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All Rick Nash talk- The Free Agency Frenzy Edition

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Old
06-30-2012, 10:37 PM
  #76
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Originally Posted by Gagnefan924 View Post
Unfortunately for the "Hell no" crowd, the respected Gms of those teams seem to have some interest.
They do. But they are not willing to meet Howson's demands. If they were a trade would already been done by now.

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06-30-2012, 10:39 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by IHeartZherdev View Post
Staal for Bobby Ryan? For someone who likes to make fun of what other people expect for trades, you sure propose some brilliant ones yourself
Marc Staal (great contract, premier shutdown D) +1st rounder + for Ryan + is not a bad deal.

Staal + Anisimov + 1st for Ryan + is a real good offer. I really doubt they'd say no to that. Staal holds alot of value so this deal is prob overpayment but that's what it would take.

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06-30-2012, 10:39 PM
  #78
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Jackets fans know we aren't going to get as much as Howson thinks he is, and we aren't really expecting the world for him. As for the Rangers, Stepan doesn't count as 'the world'.


Last edited by Majik1987: 06-30-2012 at 10:57 PM. Reason: qdp and response
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06-30-2012, 10:40 PM
  #79
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If they "don't want him because of the high cost" then why are they talking to the Jackets?
What fans want and what management does are not always the same thing.

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06-30-2012, 10:40 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by RyanCallahan24 View Post
They do. But they are not willing to meet Howson's demand. If they were a trade would already been done by now.
Not sure if you know this, but there's something called "negations" where teams trade proposals back and forth.

Howson talked to teams at the deadline, talked to teams around the draft, and is talking now.

Why would have a trade have had to happen by now? Why not tomorrow? or a week from now?

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06-30-2012, 10:41 PM
  #81
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Well, whats the major incentive to leave a dead last team to join a team that finished 12th in the Conference? His reasons for wanting out are because he wants to win are they not?
I believe his reason for leaving Columbus is that he was told they would surround him with talent, make steps to be a playoff contender, then failed to do so. Having Carter leave seemed to be the straw that broke the camel's back.

Carolina has no such problem. They had talent before (Staal, Skinner, Ward) and added to it (Staal). They're taking clear steps forward. If Nash comes here, he would likely play with both brothers on the top line, surrounding him with talent.

And in terms of the off-ice situation, Nash has said he likes the anonymity in Columbus. That he can walk down the street and not be pestered. Carolina offers that luxury. NY, Philly, Ottawa...not so much. In terms of markets interested, Carolina's probably the closest to Columbus.

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06-30-2012, 10:42 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by IHeartZherdev View Post
Marc Staal for Bobby Ryan? For someone who likes to make fun of what other people expect for trades, you sure propose some brilliant ones yourself
Many agreed at the time it was a modestly fair proposal. A little bit of value would have been added from the Rangers end, but not as off base as you seem to think.

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06-30-2012, 10:42 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by gojackets1 View Post

Jackets fans know we aren't going to get as much as Howson thinks he is, and we aren't really expecting the world for him. As for the Rangers, Stepan doesn't count as 'the world'.
Funny how the last 2 hours the CBJ fans I've talked to is expecting what Howson expects, so yeah most of you (at least the active one's in here do).

And Stepan + Del Zotto/McD + Kreider is overpayment by alot. So yeah...

That's what Howson wants.


Last edited by Majik1987: 06-30-2012 at 10:57 PM. Reason: qe
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06-30-2012, 10:42 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by gojackets1 View Post
Jackets fans know we aren't going to get as much as Howson thinks he is, and we aren't really expecting the world for him. As for the Rangers, Stepan doesn't count as 'the world'.
So your saying you dont expect 'the world', then say a player isnt 'the world'... does that mean hes a fit?


Last edited by Majik1987: 06-30-2012 at 10:58 PM. Reason: qe
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06-30-2012, 10:45 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by RyanCallahan24 View Post
Marc Staal (great contract, premier shutdown D) +1st rounder + for Ryan + is not a bad deal.

Staal + Anisimov + 1st for Ryan + is a real good offer. I really doubt they'd say no to that. Staal holds alot of value so this deal is prob overpayment but that's what it would take.

It's a horrible deal because Staal is a UFA in 3 years and they'll have to worry about losing him. That, and his play fell off dramatically due to a concussion. And, they could get a lot better than that from another team.

You are one of those fans who likes to propose deals that would never have your team losing anything of value and getting great value back.

