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Carolina - Boston - Anaheim

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Old
07-09-2012, 02:03 PM
  #26
Blueline Bomber
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeromeo87 View Post
I guess unless you watched every Hurricanes game last year you wouldn't know about Tlusty's emergence. It was kind of his breakout year - his numbers don't show much, but he only started playing with E.Staal around the halfway mark of the season.
Coincidentally at the same time E. Staal starting playing his best hockey. And there's no way Tlusty benefited from Staal, right?

You overrate the value of a lot of Canes players, Tlusty and Pitkanen don't have the value you believe they do.

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Old
07-09-2012, 02:05 PM
  #27
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nooooooooo

Quote:
Originally Posted by BergyWho37 View Post
To
Krejci

To
Pitkanen, Ryan

To
Horton

Both Pitkanen and Horton suffered from concussions last year

This is close IMO maybe throw in picks
sorry not meaning to offend, but Horton is one hit away from his career ending...

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Old
07-09-2012, 02:06 PM
  #28
Boom Boom Anton
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Tlusty's breakout year consists of 36 points while being given top line minutes. Don't get me wrong, I am happy with the progression of Tlusty and am surprised by his overall game, but he's a 3rd liner being thrust into a top line role simply because there was no other alternative in Carolina.

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Old
07-09-2012, 02:06 PM
  #29
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Bruins have a depth problem. Losing Krejci & Horton while adding Ryan only adds to that depth problem, and might take the center strength the Bruins have been o proud of for years.

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Old
07-09-2012, 02:08 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PJ StockBB View Post
no thanks. maybe the value isn't far off but i really don't think this makes the Bruins better. Bruins have a good offense but it is built on depth. so trading two top 6 forwards for one doesn't make us better, even if Ryan is the best offensive player in the deal. and i still think Ryan is one of the most overrated players on these boards.

and obviously Pitkanen is better then McQuaid, but i like our defense as is and i like McQuaid and i think they will wait and see how Hamilton does before looking to make any changes back there.
That's fair enough. Although, I really thought I've read in multiple places about Boston actively looking for a top pairing, puck-moving dman.

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07-09-2012, 02:11 PM
  #31
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so

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeromeo87 View Post
Someone we hardly had last year, and even when he returned our blueline didn't get much better... at all.
jerome, any on the canes u think can play?? Piks , when healthy is good, tlusty has speed and a good shot, , i watch every canes game, and dont u need a great center or winger or change it around, to be a better player, im confused with ur logic..

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07-09-2012, 02:14 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blueline Bomber View Post
Coincidentally at the same time E. Staal starting playing his best hockey. And there's no way Tlusty benefited from Staal, right?

You overrate the value of a lot of Canes players, Tlusty and Pitkanen don't have the value you believe they do.
I don't think I do.. Honestly, I was thinking Pitkanen for Horton straight up might be too much for Horton, someone who has suffered back-to-back concussions, and only has 1 year left on his current contract.

I don't see what's so hard here...

It has been mentioned that Boston is looking for a top pairing, pucking dman - Pitkanen is that. In order to fit Pitkanen (or any other top pairing dman) under there cap, they are going to have to give up someone. Horton seems to fit that bill the most.

It has been mentioned that Anaheim wants a 2nd line center + for Ryan. Krejci for Ryan straight up is close. I thought Tlusty would fill the value in the difference of Krejci for Ryan.


Last edited by jeromeo87: 07-09-2012 at 02:21 PM.
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Old
07-09-2012, 02:15 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jstaal View Post
jerome, any on the canes u think can play?? Piks , when healthy is good, tlusty has speed and a good shot, , i watch every canes game, and dont u need a great center or winger or change it around, to be a better player, im confused with ur logic..
I'm confused with what you just said.

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Old
07-09-2012, 02:31 PM
  #34
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^dinz just happened.

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Old
07-09-2012, 02:36 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jstaal View Post
sorry not meaning to offend, but Horton is one hit away from his career ending...
I've also heard this about Bergeron ...

