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Roberto Luongo XXII - Quantam of SoLuuuuuce [Mod Warning post 540]

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Old
07-09-2012, 12:40 PM
  #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mapes View Post
I think atleast one of Kadri or JVR works out there. Having the same problem between the pipes as last year is stupid too. The reason we collapsed last year, IMO, was having 2 inexperienced goalies between the pipes.
So 1 of Kadri who has looked terrible at center in the NHL or JVR who hasn't played center since minor hockey?

Thankfully I'm pretty sure Burke feels much differently than you do.

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07-09-2012, 12:40 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Cyris View Post
Reimer and Scrivens are a hell of alot more proven as starting goaltenders than JVR is as a center.

Why trade for a goalie at all? Why not just go into next season with Dion as our starter? Sure that would create a hole in our D but I'm sure Reimer can fill it.
Not really. Scrivens has played how many games? JVR has proven to be good as a winger in the NHL and has played center in juniors.

What? Dumbest arguement Ive heard. You do know they are trying JVR at center right? Never heard Dion would be our goalie though.

You're acting like going from a winger to center is HUUUUGE. Comparing it to a D going between the pipes?

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07-09-2012, 12:43 PM
  #78
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Reimer
McCarthur
2013 1st
(must take) Komisarek

gets it done! If Canucks fans wouldn't so this you ppl are lost!!

Gives you a great b/u goalie, a 2nd/3rd line winger who is good for 20 goals and brings grit, a respectable btm pairing D-man who can block shots and use a change of scenary (contract only 2 years left) and a 1st rd pick to pay the premium to win the sweepstakes or a much needed asset.

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07-09-2012, 12:45 PM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calacatz View Post
Reimer
McCarthur
2013 1st
(must take) Komisarek

gets it done! If Canucks fans wouldn't so this you ppl are lost!!

Gives you a great b/u goalie, a 2nd/3rd line winger who is good for 20 goals and brings grit, a respectable btm pairing D-man who can block shots and use a change of scenary (contract only 2 years left) and a 1st rd pick to pay the premium to win the sweepstakes or a much needed asset.
canucks would rather have lack than reimer backing up. whos the respectable dman in this deal?

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07-09-2012, 12:45 PM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calacatz View Post
Reimer
McCarthur
2013 1st
(must take) Komisarek

gets it done! If Canucks fans wouldn't so this you ppl are lost!!
I guess every single one of us are.

Including Mike Gillis.

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07-09-2012, 12:46 PM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calacatz View Post
Reimer
McCarthur
2013 1st
(must take) Komisarek

gets it done! If Canucks fans wouldn't so this you ppl are lost!!

Gives you a great b/u goalie, a 2nd/3rd line winger who is good for 20 goals and brings grit, a respectable btm pairing D-man who can block shots and use a change of scenary (contract only 2 years left) and a 1st rd pick to pay the premium to win the sweepstakes or a much needed asset.
It's been stated ad nauseum from (most) Leafs fans and Canucks fans that Komisarek is a non-starter.

If we're taking a cap dump back Florida has better options than Toronto.

And I'd rather roll with Lack as a back up than Reimer. Lack has size and decent athletic ability. Reimer is not an athletic goalie, and while he has some okay numbers, Lack has more upside. Not trying to **** on Optimis Reim, but Vancouver is stocked with good goalie prospects.

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07-09-2012, 12:50 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calacatz View Post
Reimer
McCarthur
2013 1st
(must take) Komisarek

gets it done! If Canucks fans wouldn't so this you ppl are lost!!

Gives you a great b/u goalie, a 2nd/3rd line winger who is good for 20 goals and brings grit, a respectable btm pairing D-man who can block shots and use a change of scenary (contract only 2 years left) and a 1st rd pick to pay the premium to win the sweepstakes or a much needed asset.
Wow, it's like you know nothing that the Canucks need.
We don't need a young goalie, we don't need a 2nd/3rd line tweener (we have three of those already), we don't need a 7th/8th d-man making $4.5 mil per year.

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Old
07-09-2012, 12:52 PM
  #83
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Not really. Scrivens has played how many games? JVR has proven to be good as a winger in the NHL and has played center in juniors.

What? Dumbest arguement Ive heard. You do know they are trying JVR at center right? Never heard Dion would be our goalie though.

You're acting like going from a winger to center is HUUUUGE. Comparing it to a D going between the pipes?
Despite the rumor on the Leafs board JVR was a winger in college(never played junior) and drafted as a winger. He last played center in minor hockey.

I know we are trying JVR at center. It is an experiment that isnt likely to work out but there is no risk so why not. Trading our only legit top 6 forward before we see how the experiment works is stupid and wont happen.

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07-09-2012, 12:54 PM
  #84
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can't blame a guy for trying lol.....

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Old
07-09-2012, 12:57 PM
  #85
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Fransen, Kulemin & 2013 1st should be a more then fair package...

