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Old
07-07-2012, 03:05 PM
  #76
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Originally Posted by YourBuddy View Post
Weber, he deserves his chance on another team. He has put up with alot of crap over the last few seasons.

And please sign goon defenseman who can play 20-30 games against the Bruins and now Sabres ( Scott ) and all the other teams in the east that use to run over the Habs.

How about we sign the big boy from Terrebonne, J-F Jacques ?
Already signed by Florida.

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07-07-2012, 03:19 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by habitue View Post
Already signed by Florida.
We can revisit when he's on waivers...like every season it seems.

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Old
07-07-2012, 03:24 PM
  #78
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Trade "Vebaire".

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Old
07-09-2012, 10:09 AM
  #79
WestIslander
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Markov - Emelin
Gorges - Subban
Kaberle - Bouillon
Diaz

* Weber traded sooner than later

Future:

Gorges - Subban
Tinordi - Beaulieu
Ellis - Emelin
Thrower

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Old
07-09-2012, 11:08 AM
  #80
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Weber won't be traded. He's AHL bound since no one will claim him on waivers.

We might have the worst defense in the league. If Weber isn't good enough for us, if he's not able to outplay Diaz-Emelin-Bouillon, he won't be good enough for other teams either.

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Old
07-09-2012, 12:19 PM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UniverStalinGraduate View Post
Love it. I'm sure Bergevin feels the same way as well.

Something people need to remember about Kaberle too...he went VERY late in the Summer, and didn't get that many years or that much per year, his first time hitting uFA and coming off of not only all those 50ish point seasons in a row, but a cup as well.

The guy has his faults, and his contract reflected that. Last year Kaberle had a bad season with 2 teams that were quite bad for the season. Not entirely sure I'd be putting all that much blame one way or another on Kaberle, in either case. It's also hardly the first time someone has had a bad season, especially after a long playoff run. A guy doesn't play 974 games and get 560 points and all of a sudden at 34 just stop being a competent d-man. I expect people are going to be very pleasantly surprised by what Kaberle brings next season.

As for Bourque...I think a certain Mr. David Desharnais might play a big part in him having a big bounceback season after such a poor season last year.
Just to clarify something here, people are not mad at Kaberle because he is not putting enough points on the scoreboard. He actually is putting the numbers. People are complaining about Kaberle because he is soft, not solid defensively and makes mistakes that end up in goals against.

You can be the best offensive specialist defenseman in the world, but if in the end you suck at defending your own zone, you're a worthless defenseman, moreover when you are paid $4,250,000 a year to do so.

And with such a small hockey stick, what's the point of even trying to pokecheck?

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Old
07-09-2012, 12:23 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrunkenHabz View Post
Just to clarify something here, people are not mad at Kaberle because he is not putting enough points on the scoreboard. He actually is putting the numbers. People are complaining about Kaberle because he is soft, not solid defensively and makes mistakes that end up in goals against.

You can be the best offensive specialist defenseman in the world, but if in the end you suck at defending your own zone, you're a worthless defenseman, moreover when you are paid $4,250,000 a year to do so.

And with such a small hockey stick, what's the point of even trying to pokecheck?
Kaberle is what he is though. As I, and many have mentioned many times...there's a reason that upon hitting UFA after winning the cup and leading his team in scoring for a d-man in that cup run as well, he managed only a 3 year 4.25 deal.

He is a flawed d-man. But the key is to figure out his assets and weaknesses as best as possible and how to allow him to be the most effective player he can.

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Old
07-09-2012, 01:08 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Habs 4 Life View Post
Wasn't that hard all he had to do was out play Niinimaa


And ended up n.1 for the most of the 2 last years..

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07-09-2012, 01:48 PM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UniverStalinGraduate View Post
Kaberle is what he is though. As I, and many have mentioned many times...there's a reason that upon hitting UFA after winning the cup and leading his team in scoring for a d-man in that cup run as well, he managed only a 3 year 4.25 deal.

He is a flawed d-man. But the key is to figure out his assets and weaknesses as best as possible and how to allow him to be the most effective player he can.
agree, and has bad as he was defensively he was only -6 as a Hab, and that was playing a new comer in Emelin and Campoli.

