HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Notices

Give Plekanec a chance?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
07-12-2012, 02:37 PM
  #51
S Bah
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: victoria bc
Country: Wales
Posts: 4,528
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Analyzer View Post
No, Gomez gets all the chances. No one else gets a chance.
Where's thesign Mr. Gomez hasn't the right to lace Plekanec's skates for him IMHO.Let alone be making the dollars he makes and seems uninterested in earning $500,000 a year by his play the last two years.Plekanec is the best center the Habs have until Galchenyuk or Eller are ready to step into a bigger role.

S Bah is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-12-2012, 02:44 PM
  #52
417
Registered User
 
417's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ottawa
Country: Haiti
Posts: 19,282
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Subnordi View Post
Plekanec is bigger than Crosby, size isn't the issue, the issue is that he has assy faced wingers, like Darche.
Plekanec is not bigger than Crosby...but agreed, size is not the issue with Plekanec.

I think the last 2 years, a big problem with Plekanec is that he's refused to commit himself in physical confrontations, something I always admired about him prior.

Not sure if he's been playing injured the last two years...but he hasn't looked like himself since the 2nd half of the year prior.

417 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-12-2012, 03:53 PM
  #53
habsfanatics
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 3,422
vCash: 500
I think pleks is the better player , hands down, I'm not, however, convinced he's better offensively than dd. I think dd is a better Passer, has much better offensive instincts and is a borderline wizard creating plays. I can see him going on to having a career similar to ray whitney. Love him or hate him, he creates offense.

Cole/pacioretty have to be spread out, I don't think it's debatable. The overall team success is more important than one very good line, we need balance.

habsfanatics is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 07:23 AM
  #54
Paul Dipietro
Registered User
 
Paul Dipietro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Country: Canada
Posts: 710
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by habsfanatics View Post
I think pleks is the better player , hands down, I'm not, however, convinced he's better offensively than dd. I think dd is a better Passer, has much better offensive instincts and is a borderline wizard creating plays. I can see him going on to having a career similar to ray whitney. Love him or hate him, he creates offense.

Cole/pacioretty have to be spread out, I don't think it's debatable. The overall team success is more important than one very good line, we need balance.
Until we get a bonafide top-6 winger (or Bourque turns into one), breaking them up will at best, still leave us with only 1 good line and at worst, none

Training camp can't come soon enough

Paul Dipietro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 08:43 AM
  #55
Kriss E
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 22,707
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 417 View Post
Plekanec is not bigger than Crosby...but agreed, size is not the issue with Plekanec.

I think the last 2 years, a big problem with Plekanec is that he's refused to commit himself in physical confrontations, something I always admired about him prior.

Not sure if he's been playing injured the last two years...but he hasn't looked like himself since the 2nd half of the year prior.
I think the problem is that Plekanec has not only been carrying out the big assignments, but he's also had to drag some linemates along. He had to revive Gionta early in the year. He was given the cold wingers and guys like AK-Cammy were taken off his wing at times. Not to mention, every time one of them suffered an injury, Plekanec was given grinders.
So, I think fatigue, both physical and mental, has more to do with it than injury.

I know I'd be absolutely fed up of having to always deal with the problem wingers.

Kriss E is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 09:03 AM
  #56
417
Registered User
 
417's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ottawa
Country: Haiti
Posts: 19,282
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
I think the problem is that Plekanec has not only been carrying out the big assignments, but he's also had to drag some linemates along. He had to revive Gionta early in the year. He was given the cold wingers and guys like AK-Cammy were taken off his wing at times. Not to mention, every time one of them suffered an injury, Plekanec was given grinders.
So, I think fatigue, both physical and mental, has more to do with it than injury.

I know I'd be absolutely fed up of having to always deal with the problem wingers.
I don't agree with that...Ak-Cammy were taken off Plekanec's wings because they weren't producing as a line, curiously, both Cammy & AK played better with Desharnais & Eller, then they did with Plekanec.

I agree that all those heavy minutes have probably caught up to Plekanec...but he's not without blame either.

The very notion of this thread, 'to give Plekanec a chance', is kind of silly considering no other forward saw as much time on the ice as Plekanec last year in all situations.

417 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 09:04 AM
  #57
beowulf
Poster of the Year!
 
beowulf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 35,009
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to beowulf
Quote:
Originally Posted by MXD View Post
Why would DD HAVE to slow down?

I mean... it's entirely possible that he slows down, as it's entirely possible that he'll produce to a slightly-below-PPG-pace...