I am curious what Gillis ACTUAL ask was on draft day which Burke's been alluding to as "im not gonna trade 15 1st rounders for a goalie"

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07-09-2012, 01:00 PM
  #86
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I feel that Chicago will get Luongo.

Here'S the offer


Salak
Dylan Olsen
N. Hjalmarsson
Phillip Danault

for

Luongo
3rd 2013


The thing is I know Luongo is eager to go back to Florida but the question is does Panther need him ??



Here's a possible offer that Panther would make for Luongo

Versteeg
Theodore
Colby Robak
Corban Knight

for

Luongo


Last edited by TheNudge: 07-09-2012 at 01:08 PM.
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Old
07-09-2012, 01:03 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Cyris View Post
So 1 of Kadri who has looked terrible at center in the NHL or JVR who hasn't played center since minor hockey?

Thankfully I'm pretty sure Burke feels much differently than you do.
Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't he play LW in the NHL last season? He looked very good at center in the AHL.

So you would rather go into next season with the same problem as last season? Goaltending is the thing that wins or loses you games. Mind you, Reimer might work out he did look good as a rookie but I dont know if I'd be confident with 2 inexperienced guys like that again. A top 6 of Lupul - JVR - Kessel, Kulemin - Kadri - Cmac with Luongo between the pipes is most likely a playoff team.

EDIT: I think you're also forgetting Connolly. Sure he struggled last year but he had 65 points in 73 games just a couple years ago and the season before that had 47 points in 48 games.


Last edited by mapes: 07-09-2012 at 01:15 PM.
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07-09-2012, 01:04 PM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNudge View Post
I feel that Chicago will get Luongo.

Here'S the offer


Salak
Dylan Olsen
N. Hjalmarsson
Phillip Danault

for

Luongo
3rd 2013
Not even close.
If Chicago wants Luongo, they'll have to part with a very good player. It's been stated a million times already, since they're a rival and in the same conference.

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Old
07-09-2012, 01:05 PM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calacatz View Post
Fransen, Kulemin & 2013 1st should be a more then fair package...

I am curious what Gillis ACTUAL ask was on draft day which Burke's been alluding to as "im not gonna trade 15 1st rounders for a goalie"
I'm in for that. Notch one for "come back proposals'.

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07-09-2012, 01:05 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calacatz View Post
Fransen, Kulemin & 2013 1st should be a more then fair package...

I am curious what Gillis ask was on draft day which Burke's been alluding to as "im not gonna trade 15 1st rounders for a golaie"
Honestly, Burke needs to play a bit of a risk with acquiring Luongo to save his job. It's absolutely unacceptable for the biggest hockey market to flounder so spectacularly in his tenure there, never drafting out of the top 10.

Burke needs to re evaluate his stance on albatross contracts as its becoming the standard for high end talent to sign long term, front loaded (unless this changes in the new CBA) deals. Standard 2-5 year contracts will not net Toronto the star goalie or star centre the Leafs desperately need. Expect Kessel to want a lifetime deal if he intends to stay in TDot, and Burke would be a damn fool not to give it to him.

Luongo is in for 10 years. That's 10 years of upper tier net minding that Toronto won't have to worry about. It allows them to focus on acquiring a true 1C with our having to hand out ridiculous goalie offers to UFAs. While any bonafide blue choppers (Reilly, kadri to an extent) are a bit rich to expect, trading Lupul when you have JvR now would not be amiss. It's a pretty cut and dry hockey trade, both sides get what they need and loops is one year away from UFA and honestly, he isnt a star power like Kessel so Carlyle will expect him to up his defensive game or be banished to the dog house.

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Old
07-09-2012, 01:09 PM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calacatz View Post
Fransen, Kulemin & 2013 1st should be a more then fair package...

I am curious what Gillis ACTUAL ask was on draft day which Burke's been alluding to as "im not gonna trade 15 1st rounders for a goalie"
The value might be there but I doubt Burke does that. Giving up another first would make me nervous and Kulemin is the best defensive forward we have. We really need to keep Kulemin in a bad way.

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07-09-2012, 01:11 PM
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calacatz View Post
Fransen, Kulemin & 2013 1st should be a more then fair package...

I am curious what Gillis ask was on draft day which Burke's been alluding to as "im not gonna trade 15 1st rounders for a golaie"
If Gillis gets offered that he should take it. They're both RFA but Vancouver has plenty of cap space to make it work if Luo is leaving town.

Franson might still have complaints about not getting a large enough role because Vancouver would have plenty of D. Hamhuis, Garrison, Ballard, Bieksa, Edler, Tanev, Alberts & Franson? Gives them 8 quality guys with some decent call up options.