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Old
07-09-2012, 03:10 PM
  #36
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Boston would rather roll the dice that Horton is healthy. They aren't going to trade 2 top 6 Fs.

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Old
07-09-2012, 03:10 PM
  #37
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Oh boy, this might end up being quite the thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zapp Brannigan View Post
We must have different definitions of "pretty good" term. It's the only logical explanation.
I don't think you'll find a Canes fan who would blame you for thinking Tlusty is a scrap. Like a lot of former Leaf prospects, he's still playing out from under the reputation of his early seasons. He quietly had a respectable season where he played on the top line against tough defenders, and didn't look overwhelmed. He fits well with Staal (who of course, is not similar to any Bruins center, so that doesn't help this trade) and will probably have a decent career when it's all said and done. Not great, but respectable.

Not to compare them too closely, but he's a little like Kyle Wellwood in the sense that people still think of the version of him from 3 years ago, before he found his comfort zone as a player.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeromeo87 View Post
Someone we hardly had last year, and even when he returned our blueline didn't get much better... at all.
So that justifies trading him and not even getting a top-4 defenseman in return?

I'm curious how you would draw up the Hurricanes blue line after this trade. How about:

Gleason-Corvo
Harrison-Faulk
McQuaid-McBain

Looks like a winner!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jets View Post
looks like the ducks get took here. I'd think they could get a much better return on Ryan than Krejci and Tlusty. Look for something similar to the J.Staal return IMHO.
Unless you think good #3 centers are more desirable than average #1 centers, and prospects are more desirable than NHL players, this return already IS better than the J. Staal trade. Or do you mean in terms of acquiring forwards vs defensemen?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jstaal View Post
sorry not meaning to offend, but Horton is one hit away from his career ending...
So's everybody else in the league. The problem isn't Horton's health, it's that he's a great fit for the Bruins and a poor fit for the Hurricanes.

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Old
07-09-2012, 03:14 PM
  #38
w e l o s t b o y s
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While I disagree that Tlusty is garbage, this is brutally in the Canes' favour.

I think this is where I'm supposed to say "LOOKS GOOD!"


Last edited by w e l o s t b o y s: 07-09-2012 at 03:18 PM. Reason: accidentally some words
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Old
07-09-2012, 03:16 PM
  #39
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Horton with that problems scares me out. No, please.

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Old
07-09-2012, 03:25 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeromeo87 View Post
I guess unless you watched every Hurricanes game last year you wouldn't know about Tlusty's emergence.
There's the rub. There exactly is the thing. If he's a guy who you wouldn't understand how good he is unless you're a dedicated 'Canes fan...he's not that good.

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07-09-2012, 03:29 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 8spokesontheB View Post
There's the rub. There exactly is the thing. If he's a guy who you wouldn't understand how good he is unless you're a dedicated 'Canes fan...he's not that good.
Wat

There are plenty of players that fall under the radar for how good they are in smaller markets.

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Old
07-09-2012, 03:35 PM
  #42
Finlandia WOAT
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 8spokesontheB View Post
There's the rub. There exactly is the thing. If he's a guy who you wouldn't understand how good he is unless you're a dedicated 'Canes fan...he's not that good.
Tlusty really broke out in the second half of the season when he was put on the Staal line, and had an insane 12 game point streak. He went for around PPG for the last 25 games of the season.

Yes, he benefited from a hot E. Staal. But E. Staal also benefited from him.

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Old
07-09-2012, 03:35 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stahl2Stall View Post
Wat

There are plenty of players that fall under the radar for how good they are in smaller markets.
I don't mean to be contrarian, but I don't think so.

Small market teams play the league like everyone else; we all know about the good players on the Islanders, Oilers, Blue Jackets and Leafs. If you seriously say that you'd have to watch every game he's played to understand how good he is and nobody else knows it...he's just not that good. Especially when the addendum is, "even though his numbers don't show it".

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Old
07-09-2012, 03:36 PM
  #44
Finlandia WOAT
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 8spokesontheB View Post
I don't mean to be contrarian, but I don't think so.

