Much alike losing both Carter and Richards - other will step up this year - the hunger is there. Giroux would NOT have done what he done this year had both of the previous 2 been here....
I am looking forward to the forwards and what they can do with it.
Solid stuff and all good points. Hopefully the organization decides to see where the youngsters are at a quarter way through the season. The trade deadline will certainly yield a more favorable trade market.
@Chris Shafer
That was the point of my article. IF the young players breakout. Rangers have been climbing in their point totals from 87-93-109 year after year. They are getting better. Even if the Penguins are worse defensively, they have enough talent to make it to playoffs by rolling over inferior teams (and winning shootouts of course, same with Devils). Their defense/goaltending was exploited by another offensive-minded team, same could be said of our team in the postseason. Missing out on a serviceable defenseman this offseason is going to put another full workload on Timonen and the same thing in the second round is going to happen the past two seasons. Out hustled in our own end.
@BillDineen
Always confuses me why people think that the Flyers are capable of signing everyone of the FA market. Doan isn't coming to the Flyers, neither is Arnott to play the 4th line center on a cheap deal.
I didn't vote as it isn't as simple as those options. Do I want the Flyers to sign an elite UFA to play on G's wing? Yes. There are 29 other teams. So....Shane Doan isn't coming, Parise and Suter wen't elsewhere. You can't say Homer didn't try.
Do I want them to trade for Ryan? Yes. Assuming it makes us better. Current asking price would hamper not help the Flyers.
Do I want Rick Nash? Yes. But, that cap hit is tough to swallow. I certainly do not want the Flyers to give up the asking price AND take that cap hit. If Nash was a UFA and signed in Columbus instead of Philly for that term and money I would post "thank God - no thanks for 7.8 per". To give players to attain a contract I wouldn't give to a UFA....makes zero sense
Trade for Weber? OK, what will it take, start with the Lindros trade and go from there. OK, so we give half our team to get him. Yeah, we have our shutdown D-man. But.....will he sign with us? Uh-oh.
Wait until next off-season to sign Weber, Perry and Getzlaf like many say. SO easy, except.....they might not be UFA's next year and if they are they have 29 other options.
Here is what I think:
-Make a trade if it makes us better
-Try to sign UFA's to good cap hit contracts
-Keep your draft picks and groom young players correctly (finish Juniors, year or two in the AHL, etc). Our "young core" is solid, we need to continue to build our system to "build stars" instead of planning to "buy stars".
NYR - didn't do much.
PIT - got worse, possibly significantly where defense is concerned.
PHI - got worse offensively, maybe better defensively.
NJD - lost a key player.
NYI - got slightly better.
If Schenn and Couturier each have their breakout year this year, the rest of the Atlantic isn't going to be too pleased.
Agreed - however it isn't over. Agents are doing a great job. Every free agent is rumoured to either the Rangers, Penguins or Flyers. In turn, the others wan't that player simply because they don't want him on the other teams.
If Pit gets Doan. Ouch
If Rangers trade for Nash. Meh, sounds like they will be worse with the asking price
Flyers will be battling for the division this year. I agree with Homer "I like our team"
Not gonna read all that crap but the concept that the Flyers don't have the talent to keep up any other team is laughable. It was laughable before you listed Kunitz, Fleury, Hagelin, and Dubinsky as elite.
Really. Too bad it is not on TP because if it was I would wipe my ass with it. Everyone has the right to their opinion. But so do I and that was a frigging joke if you ask me.
I would like to point out too. That Eric Wellwood had 9 points in 24 games last season while being a +12. Thats right, a +12. I bet he gets more than a cup of coffee with the big club this year, I bet he's already pencilled in for that 3rd line winger next to Couturier.
I would like to point out too. That Eric Wellwood had 9 points in 24 games last season while being a +12. Thats right, a +12. I bet he gets more than a cup of coffee with the big club this year, I bet he's already pencilled in for that 3rd line winger next to Couturier.
I agree that Wellwood should be in the lineup next year, but not on the third line with Couturier and Read. Paired with Talbot, they had 6 goals for and 2 against at even strength, and had shot differential of +5. Couturier and Read were exceptional together as they produced in limited time regardless of the other winger. Fedotenko will complement Couturier and Read nicely as Talbot and Wellwood will/should be paired together on the fourth line with Rinaldo/Shelley/Sestito while still producing.