Kulemin would be a reclamation project of sorts after struggling last season but I could see him having success in their system. Raymond just resigned for a year, so maybe he doesn't get traded, but I think it would make sense to ship him out to make room. Jensen probably wont make the squad, but Kassian likely competes for a larger role. Too many wingers battling for those 2/3 line roles IMO. Maybe they could even send him the other way along with Luongo.

They're getting two solid roster players back in the trade and also a 1st, which I think is crucial to replenishing their prospect pool which is relatively shallow right now.

My read of the trade is a good deal for Vancouver. Question is, does Toronto pull the trigger on the deal? They certainly could afford to ship out a D, and Kulemin is an important but not critical part. They've been burned on shipping out 1st rounders recently. Is getting an elite goaltender in return justification for trading away another?

I think the value is pretty fair but know more about the Canucks than the Leafs so tough to understand their needs.

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Old
07-09-2012, 01:14 PM
  #93
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Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't he play LW in the NHL last season? He looked very good at center in the AHL.

So you would rather go into next season with the same problem as last season? Goaltending is the thing that wins or loses you games. Mind you, Reimer might work out he did look good as a rookie but I dont know if I'd be confident with 2 inexperienced guys like that again. A top 6 of Lupul - JVR - Kessel, Kulemin - Kadri - Cmac with Luongo between the pipes is most likely a playoff team.
Are you sure he played center in the AHL? You were wrong about him playing center in college.
Here is an interview from after he was drafted where JVR himself says he hasnt played center since peewee hockey:

HF: You played center at the Flyers Development Camp while you used to play as a winger?
JVR: I haven’t played center for a really long time. That was indeed the first time since I was a peewee. It needed some adjustments to get used to.


http://www.hockeysfuture.com/article...s_vanriemsdyk/

There are other trades to be made besides trading Grabo. It has to be a deal that works for both sides and trading Grabo doesn't work for us.
There was a general consensus last night about Kule, Kadri and a 2nd.

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07-09-2012, 01:14 PM
  #94
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There...

We only have one more after this. We are in trouble.
There is always "Never say never again" - an independent release version of Thunderball.

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07-09-2012, 01:16 PM
  #95
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I would do franson and Kulemin

We have frattin ready to replace Kulemin

Franson is redundant IMO

1st is a tough one but ehhhh I'm sure we can make it a bad pick

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07-09-2012, 01:18 PM
  #96
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There is always "Never say never again" - an independent release version of Thunderball.
And the currently unnamed Bond 24 they are starting work on now. They could also do Casino Royal again a there are 2 of those films.

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07-09-2012, 01:19 PM
  #97
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The value might be there but I doubt Burke does that. Giving up another first would make me nervous and Kulemin is the best defensive forward we have. We really need to keep Kulemin in a bad way.
Best defensive forward? Interesting. I suppose my comment about him struggling last year isn't fair.

Kulemin with Kesler on paper sounds like a good combination. Would be a good shut-down line that can contribute plenty of offense.

Though if he's that valuable, Vancouver has to sweeten the pot then. What would you want coming back?

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07-09-2012, 01:20 PM
  #98
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The value might be there but I doubt Burke does that. Giving up another first would make me nervous and Kulemin is the best defensive forward we have. We really need to keep Kulemin in a bad way.
I would hate to lose these assets too and Fransen with that shot can be a great btm pair for canucks too but I am willing to pay for what would be a much needed premium return as well...

Carlyle will have the team playing better defensively overall and with solid goaltending and the abilty to score.. we should be in the playoffs again FINALLY!

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07-09-2012, 01:20 PM
  #99
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The value might be there but I doubt Burke does that. Giving up another first would make me nervous and Kulemin is the best defensive forward we have. We really need to keep Kulemin in a bad way.
Grabo>>>>>Kule

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07-09-2012, 01:21 PM
  #100
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Are you sure he played center in the AHL? You were wrong about him playing center in (college).
Here is an interview from after he was drafted where JVR himself says he hasnt played center since peewee hockey:

HF: You played center at the Flyers Development Camp while you used to play as a winger?
JVR: I haven’t played center for a really long time. That was indeed the first time since I was a peewee. It needed some adjustments to get used to.


http://www.hockeysfuture.com/article...s_vanriemsdyk/

There are other trades to be made besides trading Grabo. It has to be a deal that works for both sides and trading Grabo doesn't work for us.
There was a general consensus last night about Kule, Kadri and a 2nd.
No, sorry, I was talking about Kadri.


Kulemin, Kadri and a 2nd? Eh, honestly Im not big on that. Kulemin is our best defensive forward who has good offensive upside (as we saw in 2010-2011), Kadri our top prospect and one of our top picks? I'm not big on dealing either Kulemin or Kadri, I think both have good upside. Kadri is so good in shootouts, too, which is important to have. Meh, I suppose it's up to Burke, I just don't like the thoughts of a Lupul - Bozak - Kessel top line and JVR - Grabo - Cmac 2nd line.

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