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Free Agent Frenzy (Part VIII): Still no decision with Doan

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Old
07-08-2012, 04:18 PM
  #126
Kreider Typical
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Originally Posted by -31- View Post
Age is irrelevant when evaluating player's performances?
when evaluating rookie performances-- age has nothing at all to do with it. if nabokov can win the calder at 25 and skinner can win it at 18, then age has nothing to do with rookie status.

first year is first year.

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07-08-2012, 04:20 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by mooskating View Post
when evaluating rookie performances-- age has nothing at all to do with it. if nabokov can win the calder at 25 and skinner can win it at 18, then age has nothing to do with rookie status.

first year is first year.
I thought the basis of the argument was offensive growth?

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07-08-2012, 04:21 PM
  #128
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Jim Cerny's chats are informative. He indicated a few days ago the Rangers are looking at Hagelin to the fill the void on the PK this coming season whenever it starts. Dubinsky and AA are the two players he mentions when trade questions come up.
If all we are willing to give up are dubi and AA, just keep what we have. They are better than anything we could realistically get for either or let alone both

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07-08-2012, 04:21 PM
  #129
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Realistically, this is the most i'd offer for Weber, Nash fans may say not enough, some of us may say too much.

To NSH: Staal, Hagelin, McIlrath,

To NYR: Weber

NYR gets their bomb from the point and drastically improves their PP not to mention how great of a dman/tough sob Weber is.

NSH gets a solid replacement for Weber in staal, a young up and coming forward who prorated got just about 50 points in his rookie year, and a tough sob top prospect dman from the rangers.

Downside: Rangers are looking at a contracts of about 14 years 115 mill. after seeing what Suter just got.

Thoughts?

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07-08-2012, 04:21 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Well, hes declining, for one. Not sure how anyone can expect anything more than 55 points from him from here on out.

The other issue is a +35 contract. If he'll take 2 years, I'd be fine. 3? Not so much. 4? No chance in hell.
Would you please stop this "he's declining" crap. His scoring totals have dipped a little. He was never a big scorer. His greatest value is heart and soul. Think Ryan Callahan in a much bigger body. He is not in any type of deep decline.

And $8MM a year for Weber? I don't have a problem paying a guy that kind of money when he is worth that kind of money. And Weber is.

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07-08-2012, 04:22 PM
  #131
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You have to think Nashville is going to ask for a prime offensive piece along with Staal.

I feel like it'll take Staal+Stepan+

I'd rather trade for Weber than Nash, to be quite honest. He's a game breaker and our defense
McD-Weber, Del Zotto-Girardi, Erixon/McI/Stralman would be eye popping.

If we could sign Doan and call it a day after that, I'd be happy.


Regardless of how it goes, though, I still really already think Nash will be a Ranger. Regardless of how long it takes, we'll get him. And it'll be for pennies on the dollar. We'll give up Dubinsky and some second tier prospects and a first.

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07-08-2012, 04:23 PM
  #132
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Dubinsky for Stafford would be an intriguing deal, but it's a deal I would wait on. I'm really curious to see how Dubi responds this season. His value isn't going down that much, even if he struggles to score this year, mainly because he brings so many other unique intangibles (size, puck possession, penalty killing, agitation, etc.). If he rebounds, great. He's a versatile forward. If not, he could still be moved for something valuable (like Stafford) during the season.

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07-08-2012, 04:24 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by Edge View Post
The cap situation might be helped if another roster playe goes with Staal. Even without, the cap difference over the next three years amounts to approx. $4m, $3.5m, $2.25 million. Give or take several hundred thousand. Over that time we will also lose Gaborik's contract and possibly a few more if young guys push vets.

Make no mistake, the salary is a challenge. But Weber's age is thing that puts it over the top for me. If he were three of four years older, I'd probably be a bit more hesitant.
Plus, it's the last opportunity to use the cheating provisions of the current CBA.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mooskating View Post
when evaluating rookie performances-- age has nothing at all to do with it. if nabokov can win the calder at 25 and skinner can win it at 18, then age has nothing to do with rookie status.

first year is first year.
OK. For me, age is a big part of evaluating a first year player's performance.

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07-08-2012, 04:25 PM
  #134
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I could totally see Sather taking this fork in the road and going all in for Weber. Weber is a cornerstone player. He is miles ahead any defender we have. Nash and Semin are nice offensive pieces, but come with flaws.

Weber is a perfect fit as a Ranger. Right handed shot. PP presence on point. Physical, huge, and good character.

This screams blue all over it.

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07-08-2012, 04:25 PM
  #135
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The Rangers survived without Staal because of Sauer, for what it's worth. While I tend to overvalue Staal, I feel like a lot of people don't appreciate just how important his game is. Sauer played over his head and masked the absence of Staal, we don't have that luxury right now.

