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06-30-2012, 05:27 PM
  #26
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Price has his costly puck mishandling moments too. Hey I like Pricey too. He's our franchise goalie and he's a damn good one, but he is not worth more than Quick nor is he a better goalie. I understand the whole taxes situation so bump it up to 6mil. But if he demands more then I don't think he wants to help build a contender.
Cam ward contract looks fine to me...and it was done YEARS ago.

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06-30-2012, 05:29 PM
  #27
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Right now? Sure. I'd also like Stamkos over Plekanec. Actually, perhaps too far of a comparison. I actually feel Price on the kings would've probably had similar success. What a solid team. Quick is excellent and his success has left us saying Quick>Price but I don't think Price is far off and I'd be content with either.
Quick is so agile, and his compete level is so high.. I think, higher than Price's, on both counts. Quick is also quicker than Price, as well as being more agile, and better on breakaways.

Just saying.

I do love Price though and glad we have in.

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06-30-2012, 05:35 PM
  #28
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Quick is so agile, and his compete level is so high.. I think, higher than Price's, on both counts. Quick is also quicker than Price, as well as being more agile, and better on breakaways.

Just saying.

I do love Price though and glad we have in.
I think Price is a better positional goalie. I think Price's size advantage is useful for montreal who have very little in the form of crease clearers. I don't disagree that Quick is more agile and more quick but by same regard price is superior in other respects. Overall, Quick really came out this year as a great young goalie surpassing Price(until price proves otherwise) and LA is lucky to have him, but I really don't think it's as far off as people suggest just yet. I still believe Price can be the better goalie long term. He may just as easily never surpass Quick again, who knows. I just think those two belong in same sentence.

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06-30-2012, 05:44 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
I think Price is a better positional goalie. I think Price's size advantage is useful for montreal who have very little in the form of crease clearers. I don't disagree that Quick is more agile and more quick but by same regard price is superior in other respects. Overall, Quick really came out this year as a great young goalie surpassing Price(until price proves otherwise) and LA is lucky to have him, but I really don't think it's as far off as people suggest just yet. I still believe Price can be the better goalie long term. He may just as easily never surpass Quick again, who knows. I just think those two belong in same sentence.
Yeah.. I don't actually disagree with you, not at all, completely valid points all around.

I hope Price can get to that 'next-level' where you go from 'potential elite goalie' to 'elite goalie'.

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06-30-2012, 07:05 PM
  #30
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It doesn't matter how much he signs for, it only matters how good he plays. A million dollars either way on a 70 million cap is not going to make or break MB's ability to ice a team.
You say that for every important player for this team and suddenly your overpayment total amounts to 5mil.

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06-30-2012, 07:12 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Habsolument90 View Post
Price has his costly puck mishandling moments too. Hey I like Pricey too. He's our franchise goalie and he's a damn good one, but he is not worth more than Quick nor is he a better goalie. I understand the whole taxes situation so bump it up to 6mil. But if he demands more then I don't think he wants to help build a contender.
Dude...Quick is making 7 million a year.

Over the next 7 seasons after next season he's making 49 million.

Then they added 3 years on to artificially lower the cap.

What his cap hit is, has NOTHING to do with what Price's should, or shouldn't be.

I think he's definitely a better goalie, he was better than Quick 2 seasons ago and this year they played on 2 completely different levels of teams.

Also, in regards to your last comment...that's absolute malarkie. If Price wanted he could demand 8 a year. This franchise will be in a black hole wtihout him for the next 5 years and everyone knows it. With a cap of 70.2 making between 6 and 7 for a legitimate number 1 goalie who was a top 5 goalie last year and only "slipped'' this year becuase of the awful team in front of him I really just don't get how he isn't worth that.

Look at what Lundqvist signed for 4 and a half years ago, and what Miller signed for 4 years ago and tell me how absurdly overpaid they were, and how little they cared about team success based on those deals.

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06-30-2012, 07:16 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by BobbyFischer View Post
Quick is so agile, and his compete level is so high.. I think, higher than Price's, on both counts. Quick is also quicker than Price, as well as being more agile, and better on breakaways.

Just saying.

I do love Price though and glad we have in.
Hahaha

Do people actually listen and believe that garbage the media says?

His compete level is so high? What does that even mean?

How the hell do people think guys become starting NHL goaltenders unless their compete level is through the roof?

You haer that "never quit attitude'' nonsense with guys like Thomas and Quick all the time, but never guys like Lundqvist and Price.

