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Free Agent Frenzy 2012 - ALL NON-RANGER UFA TALK AND SIGNINGS HERE! (PART IV)

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07-02-2012, 08:17 PM
  #126
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Originally Posted by dtrap View Post
How am I not assigning proper value...Dubi makes 4.2 a year....MDZ should get about 2 mil on his second contract and Erixon has a cap hit of 1.785 million or so.

I never said we should do it...all I'm saying is that for a couple of years Nash would technically be replacing Dubinsky for about 3-4 mil more.
Erixon is going to waltz in and replace MDZ?

Thats how

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07-02-2012, 08:18 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by Svenhart2008 View Post
Darren Dreger ‏@DarrenDreger

2 year deal, $9mil for Jokinen in Wpg. $4.5 aav
Decent deal for Jokinen, but he had an above average season in a contract year. For this market, surprised no one offered him $5 million.

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07-02-2012, 08:18 PM
  #128
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Originally Posted by Lion Hound View Post
If Ryan was the return I would trade Stepan depending on what else it would take to complete the deal. 1st and Erixon. Maybe Steps/Mdz
Then you would have absolutely no one to pass the puck to our wingers on the second line. Stepan is a rising young playmaker on an ELC. We have no depth at center...he is far more valuable to us then Bobby Ryan.

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07-02-2012, 08:20 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
It works both ways, del Zotto's and hagelin's contracts also go back to Columbus. which are not much NOW, but Del Zotto is going to get a hefty raise, and Hagelin will make decent money in the future, that money could be used to replace them. So in the end it almost all washes out depending on the players we were to sign to replace them.
Nash makes 7.8, Dubi 4.2, Hags .875.

MDZ is a RFA who will probably get 2.5-3 on his next contract. Let's say it's 3.

That's 8.075 going out, 7.8 coming in.

Find a puck moving D that can put up 40 points and a 3rd liner like Hagelin and sign them both for the 275 thousand we're "saving" in the deal.

Realistically you're looking at 4-5 for a D and 1-2 for a 3rd liner.

That's 5-7 million on top of Nash's contract to replace what we trade for him.

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07-02-2012, 08:21 PM
  #130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Erixon is going to waltz in and replace MDZ?

Thats how
I was assigning proper financial value. You said Nash wouldn't replace Dubi and I said financially yes he was for 3-4 million more. Actual value on the ice in terms of minutes and stats are a different thing.

Honestly I'd much rather trade Erixon than MDZ...better to keep a proven commodity than open a hole and try to fill it with promise.

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07-02-2012, 08:22 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by turcotte8 View Post
Nash makes 7.8, Dubi 4.2, Hags .875.

MDZ is a RFA who will probably get 2.5-3 on his next contract. Let's say it's 3.

That's 8.075 going out, 7.8 coming in.

Find a puck moving D that can put up 40 points and a 3rd liner like Hagelin and sign them both for the 275 thousand we're "saving" in the deal.

Realistically you're looking at 4-5 for a D and 1-2 for a 3rd liner.

That's 5-7 million on top of Nash's contract to replace what we trade for him.
3rd liner fine although Hagelin did more than that. Replacing Del Zotto is not that easy. Its hard to find a top 4 puck moving Dman

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07-02-2012, 08:22 PM
  #132
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I never said I would give up those 3 assets, I'm just saying thats the only way something like a dubi centered deal would be taken.

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07-02-2012, 08:22 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by dtrap View Post
I was assigning proper financial value. You said Nash wouldn't replace Dubi and I said financially yes he was for 3-4 million more. Actual value on the ice in terms of minutes and stats are a different thing.

Honestly I'd much rather trade Erixon than MDZ...better to keep a proven commodity than open a hole and try to fill it with promise.
With no longterm view whatsoever.

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07-02-2012, 08:23 PM
  #134
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This is a bad Ufa group, and few players are available that would help our team. I think everybody sees that and that is why their is such a panic to get Ryan or Nash.

I really hope management doesn't panic, let Philly or Pittsburgh get rid of assets for Nash and Ryan, or overspend for Parisie, I'll take a third place year next year, and go nuts next year during free agency while those other teams that over spent this year are having cap issues

Right now next years class seems to have a ton of options that will make us much better then this years group. Not to mention if teams lie Anaheim struggle again, perry and getzlaf will become available via trade as well, Likely much cheaper then ryan or Nash, since they would be rentals

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07-02-2012, 08:24 PM
  #135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turcotte8 View Post
Nash makes 7.8, Dubi 4.2, Hags .875.

MDZ is a RFA who will probably get 2.5-3 on his next contract. Let's say it's 3.

That's 8.075 going out, 7.8 coming in.

