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The 2012-2013 Boston Celtics Thread: Part II

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07-01-2012, 12:09 AM
  #226
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Estatic about Garnett re-signing. Ray Allen is gone though. I imagine Jamal Crawford, or OJ Mayo will replace him and they may be able to squeeze a decent bench player out of their payroll. Think Crawford and Mayo are both the antithesis of the Celtics style of play. I am interested to see what happens to Bass as he is probably gone. Will he allow a sign and trade or will he just leave?
With the luck of getting KG to come back at a reduced cap hit, and Mayo becoming a UFA, perhaps the Celtics will be able to move Bass+ for Josh Smith.

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07-01-2012, 12:17 AM
  #227
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Also, there was talk of the Celtics being interested in Michael Beasley at the trade deadline. He was not given a qualifying offer, so he's a UFA now too.

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07-01-2012, 02:31 AM
  #228
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It wasnt just Allen who was upset. KG and Pierce were also upset. Teammates having issues with each other is commonplace. Rondo took his issue onto the court. He REPEATEDLY would not pass the ball to Allen in 2 consecutive games.

I like Rondos game, but how can you back him up? This is a kid who has done the following:

1. Pouted after the Perkins trade and allowed it to greatly affect his play.
2. Sat in his car before a game and REFUSED to enter the arena because he was upset with his coach. He would not enter the building until Perk and Pierce talked him back in.
3. Got upset over Obamas joking comment about his struggles with his jumper. He was not the only player on the team that Obama teased. But Rondo allowed it affect his play.
4. Refused to distribute the ball to a player he had an issue with.

This is also the kid who was a coach killer at Kentucky. He was suspended 3 times for conduct detrimental to the team.

This is not a kid who had a bad day. He has MANY bad days.

That said, I wouldnt trade him for any other 1, other than Chris Paul or Derrick Rose.

Later
Lots of growing pains with Rajon.

Funny enough how much he sucked at Kentucky is probably the biggest thing I hold against him (Ainge thought he'd be a #1 overall draft pick before his freshmen year.)

Rivers is obviously pumping his tires after the season telling him he is the smartest player he ever coached to keep him happy. Rondo needs his balls stroked a little bit. He is still hurt by our GM and doesn't really like hearing the "big 3" stuff since he had a great series in 2008.


But the thing with Rondo is I think we have just gotten to his peak...and right now he is so damn good that you need to accept a certain amount of diva-ness from him. He was good in 2008-2011 but right now hes another level and out of this world good.

Now its his team I think his behavior and immaturity will be less of an issue. We should be past the worst of this stuff with Rondo. In his defense Ainge tried to trade him over and over again.


And the thing about Rondo is right now July 2012 he is just sooooo good right now. Easily one of the 5 best players in the NBA and arguably no true point guard in the history of basketball has played the position as well as Rondo did last playoffs (DJ Seattle Supersonics 78 Championship is maybe the closest thing.)


NBA superstars all have egos. There is plenty of room for PP, KG, and Rondo's ego. There is NO room whatsoever for Allens ego at this point since he is so washed up (hes happy to be a three point specialist in Miami or Indiana but not for us.) Add in the fact Rondo dislikes him way more than Pierce or KG and Ill drive him and his mom to the airport this morning.

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Old
07-01-2012, 06:49 AM
  #229
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Without Rondo, the Big 3 are the Big 3 without a championship ring & no trips to ECF's or Finals

You coach & motivate players in different way.....some need stroking, some need pats on the back. some need kicks in the ass....I am sure Doc knows what he is doing....

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07-01-2012, 08:08 PM
  #230
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Marcus Camby is considering us, along with the Heat, Mavs, Spurs, and Knicks

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07-01-2012, 08:11 PM
  #231
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Marcus Camby is considering us, along with the Heat, Mavs, Spurs, and Knicks
He's still in the league?

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07-01-2012, 08:12 PM
  #232
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He's still in the league?


Still a good rebounder and shot blocker too

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07-01-2012, 08:15 PM
  #233
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Marcus Camby is considering us, along with the Heat, Mavs, Spurs, and Knicks
I'd love him in the role Jermaine Oneal or Shaq were in last couple years. I am sure Ainge feels the same way if Camby wants to come on board for reasonable money.

