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The 2012-2013 Boston Celtics Thread: Part II

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07-06-2012, 09:50 PM
  #326
Ten Thousand Hours
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Originally Posted by kman22 View Post
Wade played the fewest minutes per game of his career last year at just under 34 minutes. Unless he or Allen are now magically a 1 or 3, the minutes he'll get are not going to be significantly different.

Once again, the part that amused me the most was that he genuinely believed people wouldn't mind him leaving for Miami.
Miami can play without a point guard. Every team can play with 3 guards for stretches of time (the Heat especially). The Celtics have 2 shooting guards ahead of him on the depth chart (Terry plays the 2 a lot more than the point). There's undoubtedly more playing time to be had in Miami. And that doesn't even include the Rondo factor.

And I don't think most fans hate him now. Only the loud, obnoxious, oversensitive minority like yourself.

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07-06-2012, 09:52 PM
  #327
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Some in this thread are proving 2 things I've always said....

1) The fans care more than the players.

2) That's not entirely healthy.
From my perspective I will just say this.....

Love the C's but they are 4th in my world of the Boston teams. I don't live and die with the C's. My dog is much more likely to get kicked after a Bruins or Pats loss to be honest

My comment about Ray being dead to me was a knee jerk reaction. Hopefully no one is offended. I will certainly get over tonight's news.

On your 2nd point, let me assure you I am not going to lose any sleep tonight after hearing Ray signing with Miami. Garnett was the key piece of this offseason for the Celts. I had thought weeks ago that Allen would be gone. It wasn't til just a couple of days ago that it appeared there was a real chance they might be able to keep this thing together for another run. But as a wise man down in Foxboro often says "It is what it is."

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07-06-2012, 09:54 PM
  #328
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All good things........I do not think Ray will help Miami that much as they run a totally different style of offense. THe problem for the Celtics is that Bradley will not be back until December. That basically leaves them where they were last year, except a year older.....

Btw if they sign Jeff Green for 10 million a year for four years it will be the second stupidest free agent signing in any sport this year....Jeff Green is a very medicore total tweener. I think Ainge lost his mind.
Yeah I sort of have the same reservations about Green. However he only had that one year in OKC averaging 15 points before Harden came on the scene where he looked to be coming along as a good NBA starter...and the emergence of Harden derailed his career a little bit.

Green fits into our depth pretty well I like how he compliments Pierce, K Joseph, Bass, and Sullinger (and can play as well as guard a 2 better than any of them until Avery is back.)

Like you I am not sure he is "that" good. (We'd know exactly how good Green is if Harden hadn't taken his job or if he played all of this year but since he did Green's a little unknown.)

Hes a big kid and a good athlete if he gets hot with his jumper I don't see many holes in his game.

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07-06-2012, 10:01 PM
  #329
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Common misconception that Harden took over his job/production. He was still averaging 15 ppg before being dealt to the C's- pretty much the same as in years past.

He was just expendable for that big, rugged guy that they so desperately needed.

I like him a lot. VERY smart and crafty baller, not to mention he is very athletic. He just needs to work on his 3-ball a bit more.

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07-06-2012, 10:13 PM
  #330
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Miami can play without a point guard. Every team can play with 3 guards for stretches of time (the Heat especially). The Celtics have 2 shooting guards ahead of him on the depth chart (Terry plays the 2 a lot more than the point). There's undoubtedly more playing time to be had in Miami. And that doesn't even include the Rondo factor.

And I don't think most fans hate him now. Only the loud, obnoxious, oversensitive minority like yourself.
Im all those so what?

Believe it or not sports are a lot more fun when you have teams to hate. And its not like I hate the logo its the players on the team I dislike and if its a strong enough dislike for a reason then I hate them.

Think about it if you are a Boston fan nearly all the other good teams in pro sports over the last decade have SERIOUS beef with Boston teams.

