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Free Agent Frenzy (Part VIII): Still no decision with Doan

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Old
07-08-2012, 05:45 PM
  #226
iamitter
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Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
Okay, I missed that they literally JUST signed him. On that, I stand corrected. In my defense, that they signed him is indication they would have gone for him as asset in this deal.
Ignoring the far-fetchedness of everything else, the fact that they signed him is indication they would not have gone for him as an asset. You know why? Because he's not ours to give. He was a UFA. He had an AHL deal with us.

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07-08-2012, 05:46 PM
  #227
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Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
Screw Robinson.
If they're in financial turmoil, can we get Adam Larsson? I'm not saying cheap, just reasonable?
Think you would trade your top pairing 19 year old D-man whose signed to an ELC and controllable long-term? Oh, and to your arch rival ;-)

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07-08-2012, 05:47 PM
  #228
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Since they lost Suter I think things have changed a bit in Nashville. I think they are feeling poached and pissed.

I think their level of commitment on keeping Weber just went up quite a bit.
I think them wanting to keep Weber is a given. The question is whether Weber wants to stay.

The hypothetical all comes down to two conditions:

The assumption that Nashville makes Weber their best offer and whether he accepts.

The assumption that if Weber turns down the offer that Nashville gets what they can now, rather than risk getting nothing for him (aka Pitts and Jordan Staal).

If those two things happen, based on recent history, McD and Kreider is not going to be the only thing it takes to get Weber.

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07-08-2012, 05:48 PM
  #229
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Stepan got kneed at the end of the regular season, wasn't full strength. Gaborik was bashed until his injury was revealed. Callahan got the benefit of the doubt, and rightly so. Stepan was hurt right in front of us. We saw it. Dude's playing one of the toughest positions as a man-child.

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07-08-2012, 05:51 PM
  #230
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I think them wanting to keep Weber is a given. The question is whether Weber wants to stay.

The hypothetical all comes down to two conditions:

The assumption that Nashville makes Weber their best offer and whether he accepts.

The assumption that if Weber turns down the offer that Nashville gets what they can now, rather than risk getting nothing for him (aka Pitts and Jordan Staal).

If those two things happen, based on recent history, McD and Kreider is not going to be the only thing it takes to get Weber.
The question is... how long do you wait to see whether he's going to be available...

You would like to think Nashville has a plan that they're working on, as well as a plan-B. It's tough to turn down that huge deal that may be written out o the CBA. Poile may take the hard stance - Sign now, or take your chances later...

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07-08-2012, 05:51 PM
  #231
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I think them wanting to keep Weber is a given. The question is whether Weber wants to stay.

The hypothetical all comes down to two conditions:

The assumption that Nashville makes Weber their best offer and whether he accepts.

The assumption that if Weber turns down the offer that Nashville gets what they can now, rather than risk getting nothing for him (aka Pitts and Jordan Staal).

If those two things happen, based on recent history, McD and Kreider is not going to be the only thing it takes to get Weber.
Good points. I would hate lose either of McD or Kreider. I view them as franchise players....pretty much as of now.

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07-08-2012, 05:51 PM
  #232
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Originally Posted by DutchShamrock View Post
Stepan got kneed at the end of the regular season, wasn't full strength. Gaborik was bashed until his injury was revealed. Callahan got the benefit of the doubt, and rightly so. Stepan was hurt right in front of us. We saw it. Dude's playing one of the toughest positions as a man-child.
he started slipping slightly before that. i think it just cemented his decline... still baffling that neal didn't get suspended (or was it letang?)

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07-08-2012, 05:52 PM
  #233
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Good points. I would hate lose either of McD or Kreider. I view them as franchise players....pretty much as of now.
Kreider's got a ways to go 'till he gets franchise player status.

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07-08-2012, 05:53 PM
  #234
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I can't deal with the main board when it comes to the Nash rumors. They just don't understand that the Nash trade is not a true HOCKEY trade. He has asked to be traded, has a huge cap hit, and most importantly a NMC clause. If you think you will even get close to fair value for him, you need your head checked,

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07-08-2012, 05:54 PM
  #235
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Good points. I would hate lose either of McD or Kreider. I view them as franchise players....pretty much as of now.
McDonagh, I can understand why you think he might one day be a franchise player.

Kreider? Thats pretty ridiculous at this point.

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07-08-2012, 05:55 PM
  #236
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I can't deal with the main board when it comes to the Nash rumors. They just don't understand that the Nash trade is not a true HOCKEY trade. He has asked to be traded, has a huge cap hit, and most importantly a NMC clause. If you think you will even get close to fair value for him, you need your head checked,
They seem to have gotten a hate on for Ranger fans now too, so even anything reasonable you say gets tossed away anyhow.

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07-08-2012, 05:57 PM
  #237
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he started slipping slightly before that. i think it just cemented his decline... still baffling that neal didn't get suspended (or was it letang?)
It was Orpik. Didn't think it was suspension worthy.

