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Old
07-07-2012, 02:27 PM
  #251
TMI
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And Weber is arguably the best defenseman in the game. I stand by my Couture statement, with or without a contract for Weber.

Honestly, I'm tired of this nonsense about how Weber only has a year left before he hits UFA. I don't care. If a team wants to deal for him they had better accept the risk. Otherwise we'll just move right down the line to the next team interested. Trust me, there will be plenty of fish biting.

Sorry if I sound like an *******, but it's the truth. I still love you guys

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07-07-2012, 05:12 PM
  #252
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Originally Posted by ThirdManIn View Post
And Weber is arguably the best defenseman in the game. I stand by my Couture statement, with or without a contract for Weber.

Honestly, I'm tired of this nonsense about how Weber only has a year left before he hits UFA. I don't care. If a team wants to deal for him they had better accept the risk. Otherwise we'll just move right down the line to the next team interested. Trust me, there will be plenty of fish biting.

Sorry if I sound like an *******, but it's the truth. I still love you guys
Dude, your not getting Logan Couture for a rental. If your saying Logan Couture+ for Weber agreeing with an extension with the Sharks, then yeah that is reasonable.

Will you be able to trade Weber for a good rental package from a desperate team? Probably. But it ain't going to be Logan Couture or anything close to that known quality.

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07-07-2012, 05:18 PM
  #253
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I'm saying that if I were the GM and San Jose, a team who will be in direct competition with the Preds for years to come, wants Weber they had better be prepared to give. If they don't want to give up Couture then they won't be getting Weber. That's how it would work if I had any say. There are 28 other teams who will be willing to talk trade, and I'm sure at least one of them will be willing to give up something substantial. No need in Poile just taking any deal.

Forgive me if I'm skeptical of the value placed on players by HF Boards. How many people were saying Suter would get a $98m contract before July 1? No one. Yet here we are. Weber is definitely worth Couture, and probably slightly more. His contract negotiations aren't Poile's problem if he is going to be traded, so bringing that into it doesn't really make sense. At least not on this side of things.

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07-07-2012, 09:07 PM
  #254
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Originally Posted by NoNecksCurse View Post
that first deal just sucks.

one of the big 4 have to be included.
Edmonton will not back up the truck for 1 year of Weber. If he won't sign a loing term deal as part of the trade, the return will be much less than many here would like to believe.

A team like Philly might give more, as they would believe they have a chnace to sign him.

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07-07-2012, 09:26 PM
  #255
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Originally Posted by slappipappi View Post
Edmonton will not back up the truck for 1 year of Weber. If he won't sign a loing term deal as part of the trade, the return will be much less than many here would like to believe.

A team like Philly might give more, as they would believe they have a chnace to sign him.
so let me guess....

hemsky + gagner + and a 2014 1st?

oilers have nothing beyond the big 4 to even make poile think of trading him there.

if you want the best defenseman in the NHL, be ready to pony up. quantity isn't going to get it done.

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07-07-2012, 09:39 PM
  #256
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Are contract negotiations with Weber going on at the moment? He's technically an RFA, but with another year of arbitration left, right?

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07-07-2012, 10:00 PM
  #257
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Are contract negotiations with Weber going on at the moment? He's technically an RFA, but with another year of arbitration left, right?
Yes negotiations are going on. Preds already offered him a contract when they did Suter but I'm sure it could be adjusted even more upward since they don't have to pay Suter. He elected to not go to arbitration and team did arbitration last year and can't do it again. He is an RFA and can be offer sheeted but the preds have already said they'd match any offer.

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07-07-2012, 10:09 PM
  #258
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Originally Posted by slappipappi View Post
Edmonton will not back up the truck for 1 year of Weber. If he won't sign a loing term deal as part of the trade, the return will be much less than many here would like to believe.
Nobody will need to do that. He will sign here or he will name one or more places where he will sign prior to mid-September and there will be a sign-and-trade with a HUGE return. Why is this hard for people to understand the interplay between his situation and the CBA?

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07-07-2012, 10:13 PM
  #259
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I swear, if I have to say this one more time....

Shea is an RFA. Tambellini (or any other GM) can call him up right now and say "Hey, will you sign here long term?". They will know before any trade happens that Weber will sign there. It's not for "one year" of Weber, because a team can work out a deal with him before a trade ever happens. He's an RFA, not signed to a one year deal.