Think of all the teams that consider Boston one of their most hated teams (this is without getting into un sports related resentment for being "educated liberals")

NFL hate towards Boston- Rams greatest show on turf, Raiders team that made the SB year after snow angels game hates us, Jets, fights with Tennessee, Miami, Denver before Manning was always on our schedule and a rival, Indy with Manning, Denver with Manning, Buffalo, Ladanian Tomlinson you don't disrespect Shawn Merriman's dance, Pittsburgh has never won a playoff game against Brady/Bledsoe and always talk smack before we play. That it? Course not...how about Baltimore do you think they consider us one of their 5 most hated teams after we made them miss the Super Bowl somewhat controversially? Eagles fans hate us for beating them in the only SB appearance. Browns fans hate Belichick #2 after Modell. (Probably forgot a team who also really hates the Pats.)

NBA- The LA Lakers biggest rivals are the NBA team geographically located furthest away from them. The Miami Heat are the hands down most dominant team in the sport atm (only 2 years after being irrelevant) is their biggest most hated rival at the moment their neighbor Orlando? Or is it the team from BOSTON?

NHL- OUr biggest rivals are one of the 3 teams from NYC area right???? Freakin hell no those joke squads aint our rivals not even close!!!! Our rivals in hockey have won twenty something times and come from a city where hockey is #1 followed by hockey, and then hockey. THe most talented team in the NHL (and only one I like to watch when we aren't playing) right now is Vancouver...who is the team they hate the most?

Baseball- Yankees should be enough said. (Not like the TB Rays don't hate us #1 and always have in their brief history especially with the Pedro WIlliams stuff.)

How many dominant teams in pro sports during the last 10-12 years don't make that list above somewhere? If you can think of some list them see if you can get more than my NFL list than I will shut up and apoligize for daring to hate Allen deal?


Am I not allowed to hate back a little?

Hate is good/fun. So is being a Boston sports fan!

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07-06-2012, 10:36 PM
  #331
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Im all those so what?

Believe it or not sports are a lot more fun when you have teams to hate. And its not like I hate the logo its the players on the team I dislike and if its a strong enough dislike for a reason then I hate them.

Think about it if you are a Boston fan nearly all the other good teams in pro sports over the last decade have SERIOUS beef with Boston teams.

Think of all the teams that consider Boston one of their most hated teams (this is without getting into un sports related resentment for being "educated liberals")

NFL hate towards Boston- Rams greatest show on turf, Raiders team that made the SB year after snow angels game hates us, Jets, fights with Tennessee, Miami, Denver before Manning was always on our schedule and a rival, Indy with Manning, Denver with Manning, Buffalo, Ladanian Tomlinson you don't disrespect Shawn Merriman's dance, Pittsburgh has never won a playoff game against Brady/Bledsoe and always talk smack before we play. That it? Course not...how about Baltimore do you think they consider us one of their 5 most hated teams after we made them miss the Super Bowl somewhat controversially? Eagles fans hate us for beating them in the only SB appearance. Browns fans hate Belichick #2 after Modell. (Probably forgot a team who also really hates the Pats.)

NBA- The LA Lakers biggest rivals are the NBA team geographically located furthest away from them. The Miami Heat are the hands down most dominant team in the sport atm (only 2 years after being irrelevant) is their biggest most hated rival at the moment their neighbor Orlando? Or is it the team from BOSTON?

NHL- OUr biggest rivals are one of the 3 teams from NYC area right???? Freakin hell no those joke squads aint our rivals not even close!!!! Our rivals in hockey have won twenty something times and come from a city where hockey is #1 followed by hockey, and then hockey. THe most talented team in the NHL (and only one I like to watch when we aren't playing) right now is Vancouver...who is the team they hate the most?

Baseball- Yankees should be enough said. (Not like the TB Rays don't hate us #1 and always have in their brief history especially with the Pedro WIlliams stuff.)

How many dominant teams in pro sports during the last 10-12 years don't make that list above somewhere? If you can think of some list them see if you can get more than my NFL list than I will shut up and apoligize for daring to hate Allen deal?


Am I not allowed to hate back a little?

Hate is good/fun. So is being a Boston sports fan!
Fair enough. I completely get it. But you say it's funny that Ray thinks he'll still be liked on the way out and I think you're in the minority, even if your group is louder than mine.

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07-06-2012, 10:42 PM
  #332
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Screw Ray. He took less money to go play with a bunch of classless punks. I hope the Celtics beat the Heat in the playoffs on the way to a Championship and Allen never sniffs the Finals again. Way to tarnish your legacy buddy.

