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So why don't top FA's come to Canada?

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Old
07-10-2012, 05:38 PM
  #26
Petes2424
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Originally Posted by leaflover View Post
Taxes for sure, yes they make plenty of loot but no matter how high your salary it hurts to have a big chunk go to the government. It doesn't make them greedy, just smart business. Also there aren't a whole pile of attractive Canadian options if you're looking to hoist a cup anytime soon.Those would be the main focus of the vast majority of players and when neither is available north of the 49th you stay south of it.
It's even worse if you're an American, do to the good old IRS collecting on out of Country wages.

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07-10-2012, 05:38 PM
  #27
Ziggy Stardust
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Originally Posted by RogerRoeper View Post
Because no Canadian teams are offering those ridiculous contracts.
Calgary? And do the names Jeff Finger and Mike Komisarek ring a bell?

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07-10-2012, 05:39 PM
  #28
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Just have to find the right situation. Not many "top" FAs out there unless you mean just the best one of any given year. Gotta have a lot of open money and the willingness/ability to spend it (most importantly), but then you also have to have some sort of draw, I would imagine, to make it worth the taxes--hometown team, family, etc.

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07-10-2012, 05:40 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
Calgary? And do the names Jeff Finger and Mike Komisarek ring a bell?
That's still not a lot of money. I'm talking about the 90+ million contracts top free agents get.

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07-10-2012, 05:41 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Pucklington View Post
Actually in many cases taxes are lower then they are in the US. Look at Alberta for example.

There are 7 Canadian teams, and 23 American teams. Numbers dictate that top end free agents are more likely to sign in the US.

Some notable free agents to sign in Canada in the last couple of years:

Schultz
Bouwmeester (I know sign and trade, but 1 day away from UFA)
Souray
Hamhuis
Alberta is the only province with taxation rate comparable to the US.


Last edited by TMI: 07-10-2012 at 10:40 PM. Reason: quote
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07-10-2012, 05:42 PM
  #31
Ashley
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Ya it's not like T.O, Habs, Flames or Oilers are Cup Contendors.

Also your average NHLer could live under more anonymity playing in the US vs Canada where they live under the microscope.
The one thing I learned watching HBO's 24/7 is that these guys enjoy the limelight. Anonymity is a very overrated excuse.

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07-10-2012, 05:42 PM
  #32
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Yeah because L.A., SJ and Carolina are just always signing the top free agents....
Adam Burish says hello

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07-10-2012, 05:43 PM
  #33
Ace Rimmer
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Not saying it's right or wrong, but the misconception about taxes (economics in general, really) is there. You could even argue the myth about the disparity of the CDN$ vs. US$ (which isn't there anymore). Certain goods are also cheaper in the US vs Canada (see: book prices as a prime example). It's a cumulative effect.




Poutine is a horrible response; who doesn't like cheese curds & gravy on french fries?

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07-10-2012, 05:44 PM
  #34
RandV
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Like others have said it's mostly a combination of a numbers game with poor teams, or good teams with no room.

I don't mean this as a shot at them but really it seems the only Canadian team in recent years that pursues and fails to acquire the elite UFA's is Toronto. And most of that probably has to do with them being a poor team.

Really rather than being unable to acquire top UFA's a bigger problem is being unable to retain your own top UFA's. And the Canadian teams don't have a problem here, most of the big losses can be attributed to the salary cap crunch.

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07-10-2012, 05:46 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Canuckle16 View Post
I love the general misconception about oh so scary Canadian taxes.. oooOooh

I mean why go to Vancouver and pay that scary top rate of 43.7% (29% Fed + 14.7% BC) when you can go play somewhere like California at pay.. wait for it.. a top rate of 44.3% (35% fed & 9.3% CA).. hmm wait a second!

How about NY..? Top rate of 43.82%?? (35% Fed, 8.82% NY).

If we use Ontairo with it's top rate of 40.16% (29% Fed, 11.16% ON) we could find even more states with a higher rate!

Certain states are definately lower... but to fault taxes is just plain old school.
But doesnt this assume they live in Canada full time? What if they actually live in the states? Do they pay twice?

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07-10-2012, 05:46 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by RogerRoeper View Post
That's still not a lot of money. I'm talking about the 90+ million contracts top free agents get.
Aside from Vancouver, none of the other Canadian clubs have shown any signs of stability in terms of being playoff contenders. Can't blame players for not wanting to play for a Canadian city, especially when you consider how their media tends to treat the players.

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07-10-2012, 05:46 PM
  #37
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Hamhuis, JBo, Gonchar, Komisarek. Maybe they should go after the right ones.