Again, I totally get fans not wanting to get rid of youth or talent on their roster. But to expect to get elite players of Nash and Bobby Ryan's caliber, it requires giving up some significant value

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06-30-2012, 10:45 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by Gagnefan924 View Post
Not even top 50? Can you underrate Nash anymore? Give me a list of 50 better players and I'll pick out 15 of them that have no business being there.
Perry
Ryan
Getzlaf
Seguin
Chara
Bergeron
Pominville
Vanek
Miller
Iginla
Skinner
Ward
Kipprusoff
E Staal
J Staal
Hossa
Sharp
Kane
Toews
Kieth
Sheabrook
Stastny
Duchene
Landeskog
Eriksson
Benn
Zetterberg
Datsyuk
Hall
Nugent-Hopkins
Eberle
Kopitar
Richards
Brown
Carter
Doughty
Quick
Heatley
Koivu
Webber
Sutter
Rinne
Kovalchuk
Parise
Tavares
Moulson
Gaborik
Richards
Lundqvist
Karlsson
Spezza
Michalek
Giroux
Yandle
Crosby
Malkin
Letang
Neal
Thornton
Marleau
Couture
Pietrangelo
Halak
Stamkos
St. Louis
Hedman
Kessel
Phanuef
Sedin
Sedin
Kessler
Luongo
Edler
Ovechkin
Backstrom
Green
Kane
Byfuglien
Pavelec

I have no idea how many that is and I know there are some younger names, but those are guys I rate over Rick Nash all things considered

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06-30-2012, 10:47 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Rainbow Express View Post
Perry
Ryan
Getzlaf
Seguin
Chara
Bergeron
Pominville
Vanek
Miller
Iginla
LaRose
Skinner
Ward
Kipprusoff
E Staal
J Staal
Hossa
Sharp
Kane
Toews
Kieth
Sheabrook
Stastny
Duchene
Landeskog
Eriksson
Benn
Zetterberg
Datsyuk
Hall
Nugent-Hopkins
Eberle
Kopitar
Richards
Brown
Carter
Doughty
Quick
Heatley
Koivu
Webber
Sutter
Rinne
Kovalchuk
Parise
Tavares
Moulson
Gaborik
Richards
Lundqvist
Karlsson
Spezza
Michalek
Giroux
Yandle
Crosby
Malkin
Letang
Neal
Thornton
Marleau
Couture
Pietrangelo
Halak
Stamkos
St. Louis
Hedman
Kessel
Phanuef
Sedin
Sedin
Kessler
Luongo
Edler
Ovechkin
Backstrom
Green
Kane
Byfuglien
Pavelec

I have no idea how many that is and I know there are some younger names, but those are guys I rate over Rick Nash all things considered
Fixed. I'm not a Columbus fan, but half the names on that list would probably rank behind Nash in my opinion.

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06-30-2012, 10:47 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by RyanCallahan24 View Post
Funny how the last 2 hours the CBJ fans I've talked to is expecting what Howson expects, so yeah most of you (at least the active one's in here do).

And Stepan + Del Zotto/McD + Kreider is overpayment by alot. So yeah...

That's what Howson wants.
Come look at the Jackets board and see what some are expecting. We aren't really talking much about the Rangers currently, however. And I wasn't saying Stepan+DZ+Kreider isn't the world. That's ridiculous and certainly won't happen. If any Jackets fan expects that they should be ashamed. However, I think Dubinsky+Stepan+1st/(prospect+2nd) is certainly a fair deal. If you don't want Nash, I get it. But just because the fans of a team don't want a player doesn't mean it lower his value.

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06-30-2012, 10:49 PM
  #89
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Dude, I get you're trying to troll jacket fans, but by proclaiming Dion Phaneuf, Matt Moulson, Alex Edler, etc. are better than Rick Nash all you're doing making it clear you are clueless about hockey

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06-30-2012, 10:50 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Rainbow Express View Post
Perry
Ryan
Getzlaf
Seguin
Chara
Bergeron
Pominville
Vanek
Miller
Iginla
Skinner
Ward
Kipprusoff
E Staal
J Staal
Hossa
Sharp
Kane
Toews
Kieth
Sheabrook
Stastny
Duchene
Landeskog
Eriksson
Benn
Zetterberg
Datsyuk
Hall
Nugent-Hopkins
Eberle
Kopitar
Richards
Brown
Carter
Doughty
Quick
Heatley
Koivu
Webber
Sutter
Rinne
Kovalchuk
Parise
Tavares
Moulson
Gaborik
Richards
Lundqvist
Karlsson
Spezza
Michalek
Giroux
Yandle
Crosby
Malkin
Letang
Neal
Thornton
Marleau
Couture
Pietrangelo
Halak
Stamkos
St. Louis
Hedman
Kessel
Phanuef
Sedin
Sedin
Kessler
Luongo
Edler
Ovechkin
Backstrom
Green
Kane
Byfuglien
Pavelec

I have no idea how many that is and I know there are some younger names, but those are guys I rate over Rick Nash all things considered
You're comparing Nash to goalies? Give me a break.