You know why? Because of their styles. Thomas and Quick can get thesmelves out of position with their aggressive style...not that this is a bad, or good thing...but this "'compete level'' of Quick's that is so much higher than Price's (or any other great goalie) is a myth.

It's just a way for media folks to compliment a goalie, that means nothing.

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06-30-2012, 07:20 PM
  #33
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Cam ward contract looks fine to me...and it was done YEARS ago.
Yup, Ward has a fair contract. For both the team and the player.

Just like Lundqvist and Miller.

I think the problem is that a handful of goalies have signed deals that were really long term giving them a misrepresentation of their "'worth'' to the team.

Bryzgalov signs for 9 years at 31 and has a 5.666 cap hit.

Price looks like he'll sign for 6 or 7 years at 25 and he'll have a 6.75(ish) cap hit.

Do people really not understand the massive difference between those 2 situations and how asinine it is to look at one cap hit and proclaim it to be some sort of benchmark.

It's the same, and even more relevant with Quick. His cap hit is artificially lowered due to the length of the deal. Him signing for 5.8 million for 10 years does not mean in any way that if Price signs for 6.75 for 7 years he's overpaid.

What it means is that Price got a legitimate contract without any funny business to alter the cap. That's all.

It's Bergevin's (And associates) job to figure out how to make it all work.

I find it so odd people are becoming this irate over such a minor issue with the contract.

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06-30-2012, 08:42 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by UniverStalinGraduate View Post
I'd way rather have Price.

Quick is BRUTAL at playing the puck, despite waht the CBC media said numerous times during the playoffs.

Quick was great, but the team was amazing defensively and has been for a couple of years now.
Price has a bigger edge, hands-wise over Quick than Quick has an edge in agility over Price.

I mean, Price is among the goalies with the best hands, league-wide, perhaps second only to Brodeur, and his capability to handle the puck helped us out with the penalty kill.

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06-30-2012, 08:53 PM
  #35
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What is this bull **** about focusing on salary rather than cap hit? Quick's cap hit is less than 6mil for bazillion whatever **** years. That's all that matters.

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06-30-2012, 08:54 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Mathradio View Post
Price has a bigger edge, hands-wise over Quick than Quick has an edge in agility over Price.

I mean, Price is among the goalies with the best hands, league-wide, perhaps second only to Brodeur, and his capability to handle the puck helped us out with the penalty kill.
I don't believe there to be much of any edge in agility either.

The reason Price is viewed as less agile or athletic than Quick is because the way he plays looks awfully boring. He plays in net beautifully and because of that a lot of his play looks far more routine than it would were other guys in that situation.

Price is just going to get older, more experienced and better at playing the puck, regards to your 2nd comment. That probably rings true for some other areas for him as well though

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06-30-2012, 09:05 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by UniverStalinGraduate View Post
I don't believe there to be much of any edge in agility either.

The reason Price is viewed as less agile or athletic than Quick is because the way he plays looks awfully boring. He plays in net beautifully and because of that a lot of his play looks far more routine than it would were other guys in that situation.

Price is just going to get older, more experienced and better at playing the puck, regards to your 2nd comment. That probably rings true for some other areas for him as well though
Absolutely bang on. Price's style appears more effortless (read less dramatic) so many observers consider him less athletic or to make fewer 'spectacular' saves than other top goalies.

As for those who ask question his accomplishments vis-a-vis his peers, let me remind you that he has had, at best, average teams in front of him in Montreal. And often those average teams were decimated by injury.

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06-30-2012, 09:09 PM
  #38
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Hahaha

Do people actually listen and believe that garbage the media says?

His compete level is so high? What does that even mean?

How the hell do people think guys become starting NHL goaltenders unless their compete level is through the roof?

You haer that "never quit attitude'' nonsense with guys like Thomas and Quick all the time, but never guys like Lundqvist and Price.

You know why? Because of their styles. Thomas and Quick can get thesmelves out of position with their aggressive style...not that this is a bad, or good thing...but this "'compete level'' of Quick's that is so much higher than Price's (or any other great goalie) is a myth.

It's just a way for media folks to compliment a goalie, that means nothing.
I'm so with you on this.

Media (*cough* CBC *cough*) is hyping up a successfull goal with crap like this is usually because the commentator/analyst has nothing more insightful to say. Also, naturally, it sounds better if you say the goalie was amazing on this or that play instead of saying "nobody was screening the goalie on that shot" or "the goalie was out of position but was lucky with that desperate save" or "the defense made the goalie's job easy" or "he simply shot at the goalie". (Of course, you do hear that sometimes but not nearly enough; and I understand that since it's a show.)