I wouldn't hold up a Staal for Weber deal because of talent, I just wonder if the contributions from Weber outweigh the salary which will hinder adding offense. No way of knowing without a new CBA in place. And will Sather offer a cap circumventing deal with 3 final years at $1m each? Not sure how Richards' contract was structured but Sather never really liked handing out the drastic contracts.

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07-08-2012, 04:25 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by mcsauer2738 View Post
Realistically, this is the most i'd offer for Weber, Nash fans may say not enough, some of us may say too much.

To NSH: Staal, Hagelin, McIlrath,

To NYR: Weber

NYR gets their bomb from the point and drastically improves their PP not to mention how great of a dman/tough sob Weber is.

NSH gets a solid replacement for Weber in staal, a young up and coming forward who prorated got just about 50 points in his rookie year, and a tough sob top prospect dman from the rangers.

Downside: Rangers are looking at a contracts of about 14 years 115 mill. after seeing what Suter just got.

Thoughts?
Probably got to throw a pick in there, but yeah that is a solid trade. It depends on what Nashville covets though-Dmen or Forwards. If Nashville wants forwards, they are going to trade with the Flyers.

Also, bear in mind, McIlrath is out 8 weeks. Most likely your going to have to give up another prospect. If this gets rolling its within 2-4 weeks.

Also, the bidding war for Weber could have already started, and nobody knows about it yet.


Last edited by Blueshirt Believer: 07-08-2012 at 04:33 PM.
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07-08-2012, 04:30 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by iamitter View Post
You have to think Nashville is going to ask for a prime offensive piece along with Staal.

I feel like it'll take Staal+Stepan+

I'd rather trade for Weber than Nash, to be quite honest. He's a game breaker and our defense
McD-Weber, Del Zotto-Girardi, Erixon/McI/Stralman would be eye popping.

If we could sign Doan and call it a day after that, I'd be happy.


Regardless of how it goes, though, I still really already think Nash will be a Ranger. Regardless of how long it takes, we'll get him. And it'll be for pennies on the dollar. We'll give up Dubinsky and some second tier prospects and a first.

If Weber gets traded, Nashville won't really be in a position to demand anything, they'll simply take the best package that is offered.

You know that they'd want a defenseman coming back in the deal to help offset losing both Suter and Weber, that would be priority #1.

there arent many teams out there that would be able or willing to top an offer that starts out with Marc Staal.

That plus being in the East would put us in a great position to land Weber if we want to go that route.

I think Staal+Nash package (Dubi+AA/Hagelin+Prospect(s)+Pick(s)) is what he would go for.

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07-08-2012, 04:30 PM
  #138
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Whats a realistic package for Weber? Staal, Miller, #1 pick? And thats before the 15 years/120M or so that he will command.

This team has managed to build a top 4 on defense that is greater than the sum of its parts. I really enjoyed that this season. Im not enamored with the idea of breaking the bank for a guy thats going to have to be every bit "the man" back there to be accepted by this fanbase. It just seems to set up for disaster, but thats admittedly me being a bit paranoid.
The money is too much.

If Chris Kreider developed into a 50 + goal scorer management should consider moving him out before he becomes a fA.

Fortunately for the sport.. That's where the market is.


Last edited by ltrangerfan: 07-08-2012 at 04:43 PM.
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07-08-2012, 04:33 PM
  #139
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So if Sather signs Doan (assuming the deal is in the ballpark of $5 million a year), does that take us out of the Nash running? Could Slats use the threat of Doan coming to the Rangers as leverage with Howson? Howson I'm sure would hate to lose the Rangers as a possible trading partner for Nash. If you're Sather, do you try to ink Doan, and at the last minute, give Howson an opportunity to come down on his demands for Nash?

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07-08-2012, 04:36 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by nyr5186 View Post
So if Sather signs Doan (assuming the deal is in the ballpark of $5 million a year), does that take us out of the Nash running? Could Slats use the threat of Doan coming to the Rangers as leverage with Howson? Howson I'm sure would hate to lose the Rangers as a possible trading partner for Nash. If you're Sather, do you try to ink Doan, and at the last minute, give Howson an opportunity to come down on his demands for Nash?
Most likely, although I think technically we could fit both(but it would take some maneuvering).

As I said, if we get Doan, the Rangers are going to probably address other needs with the assets available.

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07-08-2012, 04:36 PM
  #141
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Originally Posted by nyr5186 View Post
So if Sather signs Doan (assuming the deal is in the ballpark of $5 million a year), does that take us out of the Nash running? Could Slats use the threat of Doan coming to the Rangers as leverage with Howson? Howson I'm sure would hate to lose the Rangers as a possible trading partner for Nash. If you're Sather, do you try to ink Doan, and at the last minute, give Howson an opportunity to come down on his demands for Nash?
Nash+Doan is tight but doable. I think this is one of the reasons Sather saved his nickles and dimes on the 4th line.

