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Alex Semin - Plan B

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Old
07-02-2012, 02:17 PM
  #151
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Having a coach that will only have certain players able to play for him mainly , plumbers , shot blockers , rookies with no choice , and former glory days guys record or not does not impress me.
The NYR = Lundqvist .

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07-02-2012, 02:24 PM
  #152
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If we dont get ryan i want the rangers to get Semin. I mean on a 1-2 year contract at 6,5-7mil cap its okey, he can score, and with a Center like Richards he maybe will be a 40-50 goalscorer?


Semin - Richards - Cally
Kreider - Step - Gaborik/Hags
Hags - Anisimov/X - Dubi/Anisimov
4th line

Maybe trade Dubi for pick and a 3C and anismov plays wing?

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Old
07-02-2012, 02:29 PM
  #153
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Seems like he's plan B for many teams, bet he gets a crazy deal. Teams are desperate and there's not much out there.

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07-02-2012, 02:29 PM
  #154
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Originally Posted by Dorado View Post
Having a coach that will only have certain players able to play for him mainly , plumbers , shot blockers , rookies with no choice , and former glory days guys record or not does not impress me.
The NYR = Lundqvist .
Funny. Having a coach that will only play the guys who work hard is just fine by me.

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07-02-2012, 03:23 PM
  #155
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Having a coach that will only have certain players able to play for him mainly , plumbers , shot blockers , rookies with no choice , and former glory days guys record or not does not impress me.
The NYR = Lundqvist .
What year do you think it is?

First of all, your categories are pretty silly. "Shot blockers" aren't types of players. Is Girardi a "shot blocker" or is he a solid defensive defenseman who blocks shots because that the hallmark of this team's defensive system? Is Callahan a "shot blocker" or one of the best two-way forwards in the game right now? Also, players like Richards, Gaborik, McDonagh and others don't fit in your boxes.

Second, every player "has a choice," including rookies. The young guys on this team aren't here solely because they can't go anywhere else. Anyone can demand a trade and make a scene. That'd get any player shipped out of NYR pretty quick.

Third, what "former glory days guys" do we have?

Lastly, how was this team 11th in goals for if Hank is the whole team? How do Gaborik's 76 points or Callahan's 29 goals or McDonagh's ridiculous defense all year long fit in with Hank being the whole team?

Semin not meshing with Torts isn't about Torts only being willing to coach certain players, its about a team wanting players who fit in with their team mentality and their offensive and defensive systems. That's how you build successful teams. That's why the old NYR teams that were just collages of expensive players couldn't do anything and that's why last years team led the conference for a huge chunk of the year. You establish a culture and you get players who fit into it. Having said that, maybe Semin feels he really has something to prove since he's been absolutely blasted in the media. If he's willing to do whatever is asked of him in order to prove everyone wrong, including playing in NYR's system, give him a short contract and bring him over. I doubt there will ever be a time where he'd be worthless in a trade - he's a solid goal scorer regardless of how much of a head case he is or isn't, and at this point they can get him for cash only.

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07-02-2012, 04:14 PM
  #156
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Originally Posted by haveandare View Post
What year do you think it is?

First of all, your categories are pretty silly. "Shot blockers" aren't types of players. Is Girardi a "shot blocker" or is he a solid defensive defenseman who blocks shots because that the hallmark of this team's defensive system? Is Callahan a "shot blocker" or one of the best two-way forwards in the game right now? Also, players like Richards, Gaborik, McDonagh and others don't fit in your boxes.

Second, every player "has a choice," including rookies. The young guys on this team aren't here solely because they can't go anywhere else. Anyone can demand a trade and make a scene. That'd get any player shipped out of NYR pretty quick.

Third, what "former glory days guys" do we have?

Lastly, how was this team 11th in goals for if Hank is the whole team? How do Gaborik's 76 points or Callahan's 29 goals or McDonagh's ridiculous defense all year long fit in with Hank being the whole team?

Semin not meshing with Torts isn't about Torts only being willing to coach certain players, its about a team wanting players who fit in with their team mentality and their offensive and defensive systems. That's how you build successful teams. That's why the old NYR teams that were just collages of expensive players couldn't do anything and that's why last years team led the conference for a huge chunk of the year. You establish a culture and you get players who fit into it. Having said that, maybe Semin feels he really has something to prove since he's been absolutely blasted in the media. If he's willing to do whatever is asked of him in order to prove everyone wrong, including playing in NYR's system, give him a short contract and bring him over. I doubt there will ever be a time where he'd be worthless in a trade - he's a solid goal scorer regardless of how much of a head case he is or isn't, and at this point they can get him for cash only.
How come Torts was fired in TB with a roster of stars...we have overachieved and I suspect without some added offense and or a fixed PP we will regress this season unless Torts has the KING perform above his play from last season .