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07-08-2012, 10:14 AM
  #260
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Nobody will need to do that. He will sign here or he will name one or more places where he will sign prior to mid-September and there will be a sign-and-trade with a HUGE return. Why is this hard for people to understand the interplay between his situation and the CBA?
I agree. Poile is the worst GM ever if he hasn't told Weber that if he won't sign this summer, he will be traded before the season starts. Poile cannot let him walk without a return the way Suter did. It isn't fair to the team, the staff, the organization, the fans, or the city. Weber is just too valuable a player. He signs a long term contract with the Preds or he's gone with multiple pieces coming back to Nashville.

Poile gambled and lost with Suter. Can't happen again and Weber is smart enough to understand.

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07-08-2012, 11:39 AM
  #261
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I'm not going to wade throuigh 11 pages so if this has been said already I apologize.

Weber is in a bind. You have to think he wants a 13 year deal like suter got. He has to assume that those type of deals won't be available under the next cba. So he has to sign a monster deal sometime in the next two months.

If he signs it with us, great, if he won't, poile will allow his agent to work out a deal with a trade partner and we will get a huge haul.

One of those two scenarios will happen, the only question is when.

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07-08-2012, 11:44 AM
  #262
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Weber's past reluctance has been our franchise's ability to build a contender. With Suter walking and almost no moves made (other than Gill and Gaustad), I don't see any moves being made to woo Weber. His comments in past articles about if Suter wasn't here leave me thinking he will want out.

I hope I'm wrong; he's by far my favorite player to watch in the NHL.

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07-08-2012, 11:44 AM
  #263
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I was hoping the Weber thing would get resolved pretty quickly given the punch in the gut from the Suter situation. However, looks like all parties involved will take their sweet time and this will drag on all summer.

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07-08-2012, 12:40 PM
  #264
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Originally Posted by ThirdManIn View Post
I'm saying that if I were the GM and San Jose, a team who will be in direct competition with the Preds for years to come, wants Weber they had better be prepared to give. If they don't want to give up Couture then they won't be getting Weber. That's how it would work if I had any say. There are 28 other teams who will be willing to talk trade, and I'm sure at least one of them will be willing to give up something substantial. No need in Poile just taking any deal.
Forgive me if I'm skeptical of the value placed on players by HF Boards. How many people were saying Suter would get a $98m contract before July 1? No one. Yet here we are. Weber is definitely worth Couture, and probably slightly more. His contract negotiations aren't Poile's problem if he is going to be traded, so bringing that into it doesn't really make sense. At least not on this side of things.
One consideration that does hobble Poile a bit is the fact tht any team that does trade for Weber right now has no guarantee that he won't simply sign an offer-sheet with the team he wants to go to. A contender who thinks Weber is their missing link this year may be willing to trade substantial pieces to Nashville to get him, match an offer-sheet of a one-year deal just to keep him for a year, and then know they may lose him next season if he can't be re-signed and still be willing to do it, but that shrinks the market drastically.

Weber has the leverage here, not the GM, whether that be Poile or any other GM.

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Originally Posted by WartracePred View Post
I agree. Poile is the worst GM ever if he hasn't told Weber that if he won't sign this summer, he will be traded before the season starts. Poile cannot let him walk without a return the way Suter did. It isn't fair to the team, the staff, the organization, the fans, or the city. Weber is just too valuable a player. He signs a long term contract with the Preds or he's gone with multiple pieces coming back to Nashville.

Poile gambled and lost with Suter. Can't happen again and Weber is smart enough to understand.
I agree, and that's why the scenario of Weber signing a one-year offer-sheet is scary. Preds don't get any of their two workable scenarios. Either lose Weber for draft picks (and it would have to be more than $8.4M to get the full 4 1st-picks) or keep him for a year-rental and lose him for nothing next season since he can't be traded.

No basis to say this other than belief, but I kind of think (if Weber wants to leave) he hasn't signed such a deal because he knows it would screw the Preds and if he leaves, he wants to do it in way that the Preds get something fair back and he won't cut out Poile's knees in the negotiation process.

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Originally Posted by PredsV82 View Post
I'm not going to wade throuigh 11 pages so if this has been said already I apologize.

Weber is in a bind. You have to think he wants a 13 year deal like suter got. He has to assume that those type of deals won't be available under the next cba. So he has to sign a monster deal sometime in the next two months.

If he signs it with us, great, if he won't, poile will allow his agent to work out a deal with a trade partner and we will get a huge haul.

One of those two scenarios will happen, the only question is when.
All true, and this is Poile's counter to any scenario of a one-year offersheet to Weber.