Have to think those other 4 teams are ahead of us on his wishlist (Id guess he goes to the Mavs or Knicks and if the money he wants isn't there he'll play for the heat.)

It would be pretty disgusting to see Allen and Camby take their talents to south beach to bandwagon onto a championship there (hopefully it would end up like the glove and the mailman not getting a ring in LA.)

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Old
07-01-2012, 09:00 PM
  #234
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Still a good rebounder and shot blocker too
I thought he was done to be honest. Could be good for us and he's a local-ish boy too.

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07-02-2012, 11:32 AM
  #235
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Jeff Green close to re-signing.

Camby prioritizing a starting role. KG does not really want to play the 5 very much anymore. Perfect fit.

I.E. I bet it is down to us, the Heat, and the Mavs. And we have the most money to offer (though it wouldn't take much). And we are less occupied than the other teams (Heat still trying to woo Ray Ray, Mavs are focused on Deron Williams). Hopefully we can sneak him in.

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07-02-2012, 11:47 AM
  #236
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07-02-2012, 12:03 PM
  #237
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Originally Posted by Segchise View Post
He's also come back and played after he dislocated his elbow. He's emotional/sensitive, but he cares about winning and gives it his all when the team needs him most. He always shows up for big games. I wouldn't trade him for anyone but KD or Lebron lol. When did 2 happen? I never heard about some of the things you said.




He was defending Lebron and Wade a lot. It's not laziness, it's nearly impossible.
#2 happened a couple years ago. This was WIDELY talked about on EEI, Sports Tonight and jiust about every Boston area talk radio show. He sat in his vehicle, refusing to come in because of an issue that he had with Doc. About 20 minutes before game time, Pierce and Perk had to go outside to the players parking lot and talk him into coming into the arena.

His immaturity shows itself all the time. Just in this postseason, he bumped an official and then said, that he "tripped." Bull. He walked over to him and chest bumped him. He also blew up at a camera man, getting in his face, who was simply recording him, as they did with everyone else.

I didnt even mention his locker room blow out between games 2 and 3 of the Heat series in, I believe it was 2010. Rivers called him out in the locker room for repeated mistakes, and Rondo responded by flipping out and ripping his teammates apart for their mistakes. He also shattered the video equipment screen by throwing a bottle at it.

And bottom line is that Chalmersd ate him alive in 3 games.

Later

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07-02-2012, 12:06 PM
  #238
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Segchise....Here Is A Link For Some Of It

Here is a link for some of it.

Laterhttp://www.nesn.com/2011/12/rajon-ro...ew-report.html

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07-02-2012, 12:08 PM
  #239
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Rondo's a punk it's no secret, but I guess he is maturing. I'm still not opposed to trading him. Right now they can get a maximum return for him, and they're going to need to think about rebuilding soon, like it or not. Rondo isn't the kind of PG who's going to be able to carry this team on his own once the pieces around him are gone and the C's go young. I understand he has during the playoffs at times, but I don't think you can expect this to be consistent.

I still put him behind Paul, Rose, Deron Williams, and Tony Parker in terms of best PG's in the NBA.

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07-02-2012, 12:14 PM
  #240
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And that's why they are going to ride the Big 3 horse until it drops dead on the track. When this becomes "Rondo's team", they'll be under .500 for awhile.

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07-02-2012, 12:16 PM
  #241
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Lots of growing pains with Rajon.

Funny enough how much he sucked at Kentucky is probably the biggest thing I hold against him (Ainge thought he'd be a #1 overall draft pick before his freshmen year.)

Rivers is obviously pumping his tires after the season telling him he is the smartest player he ever coached to keep him happy. Rondo needs his balls stroked a little bit. He is still hurt by our GM and doesn't really like hearing the "big 3" stuff since he had a great series in 2008.


But the thing with Rondo is I think we have just gotten to his peak...and right now he is so damn good that you need to accept a certain amount of diva-ness from him. He was good in 2008-2011 but right now hes another level and out of this world good.

Now its his team I think his behavior and immaturity will be less of an issue. We should be past the worst of this stuff with Rondo. In his defense Ainge tried to trade him over and over again.