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07-08-2012, 05:58 PM
  #238
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i think the offer the "noooooo" was referring to was just for Nash...
Yes, that proposal for Nash was what I was saying no to.

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Hall of Famer Larry Robinson has just been hired as associate coach of the San Jose Sharks. Two years, one-year option ‪#Habs‬
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Old
07-08-2012, 05:59 PM
  #239
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Originally Posted by GregSirico View Post
I can't deal with the main board when it comes to the Nash rumors. They just don't understand that the Nash trade is not a true HOCKEY trade. He has asked to be traded, has a huge cap hit, and most importantly a NMC clause. If you think you will even get close to fair value for him, you need your head checked,
that's what I believe. Howson has been trapped by what you had said before.

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07-08-2012, 05:59 PM
  #240
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Originally Posted by Henriks Broadway Hat View Post
Bern, You can't tell me this is real. Put the Xbox controller down. I know Be a GM Mode is fun...but tone it down a little.
Why consider this unreal?
There was a post on the main board from an Edmonton guy they're looking for someone tough so their elite Fs and prized D prospect Schultz do not get roughed up. Rupp fits that to a t. They aren't likely to be crazy about about moving both Gernat and Marancin, but they are both a full 2 yrs away, and they still have Klefborn, so that side of it can work for them. Pashnin is real hit and miss, but they'd have a better shot at getting him to go there, he doesn't, apparently, want to face the competition here. Should we let Pashnin walk, or get use for him.
They complain they are thin. Boyle fits their needs, and if we get upgrade, let's make the move.

That's just one part. There was similarly discussion about Gardener, and some agreement that given their F needs, though it would be boom bust, Thomas for Gardener straight up might work. The little extra sweetener to be sure is not a back breaker, and is enough to make TML say yes.

Again, going on HFB threads, Chicago only inquired as to Dubi and his toughness, not Biron, though he's the one they really need. Dubi gets either McNeil or Olsen; Biron added delivers both.

What about these is SO OUTRAGEOUS?

I'm thinking outside the box and delivering comprehensive solutions, including snipers we urgently need, while holding on to most of our most valued assets.

Meanwhile, some of you guys pine for MZA, who is another guy who can't make the squad; unlike Thomas, he'll never be fast enough to get separation and play in NHL, let alone check properly.

We are not on the same page, my friends...

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Old
07-08-2012, 06:02 PM
  #241
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Originally Posted by iamitter View Post
Kreider's got a ways to go 'till he gets franchise player status.
I am NOT criticizing you for speaking the truth.
However, it is also true that we don't know this guy's ceiling, and moving him for ANYBODY other than an uber-elite (Malkin, Stamkos) would be a huge error.

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Old
07-08-2012, 06:10 PM
  #242
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Originally Posted by o 16 Avery NYR o View Post
that's what I believe. Howson has been trapped by what you had said before.
I've been saying this all along since the rumors broke in Feb ... if he gets moved ... it will be on Slats terms. CBJ has almost ZERO leverage. If Howson would have kept it quiet about Nash wanting out and saying something along the line of "need to improve for the better of the organization, etc" .... he definitely would have more teams knocking at his door and better offers. Knowing Nash wants out, KILLS his leverage, and when you factor in the NMC and money ... I would be shocked if he gets more than 2 roster players plus some prospects and or picks combo.

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07-08-2012, 06:11 PM
  #243
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Sorry to be inappropriate but im getting hard over here at the thought of this line up...

Hagelin-Richards-Gaborik
Kreider-Stepan-Callahan
Dubi-Anisimov-Doan
Asham-Boyle-Pyatt
Rupp

McD-Girardi
Staal-Stralman
MDZ-Erixon/Bickel

Is this not the deepest lineup in the league!?!

And this still gives us plenty of space to resign our rfas next year!

http://capgeek.com/cap-calculator/roster.php?id=11888

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Old
07-08-2012, 06:13 PM
  #244
bernmeister
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
..
Quote:
Do I really need to?
If you're gonna be objective in an effort to substantiate your opinion, you should. If you'd rather not... it's a free country, and you live by your words.

Quote:
You threw in at least 8 prospects that have no value whatsoever into 4 trades - one more ridiculous than the next.
Your unfounded, unsubstantiated, subjective opinion. Respectfully disagree.

Quote:
If you want some constructive analysis, it would be to stop wasting your time on trade proposals that involve Mike Vernace and Jason Wilson.
Normally Vernace and Wilson would not be substantial enough to merit consideration in discussion unless coke was being traded for Pepsi.

However, in the specific example I gave, where Edmonton was giving up 2 of its better blueline prospects, Vernace is a reasonable throw in.
Similarly, Hawks would be moving McNeil and Stalberg; Wilson is nice bottom depth replacement for that (the principal return, of course, being Dubinsky).

