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Philadelphia Phillies (MLB): 2012 Regular Season (Utter-Lee Hopeless Part 2)

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07-09-2012, 10:20 AM
  #126
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Originally Posted by sobrien View Post
Screw that, tell them "No Olt + Profar? Ok, the Angels are the next phone call..." *click*
as a Rangers fan I can say they dont need Cole *that* badly to part with those two. So go ahead and give the Angels a call, they dont have much to offer either

however, who knows what will happen.

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07-09-2012, 10:35 AM
  #127
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Originally Posted by Sh0otnSc0re View Post
Tell them to kick rocks, Profar, Olt +. The price is apparently 4-5 top tier prospects. No Olt + Profar, good bye.
The ASKING price is 4-5 top tier prospects. Amaro probably knows very well that he's not going to get that. If you remember the trade negotiations for guys like Halladay, Pence, and Lee, the other teams were supposedly asking for the moon, and ended up getting much less. It's now negotiating works.

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07-09-2012, 10:45 AM
  #128
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Originally Posted by BillyShoe1721 View Post
The ASKING price is 4-5 top tier prospects. Amaro probably knows very well that he's not going to get that. If you remember the trade negotiations for guys like Halladay, Pence, and Lee, the other teams were supposedly asking for the moon, and ended up getting much less. It's now negotiating works.
The Lee deal they basically gave up nothing, the Halladay deal they gave up alot. But Halladay was under contract for another season. But you can get alot for these rentals if you find the right GM that is desperate enough.

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07-09-2012, 11:06 AM
  #129
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I just think expecting to get the some other teams 4/5 top prospects for 2 months of Cole when they arent going to get draft picks is going to be hard to come by.
That's why I think they should resign Cole, and move Lee and Halladay next year. They can still get good young players without trading Cole. Maybe they could get a solid middle reliever for Victorino, or just wait and get whatever draft picks.

You might be able to get something for Blanton. Nothing good, but something.

Trading Ruiz now would make perfect sense, but I don't see them doing it due to the public outcry that it would cause.

Pence has gotten his numbers back up, and is controlled through next year so he might be an option to trade. Although, they may want to keep him since he isn't really old yet.

You could probably get something for Pierre, but I think I'd bring him back next year, unless he wants to try for another serious contract before he retires.

I still think Howard's contract is moveable if he can still hit 35+ HR's, and they eat some of the money.

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07-09-2012, 11:41 AM
  #130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chinatown81592 View Post
Mike Trout?
I'd love that.

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Originally Posted by Justified View Post
I just think expecting to get the some other teams 4/5 top prospects for 2 months of Cole when they arent going to get draft picks is going to be hard to come by.
I don't see a point to deal Cole then, just keep him and resign him. He obviously seems as if he wants to.

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Originally Posted by BillyShoe1721 View Post
The ASKING price is 4-5 top tier prospects. Amaro probably knows very well that he's not going to get that. If you remember the trade negotiations for guys like Halladay, Pence, and Lee, the other teams were supposedly asking for the moon, and ended up getting much less. It's now negotiating works.

Again, I don't move him for at LEAST Olt involved. AT least, he is a must.


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Originally Posted by Justified View Post
The Lee deal they basically gave up nothing, the Halladay deal they gave up alot. But Halladay was under contract for another season. But you can get alot for these rentals if you find the right GM that is desperate enough.
It really comes down to market and who is being offered, like I said I want at least one of Olt/Profar. Obviously, I'd rather Olt + Profar. But if neither name is mentioned, then I'll keep Cole.

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Originally Posted by Protest View Post
That's why I think they should resign Cole, and move Lee and Halladay next year. They can still get good young players without trading Cole. Maybe they could get a solid middle reliever for Victorino, or just wait and get whatever draft picks.

You might be able to get something for Blanton. Nothing good, but something.

Trading Ruiz now would make perfect sense, but I don't see them doing it due to the public outcry that it would cause.

Pence has gotten his numbers back up, and is controlled through next year so he might be an option to trade. Although, they may want to keep him since he isn't really old yet.

