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06-30-2012, 10:06 AM
  #51
NJDevs26
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Originally Posted by guyincognito View Post
They can't, the roster I posted only has two open roster spots. They could go to 23, but they're not going to 23 with anyone who costs anything.

They are going to have to sign/trade for someone big. Big as in expensive.

Of course they could pull the turd move and trade for Gomez and buy back around $2M of Kovy's overage, but again, that's just a brutal move.
At least Gomez could theoretically play, the real siren-sounding move would be bringing in Thomas and having a dead $5 million cap hit lol

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06-30-2012, 10:07 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Saugus View Post
No amount of marketing or merchandise sales is going to wipe out $80 M in arena debt. The situation the Devils are in is entirely because of the move to Newark. It was an overreach, and here we are.
We'll this arena debt was a nessesary evil to keep the franchise in NJ. No way we woud still be here playing in E.Rutherford struggiling to average 14k with even a good team. So we'll just have to deal with this.

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06-30-2012, 10:08 AM
  #53
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At least Gomez could theoretically play, the real siren-sounding move would be bringing in Thomas and having a dead $5 million cap hit lol
Except Thomas is probably faking it and then he'd report and "whoops". Not that having Tim Thomas would be totally awful, but I digress.

And from a business sense it would cost them more money in revenue then they'd save against the cap. Want to sell no ST's for the rest of the summer? Do that.

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06-30-2012, 10:19 AM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Lou's Koolaid View Post
We'll this arena debt was a nessesary evil to keep the franchise in NJ. No way we woud still be here playing in E.Rutherford struggiling to average 14k with even a good team. So we'll just have to deal with this.
Great point. I'd rather deal with this than having NO Major Sports team in NJ.


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+1. Can you imagine how bad things could be if the Devils didn't get a 20+ million cash infusion from the playoff run?
I heard it was 30 million.


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Glad I could provide some comic relief.
I think it could be either because your post is a bit absurd or that Scotty has a perverse sense of humor.

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06-30-2012, 10:21 AM
  #55
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I'd rather have Marty at $5 million than Thomas at that price. Thomas wasn't all that good at the end of the season, and it's been speculated he isn't the best friends of everybody in that locker room. Some people pointed out the Bruins started having their problems right around the time the White House snub happened with him refusing to go.

We didn't win last year, so at least we wouldn't have that problem with him.

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06-30-2012, 10:28 AM
  #56
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Would Thomas even want to report if Zach walks and it seems like we'll be a mediocre team at best? I have no idea what he wants out of his sabbatical, to play more with another team? Then why doesn't he want to go to Toronto supposedly?

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06-30-2012, 10:35 AM
  #57
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Originally Posted by NJDevs26 View Post
Would Thomas even want to report if Zach walks and it seems like we'll be a mediocre team at best? I have no idea what he wants out of his sabbatical, to play more with another team? Then why doesn't he want to go to Toronto supposedly?
I think he might retire. Whether he wants to now or not I think come next year we'll find out.

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06-30-2012, 10:42 AM
  #58
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I think he might retire. Whether he wants to now or not I think come next year we'll find out.
Well he did waive his no-trade, but it could be just a favor to the Bruins if they want to fob off his dead cap hit, who knows.

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06-30-2012, 10:46 AM
  #59
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Boo.

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06-30-2012, 10:52 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Saugus View Post
No amount of marketing or merchandise sales is going to wipe out $80 M in arena debt. The situation the Devils are in is entirely because of the move to Newark. It was an overreach, and here we are.
Pretty much (except it's actually mathematically worse).

Lets play pretend, and assume the Devils sold out every single game since moving to The Rock in 2007/08.

Even then, I highly doubt the Devils would have avoided this financial catastrophe, it just wouldn't be as bad. That's what I mean when I say this deal never made financial sense to me even before the building opened.

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Originally Posted by guyincognito View Post
But someone is coming in, because they can't spend the amount they have on random junk, they're already too close to a full roster and just gave 3 forwards one ways, when you could make an argument only Carter should have gotten one.
While I'm a HUGE fan of Lou signing the entire 4th-line , it IS a sign of a team struggling with the money.

Think about it.

Lets say you have a fixed sum of money to work with and you have to buy 7 people birthday presents, but 2 of those people get a really, really expensive present, the other 5 are acquaintances that you wont spend as much on.