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06-30-2012, 10:50 PM
  #91
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I believe his reason for leaving Columbus is that he was told they would surround him with talent, make steps to be a playoff contender, then failed to do so. Having Carter leave seemed to be the straw that broke the camel's back.

Carolina has no such problem. They had talent before (Staal, Skinner, Ward) and added to it (Staal). They're taking clear steps forward. If Nash comes here, he would likely play with both brothers on the top line, surrounding him with talent.

And in terms of the off-ice situation, Nash has said he likes the anonymity in Columbus. That he can walk down the street and not be pestered. Carolina offers that luxury. NY, Philly, Ottawa...not so much. In terms of markets interested, Carolina's probably the closest to Columbus.
I get what your saying, I would way rather play in Carolina than Columbus.. but if you want to give yourself the best chance to win, can steer the direction of any trade that comes to you, and you KNOW some of the leagues very top teams want you...

No offence but, while we dont know the concrete list of teams, we do know there is a list and theres what 5 or 6 teams? Why would a team that was 12th in the Conference make that list? With a guy that spent his entire career losing? Maybe he wants a change but not that much of a change?

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06-30-2012, 10:52 PM
  #92
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lol grow up. You're gonna cry when you see the return Nash is gonna get you. Oh well you probably won't mind since you're most likely a Nash fanboy and not a CBJ fan.
Says the person who called out CBJ fans for being "disrespectful". And how should CBJ fans react if the deal involves one or more of your so called "untouchables"? Should we go around rubbing it in your face? I sure as hell won't because, in the end, you are getting a player that you severely underrate and I guarantee will impress you. I question how much any of you actually watch Nash play. If Torts can light the fire under him that Arniel never could, which I am sure he will, you will have a true weapon on your hands.

I am one of the fans who feels that the emotional baggage of trying to carry an entire franchise has dampened his play. Since the playoff season where he probably thought the team had finally arrived and the utter disappointments that happened in the following years, Rick Nash just seems tired. Not physically tired per se, but completely emotionally drained. Once that baggage is lifted chances are you will see the Rick Nash that could be depended on to completely take over games for a team in a way few players can. You aren't going to find many 6'4 220 pound guys with the skill-set he has. Fans have no control over what the trade itself entails, but even if Sather were to give up what Howson's initial price was (Which will come down at least a bit, nobody negotiates by stating what they will accept) I am convinced that this Nash will be a great fit for the Rangers. In fact, I will run around Nationwide Arena ass-naked except for a Rangers cape singing "Clang Clang Clang Went the Trolley" if in five years Rangers fans feel like they lost the trade. Hold me to that.

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06-30-2012, 10:52 PM
  #93
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So your saying you dont expect 'the world', then say a player isnt 'the world'... does that mean hes a fit?
Yes it does.

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06-30-2012, 10:54 PM
  #94
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It's a horrible deal because Staal is a UFA in 3 years and they'll have to worry about losing him. That, and his play fell off dramatically due to a concussion. And, they could get a lot better than that from another team.

You are one of those fans who likes to propose deals that would never have your team losing anything of value and getting great value back.

Again, I totally get fans not wanting to get rid of youth or talent on their roster. But to expect to get elite players of Nash and Bobby Ryan's caliber, it requires giving up some significant value
Its a bad deal cuz his contract runs out in 3 years?

When does Ryans contract end? Do you know?

Also, if Staals play fell off dramatically because of a concussion and lowered his value, im guessing as a Bluejackets fan you didnt have much of a reason to watch the playoffs, but if you did, you would have seen a pre concussion Staal being our best defenceman.

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06-30-2012, 10:55 PM
  #95
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I get what your saying, I would way rather play in Carolina than Columbus.. but if you want to give yourself the best chance to win, can steer the direction of any trade that comes to you, and you KNOW some of the leagues very top teams want you...