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07-06-2012, 10:44 PM
  #333
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Can the C's offer OJ Mayo $6 million per they had allocated for Allen?

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07-06-2012, 10:53 PM
  #334
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Originally Posted by 24giovanni View Post
Can the C's offer OJ Mayo $6 million per they had allocated for Allen?
Nope. We had Allen's bird rights, meaning we could sign him to whatever and go over the cap. We don't actually have cap space and we used our exception on Jason Terry, so no Mayo.

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07-06-2012, 11:06 PM
  #335
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Screw Ray. He took less money to go play with a bunch of classless punks. I hope the Celtics beat the Heat in the playoffs on the way to a Championship and Allen never sniffs the Finals again. Way to tarnish your legacy buddy.
I don"t fully understand this sentiment... It seems to me that professional athletes get lambasted all the time for being greedy and overpaid, following the money and going to a worse team in the process. Some people accused Parise and Suter of just such a thing when they signed their contracts yesterday. But Ray leaves money on the table and favors winning a championship over the money, and you hate him for it?

I understand the resentment because he was a Celtic, but I doubt you'd feel the same if he was leaving any other team to increase his chances of winning a title, and taking less money in the process. Try to stay objective.

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07-06-2012, 11:22 PM
  #336
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Originally Posted by bleedsblackandgold47 View Post
I don"t fully understand this sentiment... It seems to me that professional athletes get lambasted all the time for being greedy and overpaid, following the money and going to a worse team in the process. Some people accused Parise and Suter of just such a thing when they signed their contracts yesterday. But Ray leaves money on the table and favors winning a championship over the money, and you hate him for it?

I understand the resentment because he was a Celtic, but I doubt you'd feel the same if he was leaving any other team to increase his chances of winning a title, and taking less money in the process. Try to stay objective.
It's not that he went to another team for the chance at a championship, he went to our Eastern Conference Arch-Rival whom the Cs just lost to a month ago. How would you feel if Chara didn't sign an extension here, and instead left to play for the Canadiens for less money than he was offered here?

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07-06-2012, 11:33 PM
  #337
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It's not that he went to another team for the chance at a championship, he went to our Eastern Conference Arch-Rival whom the Cs just lost to a month ago. How would you feel if Chara didn't sign an extension here, and instead left to play for the Canadiens for less money than he was offered here?
Im gonna love him forever and look down on those who don't. I really respect lebron bosh and allen along with all the heat fans who have been so loyal for the last 2 years and live nowhere near miami but are bashing Boston fans as classless morons for being upset at ray on the ESPN comment sections are completely correct and are the true fans unlike us. Shame on us for having the nerve to be upset at him for going to the team that beat us 4 weeks ago for half the money we offered him.


When all is said and done he brought KG to Boston and deserves credit for that. Not much else I got good to say about him his legacy here is ruined it was a judas move to go to the heat anywhere else and he'd be a hero in this town the rest of his life. Now his name is dirt. He didn't play long enough to go into the rafters despite leaving like this either but he would have been up there if he had retired or gone to another team.

If we were so nasty trying to trade him why did we offer him double what Miami or any other team was?

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07-06-2012, 11:58 PM
  #338
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Rose, if it weren't for injuries, might be the second best player in the league, behind durant.
That is great Oh wait, you were being serious? Its pretty clear who the best player in the league is, quite evident in the NBA Finals if you ask me, and anyone else who has common sense.

I would probably feel the same way that you guys feel if Wade left the Heat to go to the Knicks or Celtics, but the difference between Allen and Wade is that Wade is a Heat lifer. The Celtics had Allen for five seasons, and yes, he did help the Cs win a ring, but I think this is the type of hatred that Pierce would get if he left for the Heat, not Allen. Id really like to know what went on between Allen and Rondo, because I keep seeing that Allen hated the guy. Good luck next season guys, you are going to need it against us, more so if we get Camby and Lewis as well (all in good fun and banter guys).

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07-07-2012, 12:06 AM
  #339
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That is great Oh wait, you were being serious? Its pretty clear who the best player in the league is, quite evident in the NBA Finals if you ask me, and anyone else who has common sense.