Do you spend a ton on the 2 important gifts first? No.

You spendthrift on the 5 gifts as much as possible so you have enough for the last 2 gifts, and you'll know exactly how much you have to spend on those last gifts.

To me, Lou's actions of filling up the "low value" roster spots first are entirely consistent with an individual working on a tight operating budget who is saving for a future expenditure.

I kindof just wrote a biblical gospel parable of the Devils finances, but that's my $0.02.

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06-30-2012, 11:03 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by BenedictGomez View Post
Pretty much (except it's actually mathematically worse).

Lets play pretend, and assume the Devils sold out every single game since moving to The Rock in 2007/08.

Even then, I highly doubt the Devils would have avoided this financial catastrophe, it just wouldn't be as bad. That's what I mean when I say this deal never made financial sense to me even before the building opened.



While I'm a HUGE fan of Lou signing the entire 4th-line , it IS a sign of a team struggling with the money.

Think about it.

Lets say you have a fixed sum of money to work with and you have to buy 7 people birthday presents, but 2 of those people get a really, really expensive present, the other 5 are acquaintances that you wont spend as much on.

Do you spend a ton on the 2 important gifts first? No.

You spendthrift on the 5 gifts as much as possible so you have enough for the last 2 gifts, and you'll know exactly how much you have to spend on those last gifts.

To me, Lou's actions of filling up the "low value" roster spots first are entirely consistent with an individual working on a tight operating budget who is saving for a future expenditure.

I kindof just wrote a biblical gospel parable of the Devils finances, but that's my $0.02.

You forgot "Hallelujah" and "Amen".

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06-30-2012, 11:16 AM
  #62
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Originally Posted by NJDevs26 View Post
Would Thomas even want to report if Zach walks and it seems like we'll be a mediocre team at best? I have no idea what he wants out of his sabbatical, to play more with another team? Then why doesn't he want to go to Toronto supposedly?
I can think of $5 million reasons he would report. The threat to sit out is a ploy because his no-trade expired

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06-30-2012, 11:18 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by BenedictGomez View Post
Pretty much (except it's actually mathematically worse).

Lets play pretend, and assume the Devils sold out every single game since moving to The Rock in 2007/08.

Even then, I highly doubt the Devils would have avoided this financial catastrophe, it just wouldn't be as bad. That's what I mean when I say this deal never made financial sense to me even before the building opened.



While I'm a HUGE fan of Lou signing the entire 4th-line , it IS a sign of a team struggling with the money.

Think about it.

Lets say you have a fixed sum of money to work with and you have to buy 7 people birthday presents, but 2 of those people get a really, really expensive present, the other 5 are acquaintances that you wont spend as much on.

Do you spend a ton on the 2 important gifts first? No.

You spendthrift on the 5 gifts as much as possible so you have enough for the last 2 gifts, and you'll know exactly how much you have to spend on those last gifts.

To me, Lou's actions of filling up the "low value" roster spots first are entirely consistent with an individual working on a tight operating budget who is saving for a future expenditure.

I kindof just wrote a biblical gospel parable of the Devils finances, but that's my $0.02.
That's what I'm thinking too. Process of elimination.

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06-30-2012, 11:18 AM
  #64
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I'm guessing they racked up alot of debt while playing in the Meadowlands waiting for the arena to be dealt.

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06-30-2012, 11:28 AM
  #65
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It would have been cheaper to not sign Cam and keep Boulton, rather than sign Cam and buyout Boulton, things are fine.

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06-30-2012, 12:02 PM
  #66
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I think that's just how Lou operates. This isn't the first time he'd signed the little fish first and left the big fish for last to focus his energy on.

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06-30-2012, 11:49 PM
  #67
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Are the Devils losing money ever since they moved into their new arena, is that one of the reasons they're having money problems? Just curious.

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06-30-2012, 11:50 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Sportsfan1 View Post
Are the Devils losing money ever since they moved into their new arena, is that one of the reasons they're having money problems? Just curious.
Nope, the team has made a little bit of money or broken even every year. It's the loans we took out to build the arena that are hurting us along with a 47% owner who doesn't want to put more money into the team.

