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Old
07-04-2012, 03:46 PM
  #51
Legionnaire11
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Originally Posted by Top 6 Spaling View Post
Couts is a good option. I think trading for a young stud forward is the best route right now. But it's also worth considering a trade for a stud young defenseman to replace him, plus other pieces. Think McDonagh+, OEL+, Adam Larsson+, etc.

Like I said, I think getting a true top line forward is our best option, but the other track deserves consideration.

My dream deal would be McD/Staal/Girardi+Krieder/Stepan

McDonagh + Stepan... i'd trade Weber + ???? for them


Schenns are a good deal as well, but only for Weber straight up.

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07-04-2012, 03:49 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by MarkMM View Post
Not trolling, I'm a Preds fan and have been active on your board for years.

So don't get upset, but one thing I'd point out is that Vancouver has its draft picks through the next several years, has cap space now with more to come when Luongo is moved, and can add more cap space when Ballard is moved.

So in short I agree with the rest, sign or move him quickly, if not, what's to stop the Canucks offering an $8-9 million one-year deal? If Preds match, they can't trade him next year iirc and will lose him for nothing next year if Weber is set on coming home. If the Preds don't match, four draft picks from a team that should still be at the higher end of the league hence lower-end draft picks won't be a good return on the guy.

Part of the problem is, I'm wondering if other GM's looking at the Preds are thinking the same thing if they trade for his rights.
That would be a poor move by the Canucks. Assuming that's where he wants to end up long-term, and would have signed as a UFA next off-season, they've just given up 4 1st round picks (a valuable asset, regardless of placement) for 1 year of a player they would have gotten for nothing at the end of the season. Pretty poor asset management as things go.

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07-04-2012, 03:53 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
Your offer sheet proposal limits Weber's selections to teams with their own 1st, 2nd, and 3rd round pick next year + cap room to make such a deal + a team Weber would be willing to sign an offer sheet for. An unlikely scenario
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Originally Posted by MarkMM View Post
Not trolling, I'm a Preds fan and have been active on your board for years.

So don't get upset, but one thing I'd point out is that Vancouver has its draft picks through the next several years, has cap space now with more to come when Luongo is moved, and can add more cap space when Ballard is moved.

So in short I agree with the rest, sign or move him quickly, if not, what's to stop the Canucks offering an $8-9 million one-year deal? If Preds match, they can't trade him next year iirc and will lose him for nothing next year if Weber is set on coming home. If the Preds don't match, four draft picks from a team that should still be at the higher end of the league hence lower-end draft picks won't be a good return on the guy.

Part of the problem is, I'm wondering if other GM's looking at the Preds are thinking the same thing if they trade for his rights.
A few more things that I'll point out....

A) As already mentioned, Vancouver has all of it's picks for the next several years. Sending out an offer sheet is not a problem.
B) Webers wife is from Vancouver (You already know Weber is from British Columbia).
C) Weber was reportedly quoted as saying how nice it would be to play in Vancouver at a Vancouver charity golf tournament.

It's not inconceivable that he's already decided to play in Vancouver. And since he is now officially an RFA, any GM in the league is free to contact Weber and/or his agent and it's likely that Gillis has already done so.

It's very likely that all of the GM's around the league already know what his intentions are. They'd know better than you or I would since they can actually go contact him and if they know his intentions are to go to a certain city... they aren't going to offer a decent package to Nashville for him.

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07-04-2012, 03:56 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Iron Duke View Post
That would be a poor move by the Canucks. Assuming that's where he wants to end up long-term, and would have signed as a UFA next off-season, they've just given up 4 1st round picks (a valuable asset, regardless of placement) for 1 year of a player they would have gotten for nothing at the end of the season. Pretty poor asset management as things go.
This is incorrect.

An 8.4m offer sheet is only worth 2 1sts, 2nd, and a 3rd round pick. Being that they would be VERY late round picks, they don't hold nearly as much value. Gillis would easily give up that package of picks for Weber.