When Voracek lined up next to G, they had 6 goals for and 6 goals against at even strength. When Read played with Giroux, they had 8 goals for and 8 goals against at even strength and surprisingly when Read played with Hartnell, they were 10 goals for and 0 goals against at even strength. Goes to show that Giroux needs another winger that can shoot volume on net (Jagr, Hartnell) and/or accurately with a high shooting % (Hartnell, Read).
That line of Simmonds, Briere and Schenn was good for one or two games (game 1 of Pitt) but for the most part, was atrocious defensively. Voracek looked good next to Briere and connected for a few goals in the playoffs.
Quick hits
- Read made everyone he played with on the ice better save Simmonds, Briere, Schenn and Jagr at even strength and even those 4 were only slightly under .500 at even strength. Add JvR to that list, and they were awful on ice together. 1 goal for and 4 against in limited time.
- Wellwood, in his limited time, made every player he was on the ice with better at even strength. That +12 was no fluke, and next to Talbot 6 goals for and 2 goals against, next to Rinaldo 1 goal for and 1 goal against. Bryz was a +7 with Wellwood on the ice, with 9 goals for and 2 goals against. Says something about Wellwood.
- Schenn made almost everyone worse at even strength save Briere, Talbot, Giroux and Rinaldo, and was only .500 at even strength with those four. Schenn really struggled through injuries and finding the right linemates this year. With JvR and Jagr gone Schenn should be penciled in for duty as a top 6 winger, favoring Giroux over Briere.
For anyone that is wondering, stats.hockeyanalysis.com shows metrics for how a player did in a lot of advanced stat measurements, worth a look.
I love watching wellwood backcheck. It's like everyone else is moving in slowmo. That kid has to be the fastest thing on skates.
I don't know if Wellwood will ever put up the numbers that Sami Kapanen did, but he's like watching Sami all over again. The guy is going to be a crowd favourite in Philadelphia and he's going to play a pivotal role on the PK.
I agree that Wellwood should be in the lineup next year, but not on the third line with Couturier and Read. Paired with Talbot, they had 6 goals for and 2 against at even strength, and had shot differential of +5. Couturier and Read were exceptional together as they produced in limited time regardless of the other winger. Fedotenko will complement Couturier and Read nicely as Talbot and Wellwood will/should be paired together on the fourth line with Rinaldo/Shelley/Sestito while still producing.
When Voracek lined up next to G, they had 6 goals for and 6 goals against at even strength. When Read played with Giroux, they had 8 goals for and 8 goals against at even strength and surprisingly when Read played with Hartnell, they were 10 goals for and 0 goals against at even strength. Goes to show that Giroux needs another winger that can shoot volume on net (Jagr, Hartnell) and/or accurately with a high shooting % (Hartnell, Read).
That line of Simmonds, Briere and Schenn was good for one or two games (game 1 of Pitt) but for the most part, was atrocious defensively. Voracek looked good next to Briere and connected for a few goals in the playoffs.
Quick hits
- Read made everyone he played with on the ice better save Simmonds, Briere, Schenn and Jagr at even strength and even those 4 were only slightly under .500 at even strength. Add JvR to that list, and they were awful on ice together. 1 goal for and 4 against in limited time.
- Wellwood, in his limited time, made every player he was on the ice with better at even strength. That +12 was no fluke, and next to Talbot 6 goals for and 2 goals against, next to Rinaldo 1 goal for and 1 goal against. Bryz was a +7 with Wellwood on the ice, with 9 goals for and 2 goals against. Says something about Wellwood.
- Schenn made almost everyone worse at even strength save Briere, Talbot, Giroux and Rinaldo, and was only .500 at even strength with those four. Schenn really struggled through injuries and finding the right linemates this year. With JvR and Jagr gone Schenn should be penciled in for duty as a top 6 winger, favoring Giroux over Briere.
For anyone that is wondering, stats.hockeyanalysis.com shows metrics for how a player did in a lot of advanced stat measurements, worth a look.
There is a massive problem with using stats like this though. That is the teams that you are playing. You don't play an inform same level talent team every night. You can't use sample games of 2 and 3 games to evaluate a how a line plays together. Schenn was also recovering form a serious shoulder injury during the start of the season.
The Flyers simply do not have enough to give up for trades and after losing out to Parise and Suter. They have been forced into a position they are not accustomed to in relying on progression and their current roster for short and long term success.
I think this is a good assessment. I think the Flyers need to play out the season with what they got, barring getting Doan (which I would like). I don’t think the Flyers should be involved in any major trades, just for the sake of the salary cap. Keep things as they are.