You could probably get something for Pierre, but I think I'd bring him back next year, unless he wants to try for another serious contract before he retires.

I still think Howard's contract is moveable if he can still hit 35+ HR's, and they eat some of the money.

Lee - I don't see him moving.
Halladay - I don't see him moving unless he asks to be dealt.
Hamels - Keep.
Blanton - Who's going to want that, unless we're eating this season of it?

Victorino - I'd move him, last I heard Yanks/Giants were interested.
Pence - I think they keep him.
Ruiz - I don't see how they could rationalize moving him unless the deal was a steal.
Pierre - Reds were/are interested[not sure if they actually are anymore].
Howard - I think it's wishful thinking that they'd move / be able to move him. I think that's one contract we're stuck with.

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07-09-2012, 12:05 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by Protest View Post
That's why I think they should resign Cole, and move Lee and Halladay next year. They can still get good young players without trading Cole. Maybe they could get a solid middle reliever for Victorino, or just wait and get whatever draft picks.

You might be able to get something for Blanton. Nothing good, but something.

Trading Ruiz now would make perfect sense, but I don't see them doing it due to the public outcry that it would cause.

Pence has gotten his numbers back up, and is controlled through next year so he might be an option to trade. Although, they may want to keep him since he isn't really old yet.

You could probably get something for Pierre, but I think I'd bring him back next year, unless he wants to try for another serious contract before he retires.

I still think Howard's contract is moveable if he can still hit 35+ HR's, and they eat some of the money.
Im not sure of Doc's and Lee's contract in which they might be have some type of movement clause. That being said, I think it would be hard to trade Doc now because he is coming off an injury. In order to move Lee Im assuming they would have to take on some of his money. That is why I trade Cole and see if he resigns here in the offseason. He seems like he wants to hit free agency.

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Old
07-09-2012, 12:24 PM
  #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sh0otnSc0re View Post
Lee - I don't see him moving.
Halladay - I don't see him moving unless he asks to be dealt.
Hamels - Keep.
Blanton - Who's going to want that, unless we're eating this season of it?

Victorino - I'd move him, last I heard Yanks/Giants were interested.
Pence - I think they keep him.
Ruiz - I don't see how they could rationalize moving him unless the deal was a steal.
Pierre - Reds were/are interested[not sure if they actually are anymore].
Howard - I think it's wishful thinking that they'd move / be able to move him. I think that's one contract we're stuck with.
I think Halladay would be ok moving to a contender if we're struggling again next year, same with Lee. I don't see them trading Ruiz, but it makes sense because of his career year. Kind of like Pence last year with the Astros.

If Howard regains some form he could be moveable. If you look at the contracts Fielder and Pujols got, his doesn't seem as atrocious as before, and it shows teams are willing to spend that kind of money for power hitters. He also would make sense for an AL club.

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Im not sure of Doc's and Lee's contract in which they might be have some type of movement clause. That being said, I think it would be hard to trade Doc now because he is coming off an injury. In order to move Lee Im assuming they would have to take on some of his money. That is why I trade Cole and see if he resigns here in the offseason. He seems like he wants to hit free agency.
I meant next year for Lee/Halladay.

I'm not sure about there contracts either, but if they're pitching well, and the team still isn't winning then I think they'd be willing to move to a contender.

They would probably have to take some of Lee's money, but depending on the team it may not be a ton.

I think if Cole is traded he won't resign here.

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07-09-2012, 12:30 PM
  #133
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The players you move in order to replenish the system are Hamels, Pence, Victorino, and Pierre. I agree with selling high on Ruiz, too, as much as it would suck to see him leave. Halladay would be a great piece to trade if he were healthy, but he's not. Guys like Lee, Utley, Howard, Papelbon, the Phillies are stuck with them.

I'm shocked by how little a fan I am of Pence. I was really excited to get him last year but have come to the conclusion that he isn't someone I want on this team long-term. His low baseball IQ is probably what drives me the most crazy. It wouldn't look good to trade him a year later, but I'd do it if the right deal came along. Go see if the Pirates are interested in being buyers -- their farm system is all kinds of deep.