Find a puck moving D that can put up 40 points and a 3rd liner like Hagelin and sign them both for the 275 thousand we're "saving" in the deal.

Realistically you're looking at 4-5 for a D and 1-2 for a 3rd liner.

That's 5-7 million on top of Nash's contract to replace what we trade for him.
Agree totally...and that's why Sather isn't budging. Tho if the cap were to stay at 70 mil filling the open spaces would be easier.

And don't forget...after this season we get a little over 1.5 million back cause Drury is finally off the books.

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07-02-2012, 08:24 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by Vitto79 View Post
3rd liner fine although Hagelin did more than that. Replacing Del Zotto is not that easy. Its hard to find a top 4 puck moving Dman
Only Suter and Carle out there that I can think of.

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07-02-2012, 08:24 PM
  #137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turcotte8 View Post
Nash makes 7.8, Dubi 4.2, Hags .875.

MDZ is a RFA who will probably get 2.5-3 on his next contract. Let's say it's 3.

That's 8.075 going out, 7.8 coming in.

Find a puck moving D that can put up 40 points and a 3rd liner like Hagelin and sign them both for the 275 thousand we're "saving" in the deal.

Realistically you're looking at 4-5 for a D and 1-2 for a 3rd liner.

That's 5-7 million on top of Nash's contract to replace what we trade for him.
That's 3 roster players for 1. Awful idea. Hagelin wasn't just some 3rd liner, he also was our best forechecker, and Del Zotto isn't some 40 pt dman, he's a 21 year old who was the best offensive dman on the 1st place team in the East.

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07-02-2012, 08:25 PM
  #138
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This has gotten even worse than the Kovalchuk and Sundin productions.

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Old
07-02-2012, 08:27 PM
  #139
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
With no longterm view whatsoever.
You never asked me for long term view.

I'm agreeing with you that there is more than just Nash replacing Dubi.

But financially for this season it works.

And honestly you fix a lot of problems in two years by just letting Gabby walk away.

And anyway...do you really think Sather is giving up Dubi, MDZ and Hagelin for Nash? It's going to be 2 roster guys and 1 prospect or 2 prospects and 1 roster guy.

You give up Dubi, Erixon and Miller/Thomas the problem becomes a lot simpler.

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07-02-2012, 08:29 PM
  #140
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UAGoalieGuy View Post
That's what we call creative accounting. In your scenario, your trading Dubinsky, Hagelin, and MDZ plus a prospect. You still have to address the holes created be dealing Hagelin (third line LW that has some offense) and a puck moving Dman that can play the PP(To replace MDZ). That's going to cost more then $3.6 million + the cap space gained be including them in a trade (around $5.5 million). Plus the Rangers have to add another two dmen on top on that. May be Erixon can fill one of those holes of the three.
Now (when healthy)

Hagelin. Richards. Gaborik

kreider. Stepan. Callahan

Dubi. Anisimov. Feds (if signed)

Asham. Boyle. Rupp

Mcd. Girardi

Sauer. Staal

Dz. Stralman


After

Nash. Richards. Callahan

Kreider. Stepan. Gaborik

Mueller. Anisimov. ?

Asham. Boyle. Rupp

McD. Girardi

Stralman. Staal

Erixon. Sauer Bickel.



Just a thought, lines of course are mix and match at your own discretion, kinda like the balance of those, need a third liner..

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07-02-2012, 08:30 PM
  #141
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Originally Posted by dtrap View Post
Then you would have absolutely no one to pass the puck to our wingers on the second line. Stepan is a rising young playmaker on an ELC. We have no depth at center...he is far more valuable to us then Bobby Ryan.
Great passer no doubt. He's creative with the puck. With that said he's also a winner. I love the kid...but consistent 30 goal scorers with size aren't easy to come by. While the dept maybe weak, there are options. Dubi I though was a decent center before he moved to the wall. Anisimov is pretty creative too. There are options there.

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07-02-2012, 08:33 PM
  #142
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Originally Posted by Tim Erixon's Lunchbox View Post
That's 3 roster players for 1. Awful idea. Hagelin wasn't just some 3rd liner, he also was our best forechecker, and Del Zotto isn't some 40 pt dman, he's a 21 year old who was the best offensive dman on the 1st place team in the East.
Lets not get carried away, our PP stunk and McD looked like our best offensive Defenseman at times. He's hardly someone we're going to throw on the ice to shut someone down .. He's still maturing, maybe one day..

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07-02-2012, 08:35 PM
  #143
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The Jets signed Jokinen? Just read it on the main boards. Clearly I'm late to the party

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07-02-2012, 08:35 PM
  #144
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
2nd line center, top 4 D-man, and a prospect, likely.