Honestly, I found there's too much hype around Quick. IMO he had it easy in general, due to the great defensive team in front of him. Like Thomas, he won the Conn Smythe because of a great defensively minded team. They are great goalies but the players in front of them made them look way better than they really are.

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06-30-2012, 09:15 PM
  #39
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What is this bull **** about focusing on salary rather than cap hit? Quick's cap hit is less than 6mil for bazillion whatever **** years. That's all that matters.
No...it isn't.

You simply can't view Quick's contract as a comparable to what Price will get because there are added years at the end which diminish his cap hit.

Obviously at the end of the day every year for cap purposes 5.8 is the only number that matters for LA's capologists...

But for Price, his agent, and the Habs. It means approximately squadoosh. Quick just committed the next 11 (because he's still signed for a year 1.8) years of his career in LA. He'll be 38 when his obligations to that contract(s) signed with the Los Angeles Kings ends.

Price looks like he'll probably hit UFA at 30 or 31.

When you factor in the recent revenue streams for the NHL as well as speculate on what they will do in the next few years as well it seems that a 6.75 cap hit for a goalie really is not anything to worry all that much about.

Now if the Habs signed Price to a 10 year 60 million dollar deal, as opposed to some I wouldn't be mad about the length. It's the habs, Dipietro only effects the Islanders because their owner won't spend money to compete to begin with, let alone to pay a goalie 4.5 a year to not play.

That's one person too. Brodeur has been healthy for the last 17 years minus one single significant injury.

Lots of goalise play many games every year. On a consistent basis too.

I don't know if Price is the "best" goalie in the league or not, but I do know that when/if the habs sign him that will, in my eyes, mean not having to worry about goaltending for the rest of the decade.

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06-30-2012, 09:20 PM
  #40
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I'm so with you on this.

Media (*cough* CBC *cough*) is hyping up a successfull goal with crap like this is usually because the commentator/analyst has nothing more insightful to say. Also, naturally, it sounds better if you say the goalie was amazing on this or that play instead of saying "nobody was screening the goalie on that shot" or "the goalie was out of position but was lucky with that desperate save" or "the defense made the goalie's job easy" or "he simply shot at the goalie". (Of course, you do hear that sometimes but not nearly enough; and I understand that since it's a show.)

Honestly, I found there's too much hype around Quick. IMO he had it easy in general, due to the great defensive team in front of him. Like Thomas, he won the Conn Smythe because of a great defensively minded team. They are great goalies but the players in front of them made them look way better than they really are.
Agreed.

In both cases there are several guys on the team who just as much as the goalie was equally essential to that teams success.

Willie Mitchell played 18:12 at ES in the playoffs. Another 3:41 on PK.

He's just one guy too. Back to back years now the winning cup team has had an elite, or borderline elite 2 way guy as their number 1 (although in Boston's case the case could be made Krejci is as much the number 1 guy as Bergeron, but he's also a hell of a 2 way guy).

What would have been a more crippling loss for the Kings on the eve of the playoffs, Kopitar or Quick. I know many will disagree but I say Kopitar.

I watched those games...I don't honestly feel Quick stole a single game the entire playoff run. Not one.

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06-30-2012, 09:28 PM
  #41
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Absolutely bang on. Price's style appears more effortless (read less dramatic) so many observers consider him less athletic or to make fewer 'spectacular' saves than other top goalies.

As for those who ask question his accomplishments vis-a-vis his peers, let me remind you that he has had, at best, average teams in front of him in Montreal. And often those average teams were decimated by injury.
People always talk about how poor Price was in his 2nd year, when they had that tailspin whichculminated with getting swept by Boston.

Before an ankle injury cost him about 5 weeks (I think) he was putting up great numbers and the Habs were doing very well. When he got back the Habs played some of the worst hockey I have ever personally seen, on a consistent basis, from a team that made the playoffs in that season.

People talk about him being not as good as he was last year...Price was amazing this year. He kept the Habs in many, many games. This is such nonsense, do people not remember watching the games? Do people not remember stretches of several minutes where the ice looked tilted and it was just an onslaught against Price? Several times a game, and aside from maybe 5 or 6 scattered games throughout the season and the back to back wins against Philly early on, every single game of the season.