Also, those of you demanding Profar back for Hamels... keep dreaming. That wouldn't happen even if Hamels agreed to sign an extension with the Rangers. Olt would be the centerpiece in such a deal, and that's perfectly fine. Personally, I think we should get Texas and Boston into a bidding war. I'd love to get some combination of Xander Bogaerts, Matt Barnes, and Jackie Bradley (who the Phillies had a chance to draft at #39 last year but took Larry Greene instead; Bradley went next at #40) from the Red Sox.

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07-09-2012, 12:30 PM
  #134
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Originally Posted by chinatown81592 View Post
Mike Trout?
That's what I'd shoot for

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Originally Posted by Mkoll View Post
as a Rangers fan I can say they dont need Cole *that* badly to part with those two. So go ahead and give the Angels a call, they dont have much to offer either

however, who knows what will happen.
They have that Trout guy Sucks he turned into their savior this season, so I'm positive his value is at a biblical level. But I'd have no problem adding to Cole to land Mike Trout. Hamels + Victorino + cash +conditional pick (if Hamels doesn't re-sign) for Trout and a couple longshot prospects?

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Old
07-09-2012, 12:33 PM
  #135
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That's what I'd shoot for

They have that Trout guy Sucks he turned into their savior this season, so I'm positive his value is at a biblical level. But I'd have no problem adding to Cole to land Mike Trout. Hamels + Victorino + cash +conditional pick (if Hamels doesn't re-sign) for Trout and a couple longshot prospects?
Do baseball trades really work that way, though?

I mean, if they did, wouldn't it make more sense to send them Hamels + Brown for Trout + lesser prospects--giving them a lesser but still talented OF prospect, and the Phillies get a (nearly) local superstar-in-the-making?

My understanding was that baseball trades are almost always (non-MLB) prospects in bunches for established players. I would imagine there's nothing on the Phillies roster that would return Trout, right?

I'm in Bryce Harper land down here, and I literally cannot fathom any deal in which the Nats would move that kid. From what I've read, Trout is similarly regarded, no?

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07-09-2012, 12:35 PM
  #136
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I think Trout is better than Harper. He won't be moved.

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07-09-2012, 12:41 PM
  #137
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That's what I'd shoot for



They have that Trout guy Sucks he turned into their savior this season, so I'm positive his value is at a biblical level. But I'd have no problem adding to Cole to land Mike Trout. Hamels + Victorino + cash +conditional pick (if Hamels doesn't re-sign) for Trout and a couple longshot prospects?


Oh, man. If you were the Angels GM, would you trade a 21-year old superstar/MVP-in-the-making for anything? Right, didn't think so. Asking for Mike Trout if you're Amaro not only gets you laughed off the phone, it makes you look like a delusional idiot.

Come on, people don't really think Trout would be available for Hamels, do they? If so, you simply have no idea what you're talking about.

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07-09-2012, 01:02 PM
  #138
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Wait you guys were really serious about trading for Trout??? He's as untouchable as anyone in the league.

BTW you can't trade picks in baseball.

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07-09-2012, 01:16 PM
  #139
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Lol that's why I had the sarcasm emoticon after that. Trout is probably the most untouchable player in the league atm considering he's pretty much a 5 tool player.
Not sure who else is worth it in the Angels farm system. I think Texas is probably the best trading partner if they're willing to give up the pieces.
Am I the only one who was lucky enough to pick Trout off waivers in their fantasy league?


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07-09-2012, 01:25 PM
  #140
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Oh, man. If you were the Angels GM, would you trade a 21-year old superstar/MVP-in-the-making for anything? Right, didn't think so. Asking for Mike Trout if you're Amaro not only gets you laughed off the phone, it makes you look like a delusional idiot.

Come on, people don't really think Trout would be available for Hamels, do they? If so, you simply have no idea what you're talking about.

If I was Angels GM? Why would I look at it from their POV!?