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Originally Posted by Stranger View Post
Weber's past reluctance has been our franchise's ability to build a contender. With Suter walking and almost no moves made (other than Gill and Gaustad), I don't see any moves being made to woo Weber. His comments in past articles about if Suter wasn't here leave me thinking he will want out.

I hope I'm wrong; he's by far my favorite player to watch in the NHL.
My theory on this if it drags out any longer is that Weber seems to want to leave (otherwise why wouldn't he have signed by now?), Poile is trying to work out a deal with the team Weber wants to go to, but that team and Nashville just make poor trading partners. This could lead to a three-way which may be why things are taking so long.

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07-08-2012, 03:11 PM
  #265
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My theory on this if it drags out any longer is that Weber seems to want to leave (otherwise why wouldn't he have signed by now?), Poile is trying to work out a deal with the team Weber wants to go to, but that team and Nashville just make poor trading partners. This could lead to a three-way which may be why things are taking so long.
I don't think it's taking long at all yet. Everyone knew Weber wasn't going to make a decision until after Suter made his decision and that was all of 4 days ago I'd imagine right now Weber is still processing the news and contemplating whether he wants to stay or not. I know this for a fact: Weber loves Nashville but as he has said in the media in no uncertain terms he also wants to win. His upcoming decision will be the biggest he will have to make in his career likely. I expect he isn't going to rush it.

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07-08-2012, 03:47 PM
  #266
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I don't think it's taking long at all yet. Everyone knew Weber wasn't going to make a decision until after Suter made his decision and that was all of 4 days ago I'd imagine right now Weber is still processing the news and contemplating whether he wants to stay or not. I know this for a fact: Weber loves Nashville but as he has said in the media in no uncertain terms he also wants to win. His upcoming decision will be the biggest he will have to make in his career likely. I expect he isn't going to rush it.
This. Weber knows the money he can get (think Suter +5%) whether from us or someone else.

It entirely possible that Weber is giving Poile time to land some other pieces that will convince him to stay here.

Its also possible that Poile is holding an auction and will announce a trade once he's determined the best offer.

But the likelihood that Weber will entertain an offer sheet for anything less than a Suter sized deal is about zero....

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07-08-2012, 04:33 PM
  #267
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Weber's value will be sky high for the next couple months. Panicking 4 days after Suter signed and 7 days into free agency is a little premature. While I agree that we should just bite the bullet and trade him if he won't sign an extension, that's a lengthy process that will take awhile to pull off more than likely, trade or extension. Weber is clearly already debating whether he wants to stay here or not, and as someone mentioned above he may just be allowing chips to fall into place and see what our team looks like in a month. We can give it another 6 weeks easily before we feel we may need to give a real hard look at trading Weber. Unless of course he does us the courtesy of saying he won't sign long-term.

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07-08-2012, 04:39 PM
  #268
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Weber's value will be sky high for the next couple months. Panicking 4 days after Suter signed and 7 days into free agency is a little premature. While I agree that we should just bite the bullet and trade him if he won't sign an extension, that's a lengthy process that will take awhile to pull off more than likely, trade or extension. Weber is clearly already debating whether he wants to stay here or not, and as someone mentioned above he may just be allowing chips to fall into place and see what our team looks like in a month. We can give it another 6 weeks easily before we feel we may need to give a real hard look at trading Weber. Unless of course he does us the courtesy of saying he won't sign long-term.
If it drags on to six weeks, I think Poile needs to slap on a deadline. Weber, presumably, has a huge offer sitting in front of him, one that says we want him to stay. He's smart enough to know that the franchise's hands are somewhat tied while we wait for his decision. If he's not fully committed in a month and a half, Poile needs to step up and say that he's got one more week to let us know until he starts picking up the phone. September will be here before we know it.

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07-08-2012, 04:43 PM
  #269
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If it drags on to six weeks, I think Poile needs to slap on a deadline. Weber, presumably, has a huge offer sitting in front of him, one that says we want him to stay. He's smart enough to know that the franchise's hands are somewhat tied while we wait for his decision. If he's not fully committed in a month and a half, Poile needs to step up and say that he's got one more week to let us know until he starts picking up the phone. September will be here before we know it.
Yeah I know it shouldn't take that long for him to decide I'm just saying that we should be in no need to rush. I'm sure he does know what the offer is and he could just be waiting awhile to see what kind of moves we make. I doubt Weber or Poile are in too much of a hurry as of today. Slow and steady wins the race. Or however that phrase goes.

