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Panthers Free Agency 2012! Part 2

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Old
07-04-2012, 06:30 PM
  #101
JonathanHuberdoh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Rypien Farts View Post
Main thing Panthers fans are constantly thinking about before October:

Huberdeau better be pretty damn dynamic and effective this year or
our offense is probably going to struggle again.
The issue with that is that our team already struggled to get 3 goals a game.

This year we better hope to score 2 goals a game. Theo and Clemmer will have to be Jennings-worthy this season.

Seriously, I know we won't sign Semin, but that stupid hopeless romantic attitude I have for this team can't shake the idea. When he signs with DET/NJ/PIT I will be really upset. I know it's not justified cause we were probably not in the running for Semin anyways, it's just going to be a disappointing moment for me.

I don't get it either though. If you're bringing in rookies, let them play 3rd/4th line time. Why are we keeping a guy like Smithson? We have THREE roster spots committed to 3 players that have a combined 15 goals over the last two ENTIRE NHL seasons (Smithson, Parros and Skille). We are STARVED for offence. Literally starving for goals. I understand we need checkers but WE HAVE checkers. Goc, Bergy, Kopecky and Upshall are ideal checkers. Guys who play responsibly on D and can contribute offensively.

Parros at least has the toughness, but Skille and Smithson? Smithson's faceoffs is not enough to keep him on the team IMO. He played well in his first few games than tailed off to the point where he was scratched a couple of games during the playoffs (I think he only played because Wolski was the only other option).

DT clearly said offense was a problem. Our rookies should be playing on the lower lines so they can learn the game slowly. We can't seriously be passing off a line of Howden Hubs and Bjugstad as a 2nd line. Goc and co. are also NOT 2nd liners by any stretch.

Like it or not guys, our roster has too many low-scoring forwards. We need offense. Badly. Until it's addressed I won't be a happy camper. I do not like 3 rookies coming into our roster (not to mention if any D men come up). It'll be very difficult to ice a competitive team if that's that case.

I'm not trying to be Mr. Negative so before everyone attacks me, I plead with you not to. I'm being realistic. A LOT of things went right for us last season. We can't count on everyone getting better and injuries not happening. Yah maybe we have a healthy Upshall but we lose Bergy for 60 games. Who knows?

If DT doesn't at least put a couple of pieces on the roster, we're in for a long season. He can't be done, I just can't imagine him being happy with this team. Even Chicago signed Hossa for a buttload of money when DT was GM and it's not as if Hossa was known as the best team guy.

And there I am back to hoping for Semin.

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07-04-2012, 06:31 PM
  #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Georgia Panther View Post
Had that moment when we traded for Pavel Bure.
That was also 13 years ago GP

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07-04-2012, 08:09 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Matthiasitchy View Post
The issue with that is that our team already struggled to get 3 goals a game.

This year we better hope to score 2 goals a game. Theo and Clemmer will have to be Jennings-worthy this season.

Seriously, I know we won't sign Semin, but that stupid hopeless romantic attitude I have for this team can't shake the idea. When he signs with DET/NJ/PIT I will be really upset. I know it's not justified cause we were probably not in the running for Semin anyways, it's just going to be a disappointing moment for me.

I don't get it either though. If you're bringing in rookies, let them play 3rd/4th line time. Why are we keeping a guy like Smithson? We have THREE roster spots committed to 3 players that have a combined 15 goals over the last two ENTIRE NHL seasons (Smithson, Parros and Skille). We are STARVED for offence. Literally starving for goals. I understand we need checkers but WE HAVE checkers. Goc, Bergy, Kopecky and Upshall are ideal checkers. Guys who play responsibly on D and can contribute offensively.

Parros at least has the toughness, but Skille and Smithson? Smithson's faceoffs is not enough to keep him on the team IMO. He played well in his first few games than tailed off to the point where he was scratched a couple of games during the playoffs (I think he only played because Wolski was the only other option).

DT clearly said offense was a problem. Our rookies should be playing on the lower lines so they can learn the game slowly. We can't seriously be passing off a line of Howden Hubs and Bjugstad as a 2nd line. Goc and co. are also NOT 2nd liners by any stretch.

Like it or not guys, our roster has too many low-scoring forwards. We need offense. Badly. Until it's addressed I won't be a happy camper. I do not like 3 rookies coming into our roster (not to mention if any D men come up). It'll be very difficult to ice a competitive team if that's that case.