The biggest problem going forward which you point out is the lack of a #1 d-man after this season. That is going to be the biggest issue. Without that d-man, I don’t think the team has any real shot at the Cup, unless they change their overall style of play.
Plus no team is going to trade their #1 D-man, unless they are going to be a UFA.
I think this is a good assessment. I think the Flyers need to play out the season with what they got, barring getting Doan (which I would like). I don’t think the Flyers should be involved in any major trades, just for the sake of the salary cap. Keep things as they are.
The biggest problem going forward which you point out is the lack of a #1 d-man after this season. That is going to be the biggest issue. Without that d-man, I don’t think the team has any real shot at the Cup, unless they change their overall style of play.
Plus no team is going to trade their #1 D-man, unless they are going to be a UFA.
My thoughts exactly. Looking at the past 6 SC winners they either have a #1 or an elite pairing, Doughty, Chara, Keith/Seabrook, Gill/Scuderi, Lidstrom, Pronger AND Niedermayer. Weber is the only guy I would gut part of this team for, scoring never seems to be the issue.
My thoughts exactly. Looking at the past 6 SC winners they either have a #1 or an elite pairing, Doughty, Chara, Keith/Seabrook, Gill/Scuderi, Lidstrom, Pronger AND Niedermayer. Weber is the only guy I would gut part of this team for, scoring never seems to be the issue.
elite pairing? both are good defensemen, but an elite pair they wouldn't be considered one
I would like to point out too. That Eric Wellwood had 9 points in 24 games last season while being a +12. Thats right, a +12. I bet he gets more than a cup of coffee with the big club this year, I bet he's already pencilled in for that 3rd line winger next to Couturier.
I'd rather have one more forward. We will obviously have injuries, and we don't have enough options. Holmstrom is also a question mark on a 82 games season. I'd rather call him up when we have injuries to see him on a shorter sample, like we did this year with Wellwood.
I like Ben Holmstrom and Eric Wellwood. Who says we need to go into October with 30+ year old 4th liners? Give our young grinders a chance before throwing one-way deals at guys like Jason Arnott. I'd much rather have guys on two-way contracts that can be sent down if they don't perform.
4th liners are usually always available during the season. Notable grinders who changed teams throughout the 2011-12 season: Ryan Carter, Dave Steckel, Dale Weise, Eric Nystrom, Blake Comeau, Nodl, Klinkhammer, Barch, Gilbert Brule, Colton Gillies, Brandon Yip and that's not mentioning any deadline deals. 4th and 3rd liners don't need to be a priority especially when we have a talented top-9 and depth players in Talbot, Fedotenko, Wellwood, Rinaldo and the previously mentioned Ben Holmstrom along with other AHL'ers like Harry Z. Scott Laughton and Nick Cousins are long-term options for our bottom-6 but we definitely have some solid defensive forwards in the pipeline.
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This season and going onto next season, we need to address the defense. The forwards have room to grow and I would only add another high-end winger if our young guns slump. A #1 defensemen, if Chris Pronger is done, should be top priority. Instead of wasting assets on Bobby Ryan I'd much rather waste those assets on a defensemen (Enstrom would be who I would target - trade for and then extend like Grossmann). Timonen can still move the puck but not for much longer and we don't have any bonafide top-4 guys in our pipeline.
This season and going onto next season, we need to address the defense. The forwards have room to grow and I would only add another high-end winger if our young guns slump. A #1 defensemen, if Chris Pronger is done, should be top priority. Instead of wasting assets on Bobby Ryan I'd much rather waste those assets on a defensemen (Enstrom would be who I would target - trade for and then extend like Grossmann). Timonen can still move the puck but not for much longer and we don't have any bonafide top-4 guys in our pipeline.
Good point. I think our forward depth is good and should be OK. If we aquire some big name, big contract player, it should be a defensman, not another forward.
I would like to point out too. That Eric Wellwood had 9 points in 24 games last season while being a +12. Thats right, a +12. I bet he gets more than a cup of coffee with the big club this year, I bet he's already pencilled in for that 3rd line winger next to Couturier.
That ain't too shabby. I'd rather see Rinaldo or Sestito (preferably Sestito) on the fourth line over Holmstrom though. Doesn't make the team any better or worse IMO, but would make it more fun to watch. Probably makes the fourth line more difficult to play against.
During their SC run, they were an elite shutdown pairing.
that just proves the point that you can't say the Flyers have no shot because they do not have an elite shut guy. No one considered Gill or Scuderi shutdown guys. Who was NJ's shutdown guy? Salvador? Fein?
TB and CAR won without a shut down dman since the lockout.