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07-02-2012, 04:27 PM
  #157
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hey...who's this torts the clown guy anyway ?

and for the record, i do kinda agree with the nyr = lundqvist take.

its really true.

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07-02-2012, 04:36 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by haveandare View Post
What year do you think it is?

First of all, your categories are pretty silly. "Shot blockers" aren't types of players. Is Girardi a "shot blocker" or is he a solid defensive defenseman who blocks shots because that the hallmark of this team's defensive system? Is Callahan a "shot blocker" or one of the best two-way forwards in the game right now? Also, players like Richards, Gaborik, McDonagh and others don't fit in your boxes.

Second, every player "has a choice," including rookies. The young guys on this team aren't here solely because they can't go anywhere else. Anyone can demand a trade and make a scene. That'd get any player shipped out of NYR pretty quick.

Third, what "former glory days guys" do we have?

Lastly, how was this team 11th in goals for if Hank is the whole team? How do Gaborik's 76 points or Callahan's 29 goals or McDonagh's ridiculous defense all year long fit in with Hank being the whole team?

Semin not meshing with Torts isn't about Torts only being willing to coach certain players, its about a team wanting players who fit in with their team mentality and their offensive and defensive systems. That's how you build successful teams. That's why the old NYR teams that were just collages of expensive players couldn't do anything and that's why last years team led the conference for a huge chunk of the year. You establish a culture and you get players who fit into it. Having said that, maybe Semin feels he really has something to prove since he's been absolutely blasted in the media. If he's willing to do whatever is asked of him in order to prove everyone wrong, including playing in NYR's system, give him a short contract and bring him over. I doubt there will ever be a time where he'd be worthless in a trade - he's a solid goal scorer regardless of how much of a head case he is or isn't, and at this point they can get him for cash only.
Good post.

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07-02-2012, 05:15 PM
  #159
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I would honestly love to see Semin outscore Parise next year, no matter what team each one is on. All this hate Semin is getting, compared to this media lovefest towards Parise is insane. Especially when you break it down with NUMBERS in the last 5 season, not that intangibles crap every member of the Canadian media will tout, Semin has had higher averages. Funny what someones nationality does to their image.

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07-02-2012, 05:29 PM
  #160
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My point being the NYR need a one shot scorer / sniper game breaker type . Taking a flyer on Semin and getting him to buy in should be a consideration . Too many people hang the , "'Torts Kinda Guy " thing out there . It's a disservice to Torts and to the organization .
While he has his warts you either look to improve the team offensively by signing him for money and hold the " winning " character pieces with hands o stone or you trade away assets for another player with some character issues ie , Nash .

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07-02-2012, 06:16 PM
  #161
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Torts the clown? Oh thats rightttt i forgot we finished 1st and made it to the ECF because we had great scoring and young raw unexperienced players that could coach themselves.

I hate stupidity.
"Clown" is a bit much. My issue with the man is not his intelligence, but his apparent arrogance.

Torts is a my way or the highway guy, and like Billy Martin and the Oakland A's, where a case can be made he ruined a young pitching staff by overworking them, you can clearly say that Torts EXCESSIVE D first shotblocking at all costs style, in lieu of more intelligent play, is a big part of the problem.

We do not have great scoring, and need balance of both scoring AND defense, not just one or the other, to win.

Semin in...
Torts ... change or buh bye.

Yeah, I said it, I spoke the truth... again.

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07-02-2012, 06:21 PM
  #162
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My point being the NYR need a one shot scorer / sniper game breaker type . ....
Unfortunately, with all that power Pens have, need even more than 1 scorer.
But need at least 1 more game breaker type.

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07-02-2012, 06:33 PM
  #163
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Originally Posted by Dorado View Post
My point being the NYR need a one shot scorer / sniper game breaker type . Taking a flyer on Semin and getting him to buy in should be a consideration . Too many people hang the , "'Torts Kinda Guy " thing out there . It's a disservice to Torts and to the organization .
While he has his warts you either look to improve the team offensively by signing him for money and hold the " winning " character pieces with hands o stone or you trade away assets for another player with some character issues ie , Nash .
Zach Parise and Ryan Suter might be getting $100M

Semin isnt going to be a "taking a flyer" type transaction.

