthy.

Not a single injury occurred by a Flames player last year was anywhere near a "crippling" injury for a good team.
Their are more things to a team than 3 players

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06-30-2012, 01:40 PM
  #107
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I'm confused, people keep bringing up all these injuries.

Iginla played the whole season.
So did Kiiprusoff
So did Bouwmeester
So did Jokinen

Tanguay, Glencross, Giordano, and Stajan all played at least 61 games.

Can you name even a single impact, or close to impact player who missed more than 20 games?
Tanguay missed 18 games, which is roughly a fifth of the season.

Glencross missed 15 games.

Cammalleri missed 9 games.

Giordano, who is clearly a #2 defenceman, missed 21 games.

Stempniak missed 21 games. Moss 50 games. Backlund 41 games.

At one point, Tanguay, Glencross, Moss, Stempniak, Backlund, Stajan, and Giordano were all out of the lineup. How many teams can overcome the lost of six of their top-9 forwards and their #2 defenceman all at the same time? And we're not talking about 1 or 2 games, we're talking about roughly 10 games. That's an eighth of the season.

The last two Cup winners have shown that depth is extremely important. Being able to roll out four lines - and three scoring lines - is critical to sustaining success. But if you're missing two-thirds of your top-9 forwards, it's gong to be difficult for any team to have any success, as they'll be depending on bottom-6 forwards and AHLers to suddenly play critical roles on the teams.

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06-30-2012, 01:41 PM
  #108
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at one point flames had Kolanos, Desbiens, Horak, Byron, Baertschi, Nemisz, Bouma, Babchuk, wilson and Piskula on their roster not good. Tanguay, Glencross, Stempniak, Comeau, Backlund, Hannan, Giordano, Sarich, Smith were injured Cammalleri and Jones were trade to the flames, but they also got injured. The flames line-up was half full of minor league players.

2012/13

- Tanguay, Glencross, Stempniak, Comeau, Backlund, Giordano, Sarich, Smith, Cammalleri, Baertschi, Jones and Cervenka get to play a FULL SEASON .......NEUF SAID

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06-30-2012, 01:42 PM
  #109
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Their are more things to a team than 3 players
When a teams best players are healthy (it was 4 players by the way ) than if the team is anywhere remotely close to being a "good" team they can handle injuries throughout the line up.

The Flames weren't a good team though, so these injuries crippled a team that was probably never going to make the playoffs anyways.

Frankly it's kind of amusing how often people bring up the Nucks being lucky to paly in a weak division and it padding thier numbers...yet Flames were a good team who just barely missed the playoffs.

I guess they weren't able to take advantage of the weak division as well? Or...were they PART of the weak division?

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06-30-2012, 01:44 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by UniverStalinGraduate View Post
When a teams best players are healthy (it was 4 players by the way ) than if the team is anywhere remotely close to being a "good" team they can handle injuries throughout the line up.

The Flames weren't a good team though, so these injuries crippled a team that was probably never going to make the playoffs anyways.

Frankly it's kind of amusing how often people bring up the Nucks being lucky to paly in a weak division and it padding thier numbers...yet Flames were a good team who just barely missed the playoffs.

I guess they weren't able to take advantage of the weak division as well? Or...were they PART of the weak division?
So you are telling me that if Phoenix, LA, SJ had 200+ more man games lost many of them at the same time that they don't lose 5-10 points?

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06-30-2012, 01:45 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by ALI View Post
at one point flames had Kolanos, Desbiens, Horak, Byron, Baertschi, Nemisz, Bouma, Babchuk, wilson and Piskula on their roster not good. Tanguay, Glencross, Stempniak, Comeau, Backlund, Hannan, Giordano, Sarich, Smith were injured Cammalleri and Jones were trade to the flames, but they also got injured. The flames line-up was half full of minor league players.

2012/13

- Tanguay, Glencross, Stempniak, Comeau, Backlund, Giordano, Sarich, Smith, Cammalleri, Baertschi, Jones and Cervenka get to play a FULL SEASON .......NEUF SAID
Comeau, Hannan, Sarich and Smith are really not that good at all. If losing any of those guys to an injury has any sort of an effect on a team that says more about the teams lack of depth than anything else.

Backlund was a sophomore who was putting up underwhelming numbers when he was healthy. Not sure how that's a "significant" loss.

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06-30-2012, 01:46 PM
  #112
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So you are telling me that if Phoenix, LA, SJ had 200+ more man games lost many of them at the same time that they don't lose 5-10 points?
Deflect! Deflect! Deflect!

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06-30-2012, 01:46 PM
  #113
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Deflect! Deflect! Deflect!
Yes that is what you are doing.

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06-30-2012, 01:48 PM
  #114
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Yes that is what you are doing.
Hahaha, care to highlight any point where I've deflected in this conversation?

I'll just give you the 2 points for avoiding my question now, since you're obviously going to.