I would probably feel the same way that you guys feel if Wade left the Heat to go to the Knicks or Celtics, but the difference between Allen and Wade is that Wade is a Heat lifer. The Celtics had Allen for five seasons, and yes, he did help the Cs win a ring, but I think this is the type of hatred that Pierce would get if he left for the Heat, not Allen. Id really like to know what went on between Allen and Rondo, because I keep seeing that Allen hated the guy. Good luck next season guys, you are going to need it against us, more so if we get Camby and Lewis as well (all in good fun and banter guys).
Starting a team from scratch

James
Durant
Rose
Howard
CP3

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07-07-2012, 12:14 AM
  #340
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Starting a team from scratch

James
Durant
Rose
Howard
CP3
James and Durant are definitely 1-2. As a Heat homer, I go with James of course, but when discussing this same topic before the Finals, I had a tough time not going with Durant. KD is a great talent, a great scorer, but LeBron is hands down the best all-around player, and will be one of the best of all time. The guy puts up numbers that havent been seen in 30-40-50 years.

Back to the hot topic, which is Ray Allen to the HEAT , I really would like to know what the hell happened between he and Rondo. Hey, I would not have minded if he re-signed with the Cs, but this just adds to the rivalry, and I cannot wait for that first visit to Boston, where those boos lead to him draining multiple 3s, because you know LeBron will be looking for him!

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07-07-2012, 12:37 AM
  #341
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No hard feelings, Ray. Id say good luck...but nahh. I'm happy to be getting younger. Had to start sometime.

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07-07-2012, 01:49 AM
  #342
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Miami can play without a point guard. Every team can play with 3 guards for stretches of time (the Heat especially). The Celtics have 2 shooting guards ahead of him on the depth chart (Terry plays the 2 a lot more than the point). There's undoubtedly more playing time to be had in Miami. And that doesn't even include the Rondo factor.

And I don't think most fans hate him now. Only the loud, obnoxious, oversensitive minority like yourself.
I will preface this by saying I would never pay to see a basketball game. What kind of reaction do you think Ray Allen gets when he returns to the Garden as a member of the Heat? The way it was presented, it sounds like Ray believes because he has played here (and at UCONN) that fans will cheer for him wherever he goes. That would be great, but if you believe that that will happen, we have very different views of the sports culture in Boston. People loved Johnny Damon, and he left for more money to go play for the Yankees. People could rationalize that by saying, they offered him a significantly higher salary and the Red Sox didn't act like they valued him. In spite of his rational decision, people booed him for years, even after he had left the Yankees. It was not until he was a member of the Tigers that he got an ovation at Fenway. Ray wanted to leave so badly, that he took half of the annual salary to play for the Heat. That's my take on it.

I personally don't mind him leaving. It hurts that they weren't able to sign and trade him elsewhere, but I think Terry is a better option. I'm hoping they are able to bring in a center or small forward with the bi-annual exception. I still think if healthy, they can get past the heat. They were without Chris Wilcox, Jeff Green, and Avery Bradley and they still went to game 7.

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07-07-2012, 02:16 AM
  #343
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That is great Oh wait, you were being serious? Its pretty clear who the best player in the league is, quite evident in the NBA Finals if you ask me, and anyone else who has common sense.

I would probably feel the same way that you guys feel if Wade left the Heat to go to the Knicks or Celtics, but the difference between Allen and Wade is that Wade is a Heat lifer. The Celtics had Allen for five seasons, and yes, he did help the Cs win a ring, but I think this is the type of hatred that Pierce would get if he left for the Heat, not Allen. Id really like to know what went on between Allen and Rondo, because I keep seeing that Allen hated the guy. Good luck next season guys, you are going to need it against us, more so if we get Camby and Lewis as well (all in good fun and banter guys).
Durant put up more points than Lebron did in the series. He also had more blocks, a higher field goal percentage, and he shot 15 fewer free throws than Lebron. Speaking of free throws, Wade and Lebron combined for 3 fewer free throw attempts than Westbrook, Harden and Durant combined. Oh, and Lebron is 4 years older than Durant, and has been in the league for 4 years more.