An 8.41m+ offer sheet is four 1sts.

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07-04-2012, 04:02 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Uhmkay View Post
This is incorrect.

An 8.4m offer sheet is only worth 2 1sts, 2nd, and a 3rd round pick. Being that they would be VERY late round picks, they don't hold nearly as much value. Gillis would easily give up that package of picks for Weber.

An 8.41m+ offer sheet is four 1sts.
Even at that, 2 1sts, a 2nd and 3rd for a player you know you're going to get next summer anyway? That's a pretty hefty premium.

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07-04-2012, 04:02 PM
  #56
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hell no. wouldn't give weber up for crosby

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07-04-2012, 04:12 PM
  #57
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sign him to a 10+ years deal or trade,the predators will still exist with or without Weber:i hate the players who have no respect for the team that have believed in them.

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07-04-2012, 04:13 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Uhmkay View Post
A few more things that I'll point out....

A) As already mentioned, Vancouver has all of it's picks for the next several years. Sending out an offer sheet is not a problem.
B) Webers wife is from Vancouver (You already know Weber is from British Columbia).
C) Weber was reportedly quoted as saying how nice it would be to play in Vancouver at a Vancouver charity golf tournament.

It's not inconceivable that he's already decided to play in Vancouver. And since he is now officially an RFA, any GM in the league is free to contact Weber and/or his agent and it's likely that Gillis has already done so.

It's very likely that all of the GM's around the league already know what his intentions are. They'd know better than you or I would since they can actually go contact him and if they know his intentions are to go to a certain city... they aren't going to offer a decent package to Nashville for him.
Offer sheets are the boogeyman of hockey ... often used to scare yet so rarely does anyone catch a glimpse of one. For the Canucks to make such a move for Weber requires them moving salary out.

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07-04-2012, 04:19 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Iron Duke View Post
Even at that, 2 1sts, a 2nd and 3rd for a player you know you're going to get next summer anyway? That's a pretty hefty premium.
It is, but for the Canucks whose window is now, it's a small price to pay for even one more season where Weber could be the missing link.

And remember, the Canucks still have to offload Luongo, and with Weber coming in, Ballard would be moved as well. If all the Canucks did is offer Luongo to Toronto/Florida and Ballard to whoever wanted him for nothing but draft picks, the Canucks pipeline of picks would be restocked in pretty short order.


Last edited by MarkMM: 07-04-2012 at 04:29 PM. Reason: bad grammar
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07-04-2012, 04:21 PM
  #60
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As a couple of people have mentioned, throw a huge contract at him very soon. The new CBA coming up works to the Predators advantage since the Owners are apparently looking to cap the term on contracts to something like 6-7 years and reduce the players percentage of gross profits (or whatever the proper term is). Drop a deal on Webers desk that he can't refuse and if for some reason he does, move him. If the Preds only lose Suter, they'll be just fine. In the end, just like the Devils, you have much better management than most of the other teams in the league. Every year I hear about the guys who are leaving NJ and how the next year will be the downfall, but other than the MacLean fiasco for 1/2 of a season, it never happens. Besides, you guys seem to grow defenseman on trees down there.

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07-04-2012, 04:28 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
Offer sheets are the boogeyman of hockey ... often used to scare yet so rarely does anyone catch a glimpse of one. For the Canucks to make such a move for Weber requires them moving salary out.
True, and Gillis seems like a GM who would rather make a deal to keep a good relationship with Poile if at all possible.

But the salary isn't an issue, the Canucks are looking at over $10 million in cap space once Luongo is moved out, and about $14-15 million with Ballard traded. All that's missing is a top-six winger who the Canucks might just keep as Raymond once his arbitration hearing is up for give or take $2M, and a centre if Schroeder isn't used.

The Canucks have plenty of space to add Weber this season and next.

