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3 questions for you, Stars fans!

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Old
07-03-2012, 10:51 PM
  #1
Lint07
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3 questions for you, Stars fans!

Hey there, I could not find a specific thread to put this so I created one. Hopefully it's okay.

So I am a Habs fan having two questions that I figured Stars fans would be in the best position to answer. So here it goes:

1. What do you expect Jamie Benn's contract to look like? Is a 4,5M$ cap hit reasonnable at all to you or I am out to lunch with this suggestion?

2. Is the ''Jamie Benn at center'' experiment still going strong next year (I would suppose so, looking at your roster) and if so are you planning on him centering the 1st line? Who do you see him play alongside?

3. Finally, I know it might be early as I expect the Stars are not done yet and they'll upgrade their D but as of now, where do you see Phillip Larsen fitting on your team? What kind of season do you expect from him and what would be his upside?


Thank you in advance for your answers and I wish you a really good season. You have made some exciting changes in your roster, which is pretty nice! Cheers!

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07-03-2012, 10:58 PM
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My thoughts

1. I'd say something around 4-5 mil a year for 4 years, that way to keep him a RFA and sign another contract after. (Or is it 3 years, whatever keeps him a RFA at the end)

2. He'll be our #1 center, and GM Joe has said he is looking at a Eriksson-Benn-Jagr line as of right now.

3. Joe has pretty much said they are done for the offseason(although we really do need help on the backend). Larsen will probably playing #3/4 defensive minutes. I hope he gets bigger in the offseason as he is still pretty small. I would love to see 25+ points and a decent defensive game(but that point total may be asking much).

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07-03-2012, 11:22 PM
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Originally Posted by ReaallMunson18 View Post
My thoughts

3. Joe has pretty much said they are done for the offseason(although we really do need help on the backend). Larsen will probably playing #3/4 defensive minutes. I hope he gets bigger in the offseason as he is still pretty small. I would love to see 25+ points and a decent defensive game(but that point total may be asking much).
He said he was done shopping. I wouldnt rule out trades later in the summer.

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07-03-2012, 11:26 PM
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Benn's contract will likely either be a shorter term bridge contract around 3 to 4 mil or a long term deal that has a higher cap hit that could come in anywhere from 5 to 7 million depending on the amount of UFA years it buys out.

He's been at center for basically a season and a quarter now, I'd say it's past the experiment stage. He is unquestionably our #1 with Roy as the #2.

Larsen is the Stars' best hope for a significantly improved defense. After a successful rookie season he'll be taking on more responsibility in all situations. I expect him to either be the Stars' best or 2nd best defenseman next season, though he will probably play 2nd pairing minutes. He will be instrumental in turning the PP around along with the new forward acquisitions and expanded PP minutes for Benn.

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07-03-2012, 11:27 PM
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1) Really depends on Benn. If they want years then it may be a 5-6 million dollar deal for say 6 years like what Tavares got. If they go shorter term I expect less dollars because he'll still be RFA when it's over and get his mega contract then.

2) Benn will center the first line and I think Jagr is a lock on the right and coin toss as to whether Loui is on the left or Whitney. Either combination is miles better than last year.

3) It was only at the end of the year Larsen started getting PP time and he was very deferential to the other vets on the ice, not shooting the puck much at all. I hope an off season training and knowing he's NHL material himself will help him be more assertive on the PP. Playing with Whitney, Roy, and Jagr on that PP should only help. I also think he'll get #3/4 minutes and begin to look like the offensive d-man he can be. His defense was pretty good last year but he was tentative in the offensive zone at times. Experience should make a difference going into this season.

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07-03-2012, 11:34 PM
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CRSeven
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lint07 View Post
where do you see Phillip Larsen fitting on your team? What kind of season do you expect from him and what would be his upside?
I agree with everyone above that he'll be a 3/4 d-man this season.

As for his upside, I honestly think he's got #1 d-man potential. He's that good, IMO.

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07-04-2012, 12:16 AM
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Mr Misty
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lint07 View Post
Hey there, I could not find a specific thread to put this so I created one. Hopefully it's okay.

So I am a Habs fan having two questions that I figured Stars fans would be in the best position to answer. So here it goes:

1. What do you expect Jamie Benn's contract to look like? Is a 4,5M$ cap hit reasonnable at all to you or I am out to lunch with this suggestion?