Your bashes on Torts just seem to be mindless noise.

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07-02-2012, 08:33 PM
  #164
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How come Torts was fired in TB with a roster of stars...we have overachieved and I suspect without some added offense and or a fixed PP we will regress this season unless Torts has the KING perform above his play from last season .
That funny, anyone who knows anything about the TBL knows exactly why Torts was replaced.

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07-02-2012, 09:42 PM
  #165
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Originally Posted by Dorado View Post
Having a coach that will only have certain players able to play for him mainly , plumbers , shot blockers , rookies with no choice , and former glory days guys record or not does not impress me.
The NYR = Lundqvist .
This is what Torts said on break-up day about potentially bringing in new pieces that might not fit the system:

http://rangers.lohudblogs.com/2012/0...ws-tortorella/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tortorella
"Yeah, you’re always thinking about that, but you have to be really careful about ruling people out, too. Sometimes, when you think it’s a really good piece, and he may not exactly fit in all the little things you do, you can teach him those things along the way if he really brings you something else. You don’t want to box yourself in here.”
Quote:
Originally Posted by Continued...
“Listen. We have to work extremely hard to score goals. Along the way, if there’s something that can help there, you find a way to teach your concept, but allow to bring some talent in to allow that to work for you. You can’t get stubborn here, either. We’re not going to lose our identity. I think there’s enough inner-pressure in our room.”
Sounds to me like he's completely on-board with bringing in a guy like Semin...

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07-02-2012, 09:47 PM
  #166
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This is what Torts said on break-up day about potentially bringing in new pieces that might not fit the system:

http://rangers.lohudblogs.com/2012/0...ws-tortorella/

Sounds to me like he's completely on-board with bringing in a guy like Semin...
I agree. Think about all the pre-conceived notions people had about Jagr when we got him. That turned out ok right?

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07-02-2012, 09:54 PM
  #167
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im in favor of Semin at this point. Teach him the system and maybe he can be this teams Kovalev.

any rumors on where Semin will go? Rangers even mentioned with him?

I have a feeling if the Wings lose out on Parise he is going there though

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07-02-2012, 10:00 PM
  #168
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I haven't read through the entire thread but look at it this way...Dale Hunter gave us a taste of our own medicine in Round 2. By doing so, who remembers Semin being a factor? I sure as hell don't, and yes I'm sure some will ask how much of a threat Ovechkin was but the fact is that guy always hits the ice and scares everyone in the league.

We need goals and if Semin is an option Sather needs to explore it. Could this be Nik Zherdev part II? Who knows

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07-02-2012, 10:08 PM
  #169
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I haven't read through the entire thread but look at it this way...Dale Hunter gave us a taste of our own medicine in Round 2. By doing so, who remembers Semin being a factor? I sure as hell don't, and yes I'm sure some will ask how much of a threat Ovechkin was but the fact is that guy always hits the ice and scares everyone in the league.

We need goals and if Semin is an option Sather needs to explore it. Could this be Nik Zherdev part II? Who knows
he didnt do much but didnt he snipe a game winner top shelf on Hank? The guy is extremely talented and the UFA list stinks. All some fans are saying is if the team wants more goals well he can likely give more goals. He may drive us nuts at times but he is really talented and would help the PP

Richards would feed him tons of blasts

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07-02-2012, 10:29 PM
  #170
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"Clown" is a bit much. My issue with the man is not his intelligence, but his apparent arrogance.

Torts is a my way or the highway guy, and like Billy Martin and the Oakland A's, where a case can be made he ruined a young pitching staff by overworking them, you can clearly say that Torts EXCESSIVE D first shotblocking at all costs style, in lieu of more intelligent play, is a big part of the problem.

We do not have great scoring, and need balance of both scoring AND defense, not just one or the other, to win.

Semin in...
Torts ... change or buh bye.

Yeah, I said it, I spoke the truth... again.
Wait so you're saying Torts doesnt encourage intelligent play? WHATTT. Playing good defensive hockey IS intelligent play. Limiting the mental lapses and weak coverage in your own end as well as not getting caught out of position or up the ice helps you win games. I highly, highly doubt Torts goes into practice telling these guys to block shots. Not everyone on the team block shots. Torts advocates an honest effort and a 'do whatever it takes' mentality. The PLAYERS have taken on that identity because they respect their coach not because they are scared of him. They choose to lay their body on the line. Callahan has done it since he came into the league under Renney. It is why he became a fan favorite and the captain of the team.