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07-10-2012, 05:46 PM
  #38
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The more relevant question is why are so many Canadian teams so bad despite spending to the cap in many cases.

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07-10-2012, 05:50 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by vanwest View Post
The more relevant question is why are so many Canadian teams so bad despite spending to the cap in many cases.
yeah, but that just sounds mean.

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07-10-2012, 05:50 PM
  #40
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Fishbowl and not contenders would be my two picks.

Some players like being under a spot... but i would bet allot dont.

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07-10-2012, 05:52 PM
  #41
leaflover
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Originally Posted by Petes2424 View Post
It's even worse if you're an American, do to the good old IRS collecting on out of Country wages.
When i worked in Toledo, Ohio and saw my first check stub and noticed the federal,state and city tax deductions i wasn't impressed. However, they still didn't top what i paid in B.C so i got over it.

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07-10-2012, 05:55 PM
  #42
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Canucks have signed Demitra (rip), Sundin, Hamhuis, and now Garrison since 2008. That's not bad at all.

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07-10-2012, 05:56 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by puckyeah View Post
But doesnt this assume they live in Canada full time? What if they actually live in the states? Do they pay twice?
I can't remember exactly but lets say you're in the 28% bracket for the Feds and the 6% bracket for whatever state. It was approximately half back in the early 2000s. So bank on over 50% of your income going to govt between Canada and the U.S. there's actually ratios on out of country work.

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07-10-2012, 05:57 PM
  #44
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Honestly? I don't think Canadian owners really care about icing a good team.

What the last few years have done is turn the Canada/United States rivalry from something good-natured into something much more acidic. This has allowed the Canadian teams to treat being a fan less like going to a game and more like making a statement. And that statement is, "We are Canada, this is our game, and look how many of us there are. We show up to watch bad hockey."

And at the same time, that allows the opportunity to charge enormous and disproportionate ticket prices, since the people have shown and will continue to show the willingness to pay up. If the team wins, great. If the team doesn't win, blame the Americans or blame Bettman. Say the deck is stacked against you because you're in a Canadian market, and haven't you looked at Phoenix?

There's no real incentive to win. Harold Ballard figured this out 40 years ago, that winning costs more money than losing, and the additional revenues received might offset that.

With that in mind, why pursue top free agents? Maybe make a token offer, then make a comment about how no one wants to sign here...inflame the fan base a bit, then get them to renew their season tickets with the price increase.

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07-10-2012, 05:59 PM
  #45
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Bigfoot kidnapping families is much more common then you might think.

Also, most Canadian teams sign their stars when they are coming up, so there isn't the need to overpay for a free agent all the time. As a Canucks fan...recently signing the free agents our manager is targetting hasn't been an issue (Sundin, Demitra, Samuelsson, Hamhuis, Garrison...Sturm). Maybe it's an eastern thing, Edmonton got Schultz all the sudden, and Calgary trades for the rights of bigger names, then signs them (Wideman and Bouwmeester as examples, they did land Hudler too).

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07-10-2012, 06:01 PM
  #46
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The right to bear arms. Everyone wants bear arms.
With David Booth in Canada, we may need to start arming bears.

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07-10-2012, 06:14 PM
  #47
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Like teams in the western US, it's tough to get guys to go to western Canada. The travel is a huge deal. Vancouver is a contender, but they're getting guys hometown guys from BC. Edmonton isn't a destination, and won't be. Calgary has to give NMC's and NTC's all over the place to get guys to go there. Winnipeg won't be a huge destination, good team or bad. Ottawa hasn't been a big player. Toronto used to get guys. Montreal had that one summer a few years ago, but cooled down recently.

Vancouver drafted and traded well, which is why they've been a contender. Edmonton has no choice but to go through this rebuilding. Calgary is holding onto any hope of competitiveness for as long as they can. Winnipeg is going through a slow process. Ottawa has been a pretty good drafting team, which like Vancouver, is why they're able to be competitive. Toronto and Montreal are in that northeast corridor, which is where the big free agents gravitate, so they can have an edge over other teams in Canada. But those two teams still comes after Boston, NY, and Philly in the free agent pecking order.

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07-10-2012, 06:15 PM
  #48
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Poutine
Thats reason enough to sign there.

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07-10-2012, 06:17 PM
  #49
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Taxes probably have less to do with it than you guys might think.

Calgary is really high on that list...

Explains why Feaster overpays everyone

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07-10-2012, 06:21 PM
  #50
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It's a conspiracy...they're just jealous that Canada has free health care and they don't








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