Since I haven't been deflecting at any point

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06-30-2012, 01:48 PM
  #115
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The season before this one Spezza missed 20 games, Alfredsson missed 28 and was playing through back issues when he was playing. Michalek was clearly still recovering from his lengthy absence due to knee injuries, Gonchar played awful in a first year with a new team. They also had Karlsson going into his 3rd professional season where he made a huge jump from his very impressive 2nd season. Lots of things that went wrong for Ottawa went far better. Oh and again, they had Karlsson break out into THE premier puck moving/offensive d-man in the entire league.

Ottawa were also sellers, trading away Fisher and Chris Kelly both well before the trade deadline.

Neat comparison other than all those factors though
BLAH BLAH BLAH...So its okay to use injuries as an excuse for the sens but not the Flames? COOL STORY BRO?

ottawa had 74 points 2 years ago and with alll those improvements they got 92 points (2 more than the "terrible" Calgary Flames) this year

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Why wouldn't people take the Cammalleri addition lightly? He's not big enough, fast enough, or competent defensively enough to be a center in the NHL. And now he's going to be Calgary's number 1 center? In what world is that a good move?
You obviously don't watch the Flames nor do you know what you're talking about so all this conjecture is pretty much useless but i'll play along. Cammalleri flourished playing with Iginla a few years ago and seemed like he rekindled the magic when they got put back together midway through February. He just put 16 points in the final 18 games (9 goals), no big deal right? But yah Cammalleri sucks, him playing with Iggy for a full season is an awful idea.

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Wideman was indeed 10th in points by a d-man. Question though, have you seen even one SINGLE Capitals fan lamenting the loss of him? Even one?

Think there might be a reason for that?
It's good to make up random stuff to make your point but how about we get some truth? He's described as a good offensive player that struggles defensively nad being paired with a good defensive dman (LIKE a bouwmeester) will do him well

You're seriously in way over your head when you try to argue with me. I think you should just leave. People with an agenda don't win arguments.

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06-30-2012, 01:52 PM
  #116
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Comeau, Hannan, Sarich and Smith are really not that good at all. If losing any of those guys to an injury has any sort of an effect on a team that says more about the teams lack of depth than anything else.

Backlund was a sophomore who was putting up underwhelming numbers when he was healthy. Not sure how that's a "significant" loss.
Stop focusing on individual players and look at the whole picture. When a team has 6 to 8 guys out at the same time, it forces teams to play a lot of AHLers, and many have to play top-6 forward roles or top-4 defensive roles. Not many teams could adequately replace 6 or 8 injured roster players.

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06-30-2012, 01:52 PM
  #117
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BLAH BLAH BLAH...So its okay to use injuries as an excuse for the sens but not the Flames? COOL STORY BRO?

ottawa had 74 points 2 years ago and with alll those improvements they got 92 points (2 more than the "terrible" Calgary Flames) this year



You obviously don't watch the Flames nor do you know what you're talking about so all this conjecture is pretty much useless but i'll play along. Cammalleri flourished playing with Iginla a few years ago and seemed like he rekindled the magic when they got put back together midway through February. He just put 16 points in the final 18 games (9 goals), no big deal right? But yah Cammalleri sucks, him playing with Iggy for a full season is an awful idea.



It's good to make up random stuff to make your point but how about we get some truth? He's described as a good offensive player that struggles defensively nad being paired with a good defensive dman (LIKE a bouwmeester) will do him well

You're seriously in way over your head when you try to argue with me. I think you should just leave. People with an agenda don't win arguments.
Those injuries for the Sens were far more impactful.

but again, teh biggest reason why the Sens were so much better this year was the emergence of Karlsson as the premier PMD in the league. All the health in the world for Spezza and Alfredsson wouldn't have meant much if Karlsson didn't break out in the way he did.

Cammalleri doesn't suck, he's got some positives to his game. But he's soft, small, and not defensively good. And he's goign to play number 1 center? And you view this is as...a good thing?

LoL at me being in over my head trying to argue with someone who thinks all Wideman needs is a good defensive d-man to be paired with and he'll make a great top pairing d-man

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06-30-2012, 01:56 PM
  #118
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The player who the Habs signed and expected to be their number 1 d-man last year played less than 20 games and they were meaningless end of season games.

Their leading goal scorer the 2 seasons previous to this one missed 50 games, and was clearly playing through an injury when he was playing early on.
Boo hoo, markov is always hurt. Cool gionta was hurt and missed a lot of the season. It's okay to make excuses for the Habs, but for the flames its blasphemy? The habs had a few guys out for a long time, the flames had SEVERAL guys out for a short period of time. I mean why did the flames call-up a kid from the WHL to play on their? I guess because they were healthy?

Tanguay, Glencross, Stempniak, Stajan, Moss, Giordano, Babchuk all missed 15+ games...a first line winger, 2nd line winger, 3 third liners and 2 top 4 pairing dmen. You're telling me a team should not use that as an excuse if they fail to make the playoffs?

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06-30-2012, 02:02 PM
  #119
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Boo hoo, markov is always hurt. Cool gionta was hurt and missed a lot of the season. It's okay to make excuses for the Habs, but for the flames its blasphemy? The habs had a few guys out for a long time, the flames had SEVERAL guys out for a short period of time. I mean why did the flames call-up a kid from the WHL to play on their? I guess because they were healthy?