Most Ranger fans saying Anisimov (who is not a 2nd line center), Del Zotto (who is the last type of defenseman Anaheim needs), and a B/C level prospect.

That deal is not going anywhere without Stepan, and that'd be silly.
not that I want them to trade Stepan, but if I was the GM, I would trade Stepan for Ryan before Nash

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07-02-2012, 08:36 PM
  #145
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Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
Stepan on an ELC is more valuable to the Rangers than Nash at 7.8
More bang for Sathers buck. A lot more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by turcotte8 View Post
Nash makes 7.8, Dubi 4.2, Hags .875.

MDZ is a RFA who will probably get 2.5-3 on his next contract. Let's say it's 3.

That's 8.075 going out, 7.8 coming in.

Find a puck moving D that can put up 40 points and a 3rd liner like Hagelin and sign them both for the 275 thousand we're "saving" in the deal.

Realistically you're looking at 4-5 for a D and 1-2 for a 3rd liner.

That's 5-7 million on top of Nash's contract to replace what we trade for him.
Well done.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vitto79 View Post
3rd liner fine although Hagelin did more than that. Replacing Del Zotto is not that easy. Its hard to find a top 4 puck moving Dman
Damn near impossible, especially when you factor in some of MDZ's other traits, like his youth, and his physicality.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
I never said I would give up those 3 assets, I'm just saying thats the only way something like a dubi centered deal would be taken.
You would give up half the roster without thinking twice for Nash. Shiny new toy. High rating in NHL-13. Don't lie.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Erixon's Lunchbox View Post
That's 3 roster players for 1. Awful idea. Hagelin wasn't just some 3rd liner, he also was our best forechecker, and Del Zotto isn't some 40 pt dman, he's a 21 year old who was the best offensive dman on the 1st place team in the East.
Did you read anything he said? He's not advocating we should trade for Nash. Quite the opposite, actually.

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07-02-2012, 08:38 PM
  #146
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Originally Posted by Tim Erixon's Lunchbox View Post
That's 3 roster players for 1. Awful idea. Hagelin wasn't just some 3rd liner, he also was our best forechecker, and Del Zotto isn't some 40 pt dman, he's a 21 year old who was the best offensive dman on the 1st place team in the East.
I agree, that's not my proposal. I was just breaking down the numbers for that proposed deal.
Mine would be Dubi, Thomas,1st(+ maybe another minor prospect). That's it, take it or leave it. If that doesn't get him then fine, we don't get him. Move on.

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07-02-2012, 08:41 PM
  #147
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A wasted day today.

Tomorrow morning: bring back Fedotenko, Eminger, Stralman (if he can be convinced), and sign Pyatt.

Hagelin Richards Gaborik
Kreider Stepan Callahan
Dubinsky Anisimov Pyatt
Asham Boyle Fedotenko
Rupp

McDonagh Girardi
Staal Stralman
Del Zotto Eminger
Bickel

And then wait for Parise to finally make his decision. After which get back to work on Howson regarding Nash.

Seriously. At least solidify the rest of the lineup.

If Dubi and Erixon get shipped out for Nash, well, Nash takes Dubinsky's place and we can still move guys down the depth chart.

Hagelin Richards Gaborik
Kreider Stepan Nash
Pyatt Anisimov Callahan
Asham Boyle Fedotenko
Rupp

McDonagh Girardi
Staal Stralman
Del Zotto Eminger
Bickel

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07-02-2012, 08:45 PM
  #148
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Originally Posted by Blueshirt Believer View Post
I'm throwing this out there:

Cause frankly, what the hell else is there to talk about?

What would you guys be willing to part with if Howson agreed to pick up half of Nash's contract?
in my mind the money is secondary. I feel there are too many assets going the other way. I think at most it should be Dubinsky or AA, plus prospect,(either Erixon or Mcilraith), and a number one. If they need to throw in a third round pick ok, but nothing more. They can go into the season as they stand now and look for someone at the trading deadline. all they have to do is get into the playoffs. look at LA.

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07-02-2012, 08:45 PM
  #149
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Originally Posted by Jackpot View Post
Lets not get carried away, our PP stunk and McD looked like our best offensive Defenseman at times. He's hardly someone we're going to throw on the ice to shut someone down .. He's still maturing, maybe one day..
How am I getting carried away? 40+ pt 21 year old defenseman don't grow on trees. McDonagh is the teams best defenseman in my opinion, but he isn't even close to the offensive player Del Zotto is.

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07-02-2012, 08:45 PM
  #150
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I would go for Pyatt and Mueller as 3rd line wingers and go from there. They will make a trade and will need the depth.

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