No offence but, while we dont know the concrete list of teams, we do know there is a list and theres what 5 or 6 teams? Why would a team that was 12th in the Conference make that list? With a guy that spent his entire career losing? Maybe he wants a change but not that much of a change?
There were 5-6 teams at the deadline. We know that list likely expanded in the offseason, to give Howson more room to work.

I'm not commenting on Carolina's placement for two reasons:

1. Standings change from year to year. It wasn't too long ago that the Rangers were a whole 2 points ahead of the Canes in the final standings.
2. If you don't believe a top 6 with Ruutu, Skinner, both Staals and Nash couldn't compete, I don't know what to tell you.

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06-30-2012, 10:56 PM
  #96
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You're comparing Nash to goalies? Give me a break.
are goalies NHL players?

I said top 50 NHL players
not top 50 wings or top 50 forwards

I said top 50 NHL players.

Go ahead and take goalies out of it, he's still not Top 50.

Then you'll want to take away d-men, and then centers, and then right wingers, then players who wear Easton gear, then players that are born after 1988, then players who are under 6ft tall etc etc

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06-30-2012, 10:58 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Rainbow Express View Post
Perry
Ryan
Getzlaf
Seguin
Chara
Bergeron
Pominville
Vanek
Miller
Iginla
Skinner
Ward
Kipprusoff
E Staal
J Staal
Hossa
Sharp
Kane
Toews
Kieth
Sheabrook
Stastny
Duchene
Landeskog
Eriksson
Benn
Zetterberg

Datsyuk
Hall
Nugent-Hopkins

Eberle
Kopitar
Richards
Brown
Carter

Doughty
Quick
Heatley
Koivu

Webber
Sutter
Rinne
Kovalchuk
Parise
Tavares
Moulson
Gaborik
Richards
Lundqvist
Karlsson
Spezza
Michalek
Giroux
Yandle
Crosby
Malkin
Letang
Neal
Thornton
Marleau
Couture
Pietrangelo
Halak
Stamkos
St. Louis
Hedman
Kessel
Phanuef

Sedin
Sedin
Kessler
Luongo
Edler
Ovechkin
Backstrom
Green
Kane
Byfuglien
Pavelec


I have no idea how many that is and I know there are some younger names, but those are guys I rate over Rick Nash all things considered
Nash is better than all those I bolded.

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06-30-2012, 10:58 PM
  #98
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I believe his reason for leaving Columbus is that he was told they would surround him with talent, make steps to be a playoff contender, then failed to do so. Having Carter leave seemed to be the straw that broke the camel's back.

Carolina has no such problem. They had talent before (Staal, Skinner, Ward) and added to it (Staal). They're taking clear steps forward. If Nash comes here, he would likely play with both brothers on the top line, surrounding him with talent.

And in terms of the off-ice situation, Nash has said he likes the anonymity in Columbus. That he can walk down the street and not be pestered. Carolina offers that luxury. NY, Philly, Ottawa...not so much. In terms of markets interested, Carolina's probably the closest to Columbus.
The questions then become this...
- If it means losing Skinner and gaining Nash, is it still worth it?
- How big of an impact does Boucher's injury have?

Boucher is 35, and obviously injured at least through Thanksgiving and possibly longer. Steve Mason is 24, and has exactly one year left on his contract. As an athletic full-right goalie who was in the NHL unexpectedly at a young age, he's also exactly the type who could benefit from being around Tom Barrasso.

Let's say there's a basic foundation of Skinner, Jokinen, and Ryan Murphy for Nash and Mason. Faulk stays, McBain stays, Dalpe stays, etc. I'm not getting into draft pick issues, or mid-level prospects, or anything like that. Carolina loses Skinner and Jokinen off the current roster, but adds Nash and a moderate-risk/high-reward backup with one year left. If Mason totally bombs out, Boucher comes back in short order anyway, and Mason's contract is up next year. And the thought of Nash alongside Staal and Staal...

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06-30-2012, 11:00 PM
  #99
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Originally Posted by Rainbow Express View Post

...

I have no idea how many that is and I know there are some younger names, but those are guys I rate over Rick Nash all things considered
And without even realizing it, you'll probably end up shifting the entire thread toward "the bolded are worse than Nash", "the bolded are better than Nash", and then a huge debate over whether or not Brent Seabrook is better than Rick Nash will ensue.

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06-30-2012, 11:00 PM
  #100
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Nash is better than all those I bolded.
Laughable on some of the bold names.

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