And the thing about Rondo is right now July 2012 he is just sooooo good right now. Easily one of the 5 best players in the NBA and arguably no true point guard in the history of basketball has played the position as well as Rondo did last playoffs (DJ Seattle Supersonics 78 Championship is maybe the closest thing.)


NBA superstars all have egos. There is plenty of room for PP, KG, and Rondo's ego. There is NO room whatsoever for Allens ego at this point since he is so washed up (hes happy to be a three point specialist in Miami or Indiana but not for us.) Add in the fact Rondo dislikes him way more than Pierce or KG and Ill drive him and his mom to the airport this morning.
Gotta disagree about top 5 player in the NBA.

I dont think he is the best point in the NBA. I clearly take both Rose and Paul over him. Hands down. He is in the conversation with Westbrook. Different types of players, but both have weak areas that Paul and Rose do not have.

James, Paul, Rose, Durant, Griffin, Kobe, Kevin Love are names I thought of in the 1st 20 seconds after I read your post.

Rondo IS top 5 when he comes to play. But the fact remains that he does not come to play every game. He takes days off against the lesser guards of the league. And please dont say that everyone does that, because they dont.

Also, you are creating a monster if you give in allow Rondo to dictate whether Allen comes back or not, based on the fact that Rondo does not like Allen.

BTW...Allen never said he didnt or would come back to the C's in a bench role. He HAS said that he IS willing to play a bench role in Boston. AGAIN, that was stated during the postseason. He clearly stated he would do so....HOWEVER, he first wants to investigate possible starting spots across the league.

Whats wrong with that? You act as if he is a loser because he would like to continue to start.

I have way more of an issue with an immature brat who breaks a video screen simply because he was called out for his mistakes during a game buy his coach. He threw his teammates under the bus by being a whiny baby when Doc called him out.

Make excuses for him all you want. He is a cry baby who happens to be a good basketball player.

Later

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07-02-2012, 12:18 PM
  #242
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My buddy keeps arguing with me that Russell Westbrook is better than Kevin Durant and is the 2nd best player in the league.

I don't know what to say anymore.

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07-02-2012, 12:18 PM
  #243
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Originally Posted by pgm16 View Post
Without Rondo, the Big 3 are the Big 3 without a championship ring & no trips to ECF's or Finals

You coach & motivate players in different way.....some need stroking, some need pats on the back. some need kicks in the ass....I am sure Doc knows what he is doing....
Without KG they dont win a title.
Without Allen they dont win a title.
Without Pierce they dont win a title.
Without Perk, they dont win a title.
Without James Posey they dont win the title.

Whats your point? Its a TEAM game. Not one of those players were responsible for winning the title. Its a team thing.

Later

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07-02-2012, 12:21 PM
  #244
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I'd love him in the role Jermaine Oneal or Shaq were in last couple years. I am sure Ainge feels the same way if Camby wants to come on board for reasonable money.

Have to think those other 4 teams are ahead of us on his wishlist (Id guess he goes to the Mavs or Knicks and if the money he wants isn't there he'll play for the heat.)

It would be pretty disgusting to see Allen and Camby take their talents to south beach to bandwagon onto a championship there (hopefully it would end up like the glove and the mailman not getting a ring in LA.)
After reading this post, it becomes crystal clear...

You clearly hate Ray Allen.. Therefore, it is an exercise in abject futility to have a rational discussion about basketball, the Celtics, Allen or Rondo, with you.

You cleary have an intense dislike for the man.

Later


Last edited by Jeff from Maine: 07-02-2012 at 12:33 PM.
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07-02-2012, 12:36 PM
  #245
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Originally Posted by CDJ View Post
Jeff Green close to re-signing.

Camby prioritizing a starting role. KG does not really want to play the 5 very much anymore. Perfect fit.

I.E. I bet it is down to us, the Heat, and the Mavs. And we have the most money to offer (though it wouldn't take much). And we are less occupied than the other teams (Heat still trying to woo Ray Ray, Mavs are focused on Deron Williams). Hopefully we can sneak him in.
However, KG acknowledged during the postseason that the 5 is the best thing for himm at this point in his career. He knows the better post players are not centers anymore...they are the 4's.

He will never be a guy who can put up more than 13 a game or get more than 7 boards a game as a PF. He needs to be a 5. He goes up against far fewer good players when he plays the center spot.