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07-07-2012, 04:46 AM
  #344
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this was literally the only thing Allen could have done to make not like him anymore... Such a sour feeling in my stomach... Thanks for some great years Ray, but you stupid ****

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07-07-2012, 05:28 AM
  #345
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does this mean Ray's wife's cooking show is not going to be on?

this has to be about Rondo and losing his starting spot- Allen suffers from OCD and to change routines when you don't have to means there is something significant.

Always one of my favorite players but he's the enemy now. Not even close to seeing Clemens in a Blue Jays or Yankees jersey but still will be odd next season.

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07-07-2012, 05:33 AM
  #346
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If I cared about the C's/NBA Ray Allen going to South Beach would really piss me off. I don't so ...eh.

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07-07-2012, 06:01 AM
  #347
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Originally Posted by Scruffy View Post
It's not that he went to another team for the chance at a championship, he went to our Eastern Conference Arch-Rival whom the Cs just lost to a month ago. How would you feel if Chara didn't sign an extension here, and instead left to play for the Canadiens for less money than he was offered here?
This. I'm not even a big Celtics fan, but I thought it was a crap move by Allen. If it was any other team it wouldn't be a big deal. But the way I look at it, he abandoned his teammates to sign with our biggest rival. I don't care if it was for another chance at a championship. The Celtics if completely healthy could have just as easily won last year and are certainly contenders again this year if they can stay healthy.

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07-07-2012, 06:45 AM
  #348
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if Ray's wife comes up with a TV show down there, there is your answer.

also, somebody down there has to get Allen's mother and Labron's mom hanging out. Talk about hilarious.

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07-07-2012, 07:08 AM
  #349
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does this mean Ray's wife's cooking show is not going to be on?

this has to be about Rondo and losing his starting spot- Allen suffers from OCD and to change routines when you don't have to means there is something significant.

Always one of my favorite players but he's the enemy now. Not even close to seeing Clemens in a Blue Jays or Yankees jersey but still will be odd next season.
Chris Mannix was on WEEI yesterday, and said that the Rondo stuff was overblown. A factor, but a minor one. The word was that if the Celtics had met Allen's initial contract demands, he would have signed immediately with the Celts, so how much of a factor could Rondo and the playing time have been??

Not a huge B-ball guy, but from watching this situation unfold, I think the 3 reasons why he left, (in order) were:

1) Feels MIA gives him the best shot at another championship.

2) Thinks he will have a more defined role/more playing time in MIA

3) Rondo Factor

#'s 1 and 2 may not be true, but I think that Allen believes they will be?

Also, FWIW, Mannix said (yesterday) he loves Ray Allen, but if he were to leave the C's it might not be the worst thing, and that it would allow them to go in some "interesting" directions with the $$$ he was going to get.

Don't follow basketball closely enough to know what he means, I assume he's talking about stylistically on the court?

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07-07-2012, 08:05 AM
  #350
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Originally Posted by kman22 View Post
Durant put up more points than Lebron did in the series. He also had more blocks, a higher field goal percentage, and he shot 15 fewer free throws than Lebron. Speaking of free throws, Wade and Lebron combined for 3 fewer free throw attempts than Westbrook, Harden and Durant combined. Oh, and Lebron is 4 years older than Durant, and has been in the league for 4 years more.
Im sorry, but I like to go by what you actually see on the court, not just what a box score says. Its funny that you want to use stats to try to make a point. Ok fine, Ill bite. LeBron averaged more rebounds, more assists, and nearly the same points as Durant. You want to bring up blocks, , wow, Durant had five, to LeBron's two. I can say LeBron averaged more steals, like your block statistics, but a a one block difference doesnt make sense. Now, if you go by what you actually SEE on the court, then LeBron is the better defender, the better passer, the better creator, which is why he is the most complete player in the game. Durant is a hell of a shooter, who can pull up anywhere within the half court line, but he is not the better all around player. LeBron put up numbers in these playoffs that havent been seen since Magic Johnson in the 80s, and the Big O in the 60s, while the best game from the Thunder wasnt even from Durant, it was from Westbrook in Game 4.

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