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Ryan Clowe and Douglas Murray to MTL

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Old
07-12-2012, 11:39 PM
  #26
Laino
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mahleezer View Post
Not interested in Clowe and Murray to be honest.

...


If price was reasonable for Murray alone I'd pull the trigger.
Overpayment

I too think Murray would be a fit in Montreal but not sure it would be worth the cost unless it was a pick.

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Old
07-13-2012, 03:55 AM
  #27
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MacArthur + Franson + 3rd?

Sharks get younger and quicker, Leafs get bigger and meaner???

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07-13-2012, 04:00 AM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UniverStalinGraduate View Post
No, the Habs aren't getting rid of Eller and his very solid upside and 2 years at a VERY cheap rate (and still RFA afterwards) for 2 guys who are UFA's after next season.

Bourque had an awful season last year...why would the Habs give up on him after that? His value is horrendous right now.
So basically you expect the Sharks to give Clowe and Murray to the Habs for nothing of value?

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Old
07-13-2012, 05:11 AM
  #29
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Murray is an incredibly slow, hard hitting, semi-useless 3rd pairing behemoth. Barely passes for an NHL player now and who knows where he'll be at in a few years. Make a serious Clowe offer here and get Murray for crap later, because that's what he is. The package idea just encourages SJS trolls to unfairly up the value.

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Old
07-13-2012, 06:33 AM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyris View Post
MacArthur + Franson + 3rd?

Sharks get younger and quicker, Leafs get bigger and meaner???
I've been hoping Burke would make a deal for Clowe for a couple seasons now, I just love how he plays and I think he'd fit into Burke's and Carlyle's style perfectly. I'm not too familiar with Murray but I think Clowe on the 2nd line for us over MacArthur is an upgrade with some grit.

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Old
07-13-2012, 09:36 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyris View Post
MacArthur + Franson + 3rd?

Sharks get younger and quicker, Leafs get bigger and meaner???
Sharks have no use for Cody Franson. For the Sharks to entertain the thought of trading one or both of Clowe and Murray, I think Gunnarsson has to be involved. The forwards that the Leafs have are okay but nothing spectacular.

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Old
07-13-2012, 09:45 AM
  #32
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What about Bourque and Kristo for Clowe?

Bourque is the better goal scorer, and Kristo is a very fast NHL ready player that needs a different team because he will be overlooked in Montreal due to his lack of size. I know Bourque had a bad season last year, but he still scored 18 goals. Montreal considers this deal because Clowe is a big hitting winger who would be great with Plekanec and Gionta.

Thoughts?

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Old
07-13-2012, 09:54 AM
  #33
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Sorry to be this guy, but it's Ryane Clowe.

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Old
07-13-2012, 11:09 AM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vaseline stampede View Post
Murray is an incredibly slow, hard hitting, semi-useless 3rd pairing behemoth. Barely passes for an NHL player now and who knows where he'll be at in a few years. Make a serious Clowe offer here and get Murray for crap later, because that's what he is. The package idea just encourages SJS trolls to unfairly up the value.
This is so terribly uninformed I don't know where to start. Yes he is slow, no he is not semi-useless. He's a solid top-4 defensive defensemen who happens to be one of the hardest hitters in the league (and probably the hardest player to knock down). He's extremely intelligent and is excellent positionally.

He was injured most of last season which is why he struggled, guy is fearless blocking shots and broke his foot, more than once, doing so.

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Old
07-13-2012, 11:19 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Mafoofoo View Post
So basically you expect the Sharks to give Clowe and Murray to the Habs for nothing of value?
No, basically I expect the Habs aren't going to give up valuable young assets in exchange for 2 non impact players who are UFA's after next season.

Neat comment though

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Old
07-13-2012, 11:20 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by hockeyball View Post
This is so terribly uninformed I don't know where to start. Yes he is slow, no he is not semi-useless. He's a solid top-4 defensive defensemen who happens to be one of the hardest hitters in the league (and probably the hardest player to knock down). He's extremely intelligent and is excellent positionally.