It's like you want to see him fail, which is sad.
Never said I wanted him to fail. If he fails, likely means the team is not doing well also but people seem to have anointed him as the undisputed no1 center in Montreal when it could very well be Plekanec.

beowulf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 09:55 AM
  #58
Kriss E
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 22,707
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 417 View Post
I don't agree with that...Ak-Cammy were taken off Plekanec's wings because they weren't producing as a line, curiously, both Cammy & AK played better with Desharnais & Eller, then they did with Plekanec.

I agree that all those heavy minutes have probably caught up to Plekanec...but he's not without blame either.

The very notion of this thread, 'to give Plekanec a chance', is kind of silly considering no other forward saw as much time on the ice as Plekanec last year in all situations.
Well, in the same curious manner, Plekanec had no problem producing himself. He didn't have a problem putting up points, as usual, next to Cammy and AK.

I'm not saying Plek is without fault. I'm saying the reason you think he seems to have shied away from physical play is more likely fatigue.

He started last year strong, as always, with 21pts in 25gp. He gathered 25pts in 32gp, and then RC was placed as coach. The flipflopping became quite ridiculous at that point, and Plekanec was slowly turned into a 3rd center. Being used as a shutdown center more than anything and given poor wingers.

Kriss E is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:21 AM
  #59
ECWHSWI
P.K. is perfect.
 
ECWHSWI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 14,943
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 417 View Post
I don't agree with that...Ak-Cammy were taken off Plekanec's wings because they weren't producing as a line, curiously, both Cammy & AK played better with Desharnais & Eller, then they did with Plekanec.

I agree that all those heavy minutes have probably caught up to Plekanec...but he's not without blame either.

The very notion of this thread, 'to give Plekanec a chance', is kind of silly considering no other forward saw as much time on the ice as Plekanec last year in all situations.
actually, A.K. was not producing more with Eller than he was with Plekanec... he may have looker better but that's it, looked better.

as for Cammy well, he played what, 3 or 4 games with DD ?



Pretty sure if you gave him the choice between Ice time and good wingers, he would have chosen the wingers...

be serious for a sec here, we did have a Geoffrion-Plekanec-White line at some point last season, and for more than one game...

ECWHSWI is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:24 AM
  #60
Et le But
Moderator
 
Et le But's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New York
Country: Argentina
Posts: 17,619
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
be serious for a sec here, we did have a Geoffrion-Plekanec-White line at some point last season, and for more than one game...
And apparently Plekanec isn't a playmaker because he couldn't turn them into goalscorers.

Et le But is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:32 AM
  #61
Undertakerqc
Registered User
 
Undertakerqc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,282
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmdubois585 View Post
He is #1, has #1 minutes, but doesn't have the wingers. Once Gio is back, you'll see his production go up and hopefully Bourque's production too
DD is now our number one center as he is much better offensively. Plekanec is on his way out. He is way too soft to be considered a number one center. Ideally, for a bad team, he can be a second line center.

Undertakerqc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:47 AM
  #62
crazyd
Canada is hockey
 
crazyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,067
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
actually, A.K. was not producing more with Eller than he was with Plekanec... he may have looker better but that's it, looked better.
Indeed he was not producing at the same pace. But he was playing his REAL role on the team instead of trying to play a role unfitting for him with Plekanec.

If AK and Eller would of been kept together, both of them would be getting 40-50 pts next season. The missing ingredient was a better winger on the other side, in the mold of Moen but with better offensive upside.

crazyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:58 AM
  #63
Pr3Va1L
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 606
vCash: 500
Could a line of Patches-DD-Gio work ?

Offensively, a guy like gio would be the best shooter (great reflexes) we have for the "always be ready for a pass" kind of plays DD does.

BUT two 5'8 guys on the same line ?




OH and this year, with prust/armstrong/moen, Plekanec should hopefully get less TOI and better minutes (probably won't play the PK as much) and his production IMO will show it.


Last edited by Pr3Va1L: 07-13-2012 at 12:03 PM.
Pr3Va1L is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:59 AM
  #64
ECWHSWI
P.K. is perfect.
 
ECWHSWI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 14,943
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazyd View Post
Indeed he was not producing at the same pace. But he was playing his REAL role on the team instead of trying to play a role unfitting for him with Plekanec.

If AK and Eller would of been kept together, both of them would be getting 40-50 pts next season. The missing ingredient was a better winger on the other side, in the mold of Moen but with better offensive upside.
so, you're saying he was producing LESS but it was fitting more for him ? really ?


that's the ingredient Plekanec was missing for most of last season...