Signing Doan would give Sather the opportunity to move a second veteran forward (AA?) in any deal.

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07-08-2012, 04:38 PM
  #142
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Originally Posted by bobbop View Post
Nash+Doan is tight but doable. I think this is one of the reasons Sather saved his nickles and dimes on the 4th line.

Signing Doan would give Sather the opportunity to move a second veteran forward (AA?) in any deal.
Its too tight, imo, you can't really address the other needs realistically.

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07-08-2012, 04:49 PM
  #143
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Is Getzlaf possibly available now?? Manayunk Mike @ManayunkMike

#Ducks appear be very active with the phones. Listening to offers for Ryan and Getzlaf; making calls as well. Lots of buzz in ANA. #Flyers

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07-08-2012, 04:50 PM
  #144
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My latest thoughts, updating no Schultz, etc.
Do not want Hagelin + Miller + etc moved, weakens depth.

Can live without Stepan, who, be honest, bailed on us most of the year... as long as we get value and are not giving him away.

1 Boyle, Rupp, Stacjer, Mike Vernace, Pashnin + Rangers 2nd 2013
for Gernat, Marancin, Pitlick + Edmonton 1st 2013.

2. Dubinsky + Biron + St. Croix +RW Shane McColgan + LW Jason Wilson + NYR 4th 2013
to Hawks for Olsen + McNeil + Stralberg

3. Stepan + rights to JAM + Rangers 2013 1st + Edmonton 2013 1st
Nash + CBJ 2014 1st (agree to 2014 instead of next year in lieu of other assets NY gives up)

4. C.Thomas + Danny Hobbs + RW Tommy Grant + D Blake Parlett
Gardiner + pick

optional #5
MDZ, +++ for Hedman

sign Semin; 1st line until Gaborik returns; then either 2nd RW (Callahan down 1) or 3rd RW bumping Stralberg

Nash Richards Semin/Gaborik
Kreider Anisimov Callahan
Hagelin JT. Miller Semin/Stralberg
Pyatt Haley Asham

Staal Girardi
McDonagh MDZ Stalman
Erixon McIlrath
Gardiner

Lundqvist
Talbot

Bickel = reserve tough forward
Olsen = can prob = 3rd pair now, gets here if upgrade (Hedman?) for Girardi/MDZ +
McNeil + here soon
Yogan = scoring C soon knocking at the door/let him show what he can do, then keep/trade whichever is more advantageous

Gernat, Marancin = ideal lefty bookends for righty prospects Noreau, Ceresniak
Pitlick = speedy F should be developing at AHL
Stralberg = speedy RW complement to Hagelin, until Fast gets here.

That's how I think we solve the Nash issue: swap players; add enough top end value which Columbus gets 'now', wait a year, they have to add a high pick in 2014.

Flame on!
What is this, I don't even..

Wow. This is just something else.

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07-08-2012, 04:51 PM
  #145
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Originally Posted by bobbop View Post
Nash+Doan is tight but doable. I think this is one of the reasons Sather saved his nickles and dimes on the 4th line.

Signing Doan would give Sather the opportunity to move a second veteran forward (AA?) in any deal.
Ok. But there's gotta also be the thought that, with McD, Staal, G, Step, Hagelin etc. due raises in the next few years, and in order to leave space to make a deal in the future, we may be better off not squeezing ourselves at the cap.

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07-08-2012, 04:53 PM
  #146
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That's not a legit source is it?? Way too much

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07-08-2012, 04:53 PM
  #147
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Is Getzlaf possibly available now?? Manayunk Mike @ManayunkMike

#Ducks appear be very active with the phones. Listening to offers for Ryan and Getzlaf; making calls as well. Lots of buzz in ANA. #Flyers
This might be a little radical and nuts .... BUT .... if you can swing a deal with ANA for both Ryan and Getzlaf, I would be ok with trading Stepan.

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07-08-2012, 04:55 PM
  #148
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This might be a little radical and nuts .... BUT .... if you can swing a deal with ANA for both Ryan and Getzlaf, I would be ok with trading Stepan.
Its a pretty interesting idea, but would totally gut the team

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07-08-2012, 04:55 PM
  #149
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This might be a little radical and nuts .... BUT .... if you can swing a deal with ANA for both Ryan and Getzlaf, I would be ok with trading Stepan.
THIS!! Make it happen, Slats.

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07-08-2012, 04:55 PM
  #150
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That doesn't qualify as a legit source guys.

Please hold off until someone legit re-tweets it.

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