I think he'll easily crack the 40 point mark this year, and possibly have a phyiscal D-men like Bouillon with him will help a lot.

And 4.25M isn't a lot on a short term deal for Kaberle, IMO he'll be good until Bealieau is ready for the NHL as the 5th D-men, second PP unit, so it could be by this year deadline or next, and when Kaberle is traded, he'll get a nice return, most likely a 2nd and a decent prospect.

Oh and to the OP question.
I think we have too many of the same D-type of depth d-men.

Kaberle-Bouillion,Weber,Diaz, I'd like to see Weber or possibly Diaz traded and replaced with a physical D-men. But in regards to D-men, no with all the injuires, you need about 8 D-men that can play at an NHL level to start the year, becuase with injuries you'll end up using around 8-9 different guys in a whole season.

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Old
07-09-2012, 02:04 PM
  #85
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weber and kaberle are the most likely to be moved if trade happens

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Old
07-09-2012, 02:09 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clownquestionbro View Post
marek zidlicky was traded to the devils for Kurtis Foster, Nick Palmieri, Stephane Veilleux, 2nd rd pick in '12 and conditional pick in '13 at the deadline.

Zidlicky has 2 goals and 22 points in 63 games last year

Kaberle had 3 goals and 31 points in 72 games last year


sure lets trade kaberle for a 4th or 5th.
If Bergeron gets a 7th for Kaberle and his contract, he's a shoe in for GM of the year. Did you actually watch him attempt to play defense last year?

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07-09-2012, 02:12 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by gillyguzzler View Post
If Bergeron gets a 7th for Kaberle and his contract, he's a shoe in for GM of the year. Did you actually watch him attempt to play defense last year?
lol, did you see Zidlicky, apart some a little good stretch in the playoffs, the guy was just as bad as Kaberle defensivly, but didn't even put up any points on the board.

After the traded from the Canes, Kaberle was putting up points. And his contract is very comparable to Zidlicky.

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07-09-2012, 02:14 PM
  #88
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8 defensemen is the right number to break camp with. Our problem isn't really in the number, it's more in the composition of the mix. A bit too soft overall. Not a lot of size.

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07-09-2012, 02:16 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
8 defensemen is the right number to break camp with. Our problem isn't really in the number, it's more in the composition of the mix. A bit too soft overall. Not a lot of size.
yes. That's more like it. I am really looking forward to see how Markov gonna perform (or not) next October.

L.A. won the Cup with the right blend of defencemen.

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07-09-2012, 02:19 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
8 defensemen is the right number to break camp with. Our problem isn't really in the number, it's more in the composition of the mix. A bit too soft overall. Not a lot of size.
Just came in here to post exactly that, glad I read the thread first. Sure we have eight NHL defenceman, but it doesn't work as well when three of them varying degrees of the same player.

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Old
07-09-2012, 02:44 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by habs03 View Post
After the traded from the Canes, Kaberle was putting up points. And his contract is very comparable to Zidlicky.
One is owed 4M over 1 year.

The other is owed 8.75M over 2 years.

How are they very comparable? Kabs is owed almost 5M more then Zidlicky, which is more then the entire contract of Zidlicky.

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07-09-2012, 02:54 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by montreal View Post
One is owed 4M over 1 year.

The other is owed 8.75M over 2 years.

How are they very comparable? Kabs is owed almost 5M more then Zidlicky, which is more then the entire contract of Zidlicky.
There is no point in traded Kaberle now this offseason, since we aren't in any cap trouble, two we there isn't anyone on the FA market that we would use the money on, atleast IMO, so Kaberle trade would come around during midseason/trade deadline, and at that time, the conracts will be almost exactly the same, as Zidlicky got traded.

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07-09-2012, 03:04 PM
  #93
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I say trade Kaberle for a prospect and/or 2013 pick.