2. Is the ''Jamie Benn at center'' experiment still going strong next year (I would suppose so, looking at your roster) and if so are you planning on him centering the 1st line? Who do you see him play alongside?

3. Finally, I know it might be early as I expect the Stars are not done yet and they'll upgrade their D but as of now, where do you see Phillip Larsen fitting on your team? What kind of season do you expect from him and what would be his upside?


Thank you in advance for your answers and I wish you a really good season. You have made some exciting changes in your roster, which is pretty nice! Cheers!
1. No excuse not to make Benn the highest paid Star at least. 4.5-5 for sure.

2. Benn is a C, and the best one in Dallas. GMJN has said Jagr and Eriksson, so much better line mates than last year.

3. Don't expect further activity. Larsen is going to play as a 3/4 and get corresponding minutes with some pp time. 20 points should be doable, and I think his upside is a defensively capable but undersized 30ish point defense man. Not a top pairing guy, but one of the better 2nd pairing offensive guys out there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xAlex916 View Post
I agree with everyone above that he'll be a 3/4 d-man this season.

As for his upside, I honestly think he's got #1 d-man potential. He's that good, IMO.
He doesn't have the physical dimension. His lack of size doesn't prevent him from being effective, but he isn't going to be a #1.

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07-04-2012, 12:27 AM
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Thank you all very much for those insightful replies.
Really appreciated!

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07-04-2012, 01:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Mr Misty View Post
He doesn't have the physical dimension. His lack of size doesn't prevent him from being effective, but he isn't going to be a #1.
According to your criteria Zubov wasn't a #1 then.

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07-04-2012, 01:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Misty View Post
1. No excuse not to make Benn the highest paid Star at least. 4.5-5 for sure.

2. Benn is a C, and the best one in Dallas. GMJN has said Jagr and Eriksson, so much better line mates than last year.

3. Don't expect further activity. Larsen is going to play as a 3/4 and get corresponding minutes with some pp time. 20 points should be doable, and I think his upside is a defensively capable but undersized 30ish point defense man. Not a top pairing guy, but one of the better 2nd pairing offensive guys out there.



He doesn't have the physical dimension. His lack of size doesn't prevent him from being effective, but he isn't going to be a #1.
I disagree. So far with his thin frame he has shown the ability to be as strong on the defensive side of the game as the offense, and it's not as if he's 5'9. If he just puts on some weight he won't be undersized at all.

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07-04-2012, 08:58 AM
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When people say #1 defenseman, I think Weber or Chara rather than Karlsson or Mike Green. Somebody you trust to play well in all phases of the game. Last year Larsen was a 3rd pairing defenseman with little responsibility on special teams. He filled that role very well, but I want to see some results on special teams and maybe a full NHL season before I think about comparing his potential to Zubov.

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07-04-2012, 09:22 AM
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Troy McClure
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Benn is a center by default. There were better free agent wings available, so Joe left Benn at center. If there were better centers available, we might have seen Benn move back to wing.

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07-04-2012, 09:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Misty View Post
1. No excuse not to make Benn the highest paid Star at least. 4.5-5 for sure.

2. Benn is a C, and the best one in Dallas. GMJN has said Jagr and Eriksson, so much better line mates than last year.

3. Don't expect further activity. Larsen is going to play as a 3/4 and get corresponding minutes with some pp time. 20 points should be doable, and I think his upside is a defensively capable but undersized 30ish point defense man. Not a top pairing guy, but one of the better 2nd pairing offensive guys out there.



He doesn't have the physical dimension. His lack of size doesn't prevent him from being effective, but he isn't going to be a #1.
He's not big, but he does at least attempt to be physical. I think he's going to be very good defensively. I just hope he can get that offensive potential going.

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07-04-2012, 09:57 AM
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Benn is a center by default. There were better free agent wings available, so Joe left Benn at center. If there were better centers available, we might have seen Benn move back to wing.
Center by default, but turns out to be a legit #1 center. Unless you manage to find another legitimate #1 center somewhere, you keep him there as wingers are easier to find. Even more rare are actual 1C power forwards. Right now he gives them a good matchup for the size down the middle in the West. I'd rather have him at 1C and someone else at 2C then two #2C's and him on wing. Just depends on the makeup of the forward corps though.