If it's true what DP seems to be implying, that Suter indicated one thing, and the team planned both Suter and Weber around that promise, then the truth may be that the Preds are in a horrible negotiating position with Weber now, and that's not DP's fault.

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07-04-2012, 04:36 PM
  #62
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Lock Weber up long time and watch him make Josi look as good as Suter.

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07-04-2012, 04:44 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkMM View Post
True, and Gillis seems like a GM who would rather make a deal to keep a good relationship with Poile if at all possible.

But the salary isn't an issue, the Canucks are looking at over $10 million in cap space once Luongo is moved out, and about $14-15 million with Ballard traded. All that's missing is a top-six winger who the Canucks might just keep as Raymond once his arbitration hearing is up for give or take $2M, and a centre if Schroeder isn't used.

The Canucks have plenty of space to add Weber this season and next.

If it's true what DP seems to be implying, that Suter indicated one thing, and the team planned both Suter and Weber around that promise, then the truth may be that the Preds are in a horrible negotiating position with Weber now, and that's not DP's fault.
The first move (Or very close too) that Gillis ever did as a GM of Vancouver was to Offer Sheet David Backes.

I don't think Gillis has any problem throwing out an offer sheet to get a player.

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07-04-2012, 04:50 PM
  #64
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^^ and that deal would be matched.

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07-04-2012, 05:00 PM
  #65
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go discuss weber to van somewhere else.

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07-04-2012, 05:04 PM
  #66
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go discuss weber to van somewhere else.
for real, it makes my brain hurt. especially today.

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07-04-2012, 05:22 PM
  #67
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Hell yes he should trade Weber!!

I remember when the Wild GM wouldn't trade Gaborik....and they lost him for nothing, when there were rumored to be some pretty decent proposals. Nash, Rick nash could have got CBJ a CRAP load of stuff too...but he wasnt dealt..and you KNOW that he's going to go UFA once his time is up.
Suter....there were so many Suter proposals on here exactly 1 year ago..but you guys shot down everyone (and so did your GM!) now look, you lost him for nothing. It's not like you guys were cup favorites and you were risking a real shot at the cup for young prospects. You could have had a boat load of young talent and probably 1 or 2 impact players.

Now Weber......weber weber weber...you don't need a crystal ball to know that history repeats itself.
Watch him go UFA and sign elsewhere and you guys will have lost two of the best dmen in the league with nothing to show for it but a 1st or 2nd round knock out

trade him now!! while he has value!!! you guys obviously know how to develop young Dmen....you'll have another Suter and Weber eventually..in the mean time you have to maximize the return on your assets if you cant get him resigned.

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07-04-2012, 05:26 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by DopitaToDemitra View Post
Hell yes he should trade Weber!!

I remember when the Wild GM wouldn't trade Gaborik....and they lost him for nothing, when there were rumored to be some pretty decent proposals. Nash, Rick nash could have got CBJ a CRAP load of stuff too...but he wasnt dealt..and you KNOW that he's going to go UFA once his time is up.
Suter....there were so many Suter proposals on here exactly 1 year ago..but you guys shot down everyone (and so did your GM!) now look, you lost him for nothing. It's not like you guys were cup favorites and you were risking a real shot at the cup for young prospects. You could have had a boat load of young talent and probably 1 or 2 impact players.

Now Weber......weber weber weber...you don't need a crystal ball to know that history repeats itself.
Watch him go UFA and sign elsewhere and you guys will have lost two of the best dmen in the league with nothing to show for it but a 1st or 2nd round knock out

trade him now!! while he has value!!! you guys obviously know how to develop young Dmen....you'll have another Suter and Weber eventually..in the mean time you have to maximize the return on your assets if you cant get him resigned.
Step one is make him an offer and see if he'll sign long term. If he starts the wait and see game, then you shop him hard.

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07-04-2012, 05:26 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by DopitaToDemitra View Post
Suter....there were so many Suter proposals on here exactly 1 year ago..but you guys shot down everyone (and so did your GM!) now look, you lost him for nothing. It's not like you guys were cup favorites and you were risking a real shot at the cup for young prospects. You could have had a boat load of young talent and probably 1 or 2 impact players.