I'm not trying to be Mr. Negative so before everyone attacks me, I plead with you not to. I'm being realistic. A LOT of things went right for us last season. We can't count on everyone getting better and injuries not happening. Yah maybe we have a healthy Upshall but we lose Bergy for 60 games. Who knows?

If DT doesn't at least put a couple of pieces on the roster, we're in for a long season. He can't be done, I just can't imagine him being happy with this team. Even Chicago signed Hossa for a buttload of money when DT was GM and it's not as if Hossa was known as the best team guy.

And there I am back to hoping for Semin.
actually, being realistic would be to acknowledge that we have basically the same team as last year that was able to achieve 94 points while in the top 10 of games lost due to injury.

can we expect a repeat performance of last season? maybe not, but we will be competitive for a playoff spot while bringing up our young guys. that is the stage this team is in right now, we are not at the perennial playoff stage yet.

a lot of people right now are like this...

when really we should just sit back and enjoy the show like this...

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Old
07-04-2012, 08:19 PM
  #104
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SE keeps getting better. Matt Carle to sign with Tampa.

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07-04-2012, 08:24 PM
  #105
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Whether and how much the teams in the SE Division are improving is debateable. What is not debateable is they are addressing needs. The Florida Panthers, as yet, have not addressed their number one need, scoring, other than hoping their young prospects pick up the slack.

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07-04-2012, 08:37 PM
  #106
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For the record, I dont buy all the **** Semin gets. "Coach killer"? I simply dont buy it. Might be a big misunderstanding. Hunter is a junior coach that just wasnt able deal wirh him, and didnt give him the chance and icetime he deserved. I bet if we're interested, both Tallon and Dineen will have a long talk with him and tell him and his agent how its gonna work. Tallon isnt dumb, he also recognize that the teams in the division are getting stronger, and I believe he will make a trade or sign Semin/Doan. If he doesnt he puts too much faith and responsibility on the youngsters imo.

Sorry short version of my thinking, but writing on an ipad. Its hell I tell you, when you arent used to it. And no spellchecker.. lol!

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07-04-2012, 08:41 PM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Georgia Panther View Post
Whether and how much the teams in the SE Division are improving is debateable. What is not debateable is they are addressing needs. The Florida Panthers, as yet, have not addressed their number one need, scoring, other than hoping their young prospects pick up the slack.
Washington and Tampa, goaltending is their number one need. They are hoping their young guys pick up the slack.

Winnipeg, they just need a better team. They signed Jokinen and...Ponikarovsky? Guess they're hoping their young guys do better too.

Carolina, defense is their number one need and they signed...?

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07-04-2012, 08:47 PM
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Georgia Panther View Post
Whether and how much the teams in the SE Division are improving is debateable. What is not debateable is they are addressing needs. The Florida Panthers, as yet, have not addressed their number one need, scoring, other than hoping their young prospects pick up the slack.
I won't argue, but what should we be doing differently at this point?

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07-04-2012, 08:53 PM
  #109
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Tampa signing Carle is really good for them, not so good for us.

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07-04-2012, 09:06 PM
  #110
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And the SE keeps getting better...

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07-04-2012, 09:11 PM
  #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pantherbot View Post
Washington and Tampa, goaltending is their number one need. They are hoping their young guys pick up the slack.

Winnipeg, they just need a better team. They signed Jokinen and...Ponikarovsky? Guess they're hoping their young guys do better too.

Carolina, defense is their number one need and they signed...?
I don't think Washington's goaltending is an issue and we're apparently expecting our young guys to pick up the slack for goals.

Winnipeg is a slightly better team, Carolina is better, Tampa is better, and Washington is at least the same. That could mean one more loss from each team, which could mean missing out on the playoffs. Nobody is saying they'll be 100 point teams or even 90+ point teams. Any improvement means a lot with so much parity in the NHL.

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07-04-2012, 09:12 PM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AwesomePanthers View Post
For the record, I dont buy all the **** Semin gets. "Coach killer"? I simply dont buy it. Might be a big misunderstanding. Hunter is a junior coach that just wasnt able deal wirh him, and didnt give him the chance and icetime he deserved. I bet if we're interested, both Tallon and Dineen will have a long talk with him and tell him and his agent how its gonna work. Tallon isnt dumb, he also recognize that the teams in the division are getting stronger, and I believe he will make a trade or sign Semin/Doan. If he doesnt he puts too much faith and responsibility on the youngsters imo.

Sorry short version of my thinking, but writing on an ipad. Its hell I tell you, when you arent used to it. And no spellchecker.. lol!
He isn't at all. Russians always get thrown unfairly under the bus by the Canadian hockey media. And the media likes to exaggerate problems in the locker room all the time. Richards and Carter are prime examples.