Small market teams play the league like everyone else; we all know about the good players on the Islanders, Oilers, Blue Jackets and Leafs. If you seriously say that you'd have to watch every game he's played to understand how good he is and nobody else knows it...he's just not that good.
How about watch 2 games?

Honest question: How many games with Carolina have you watched that do not include the team you root for?

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Old
07-09-2012, 03:38 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BergyWho37 View Post
To
Krejci

To
Pitkanen, Ryan

To
Horton

Both Pitkanen and Horton suffered from concussions last year

This is close IMO maybe throw in picks
Much closer, although I'd jut assume go to a different team for a PMD since the canes don't add anything else to deal anyways

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Old
07-09-2012, 03:40 PM
  #46
8spokesontheB
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Originally Posted by Captain Tripps View Post
How about watch 2 games?
Alright, I'll bite. In a league-wide sense, where do you see Jiri Tlusty? First liner? Second? Bottom six?

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Old
07-09-2012, 03:47 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by jeromeo87 View Post
hm.. not sure if Krejci alone gets Ryan..
Unfortunately I think many Boston fans would agree with you. Krejci is probably the most underrated Bruin amongst Boston fans, and even moreso outside Boston. All he does is dominate 5-on-5, and he is as big of a reason as anyone that the B's were able to win a cup with essentially no production from their powerplay.

Bobby Ryan has more percieved value than Krejci because he's so much flashier, but I just don't see him as the better player. Better goal scorer, sure, but Krejci's game is incredibly well rounded and he accomplishes more with less. Krejci makes those around him better, while playing center, the more important and valuable position. I am surely in the minority, but I would be disappointed if Krejci were swapped for Ryan, and appalled if assets were added on top for the privilege.

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Old
07-09-2012, 03:48 PM
  #48
Finlandia WOAT
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Double post.

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Old
07-09-2012, 03:49 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 8spokesontheB View Post
Alright, I'll bite. In a league-wide sense, where do you see Jiri Tlusty? First liner? Second? Bottom six?
Unknown.

He had a string of around 30 games where he was around .85 PPG.

He's big(ish), fast, talented and good enough defensively that he is not a liability playing against the competition a top line faces. People forget, but he was a former first round pick, and a fairly high one at that.

Let's see how he does over an 82 game season. He is at least going to start the season on the top line with E. Staal (and maybe even Jordan).

So in a sense you are correct. His league wide value is low because of his only 30 or so of games playing well. If he plays at that level for an entire season, then I am sure you will hear about him.

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Old
07-09-2012, 03:49 PM
  #50
tarheelhockey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 8spokesontheB View Post
I don't mean to be contrarian, but I don't think so.

Small market teams play the league like everyone else; we all know about the good players on the Islanders, Oilers, Blue Jackets and Leafs. If you seriously say that you'd have to watch every game he's played to understand how good he is and nobody else knows it...he's just not that good. Especially when the addendum is, "even though his numbers don't show it".
How about this. Remember a few years ago when Krejci was the 3rd best center on the Bruins, and for the most part was ignored as a depth player? And there was that developmental phase around 2010 or so, when someone who watched the Bruins consistently could tell you that he was better than he seemed at face value? He was showing good fundamentals, sly with the puck, had a good head on his shoulders, but it wasn't till he got injured in the playoffs that it really clicked in the media that this guy was a major key to the Bruins game plan. And that was a guy who had hit 70 points before, so it's not like he was ever a scrub, he was just underrated and had a higher ceiling than most people realized.

I'm not saying Tlusty is at Krejci's level, but they have a lot in common stylistically. They're not flashy players who blow you away, but they have a skill level that isn't always captured in G-A-P. Tlusty is the same age Krejci was when he broke out. It's the same kind of story, he's making strong offensive plays more consistently and isn't hurting the team with turnovers or floating. Quietly he's becoming a modest but completely legitimate top-6 winger.

Again, it's a loose connection and they're not THAT similar, but if you remember how Krejci was regarded a few years ago compared to today, it should be easy to see why Canes fans are saying "I know he isn't a big name player, but this guy is pretty good..."

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