ECWHSWI is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 01:24 PM
  #65
tinyzombies
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Calif via Montreal
Posts: 11,401
vCash: 500
We don't have a #1 center, we have to play strength-to-strength. So Pleks will have to continue going against #1's. His offensive numbers will continue to suffer until Eller is ready for the role. DD can't do it. Eller isn't ready yet. Galchenyuk might make the team, but doubt he'd be ready either, but you never know. He's the future #1 tho - FINALLY. When he and Eller are ready, Pleks will take off with easy second line minutes.


Last edited by tinyzombies: 07-13-2012 at 01:31 PM.
tinyzombies is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 01:35 PM
  #66
AllanMTL46
Alexei BOOM Emelin
 
AllanMTL46's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Ste-Agathe, Lotb.
Country: Canada
Posts: 680
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pr3Va1L View Post
Could a line of Patches-DD-Gio work ?

Offensively, a guy like gio would be the best shooter (great reflexes) we have for the "always be ready for a pass" kind of plays DD does.

BUT two 5'8 guys on the same line ?




OH and this year, with prust/armstrong/moen, Plekanec should hopefully get less TOI and better minutes (probably won't play the PK as much) and his production IMO will show it.
I'd try Patches - DD - Bourque. Bourque deserves another chance and he's a big guy, therefore it would make up for the loss of Cole on that line. I'd give Cole to Pleks, and maybe Gio with those two? However, we definitely need another top-6 guy. It's a definite need, 'cause we can't give Eller shi* for another season. He needs good guys beside him to develop properly, and we don't have a lot to offer to him right now if we settle the two top lines like I set them.

AllanMTL46 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 01:48 PM
  #67
marvelousmotion
Registered User
 
marvelousmotion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 742
vCash: 500
Unbelievable, Plekanec is too soft, shies away from contact, on his way out, not good enough offensively, DD is better? It's sad how fans in Montreal don't realize how much they have a gem of a player in Plekanec.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZtT5_...feature=relmfu

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4DQl2QOn8s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6VlrVF0wA5I

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97sv0fMuoLE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icLg1SlR80Q

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lHQjuP7bk0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uv8aznd9CBs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7qozN2pRhs

marvelousmotion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 02:18 PM
  #68
Talks to Goalposts
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,560
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre Dagenais View Post
Has Plekanec ever played well with Gionta?
He's played very well with Gionta. However he doesn't score lots with Gionta because that pairing only got put together to play big defensive minutes as befits the team's best defensive center playing with its best defensive winger. Bigger than either normally play which is saying something.

Cammalleri-Plekanec-Gionta weren't lighting it up but they matched up against top units about equal while taking loads of defensive zone faceoffs. With that kind of set up your other lines should score enough to make up the difference.

Pacioretty-Plekanec-Gionta was also one hell of a line when it played together in 2010-11.

As I keep saying, you have to track roles and not just scoring to understand line usage.

Talks to Goalposts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 02:25 PM
  #69
bcv
My french sucks.
 
bcv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 2,902
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davebo View Post
No, they won't.

Why break up one of the only good things from last year??? Damn, people - a little common sense!
Wanna bet that they don't spend more than 25 games together?

I'm breaking them up because I want a balanced offensive squad. The Habs had 1 line that could put up points. You think that teams don't notice that kind of stuff and won't put their best shutdown line against them?

The reason why I put Bourque with DD instead of Plekanec is because Plekanec plays the tougher minutes and Bourque won't be able to produce against them. If he plays with DD, who faces softer minutes and has easier zone starts, Bourque will do just right hitting 25 goals and 50 points.

bcv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 04:03 PM
  #70
MXD
Registered User
 
MXD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 20,398
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by beowulf View Post
Never said I wanted him to fail. If he fails, likely means the team is not doing well also but people seem to have anointed him as the undisputed no1 center in Montreal when it could very well be Plekanec.
Plekanec is certainly not the undisputed no. 1 center in Montreal. I don't think DD is either, but he's closer to that status ATM.

MXD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:04 AM
  #71
pickfair
Rookie User
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 5
vCash: 500
I know this is my first post so I don't want to sound like a know it all type, but, I have to ask: do some people on this board watch the games or only the highlights? Or just look at the stats? Or watch l'anti-chambre and get their opinions there? I mean no disrespect but based on some of the comments, I have to ask.

Deharnais: -played with the 2 best wingers most of the season.
-played on PP.
-in fact, was used strictly (almost) as an offensive player.

He had 60 points

Pleks : - played with..........mostly a bunch of nobodys (offensively speaking)
- played against the best most nights
- had a defensive role every night
- always on penalty kill, last wave of PP. (Please don't talk about his time on the blue line. That was a joke and everybody knew it except for the coaches.)