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Old
07-09-2012, 03:20 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by habs03 View Post
There is no point in traded Kaberle now this offseason, since we aren't in any cap trouble, two we there isn't anyone on the FA market that we would use the money on, atleast IMO, so Kaberle trade would come around during midseason/trade deadline, and at that time, the conracts will be almost exactly the same, as Zidlicky got traded.
I didn't say anything about trading Kabs, or anyone on the FA market. Even at the deadline the contracts will not be almost exactly the same as Kabs will still be owed over 5.5M while Zidlicky's contract will almost be over.

Think of it this way, if we had Zidlicky under contract, we'd pay him 4M and then he would be gone. Instead we have to pay Kabs almost 9M over 2 years. Will you still think they are almost exactly the same when next we are paying Kabs 4.5M while Zidlicky gets paid 0 dollars?

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07-09-2012, 03:36 PM
  #95
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All will remain through training camp. Dependant on Beaulieu and Tinordi and how they do at camp.

Markov, PK, Gorges, Cube are locks
Emelin and Diaz to fight for one spot, Emelin will probably will get it, but its nice to have incentive.
Weber and Kabs are there as insurance and to push the rookies. They won't make the team, but if they impress that gives the team confidence that they can be brought up through the season for injuries.

Markov Gorges
PK Emelin
Cube Diaz to start the year
Kaberle is insurance for Markov
Weber will be dealt for a pick

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Old
07-09-2012, 03:40 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by montreal View Post
I didn't say anything about trading Kabs, or anyone on the FA market. Even at the deadline the contracts will not be almost exactly the same as Kabs will still be owed over 5.5M while Zidlicky's contract will almost be over.

Think of it this way, if we had Zidlicky under contract, we'd pay him 4M and then he would be gone. Instead we have to pay Kabs almost 9M over 2 years. Will you still think they are almost exactly the same when next we are paying Kabs 4.5M while Zidlicky gets paid 0 dollars?
The difference is Kaberle is the better player between the two. What I was simply saying is that there is no need to trade Kaberle now, specially for a 7th round pick, when we don't need the cap space, plus Kaberle gives us a good backup plan if Markov gets hurt again, and also lets Beaulieu gets some NHL time, who I think is going to replace Kaberle in the lineup in a year/ year and half.


With that said, by the trade deadline next year, Karberle contract will be very similar to that of Zidlicky when he got traded this past deadline, and he got a decent return for the Wild. I'm simply saying that it would be stupid to trade Kaberle for a 7th round pick now, when you can probably get more for him at the trade line.

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07-09-2012, 03:41 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by habfaninvictoria View Post
All will remain through training camp. Dependant on Beaulieu and Tinordi and how they do at camp.

Markov, PK, Gorges, Cube are locks
Emelin and Diaz to fight for one spot, Emelin will probably will get it, but its nice to have incentive.
Weber and Kabs are there as insurance and to push the rookies. They won't make the team, but if they impress that gives the team confidence that they can be brought up through the season for injuries.

Markov Gorges
PK Emelin
Cube Diaz to start the year
Kaberle is insurance for Markov
Weber will be dealt for a pick
Quite confused how you have Emelin and Diaz fighting for one spot, then have them both in the starting roster

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Old
07-09-2012, 04:04 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Habtacular View Post
Quite confused how you have Emelin and Diaz fighting for one spot, then have them both in the starting roster
Ya I changed my mind after and switched Kabs and Diaz, forgot to change up top... good to know we have intrepid sleuths like you watching our every move

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Old
07-09-2012, 04:10 PM
  #99
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I would prefer Diaz over Kaberle and Weber. Not looking like dealing Kaberle is all too feasible. As a result I could see Weber and/or Diaz being shipped out. The D core is way to soft and offensive minded.

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07-09-2012, 04:17 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by Rise from the Ashes View Post
I would prefer Diaz over Kaberle and Weber. Not looking like dealing Kaberle is all too feasible. As a result I could see Weber and/or Diaz being shipped out. The D core is way to soft and offensive minded.
would be better to trade him than lose him to UFA after next season. It's not like he's that much better than Weber anyway.

We have enough "feeders" in Markov, Kaberle and Subban anyway, there's no point in having a 4th one in the line-up, might as well keep the one with a good shot, especially since he's 3 years younger than Diaz and will be RFA for a few more years.

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