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07-08-2012, 07:03 PM
  #270
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Couts is a good option. I think trading for a young stud forward is the best route right now. But it's also worth considering a trade for a stud young defenseman to replace him, plus other pieces. Think McDonagh+, OEL+, Adam Larsson+, etc.

Like I said, I think getting a true top line forward is our best option, but the other track deserves consideration.

My dream deal would be McD/Staal/Girardi+Krieder/Stepan
We on the Ranger board were hypothetically discussing staal ++ for weber. Not sure CK or Steps too though

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07-08-2012, 08:14 PM
  #271
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We on the Ranger board were hypothetically discussing staal ++ for weber. Not sure CK or Steps too though
we would need a top 4 defenseman and a top 6 forward. then picks and prospects.

i don't see how weber would be traded to new york with out giradi/staal + kreider/stepan

as ive said, quantity doesn't mean quality. you guys have the pieces to acquire weber. its just a matter of if yall want to part with them. and get rid of some guys that helped yall have an impressive season last year.

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07-08-2012, 10:17 PM
  #272
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we would need a top 4 defenseman and a top 6 forward. then picks and prospects.

i don't see how weber would be traded to new york with out giradi/staal + kreider/stepan

as ive said, quantity doesn't mean quality. you guys have the pieces to acquire weber. its just a matter of if yall want to part with them. and get rid of some guys that helped yall have an impressive season last year.
You will get Staal in a deal, but Stepan/Krieder is pretty much out of the question. Stepan is a reach only if Nashville is willing to send back a 2nd line center in return.

A deal would probably look something like this:

Staal, Haglein(right now a 3rd liner but Extremely likely 2nd line ceiling)/ 1 or 2 prospects/ 1 or 2 picks. That is about as good as your going to get from the Rangers and that aint too shabby.

The situation is whether or not you want a top 6 forward or a top 2 Dman more. If you want the forwards, then your probably doing business with the Flyers. If you want a Dman more, your better doing biz with the Rangers.

Vancouver will probably try to swap Edler with you guys to see if he will sign a long term extension with Nashville. But who knows how that will turn out. Staal is signed up for three more years.

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07-08-2012, 10:25 PM
  #273
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You will get Staal in a deal, but Stepan/Krieder is pretty much out of the question. Stepan is a reach only if Nashville is willing to send back a 2nd line center in return.

A deal would probably look something like this:

Staal, Haglein(right now a 3rd liner but Extremely likely 2nd line ceiling)/ 1 or 2 prospects/ 1 or 2 picks. That is about as good as your going to get from the Rangers and that aint too shabby.

The situation is whether or not you want a top 6 forward or a top 2 Dman more. If you want the forwards, then your probably doing business with the Flyers. If you want a Dman more, your better doing biz with the Rangers.

Vancouver will probably try to swap Edler with you guys to see if he will sign a long term extension with Nashville. But who knows how that will turn out. Staal is signed up for three more years.
you're correct and I suspect with our defensive prospects looking to blossom in the next couple of years, I think we go looking for the elite forward and take a serviceable d-man rather than the other way around.

if Philly will part with Couturier, I don't think there will be anyone else in the running...

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07-08-2012, 10:29 PM
  #274
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you're correct and I suspect with our defensive prospects looking to blossom in the next couple of years, I think we go looking for the elite forward and take a serviceable d-man rather than the other way around.

if Philly will part with Couturier, I don't think there will be anyone else in the running...
The only problem with Couturier is your essentially paying for pedigree and potential. Staal is a known commodity. But, I agree, if you want forwards Flyers are the way to go.

The Rangers may also offer Dubinsky as well, but that is pretty much salary dump reasons. Still if he rebounds, that is a 50 pt player that plays both sides of the ice and can play center or wing.

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07-08-2012, 10:50 PM
  #275
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The only problem with Couturier is your essentially paying for pedigree and potential. Staal is a known commodity. But, I agree, if you want forwards Flyers are the way to go.

The Rangers may also offer Dubinsky as well, but that is pretty much salary dump reasons. Still if he rebounds, that is a 50 pt player that plays both sides of the ice and can play center or wing.
Poile wanted Cooter and was prepared to trade Ryan Ellis for the right to draft him. He can eventually be that #1C we have needed so badly. If I had to bet right now, i would say that's who poile would get if he's forced to trade Weber.

some folks think we could get Cooter and Coburn plus one or two more players from PHI... would be hard to match that

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