He had 52 points.

He had 8 lousy points less than our supposed first center.
If the Canadians get rid of this guy because of 1 good year by Desharnais, it will come back and haunt them.

I like Desharnais, but he's not as good as some people think, not yet anyway. It's just 1 season.

And all this for only 8 pts gap?

Hopefully Therrien will use him wisely and not defensively.

pickfair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:54 AM
  #72
capebretoncanadien
Registered User
 
capebretoncanadien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,062
vCash: 500
Pleks is the No.1. He's just so solid at both ends of the ice. It'd be nice to see him play with some talented linemates though.

I think with Gionta back maybe stick Cole with Pleky and Gionta for awhile and see how it works and stick that frigging Bourque with DD and Patches. I hate to break up that trio but we need to get more production up and down the lineup. I swear that little dangler could turn me into a 10 goal scorer.

Could you just imagine the unrelenting hustle you'd see out of a Cole, Gio Pleks line!?!?!

I'd even give Eller a chance in lieu of Bourque on the wing. At least on the PP. He hasn't looked awesome on the wing so far but another couple games wouldn't hurt. He's got more drive and talent in one finger than Bourque has in his whole body.

Line up Gomez as our third line center if he's not disposed of by the start of the season.

capebretoncanadien is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 11:14 AM
  #73
No Team Needed
Registered User
 
No Team Needed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: essex
Posts: 2,882
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by pickfair View Post
I know this is my first post so I don't want to sound like a know it all type, but, I have to ask: do some people on this board watch the games or only the highlights? Or just look at the stats? Or watch l'anti-chambre and get their opinions there? I mean no disrespect but based on some of the comments, I have to ask.

Deharnais: -played with the 2 best wingers most of the season.
-played on PP.
-in fact, was used strictly (almost) as an offensive player.

He had 60 points

Pleks : - played with..........mostly a bunch of nobodys (offensively speaking)
- played against the best most nights
- had a defensive role every night
- always on penalty kill, last wave of PP. (Please don't talk about his time on the blue line. That was a joke and everybody knew it except for the coaches.)

He had 52 points.

He had 8 lousy points less than our supposed first center.
If the Canadians get rid of this guy because of 1 good year by Desharnais, it will come back and haunt them.

I like Desharnais, but he's not as good as some people think, not yet anyway. It's just 1 season.

And all this for only 8 pts gap?

Hopefully Therrien will use him wisely and not defensively.
Great first post. It says what needs to be said.

Only thing one would need to add is Desharnais' poor numbers on the road.

No Team Needed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 11:30 AM
  #74
Et le But
Moderator
 
Et le But's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New York
Country: Argentina
Posts: 17,619
vCash: 500
I really hate the Plekanec vs Desharnais talk because they both are very different kinds of players and both have their uses but from every underlying stat I've seen it's clear Plekanec is still the best overall C on the team and it's not that close.

Really the only numbers that favour DD are points and +/-, and when you take into account context the latter is useless and the former is surprisingly close when you consider their respective roles on the team last year. And Desharnais was really not good at all when it comes to possession.

It still makes sense to use DD in an offensive role and Plekanec in a two way one, because the latter is a near-elite two way player and Desharnais isn't, but he has plenty of potential as an offensive player. But on a team with little offensive depth, to monopolize most offensive talent on one line is a bad idea unless we are talking multiple PPG players, which isn't the case.

Et le But is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 01:13 PM
  #75
habtastic
Registered User
 
habtastic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Mumbai via MTL
Country: India
Posts: 9,209
vCash: 500
It seems like a lot of people have forgotten all that Pleks has done for this team in the past 5+ years. He was given a defensive mission and he accomplished it. He has been a scorer when given the chance, he's a phenomenal passer and tbh he has pretty decent finishing. He is a valid candidate to be the captain (if Gio wasn't already) and has stood by this organization being a leader. We are lucky to have him, to have drafted and developed him and it will be a sad sad day if he leaves. For those who don't think he's produced offensively, delve a little deeper past last season and also consider the role of a two-way forward (and a damn good backchecker at that). He is not the problem. Bourque not being what he's supposed to be IS the problem. Fix that and watch that line's production be dangerous (with a healthy Gio).

I shudder at the thought of our PK without him at the top of the diamond or whatever formation we're using. Everyone knows he was frustrated by all the bs surrounding the team last year. He's a serious guy and wants to win. He's not just playing for a contract. He's playing for us to win.

habtastic is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:16 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.