It's ignorant posts like yours that I try to ignore but its so hard. You act like Torts wants to coach this way. No he doesn't. In fact if you could pay attention and do a little reading you'd see that his comments from break-up day indicate he wants more scoring even if it means sacrificing a little bit of the way they play. Not a lot but a little bit. Torts was FORCED to implement that system because he knew we didn't have enough offensive talent to play a more run and gun type of offense. Adding Richards last offseason was just a stepping stone in the PROCESS of building a contender that doesnt just compete for one season but for years. He had to have a more defensive system because the majority of his players were more defensive minded or better on the defensive side of the puck. He played to the team's strengths to compete. Pittsburgh tried to play to their strength. So did Philly. Where did they end up? It's frustrating reading posts like yours that attack Tortorella. You guys have all the answers its amazing.

You spoke no truth. You just pasted BS all over your reply. Thank you captain obvious for letting us know we need scoring forwards. Torts already knew this. Again take a gander at his quotes from break-up day. Torts doesn't have the blinders on. You are too funny. "Change or buh bye." Save it. Guy was up for the Jack Adams award. What a terrible coach right? Has a stanley cup on his resume. A Stanley Cup when guys like Vinny L and Richards were very young in their careers. Sounds a lot like the rangers. Hmmm....maybe he knows what he's doing as opposed to some mindless fan who has never coached hockey at any level.

And btw the billy martin analogy is bs too. Torts didn't intentionally overwork his defensemen. He had no choice. Bickel wasn't able to keep up. Eminger was still trying to get back into a rhythm after recovering from an injury. I'd rather have a 50% McDonagh and Girardi over a 100% Bickel. They didn't have the depth. That's not Torts' fault.

People on this board need to really think before they "share" their opinion.

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07-02-2012, 11:03 PM
  #171
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This is what Torts said on break-up day about potentially bringing in new pieces that might not fit the system:

http://rangers.lohudblogs.com/2012/0...ws-tortorella/





Sounds to me like he's completely on-board with bringing in a guy like Semin...
I'm glad someone brought that quote up.. thanks.

But realistically, I don't see Sather going for Semin. That would be too much of a positive thing for him to do .

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07-02-2012, 11:15 PM
  #172
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I haven't read through the entire thread but look at it this way...Dale Hunter gave us a taste of our own medicine in Round 2. By doing so, who remembers Semin being a factor? I sure as hell don't, and yes I'm sure some will ask how much of a threat Ovechkin was but the fact is that guy always hits the ice and scares everyone in the league.

We need goals and if Semin is an option Sather needs to explore it. Could this be Nik Zherdev part II? Who knows
under dale hunter, including the playoffs, he had:
70gp
19G
29A
48P
+8

Averaged abotu 17mins a game of ice time. give him 20-22 mins a night, and i dont think hes have too much of a problem putting up 30/35 numbers. 1 year deal at 5 or 6 mil would be fine with me. we can handle that for 1 year. if he needs a ton more, im not interested.

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07-02-2012, 11:19 PM
  #173
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im currently all aboard the screw nash sign semin bandwagon. howsen is ridiculous with his demands. we have the cap space. sign semin, use dubinsky and a prospect or 2 to possibly trade for an upgrade on defense, sign a 3rd line wing and lets get this show on the road. roster when healthy could look like this:

Kreider/Richards/Gaborik
Semin/Stepan/Callahan
Hagelin/Anisimov/????
Rupp/Boyle/Asham (god thats one slow ass 4th line)

McDonagh/Girardi
Staal/?????
DelZotto/Bickel/Erixon/McIlrath

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07-02-2012, 11:28 PM
  #174
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i think an ideal situation would be to deal for nash and sign semin to a 1 year deal.

AA, Dubi and prospects for nash


Hagelin - Richards - Gaborik
Semin - Stepan - Nash
Kreider - Boyle - Callahan
Asham - Rupp - Fedotenko

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07-02-2012, 11:36 PM
  #175
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i think an ideal situation would be to deal for nash and sign semin to a 1 year deal.

AA, Dubi and prospects for nash


Hagelin - Richards - Gaborik
Semin - Stepan - Nash
Kreider - Boyle - Callahan
Asham - Rupp - Fedotenko
It'd be nice but I don't think it's possible. Semin is going to want good money.

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