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Old
07-13-2012, 04:15 PM
  #51
Zip15
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Originally Posted by InfinityIggy View Post
Really?

Byron is looking like a long shot.

Butler is ok but he is a #4 d-man, so we downgraded our d.

And, we gave up a 2nd to get rid of Kotalik...

Not a good trade at all.
And that 2nd allowed us to trade you guys our 2nd so that we could move back up and take Girgensons. So, thanks again!

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Old
07-13-2012, 05:08 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by blankall View Post
Wasn't a fantastic trade for either team really. Regehr ended up falling to 5th on their depth chart. The only reason it worked out better for Buffalo was that Kotalik bolted for Europe, and they weren't on the hook for his contract anymore.

Certainly wasn't a one-sided donkey ****** that some people are making it out to be.
He was on the shutdown pair and allowed for Sekera to blossom. Maybe he was 5th on your magical depth chart or played the 5th most minutes but that doesn't mean he didn't fill the role the Sabres needed him to very well. And it made no difference that Kotalik bolted, he would have been buried in the AHL anyways.

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07-13-2012, 06:15 PM
  #53
InfinityIggy
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Originally Posted by thefifagod View Post
He was on the shutdown pair and allowed for Sekera to blossom. Maybe he was 5th on your magical depth chart or played the 5th most minutes but that doesn't mean he didn't fill the role the Sabres needed him to very well. And it made no difference that Kotalik bolted, he would have been buried in the AHL anyways.
Yeah, I am pretty sure Buffalo doesn't see Reggie as their 5th d-man lol.

Kotalik would've done the same thing had he stayed here so bad asset management on our part. Kotalik even said if he didn't make the Flames at camp he wouldn't report to the AHL.

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Old
07-13-2012, 06:32 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
No thanks. Not sure why either team does this. Strikes me as a trade for the sake of making a trade.
agreed, seems stale for both sides...

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Old
07-13-2012, 07:25 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by thefifagod View Post
He was on the shutdown pair and allowed for Sekera to blossom. Maybe he was 5th on your magical depth chart or played the 5th most minutes but that doesn't mean he didn't fill the role the Sabres needed him to very well. And it made no difference that Kotalik bolted, he would have been buried in the AHL anyways.
It makes a difference if Kotalik bolted. You weren't responsible for as much of his salary, which was the issue with the Flames not keeping him. The owners didn't want to pay an AHL player 3 mil.

Yes Regehr is still a complimentary player, but we got 2, at the time, descent prospects for him, which is pretty close to fair value. The Sabres did not get the Regehr of old, who was a top pairing defenceman. They got, as you say, a complimentary one that barely makes the top 4, and doesn't make the top 4 on many nights.

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Old
07-13-2012, 08:04 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by blankall View Post
It makes a difference if Kotalik bolted. You weren't responsible for as much of his salary, which was the issue with the Flames not keeping him. The owners didn't want to pay an AHL player 3 mil.

Yes Regehr is still a complimentary player, but we got 2, at the time, descent prospects for him, which is pretty close to fair value. The Sabres did not get the Regehr of old, who was a top pairing defenceman. They got, as you say, a complimentary one that barely makes the top 4, and doesn't make the top 4 on many nights.
It didn't make any difference to Buffalo that he bolted. Pegula has no problem paying money on a contract buried in the minors. That's where Morrisonn spent last year (cap casualty with a hit of, I think, 2.8mil) and likely where Pardy will go this year. Pegula will eat a bad contact to make trades happen.

And Regehr doesn't have any skills whatsoever outside of his own zone, which is fine when his partner can skate and move the puck as well as Sekera. He did a good job in his role, and him taking the tough shutdown minutes against top lines allowed guys like Ehrhoff, Myers, and Leopold to take a lot of offensive minutes. I'd make the trade again.

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Old
07-13-2012, 09:28 PM
  #57
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No it wasnt, I would make that deal again from a Calgary perspective
I wasn't a fan of the trade at the time, and I'm not a fan of it now either. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and Butler and Byron are from bad hockey players, but that's not the return I would of been looking for.

The Sabre fans were even shocked that WE were the ones that kicked in the 2nd. We gave up the best player AND a draft pick for a #4 dman and a probably a career AHL'er for what was the pillar of our blueline for the better part of a decade and signed to a good deal. It should of been Butler and a 1st, or one impact player/prospect coming back to us.

I'll never like the deal.

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07-13-2012, 09:39 PM
  #58
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I wasn't a fan of the trade at the time, and I'm not a fan of it now either. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and Butler and Byron are from bad hockey players, but that's not the return I would of been looking for.

The Sabre fans were even shocked that WE were the ones that kicked in the 2nd. We gave up the best player AND a draft pick for a #4 dman and a probably a career AHL'er for what was the pillar of our blueline for the better part of a decade and signed to a good deal. It should of been Butler and a 1st, or one impact player/prospect coming back to us.

I'll never like the deal.
Regehr was the best player but this last year Butler was better than Regehr. Regehr has just lost all speed and wasn't able to be as dominate in front of the net.

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Old
07-13-2012, 09:55 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by TheGleninator View Post
Regehr was the best player but this last year Butler was better than Regehr. Regehr has just lost all speed and wasn't able to be as dominate in front of the net.
I'm not trying to knock to Butler, I actually like him but he'll never have the upside that Regehr had. But I do agree with your assessment that Butler was probably better overall this year. Regehr is definitely slowing down, but that doesn't change the fact to me that it was a poor deal. Again, I'm more than fine that we got Butler, but if he was Feaster's target, then leave Kotalik out of the deal, and send us a 1st over Byron. That deal would of looked a whole lot better come this draft (Regehr for Butler and Girgensons).