Tanguay, Glencross, Stempniak, Stajan, Moss, Giordano, Babchuk all missed 15+ games...a first line winger, 2nd line winger, 3 third liners and 2 top 4 pairing dmen. You're telling me a team should not use that as an excuse if they fail to make the playoffs?
No one is making excuses for the Habs, well I'm not anyways. They weren't deep enough to handle the losses they had.

Just like the Flames (who didn't lose a single impact player for more than a quarter of the season) weren't.

Way off track now though, none of the 3 guys mentioned in the title are going to Calgary this offseason.

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06-30-2012, 02:03 PM
  #120
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No one is making excuses for the Habs, well I'm not anyways. They weren't deep enough to handle the losses they had.

Just like the Flames (who didn't lose a single impact player for more than a quarter of the season) weren't.

Way off track now though, none of the 3 guys mentioned in the title are going to Calgary this offseason.
So you are telling me that if Phoenix, LA, SJ had 200+ more man games lost many of them at the same time that they don't lose 5-10 points?

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06-30-2012, 02:06 PM
  #121
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So you are telling me that if Phoenix, LA, SJ had 200+ more man games lost many of them at the same time that they don't lose 5-10 points?
Why speculate on things that didn't happen?

Quit grasping at straws.

The flames missed the playoffs because tehy weren't deep enough, or good enough.

Their record was probably impacted in a positive way for them by playing in the division they played in as well.

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06-30-2012, 02:06 PM
  #122
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I don't like using the excuse but people seem to forgot the majority of these injuries happened at the same time meaning we were using a line and a half from the ahl plus an ahl defender and a whl player. I don't care how good your team is that is ****ing crippling.
Wait, didn't we play better when all the injuries occured? When everyone came back from injury that's when we were wishing they stayed injured so Bartschi etc could stay up as all the rookies stepped up and were playing really well? And our season injury wise wasn't terrible... still bad and worse than could have hoped for but I don't blame injuries at all for our failures.

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06-30-2012, 02:06 PM
  #123
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Those injuries for the Sens were far more impactful.

but again, teh biggest reason why the Sens were so much better this year was the emergence of Karlsson as the premier PMD in the league. All the health in the world for Spezza and Alfredsson wouldn't have meant much if Karlsson didn't break out in the way he did.
And yah all that improvement with no injuries and they finished with 2 more points in a much easier conference than the Flames who had been riddled with injuries. Congrats though on another fail troll attempt?

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Cammalleri doesn't suck, he's got some positives to his game. But he's soft, small, and not defensively good. And he's goign to play number 1 center? And you view this is as...a good thing?
What part of 9 goals and 16 points in 18 games while playing with Iggy do you not understand? Cammalleri is paid to put up points...not to be "soft, small and play defense" so who cares about this stupid point that you keep bringing up. But it is kind of funny how you bash cammalleri for his stature and style of play while being supportive of a team with a much smaller no.1 center in David Desharnais. LOL

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LoL at me being in over my head trying to argue with someone who thinks all Wideman needs is a good defensive d-man to be paired with and he'll make a great top pairing d-man
You didn't like when you were caught in a lie did you? Not a single caps fan would have a nice thing to say eh? LOL. And oh the last time Wideman was paired with a strong defensive dman he had seasons of:

13 goals, 36 points +11
13 goals, 50 points + 32

Yah wideman is totally useless... look at me overuse the laugh emoticon because i suck at making a valid point.

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06-30-2012, 02:10 PM
  #124
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Why speculate on things that didn't happen?

Quit grasping at straws.

The flames missed the playoffs because tehy weren't deep enough, or good enough.

Their record was probably impacted in a positive way for them by playing in the division they played in as well.
I am not grasping at straws if you believe that 200+ man games lost including you best to pkers doesn't effect a team than I question how much you know about hockey if you say they would drop than INJURIES MATTER!

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06-30-2012, 02:10 PM
  #125
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And yah all that improvement with no injuries and they finished with 2 more points in a much easier conference than the Flames who had been riddled with injuries. Congrats though on another fail troll attempt?

What part of 9 goals and 16 points in 18 games while playing with Iggy do you not understand? Cammalleri is paid to put up points...not to be "soft, small and play defense" so who cares about this stupid point that you keep bringing up. But it is kind of funny how you bash cammalleri for his stature and style of play while being supportive of a team with a much no.1 smaller center in David Desharnais. LOL



You didn't like when you were caught in a lie did you? Not a single caps fan would have a nice thing to say eh? LOL. And oh the last time Wideman was paired with a strong defensive dman he had seasons of:

13 goals, 36 points +11
13 goals, 50 points + 32

Yah wideman is totally useless... look at me overuse the laugh emoticon because i suck at making a valid point.
On a good team Desharnais won't be a number 1 center. "LOL"

Oh, thats cool about him having those good seasons with a strong defensive d-man...what d-man was that? I can't think of who it was. Bouwmeester is probably as good, or better than him though, right?

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