Do people not remember Diaz being signed as what looked to be AHL depth and coming in and playing big minutes for a large majority of the season?

Emelin playing big minutes as a rookie?

Gomez doing nothing, and being injured half the game.

Gionta missing most of the season.

Cammalleri stinking, and then being traded for Bourque who was absolutely abysmal.

Kaberle never really getting his game together.

Markov...well what else can be said about that. Let's just hope he can stay healthy from here on out. It's really not unrealistic. Look at Selanne's turn around he had.

Gorges and Subban were awesome but the rest of the defence was marred by mediocrity/inconsistency/lack of depth and it along with an inexperienced coach caused a very bad season for a team that wasn't, and isn't and certainly wont'be a bad team.

All things considered, I don't see how so many can complain about last season.

Galchenyuk looks like a stud prospect and guys make it to the big leagues playing impact minutes much earlier than in years past.

People need to seriously spend less time assuming the Habs won't be able to contend for the next couple of years and how poor their team is and take the time to actually look at the positives, and the potential.

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06-30-2012, 09:50 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by UniverStalinGraduate View Post
People always talk about how poor Price was in his 2nd year, when they had that tailspin whichculminated with getting swept by Boston.

Before an ankle injury cost him about 5 weeks (I think) he was putting up great numbers and the Habs were doing very well. When he got back the Habs played some of the worst hockey I have ever personally seen, on a consistent basis, from a team that made the playoffs in that season.

People talk about him being not as good as he was last year...Price was amazing this year. He kept the Habs in many, many games. This is such nonsense, do people not remember watching the games? Do people not remember stretches of several minutes where the ice looked tilted and it was just an onslaught against Price? Several times a game, and aside from maybe 5 or 6 scattered games throughout the season and the back to back wins against Philly early on, every single game of the season.

Do people not remember Diaz being signed as what looked to be AHL depth and coming in and playing big minutes for a large majority of the season?

Emelin playing big minutes as a rookie?

Gomez doing nothing, and being injured half the game.

Gionta missing most of the season.

Cammalleri stinking, and then being traded for Bourque who was absolutely abysmal.

Kaberle never really getting his game together.

Markov...well what else can be said about that. Let's just hope he can stay healthy from here on out. It's really not unrealistic. Look at Selanne's turn around he had.

Gorges and Subban were awesome but the rest of the defence was marred by mediocrity/inconsistency/lack of depth and it along with an inexperienced coach caused a very bad season for a team that wasn't, and isn't and certainly wont'be a bad team.

All things considered, I don't see how so many can complain about last season.

Galchenyuk looks like a stud prospect and guys make it to the big leagues playing impact minutes much earlier than in years past.

People need to seriously spend less time assuming the Habs won't be able to contend for the next couple of years and how poor their team is and take the time to actually look at the positives, and the potential.

I definitely remember that, especially in the first half of the year. I couldnt believe how the team left him out to dry. Afterwards, it just seemd (my impression) that he joined the rest of the team and was not as effective. Not his problem. How would you react if your whole team didnt seem to give a **** in front of you. I've been a firm Price believer from the beginning and damnit I'll be a firm believer till the end!!!

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06-30-2012, 10:40 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Mathradio View Post
Price has a bigger edge, hands-wise over Quick than Quick has an edge in agility over Price.

I mean, Price is among the goalies with the best hands, league-wide, perhaps second only to Brodeur, and his capability to handle the puck helped us out with the penalty kill.
Price is a good stick handler but he turns the puck over way to much for me to actually call that an advantage.

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06-30-2012, 11:31 PM
  #44
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Agreed.

In both cases there are several guys on the team who just as much as the goalie was equally essential to that teams success.

Willie Mitchell played 18:12 at ES in the playoffs. Another 3:41 on PK.

He's just one guy too. Back to back years now the winning cup team has had an elite, or borderline elite 2 way guy as their number 1 (although in Boston's case the case could be made Krejci is as much the number 1 guy as Bergeron, but he's also a hell of a 2 way guy).

What would have been a more crippling loss for the Kings on the eve of the playoffs, Kopitar or Quick. I know many will disagree but I say Kopitar.

I watched those games...I don't honestly feel Quick stole a single game the entire playoff run. Not one.
While I know everyone loves the allure of a "stolen" game, I think there's much more to be said for such consistently good play from start to finish that as long as your team scores first, you win 91.7% of your playoff games. And, during the same playoffs, if you play well enough that even in games when your opponent scores first, you team manages to mount comebacks more often than not, that's pretty special, too. Quick made a boat load of difficult saves at times when a goal allowed could have drastically altered the ebb/flow of the game.