Later

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07-02-2012, 12:37 PM
  #246
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He's still in the league?
He could probably live off the money he received when he was at UMass alone in retirement, without even touching his NBA salary?

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07-02-2012, 12:41 PM
  #247
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Rondo's a punk it's no secret, but I guess he is maturing. I'm still not opposed to trading him. Right now they can get a maximum return for him, and they're going to need to think about rebuilding soon, like it or not. Rondo isn't the kind of PG who's going to be able to carry this team on his own once the pieces around him are gone and the C's go young. I understand he has during the playoffs at times, but I don't think you can expect this to be consistent.

I still put him behind Paul, Rose, Deron Williams, and Tony Parker in terms of best PG's in the NBA.
To me, Paul and Rose are hands down the 2 best. Nobody else is really close to them. When you take into account EVERYTHING...attitude, ability to control a gamne offensively from both the distribution and scoring aspects, they are clearly the 2 best. Defensively Paul is easily Rondos equal. Rondo gambles and misses a lot. Tools wise he is probably a better defender than Pul, but Paul is a far more cerebral and intelligent defender. You never see him go for steals and get beat. He knows better than to do that.

I put Rondo in that next group of 1's, along with Williams and Westbrook. They all do multiple things very well, but also have questionable character (in the case on Rondo and Westbrook) and significant weaknesses in certain skill areas.

Later

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07-02-2012, 12:55 PM
  #248
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He could probably live off the money he received when he was at UMass alone in retirement, without even touching his NBA salary?
Ouch.

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07-02-2012, 01:09 PM
  #249
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He could probably live off the money he received when he was at UMass alone in retirement, without even touching his NBA salary?
It's funny because its true.

Accepted $28,000 from two sports agents. I'm sure he got a lot more as well.

As a college kid, that kind of money can buy me SOOOOOO many handles of Burnetts. I'd be able to live like the cheap vodka king. I can only imagine what he did with that cash at Zoomass

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07-02-2012, 01:32 PM
  #250
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To me, Paul and Rose are hands down the 2 best. Nobody else is really close to them. When you take into account EVERYTHING...attitude, ability to control a gamne offensively from both the distribution and scoring aspects, they are clearly the 2 best. Defensively Paul is easily Rondos equal. Rondo gambles and misses a lot. Tools wise he is probably a better defender than Pul, but Paul is a far more cerebral and intelligent defender. You never see him go for steals and get beat. He knows better than to do that.

I put Rondo in that next group of 1's, along with Williams and Westbrook. They all do multiple things very well, but also have questionable character (in the case on Rondo and Westbrook) and significant weaknesses in certain skill areas.

Later
People always forget about Tony Parker. He is just as good of a passer as Rondo, except he can create his offense by either slashing or shooting from the perimeter. To me, Rondo is a better slasher, but Parker is a much, much better shooter and the two are equal passing. When it comes down to it, when Duncan is doubled or shut down in the post Parker can take over. You saw it in flashes at times during the OKC series, but people see Rondo's 45 point game and that's what sticks out. All around Parker is a much better PG.

Westbrook isn't a PG, IMO. He is by virtue of being slotted into the position, but in reality he's a 2 guard that can dribble. He can't/won't pass, whatever it may be. OKC will be a much better team when they get a legit pass first PG. That will take the pressure off of Westbrook to set up KD, and will free up his offense even more than it already is. That's part of the reason they really, really missed Maynor this year in the post season. They can take out Perkins, slide Westbrook to the 2 and use Maynor at PG. This allows Ibaka to play C and they're virtually unstoppable.

That's the reason I wouldn't put Westbrook ahead of Rondo. Do you want your PG to score 30 plus a night? Yes. Do you need him to? No. You shouldn't be relying on you PG to score, you need to rely on him to set up an offense. Any offense of his own that comes from that is gravy. However, the PG's that can score AND pass are the ones that are the best in the league. Rose, Paul, Parker and Williams are all good to great passers, but they are ALSO great scorers. Until Rondo becomes both, he'll be behind these guys. But since Rondo is a true PG, he's more valuable than Westbrook because Westbrook's lack of passing hurts OKC in the end.

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