Now Weber......weber weber weber...you don't need a crystal ball to know that history repeats itself.
Watch him go UFA and sign elsewhere and you guys will have lost two of the best dmen in the league with nothing to show for it but a 1st or 2nd round knock out

trade him now!! while he has value!!! you guys obviously know how to develop young Dmen....you'll have another Suter and Weber eventually..in the mean time you have to maximize the return on your assets if you cant get him resigned.
Yeah, sorry I didn't orchestrate one of those trades from my keyboard. And let me guess where you would like him traded....

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07-04-2012, 05:37 PM
  #70
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^^ and that deal would be matched.
I'm curious how would Preds fans would react if Weber accepted 1 year offer sheet from some team. What would you want to do in that case?

Knowing of course that if Poile chooses to match the offer sheet, Weber would leave for nothing next summer just like Suter did now. It's guaranteed because you can't trade a player for a year after matching an offer sheet and, let's be honest, it would be very unlikely that Weber signed an extension with Nashville.

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07-04-2012, 05:40 PM
  #71
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I'm curious how would Preds fans would react if Weber accepted 1 year offer sheet from some team. What would you want to do in that case?

Knowing of course that if Poile chooses to match the offer sheet, Weber would leave for nothing next summer just like Suter did now. It's guaranteed because you can't trade a player for a year after matching an offer sheet and, let's be honest, it would be very unlikely that Weber signed an extension with Nashville.
Can you trade a player once they sign an offer sheet? If you can, deal him to the highest bidder in that week you have to decide.

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07-04-2012, 05:52 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Top 6 Spaling View Post
Can you trade a player once they sign an offer sheet? If you can, deal him to the highest bidder in that week you have to decide.
"It's guaranteed because you can't trade a player for a year after matching an offer sheet"

I was hoping that made it clear

So no, you can't. Untradeable for a year.

Edit: oh you mean before making a decision whether to match it or not match it. My bad. But I would assume no, that would make no sense at all (who would even trade for a player in that situation, lol).

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07-04-2012, 05:55 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Top 6 Spaling View Post
Can you trade a player once they sign an offer sheet? If you can, deal him to the highest bidder in that week you have to decide.
You can't.

Personally, I don't see any way Weber does this though (even as a Canucks fan). Even if he wanted to come play in Vancouver I think he gives Poile a heads up and lets him get the most value he can from the Canucks in a trade. He's not going to just completely screw over the franchise. No way.

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07-04-2012, 05:58 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by Top 6 Spaling View Post
Can you trade a player once they sign an offer sheet? If you can, deal him to the highest bidder in that week you have to decide.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vajakki View Post
"It's guaranteed because you can't trade a player for a year after matching an offer sheet"

I was hoping that made it clear

So no, you can't. Untradeable for a year.
You're not answering his question. He's asking if you can trade a player that signs an offer sheet BEFORE you match it. IE: Can you trade just his rights and let the team you traded his rights deal with the offer sheet situation.

I'm not entirely sure if you could or not. I don't think you can because the team who Offer Sheets Weber I believe technically owns his rights as at that point he has signed with a new team, but Nashville has the right to match and then take his rights back.

There have been several Offer sheets made over the years, but never can I recall a situation where the rights to that person were traded before the option to Match.

You are correct that if the team matches they could then also not trade that player.

Because of both of these reasons, I think it's in Poile's (Nashvilles) best interest to trade Weber now before the Offer Sheet has been made if it hasn't already.

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07-04-2012, 05:59 PM
  #75
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You can't.

Personally, I don't see any way Weber does this though (even as a Canucks fan). Even if he wanted to come play in Vancouver I think he gives Poile a heads up and lets him get the most value he can from the Canucks in a trade. He's not going to just completely screw over the franchise. No way.
Ryan Suter
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