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07-08-2012, 06:14 PM
  #245
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Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
Why consider this unreal?
There was a post on the main board from an Edmonton guy they're looking for someone tough so their elite Fs and prized D prospect Schultz do not get roughed up. Rupp fits that to a t. They aren't likely to be crazy about about moving both Gernat and Marancin, but they are both a full 2 yrs away, and they still have Klefborn, so that side of it can work for them. Pashnin is real hit and miss, but they'd have a better shot at getting him to go there, he doesn't, apparently, want to face the competition here. Should we let Pashnin walk, or get use for him.
They complain they are thin. Boyle fits their needs, and if we get upgrade, let's make the move.

That's just one part. There was similarly discussion about Gardener, and some agreement that given their F needs, though it would be boom bust, Thomas for Gardener straight up might work. The little extra sweetener to be sure is not a back breaker, and is enough to make TML say yes.

Again, going on HFB threads, Chicago only inquired as to Dubi and his toughness, not Biron, though he's the one they really need. Dubi gets either McNeil or Olsen; Biron added delivers both.

What about these is SO OUTRAGEOUS?

I'm thinking outside the box and delivering comprehensive solutions, including snipers we urgently need, while holding on to most of our most valued assets.

Meanwhile, some of you guys pine for MZA, who is another guy who can't make the squad; unlike Thomas, he'll never be fast enough to get separation and play in NHL, let alone check properly.

We are not on the same page, my friends...
I'd prefer if you'd try to keep things to one trade at a time. Try not to go over 5 players total. Identify a goal scorer if that's what you think we need the most--say someone like Michalek, Versteeg e.g. and try not to sell off absolutely key players that we have no replacements for. For instance Girardi is our only really fine right side defenseman. Not smart to trade. Anisimov is not a good enough replacement for Stepan as 2nd line C. Consider cap figures and try to find an area the other teams might be looking for help.

Looking at the one proposal--you trade Vernace (no big loss for sure) but I suspect (I may be wrong) that you look at Vernace as 'Oh, he's got no chance at all of ever being an NHL'er so what good is he--get rid of him'. The thing is we won't have an AHL team churning out NHL caliber players if we're just playing rookies and second year players. You need veterans at that level too or those kids will get clobbered and a lot if not most will never amount to anything. There's a reason why they're there.

I'm sure Cam Talbot thanks you for trading Biron though. The thing is Torts likes giving Henrik a rest now and again. If Talbot can't hold his own Henrik doesn't get his rest.

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Old
07-08-2012, 06:14 PM
  #246
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Originally Posted by mcsauer2738 View Post
Sorry to be inappropriate but im getting hard over here at the thought of this line up...

Hagelin-Richards-Gaborik
Kreider-Stepan-Callahan
Dubi-Anisimov-Doan
Asham-Boyle-Pyatt
Rupp

McD-Girardi
Staal-Stralman
MDZ-Erixon/Bickel

Is this not the deepest lineup in the league!?!

And this still gives us plenty of space to resign our rfas next year!

http://capgeek.com/cap-calculator/roster.php?id=11888
Considering Gaborik isnt back until December, and the lineup looks a whole lot worse without him in it, no its not the deepest lineup in the league.

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Old
07-08-2012, 06:15 PM
  #247
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I am NOT criticizing you for speaking the truth.
However, it is also true that we don't know this guy's ceiling, and moving him for ANYBODY other than an uber-elite (Malkin, Stamkos) would be a huge error.
What has Kreider done to deserve such a standing? If he was a dealbreaker for Kopitar, should he not be on the table? Eriksson? Eberle? Sharp?

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Old
07-08-2012, 06:15 PM
  #248
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Originally Posted by GregSirico View Post
I've been saying this all along since the rumors broke in Feb ... if he gets moved ... it will be on Slats terms. CBJ has almost ZERO leverage. If Howson would have kept it quiet about Nash wanting out and saying something along the line of "need to improve for the better of the organization, etc" .... he definitely would have more teams knocking at his door and better offers. Knowing Nash wants out, KILLS his leverage, and when you factor in the NMC and money ... I would be shocked if he gets more than 2 roster players plus some prospects and or picks combo.
agreed, Howson has been hanging by the wire

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07-08-2012, 06:18 PM
  #249
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Originally Posted by mcsauer2738 View Post
Hagelin-Richards-Gaborik
Kreider-Stepan-Callahan
Dubi-Anisimov-Doan
Asham-Boyle-Pyatt
Rupp

McD-Girardi
Staal-Stralman
MDZ-Erixon/Bickel
This is the lineup i would prefer.

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07-08-2012, 06:19 PM
  #250
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So just to get this straight with this Nash "rumor." La Greca, who is a radio host more than an actual reporter, re-tweeted a completely unproven source claiming MDZ was being offered. Nobody legit has said anything about it, correct?

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