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06-30-2012, 11:53 PM
  #69
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Are the Devils losing money ever since they moved into their new arena, is that one of the reasons they're having money problems? Just curious.
I think so. Some fans blame the Kovy contract. No contract helps, but seriously a lot of teams have players being paid like this so it is useless to nitpick at that.

I'm still wondering why we are seeing no payoff from the playoff run. Seriously $30 million+. That's $30 million we would not have if we had missed the playoffs again, and roughly I'd say $20 million + more than we'd have if we were eliminated in one round cause I'm basing that on ticket prices going up in the later rounds.

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07-01-2012, 01:58 AM
  #70
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I'm still wondering why we are seeing no payoff from the playoff run. Seriously $30 million+. That's $30 million we would not have if we had missed the playoffs again, and roughly I'd say $20 million + more than we'd have if we were eliminated in one round cause I'm basing that on ticket prices going up in the later rounds.
When you're eleventy-billion in debt, $30 million+ doesn't cut it.

The problems here are financially structural, which is why I am, as in day 1, sticking to a bankruptcy prediction and just hoping for the best.

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07-01-2012, 02:06 AM
  #71
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When you're eleventy-billion in debt, $30 million+ doesn't cut it.

The problems here are financially structural, which is why I am, as in day 1, sticking to a bankruptcy prediction and just hoping for the best.
You're right it's nearly nothing. Chump change. Just imagine if we got beat out in the first or missed altogether again? The Buttman said he expected a deal to be reached shortly, but probably after July 1st. I think we can put our trust in him!

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07-01-2012, 02:11 AM
  #72
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You're right it's nearly nothing. Chump change. Just imagine if we got beat out in the first or missed altogether again? The Buttman said he expected a deal to be reached shortly, but probably after July 1st. I think we can put our trust in him!
If there's one thing I've learned in situations like this (well, not quite like this, but in situations with publicly traded companies that are kindof sortof at least a little bit like this), it's that you never trust the person who says everything is going to be okay. They're almost never truthful/right. The truth usually resides somewhere between rainbows + unicorns, and nuclear doom.

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07-01-2012, 02:15 AM
  #73
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If there's one thing I've learned in situations like this (well, not quite like this, but in situations with publicly traded companies that are kindof sortof at least a little bit like this), it's that you never trust the person who says everything is going to be okay. They're almost never truthful/right. The truth usually resides somewhere between rainbows + unicorns, and nuclear doom.
Believe me man I don't trust anything he says. I really don't trust anything that anybody is saying about this. The whole organization denied there were problems after the Forbes article which broke it last Summer, and then the team acknowledged it but it's still hasn't been talked about much by Lou publicly. I think we've heard more from Buttman than we have from the organization directly on the topic. Then there was a Wendy's guy trying to buy the team, and then some other investor. It's like a carousel.

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07-01-2012, 06:52 AM
  #74
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Believe me man I don't trust anything he says. I really don't trust anything that anybody is saying about this. The whole organization denied there were problems after the Forbes article which broke it last Summer, and then the team acknowledged it but it's still hasn't been talked about much by Lou publicly. I think we've heard more from Buttman than we have from the organization directly on the topic. Then there was a Wendy's guy trying to buy the team, and then some other investor. It's like a carousel.
Today will be the biggest telling point of all either way. If Zach walks, the organization's status quo meme won't be enough, there has to be some indication of what they actually offered and I think there will be unless it's so far below what he winds up getting that letting everyone know would confirm our financial woes. And like you said earlier, there DEFINITELY has to be an explanation if Marty walks, for more than finanancial reasons.

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07-01-2012, 11:44 AM
  #75
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Today will be the biggest telling point of all either way. If Zach walks, the organization's status quo meme won't be enough, there has to be some indication of what they actually offered and I think there will be unless it's so far below what he winds up getting that letting everyone know would confirm our financial woes. And like you said earlier, there DEFINITELY has to be an explanation if Marty walks, for more than finanancial reasons.
Take this one to the bank...

It's not the offer that is below market but the structure.

Parise could have been done last year on a LT multiyear at numbers everyone agreed.

Problem is salary timing, not term and amount. On a cash basis the club cannot afford premiere players on a normal payout, they need salary backended. That doesn't work for players who can demand and get frontended contracts.

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