Let me put his consistency in another way. If you look at the goalie stats for the playoffs, the SV% "mean" is at Florida's goaltending, 0.919/0.920. Now, that's pretty damn good. Now, realize that Quick had a higher SV% than that in 15 of the 20 playoff games he played this year.

He didn't steal games, he stole an entire post season.

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07-01-2012, 12:24 AM
  #45
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All I can say is I dont wana see any of the people here who are demeaning price jump on his bandwagon when the team has success. I dont get some people here most teams would kill to have price as there goalie
This.

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07-01-2012, 12:38 PM
  #46
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People always talk about how poor Price was in his 2nd year, when they had that tailspin whichculminated with getting swept by Boston.

Before an ankle injury cost him about 5 weeks (I think) he was putting up great numbers and the Habs were doing very well. When he got back the Habs played some of the worst hockey I have ever personally seen, on a consistent basis, from a team that made the playoffs in that season.

Don't blame the team for Price's insucess, he was a good reason for that teams failure. Halak got the job done during the second part of that season. Even if the team wasn't playing great, goaltending was a major reason why this team was slipping. If it wasn't for Halak we wouldn't have made the playoffs

He did poor during that season and that teams faith could have been a bit better (not getting sweep) if uncle Bob trusted Halak instead of showing off his golden boy.

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07-01-2012, 08:19 PM
  #47
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If the pre-July 1st rumors were true, we won't have to worry about goaltending for the next 6-7 years.

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Don't blame the team for Price's insucess, he was a good reason for that teams failure. Halak got the job done during the second part of that season. Even if the team wasn't playing great, goaltending was a major reason why this team was slipping. If it wasn't for Halak we wouldn't have made the playoffs

He did poor during that season and that teams faith could have been a bit better (not getting sweep) if uncle Bob trusted Halak instead of showing off his golden boy.
All goalies had growing pains at one time or another in their development.

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07-01-2012, 08:23 PM
  #48
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While I know everyone loves the allure of a "stolen" game, I think there's much more to be said for such consistently good play from start to finish that as long as your team scores first, you win 91.7% of your playoff games. And, during the same playoffs, if you play well enough that even in games when your opponent scores first, you team manages to mount comebacks more often than not, that's pretty special, too. Quick made a boat load of difficult saves at times when a goal allowed could have drastically altered the ebb/flow of the game.

Let me put his consistency in another way. If you look at the goalie stats for the playoffs, the SV% "mean" is at Florida's goaltending, 0.919/0.920. Now, that's pretty damn good. Now, realize that Quick had a higher SV% than that in 15 of the 20 playoff games he played this year.

He didn't steal games, he stole an entire post season.
LoL

No he didn't.

You either didn't watch the games, or did and simply don't possess the ability to be able to determine between a goalie standing on his head in a game and a goalie being solid behind a ridiculously strong defensive team.

If you actaully think Quick's playoffs this year was the best playoffs by a goalie ever than I have some lovely Madoff stock tips you'd be all over.

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07-01-2012, 08:25 PM
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Don't blame the team for Price's insucess, he was a good reason for that teams failure. Halak got the job done during the second part of that season. Even if the team wasn't playing great, goaltending was a major reason why this team was slipping. If it wasn't for Halak we wouldn't have made the playoffs

He did poor during that season and that teams faith could have been a bit better (not getting sweep) if uncle Bob trusted Halak instead of showing off his golden boy.
That team was terrible. Every single game from basically January 1st on was pathetic.

If you seriously think Price was any part of that teams failings you should take up a new sport to follow.

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07-02-2012, 09:47 AM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UniverStalinGraduate View Post
LoL

No he didn't.

You either didn't watch the games, or did and simply don't possess the ability to be able to determine between a goalie standing on his head in a game and a goalie being solid behind a ridiculously strong defensive team.

If you actaully think Quick's playoffs this year was the best playoffs by a goalie ever than I have some lovely Madoff stock tips you'd be all over.
Nice strawman. But anyway, I laugh at people like yourself would seemingly would value (or be impressed by) 1 or 2 really, really lopsided games in which the goalie saves the day over an entire playoffs of posting numbers like those.

And please don't insult my ability to analyze what I watch with my own eyes and form an opinion. I don't think you've proven to anyone that you're any more of an authority in such matters than myself.

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