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07-04-2012, 09:14 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by angry_treefrog View Post
I won't argue, but what should we be doing differently at this point?
I agree that free agency wasn't full of answers but we have an overflowing batch of prospects in the system that can be used as chips, something that Tallon appears loathe to do. There's a Bobby Ryan out there waiting to be dealt. There's impending UFA Getzlaf that likely can be had for the right price. Others I'm sure are available. Young or relatively young players that can have long futures with the team so you can deal away prospects and still say you are building for long term success.

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07-04-2012, 09:15 PM
  #114
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Lol 6 years at 5.5 per? Wow. Tough signing, but not the end of the world. Still 3 months til season starts, I'm sure we'll have plenty of sky fallers coming around now. Lol

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07-04-2012, 09:18 PM
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Georgia Panther View Post
I agree that free agency wasn't full of answers but we have an overflowing batch of prospects in the system that can be used as chips, something that Tallon appears loathe to do. There's a Bobby Ryan out there waiting to be dealt. There's impending UFA Getzlaf that likely can be had for the right price. Others I'm sure are available. Young or relatively young players that can have long futures with the team so you can deal away prospects and still say you are building for long term success.
On this we agree, but who is to say that Tallon isn't working those angles as we speak.

Perhaps he brought Parros is as a way of getting Ryan. I am not saying that that is why we signed him. On the other hand, do we know that it didn't play a role.

I really hate being thrust into the "apologist" role, but I just don't see a reason to panic prematurely.

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07-04-2012, 09:24 PM
  #116
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Originally Posted by angry_treefrog View Post
On this we agree, but who is to say that Tallon isn't working those angles as we speak.

Perhaps he brought Parros is as a way of getting Ryan. I am not saying that that is why we signed him. On the other hand, do we know that it didn't play a role.

I really hate being thrust into the "apologist" role, but I just don't see a reason to panic prematurely.
The thing about trading top prospects for young but established players are those type of players have cashed or are about to be cashing some very big pay checks which I suspect is the true reason Tallon is reluctant to part with top prospects.

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07-04-2012, 09:39 PM
  #117
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Originally Posted by Georgia Panther View Post
The thing about trading top prospects for young but established players are those type of players have cashed or are about to be cashing some very big pay checks which I suspect is the true reason Tallon is reluctant to part with top prospects.
True, but fannies in seats means more ticket revenue, more concession revenue and more advertising dollars.

If it's the RIGHT young player...

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07-04-2012, 10:17 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by Georgia Panther View Post
The thing about trading top prospects for young but established players are those type of players have cashed or are about to be cashing some very big pay checks which I suspect is the true reason Tallon is reluctant to part with top prospects.
So if you already understand the budget constraints that our team operates under and the financial realities of trading (and then signing) established players, why are you criticizing Tallon for not trading away our prospects?

It's not like our owners will suddenly become much richer overnight. Our budget is what it is because of the owners we have.

Our best bet is to remain competitive, develop our young players, hopefully grow the fan base, and then go from there.

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07-04-2012, 10:18 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by Matthiasitchy View Post
Tampa signing Carle is really good for them, not so good for us.
5.5 mil for SIX YEARS for Matt Friggen Carle?

Suddenly - 4 mil doesn't look so bad for Kuba does it?

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07-04-2012, 10:30 PM
  #120
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Matt Carle has developed into a better player since his last stint with TB.

Still, they are/were in need of a better defense.

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07-04-2012, 10:37 PM
  #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flapanthersfan View Post
5.5 mil for SIX YEARS for Matt Friggen Carle?

Suddenly - 4 mil doesn't look so bad for Kuba does it?
Never said the terms were good. But you can't argue that Carle doesn't help their defense.

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07-05-2012, 12:07 AM
  #122
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I get the point that DT is trying to build a contender on the cheap, which requires building from the draft -- there's no other way if you're low on the bucks. And I get the point that DT is in particular adverse to signing really long term deals at this point, pretty much anything over 4-5 years. So we were already self-eliminated form the Parise sweepstakes, and he's very reluctant on Luongo, unless he gets him for a bag of pucks and a pre-owned zamboni in need of new heater coils.