He was injured most of last season which is why he struggled, guy is fearless blocking shots and broke his foot, more than once, doing so.
He is just quite simply getting too old.

Guys like him once they start to get older their games deteriorate very quickly.

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Old
07-13-2012, 11:21 AM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UniverStalinGraduate View Post
No, basically I expect the Habs aren't going to give up valuable young assets in exchange for 2 non impact players who are UFA's after next season.

Neat comment though
Not being mean here but have you seen Clowe and Murray play? Understand the UFA part but non-impact?

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Old
07-13-2012, 11:34 AM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyris View Post
MacArthur + Franson + 3rd?

Sharks get younger and quicker, Leafs get bigger and meaner???
Is MacArthur + Franson + 3rd the new Ryder + Halak + 2nd..

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Old
07-13-2012, 11:38 AM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UniverStalinGraduate View Post
He is just quite simply getting too old.

Guys like him once they start to get older their games deteriorate very quickly.
He's 32... I'm really getting sick and tired of people calling 32 'old'. I'm freaking 32.

Would he have played better at 30 after multiple foot fractures in the same season? He broke his damn foot, twice, what do you expect? Most players wouldn't have even gone back on the ice, but he's a tough ******* who will play through almost anything.


Last edited by TMI: 07-13-2012 at 11:53 AM. Reason: poster already knows why
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Old
07-13-2012, 11:40 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by Fistfullofbeer View Post
Not being mean here but have you seen Clowe and Murray play? Understand the UFA part but non-impact?
I classify impact players as top line (or unreal 2nd line guy) forwards or top pairing d-men (or a guy who can play 2nd minutes but get 40+ points).

Clowe is a solid 2nd line guy who provides a physical presence and can pot goals in bunches as well. But he's played on a very good offensive team, and is IMO not a top line player.

Doesn't mean he's not a solid player...but he's just not an impact player according to how I feel.

Murray isn't even close to an impact guy, it's debateable whether he's even a top 4 d-man moving forward.

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Old
07-13-2012, 12:33 PM
  #41
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3 way madness

MTL
Eller + Bourque + Kaberle + (Greg Pateryn)

SJ
Boyle + Clowe + (Sean Kuraly)


NJD

Volchenkov + Tedenby + (Blake Pietila)


-----------------------------

MTL
Clowe + Volchenkov + (Blake Pietila)

SJ
Eller + Tendenby + Kaberle


NDJ

Boyle + Bourque + (Sean Kuraly) + (Greg Pateryn)

_______________________

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Gionta Plekanec Clowe
Pacioretty DD Cole
Moen Prust (? Leblanc ?) Arsmtrong
Nokelainen Gomez White
Geoffrion

Subban Gorges
Markov Volchenkov
Bouillon Emelin
Diaz Weber
St-Denis

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Old
07-13-2012, 12:37 PM
  #42
hockeyball
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habitant le colon View Post
3 way madness

MTL
Eller + Bourque + Kaberle + (Greg Pateryn)

SJ
Boyle + Clowe + (Sean Kuraly)


NJD

Volchenkov + Tedenby + (Blake Pietila)


-----------------------------

MTL
Clowe + Volchenkov + (Blake Pietila)

SJ
Eller + Tendenby + Kaberle


NDJ

Boyle + Bourque + (Sean Kuraly) + (Greg Pateryn)

_______________________

SORRY
______________________


Gionta Plekanec Clowe
Pacioretty DD Cole
Moen Prust (? Leblanc ?) Arsmtrong
Nokelainen Gomez White
Geoffrion

Subban Gorges
Markov Volchenkov
Bouillon Emelin
Diaz Weber
St-Denis
Don't want Kaberle at any cost, Tedenby doesn't really fit a need either. I like Eller but he's a 3rd liner right now and we are giving up a #1 d-man and a top-6... You just made us a worse team by quite a bit.

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Old
07-13-2012, 12:54 PM
  #43
Tkachuk4MVP
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What we need is a "Value of: Ryane Clowe and Douglas Murray" thread. There are much better trading partners than Montreal out there.