You may be right, but Amaro isn't doing his job if the first name he asked about isn't Trout. Whether he's untouchable or not, you have to ask. Like I said, it sucks for us that he's their team MVP this season, because he struggled mightily last year during his call up...he might have been trade-able then.

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07-09-2012, 01:26 PM
  #141
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Lol that's why I had the sarcasm emoticon after that. Trout is probably the most untouchable player in the league atm considering he's pretty much a 5 tool player.
Not sure who else is worth it in the Angels farm system. I think Texas is probably the best trading partner if they're willing to give up the pieces.
Am I the only one who was lucky enough to pick Trout off waivers in their fantasy league?
No i did as well...someone dropped him

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07-09-2012, 01:28 PM
  #142
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Mike Olt, Leonys Martin, and a pitching prospect (preferably Cody Buckel) for Hamels and Victorino is a trade I'd make. I just get the feeling the Rangers will tell Amaro he can only have one of Olt or Martin, not both.

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07-09-2012, 01:31 PM
  #143
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Mike Olt, Leonys Martin, and a pitching prospect (preferably Cody Buckel) for Hamels and Victorino is a trade I'd make. I just get the feeling the Rangers will tell Amaro he can only have one of Olt or Martin, not both.
"But I'm also giving you Victorino. SHANE VICTORINO!! He won a gold glove once or twice, all-star, world champion. Plus he does a lot of commercials and mic'd up segments"

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07-09-2012, 01:36 PM
  #144
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If I was Angels GM? Why would I look at it from their POV!?

You may be right, but Amaro isn't doing his job if the first name he asked about isn't Trout. Whether he's untouchable or not, you have to ask. Like I said, it sucks for us that he's their team MVP this season, because he struggled mightily last year during his call up...he might have been trade-able then.
Why would you look at it from the Angels's POV? Because then you might get a sense of appropriate trade value.

And no, even with Trout's struggles after getting called up last year (he'd also just turned 20, mind you), at no point was he ever "trade-able." He's been a top five prospect since 2010 and universally viewed as a surefire franchise player. Those guys don't get dealt. It sucks, too, because he's a local boy.

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07-09-2012, 02:00 PM
  #145
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Oh, man. If you were the Angels GM, would you trade a 21-year old superstar/MVP-in-the-making for anything? Right, didn't think so. Asking for Mike Trout if you're Amaro not only gets you laughed off the phone, it makes you look like a delusional idiot.

Come on, people don't really think Trout would be available for Hamels, do they? If so, you simply have no idea what you're talking about.
Too bad Reagins still isnt in charge, he traded Napoli for Vernon Wells .

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07-09-2012, 02:07 PM
  #146
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I don't like the idea of trading a franchise player, and not returning a franchise player. I'd rather sign Hamels.

If they can't sign him before the deadline, they''ll have to trade him, and I'm sure they'll get good pieces. I'm not sure it'll actually be better for the team though.

Hamels should have about 6 dominate years left in him with that change up, and his delivery.

Also, anyone for bringing back Madson on a 1 year deal? He'll be a full calendar year removed from surgery.

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07-09-2012, 02:09 PM
  #147
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That's what I'd shoot for



They have that Trout guy Sucks he turned into their savior this season, so I'm positive his value is at a biblical level. But I'd have no problem adding to Cole to land Mike Trout. Hamels + Victorino + cash +conditional pick (if Hamels doesn't re-sign) for Trout and a couple longshot prospects?
the Angels have always struggled with offense. Pujols helps, as does Trumbo, but thats it...I dont see them trading away one of the few offensive pieces they have.

Like I said though, who knows. Maybe they will.

The Angels have rarely had problems developing pitchers though, so not sure how interested they would be in aquiring one. However, I am definitely no Angels expert

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07-09-2012, 02:19 PM
  #148
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So have they fixed the team yet?

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07-09-2012, 02:26 PM
  #149
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So have they fixed the team yet?
oh you .

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07-09-2012, 09:33 PM
  #150
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So tied 1-1 in the 11th, Bastardo surrenders 6 runs to blow the game in The Show on my Vita. Sounds about right, what an accurate and realistic game.

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