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07-04-2012, 11:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Mr Misty View Post
but I want to see some results on special teams and maybe a full NHL season before I think about comparing his potential to Zubov.
That's not the point. You pointed to a lack of physicality as your reason for why he's not #1 material. I merely picked the most useful #1 defenseman I could think of to illustrate that your reasoning is flawed.

And just to be clear, people here are saying #1 defenseman, not Norris caliber. I'm sure most teams wish their best defenseman was Weber or Chara.

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07-05-2012, 01:05 PM
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That's not the point. You pointed to a lack of physicality as your reason for why he's not #1 material. I merely picked the most useful #1 defenseman I could think of to illustrate that your reasoning is flawed.

And just to be clear, people here are saying #1 defenseman, not Norris caliber. I'm sure most teams wish their best defenseman was Weber or Chara.
I completely agree. Larsen is 6-1. This is the same height as the best defenseman to play for this franchise, likely the best defenseman to play the game, and another one of the best ever (Niedermayer).

Those guys had pretty good careers without ever having to crush guys in the crease or land highlight reel open ice hits.

The chances of Larsen ever being in that tier of players is extremely unlikely, but it's pretty silly to say that his height will prevent him from being a solid top four or better.

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07-06-2012, 05:16 PM
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I dont think Larsen will be a number one, and my reasoning wasn't as clear as it could have been.

I think number one guys have more physicality than Larsen, and although I was impressed with him last year I still expect him to be pushed around a little bit. I expect he will be paired with a more defensive player and would be nervous thinking that Larsen was the more physical defenseman in a pairing.

A number one also needs to play special teams, and Larsen hasn't shown much in his limited time on the pp and has barely killed penalties at all. There isn't much of a sample to draw on, but to suggest that he has the potential to be an elite defenseman without any evidence is premature.

Fans should have more reasonable expectations about Larsen IMO, and while I hope he will turn out to be Scott Niedermayer or Sergei Zubov, I expect him to become a good to very good 2nd pairing defenseman.

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07-07-2012, 09:42 AM
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I dont think Larsen will be a number one, and my reasoning wasn't as clear as it could have been.

I think number one guys have more physicality than Larsen, and although I was impressed with him last year I still expect him to be pushed around a little bit. I expect he will be paired with a more defensive player and would be nervous thinking that Larsen was the more physical defenseman in a pairing.

A number one also needs to play special teams, and Larsen hasn't shown much in his limited time on the pp and has barely killed penalties at all. There isn't much of a sample to draw on, but to suggest that he has the potential to be an elite defenseman without any evidence is premature.

Fans should have more reasonable expectations about Larsen IMO, and while I hope he will turn out to be Scott Niedermayer or Sergei Zubov, I expect him to become a good to very good 2nd pairing defenseman.
Physical..like Nick Lidstrom? Or Zubov? Two CLEAR CUT #1's. Larsen is already more physical than either of those guys. He throws his body around. He gets knocked around too because he's not that big, but he's not soft by any means. Evidence people are using is the fact that despite the expectation of a guy with below average size and an expectation for being an offensive guy, he's a lot better defensively at that age than most guys in the NHL. Except for a handful of blue chip high draft picks at the position, it's rare to figure things out defensively in the age 20-23 range as an NHL defenseman. Usually a lot of improvement if a guy is that young at that position.

So considering his starting point is more advanced defensively than most, if his improvement curve is as much as most who don't start off as well, then that means he could end up being VERY good defensively. Then again maybe he just "got it" earlier than many others and his ceiling defensively isn't much higher than where he is now. We'll see. Offensively the individual skills are there, we just have to wait and see what happens. Daley, for example, has all the skills in terms of skating and puck handling, but never developed into more than a 20-25 point guy.

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07-07-2012, 10:21 AM
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Has a Daley - Larsen pairing ever been tried.

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07-07-2012, 11:51 AM
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Offensively the individual skills are there, we just have to wait and see what happens. Daley, for example, has all the skills in terms of skating and puck handling, but never developed into more than a 20-25 point guy.
Daley has never had the puck skills that Larsen currently does. He's always been a guy who's relied heavily upon his skating, much moreso than Larsen even at this stage.

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