Last edited by Tkachuk4MVP: 07-13-2012 at 01:00 PM.
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Old
07-13-2012, 01:28 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tkachuk4MVP View Post
What we need is a "Value of: Ryane Clowe and Douglas Murray" thread. There are much better trading partners than Montreal out there.
I agree.

As it was already said previously, Montreal is in a rebuild/retool process IMO and to acquire those 2 players, the habs would have to part ways with young players like Eller/Leblanc and picks which does not make any sense.

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Old
07-13-2012, 02:28 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UniverStalinGraduate* View Post
No, the Habs aren't getting rid of Eller and his very solid upside and 2 years at a VERY cheap rate (and still RFA afterwards) for 2 guys who are UFA's after next season.

Bourque had an awful season last year...why would the Habs give up on him after that? His value is horrendous right now.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UniverStalinGraduate* View Post
No, basically I expect the Habs aren't going to give up valuable young assets in exchange for 2 non impact players who are UFA's after next season.

Neat comment though
First off, Bourque isn't young, and is actually older than Clowe. Second, what would you give up for Clowe + Murray? If it's not a decent prospect that is running out of time to hit his top-6 ceiling and an older player that may have crashed through his floor, then who or what?

Quote:
Originally Posted by UniverStalinGraduate* View Post
He is just quite simply getting too old.

Guys like him once they start to get older their games deteriorate very quickly.
What does this mean, "guys like him"? Everyone's game deteriorates when they get older. I understand that players with a physical edge tend to put more strain on their bodies, but it's not like Murray goes out and just crashes into people every shift. In a sense, it's good that he's not a quick skater as that would probably allow him to throw his weight around more. As it is, he has a fairly small sphere of influence, and anyone caught within it is in danger of getting hit. That's it. He is also someone that other players often won't go after because of his reputation. Guys like him that play smart, preserve their energy, and don't throw their weight around just because they can tend to have longer careers than you would think. As long as Murray can skate, he'll be a good defenseman.

Quote:
Originally Posted by UniverStalinGraduate* View Post
I classify impact players as top line (or unreal 2nd line guy) forwards or top pairing d-men (or a guy who can play 2nd minutes but get 40+ points).

Clowe is a solid 2nd line guy who provides a physical presence and can pot goals in bunches as well. But he's played on a very good offensive team, and is IMO not a top line player.

Doesn't mean he's not a solid player...but he's just not an impact player according to how I feel.

Murray isn't even close to an impact guy, it's debateable whether he's even a top 4 d-man moving forward.
Clowe might not be "top line" by your definition of impact, but he's still very valuable. 20 goals, 50-60 points, will drop the gloves...how many of those guys exist in the league? Or a better question, how many of those guys exist in the league that are available and have a cap hit under $4m?

As for Murray, you're right, it is entirely debatable whether he's a top-4 defenseman. But it's most likely a debate that you would lose. A healthy Murray is out there about 20 minutes a game, oftentimes against "top line" players. He doesn't put up many points but that's not a requirement for defensemen.

Both players bring a lot of value to a team that wants to win games.

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Old
07-13-2012, 04:12 PM
  #46
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I'm just curious to know what the Sharks would ask for those 2 players.
The Sharks would need top six speed and help on the PK.

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Old
07-13-2012, 04:18 PM
  #47
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I'll tell you what


To Sharks

Bourque

and

Emelin

To Habs

Clowe

and

Murray

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Old
07-13-2012, 04:20 PM
  #48
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Due to the contracts of each player the deal I propose would be insane as of right now. So how about the Sharks through in Demers and a second.

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Old
07-13-2012, 04:37 PM
  #49
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Due to the contracts of each player the deal I propose would be insane as of right now. So how about the Sharks through in Demers and a second.
No way I'd throw in Demers and a 2nd.

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Old
07-13-2012, 04:49 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
Sharks have no use for Cody Franson. For the Sharks to entertain the thought of trading one or both of Clowe and Murray, I think Gunnarsson has to be involved. The forwards that the Leafs have are okay but nothing spectacular.
Pacioretty and Diaz or Weber from the Habs makes a lot of sense.

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