But why not Olli? Why not Jagr for a year or two? Why not Semin -- is he looking for a 5+ year deal? Why not Wellwood? All of those guys could help us in the short term, yet we find other teams signing them up. All in the name of "not DT's kind of player" or the tired old "locker room cancer" stuff. You can ALWAYS find a reason not to sign a player if you set your mind to it. Heck, the Crosby signing was a risky move health wise, and so was Parise. But it sets a course, it sets an expectation, and it gets people excited. Seems like in Panther land exciting FA signings are about as common as honesty in government.

If DT is worried about setting a high salary expectation when the young ones as well as Weiss begin to talk contracts, there's two points he can make to the owners: 1) Panthers have to accept they aren't going to be able to have a winning team and not pay reasonable NHL salaries, and 2) Short term contracts can be explained away with more ease than long term ones (a 2 year $9M for Olli is easier to justify than a 12 year $100M for Parise).

I'm not saying I believe DT is done, but I'm getting very worried and skeptical with every passing day. Last year's signings created an excitement, a buzz that definitely sold tickets. DT could continue that with one great acquisition, even if it is a bit expensive. $9M for Olli over 2 years would have more than paid for itself, but hey, "not DT's kind of player". So what's the solution then if no one can meet DT's high standard? Play a bunch of rookies? I guess that's DT's message.

Trying to look on the bright side, as exciting as it will be to see Huber, Howden and co. on the ice, even more interesting will be to see what kind of a marketing spin Yorkster will think up by the time September rolls around.

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07-05-2012, 12:25 AM
  #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pantherbot View Post
Washington and Tampa, goaltending is their number one need. They are hoping their young guys pick up the slack.

Winnipeg, they just need a better team. They signed Jokinen and...Ponikarovsky? Guess they're hoping their young guys do better too.

Carolina, defense is their number one need and they signed...?
Have you forgotten about Jordan Stall?

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07-05-2012, 12:26 AM
  #124
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I get the point that DT is trying to build a contender on the cheap, which requires building from the draft -- there's no other way if you're low on the bucks. And I get the point that DT is in particular adverse to signing really long term deals at this point, pretty much anything over 4-5 years. So we were already self-eliminated form the Parise sweepstakes, and he's very reluctant on Luongo, unless he gets him for a bag of pucks and a pre-owned zamboni in need of new heater coils.

But why not Olli? Why not Jagr for a year or two? Why not Semin -- is he looking for a 5+ year deal? Why not Wellwood? All of those guys could help us in the short term, yet we find other teams signing them up. All in the name of "not DT's kind of player" or the tired old "locker room cancer" stuff. You can ALWAYS find a reason not to sign a player if you set your mind to it. Heck, the Crosby signing was a risky move health wise, and so was Parise. But it sets a course, it sets an expectation, and it gets people excited. Seems like in Panther land exciting FA signings are about as common as honesty in government.

If DT is worried about setting a high salary expectation when the young ones as well as Weiss begin to talk contracts, there's two points he can make to the owners: 1) Panthers have to accept they aren't going to be able to have a winning team and not pay reasonable NHL salaries, and 2) Short term contracts can be explained away with more ease than long term ones (a 2 year $9M for Olli is easier to justify than a 12 year $100M for Parise).

I'm not saying I believe DT is done, but I'm getting very worried and skeptical with every passing day. Last year's signings created an excitement, a buzz that definitely sold tickets. DT could continue that with one great acquisition, even if it is a bit expensive. $9M for Olli over 2 years would have more than paid for itself, but hey, "not DT's kind of player". So what's the solution then if no one can meet DT's high standard? Play a bunch of rookies? I guess that's DT's message.

Trying to look on the bright side, as exciting as it will be to see Huber, Howden and co. on the ice, even more interesting will be to see what kind of a marketing spin Yorkster will think up by the time September rolls around.
I have to agree with you here.. While I am excited about our future and what Tallon has built here, teams around us are getting better and we're kind of keeping the status quo. I really want to see Tallon bring in Semin and bolster this lineup. He has said before that we need help on offense, yet he makes it seem like he's relying on our youth to be those answers and I don't know if thats the right thing to do. I know people have their own views of Semin, but the kid is young and can score goals. He can put fannies in the seats and help this team keep on pace with the winning atmosphere. We really need to do something because it seems like all other teams are making those efforts to at the very least improve their hockey clubs. Yes, we have three months till season starts, but we need some excitement now.. something to look forward too

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07-05-2012, 05:07 AM
  #125
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We need a 2nd line center, sign Wellwood!


Huberdeau-Weiss-Versteeg
Fleischmann-Wellwood-Bergenheim
Shore - Goc - Upshall
Kopecky-Matthias-Parros

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