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07-13-2012, 10:17 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by MVW View Post
I'm not trying to knock to Butler, I actually like him but he'll never have the upside that Regehr had. But I do agree with your assessment that Butler was probably better overall this year. Regehr is definitely slowing down, but that doesn't change the fact to me that it was a poor deal. Again, I'm more than fine that we got Butler, but if he was Feaster's target, then leave Kotalik out of the deal, and send us a 1st over Byron. That deal would of looked a whole lot better come this draft (Regehr for Butler and Girgensons).
I agree that Butler will never be 2005-2008 Regehr but he is young and better right not. I hate adding the second and there is no way Byron is worth a first so it is Regehr for Butler + 2nd.

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Old
07-14-2012, 01:17 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by TheGleninator View Post
I agree that Butler will never be 2005-2008 Regehr but he is young and better right not. I hate adding the second and there is no way Byron is worth a first so it is Regehr for Butler + 2nd.
Byron isn't worth a 1st, but Feaster got worked on that trade. Kaberle who was a rental, got Colborne, a 1st and a conditional pick. While Regehr wasn't quite on the level Kabs was back then, he wasn't a rental and is signed to a good contract. I see no reason why a decent roster player (ie. Butler) and a 1st shouldn't of been the return. For that reason, I'll always feel it was a poor deal especially considering we unnecessarily used Regehr to dump Kotalik and lost a 2nd in the process. At least Butler is a decent dman though.

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07-14-2012, 01:31 AM
  #62
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Originally Posted by TheGleninator View Post
I agree that Butler will never be 2005-2008 Regehr but he is young and better right not. I hate adding the second and there is no way Byron is worth a first so it is Regehr for Butler + 2nd.
Byron isn't worth a 1st, but Feaster got worked on that trade. Kaberle who was a rental, got Colborne, a 1st and a conditional pick. While Regehr wasn't quite on the level Kabs was back then, he wasn't a rental and is signed to a good contract. I see no reason why a decent roster player (ie. Butler) and a 1st shouldn't of been the return. For that reason, I'll always feel it was a poor deal especially considering we unnecessarily used Regehr to dump Kotalik and lost a 2nd in the process. At least Butler is a decent dman though.

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Old
07-14-2012, 02:21 AM
  #63
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Regier played almost every night for Buf. Butler would have been in Roc with MAG as #6 and Weber #7. Sabres gave up spare parts for a shut down dman and a pick that we spun to get Girgs. Isn't a part of that deal the Sabres lost on.

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07-14-2012, 03:25 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Imlach a cup View Post
Regier played almost every night for Buf. Butler would have been in Roc with MAG as #6 and Weber #7. Sabres gave up spare parts for a shut down dman and a pick that we spun to get Girgs. Isn't a part of that deal the Sabres lost on.
Technically it wasn't that pick that they moved to get Girgs and Regehr this year wasn't as good an all around defender as Butler the only thing we lost was a second.

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07-14-2012, 03:28 AM
  #65
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Originally Posted by MVW View Post
Byron isn't worth a 1st, but Feaster got worked on that trade. Kaberle who was a rental, got Colborne, a 1st and a conditional pick. While Regehr wasn't quite on the level Kabs was back then, he wasn't a rental and is signed to a good contract. I see no reason why a decent roster player (ie. Butler) and a 1st shouldn't of been the return. For that reason, I'll always feel it was a poor deal especially considering we unnecessarily used Regehr to dump Kotalik and lost a 2nd in the process. At least Butler is a decent dman though.
They are two different players. Simply put a pure defensive player is not worth what a pure offensive player is worth. Kabs was/is one of the best pp defenseman and Boston was desperate to fix their pp, Regehr is a top defensive defenseman but is to slow to play on a top pairing anymore and no longer brings any offense. Just because one team overpays for a player does not mean that is the bar at which all other trades should be measured. Or else we could compare it to the Dion trade.

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Old
07-14-2012, 03:39 AM
  #66
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I can't see Glencross being moved unless it's in a package for a number one center. One of those guys who actually elevated his play after getting a big contract (that 2.55 cap-hit is sweet).
Btw I gotta ask what is your name based on.

Also agreed Glencross is very underrated here.

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07-14-2012, 03:59 AM
  #67
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Technically it wasn't that pick that they moved to get Girgs and Regehr this year wasn't as good an all around defender as Butler the only thing we lost was a second.
Regehr played against the Malkins and Ovechkins of the world an held his own pretty damn well. There's nothing about his season that came in below expectations. Was an excelled addition an despite having 10? NHL ready dmen ATM no one has once considered Regehr as the guy that won't be on the roster. Every team needs a player like him and my respect for his game is very high. The Butler trade accomplished exactly what the Sabres needed and didn't cost us anything we would have missed. Hope Butler continues to improve, I liked him, but Regehr is the meat we needed on the bak end.

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07-14-2012, 06:01 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by TheGleninator View Post
Technically it wasn't that pick that they moved to get Girgs and Regehr this year wasn't as good an all around defender as Butler the only thing we lost was a second.
Didnt Butler tie the record for worst statistical game in NHL history last year?

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07-14-2012, 07:04 AM
  #69
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Didnt Butler tie the record for worst statistical game in NHL history last year?
He sure did. -7. It was obviously not the teams greatest outing.

But what's your point? He still finished will a better +/- than Regehr over the course of a full season.

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Old
07-14-2012, 07:29 AM
  #70
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He sure did. -7. It was obviously not the teams greatest outing.

But what's your point? He still finished will a better +/- than Regehr over the course of a full season.
Ah yes, I remember that game, against the Bruins.. Somehow Brodie managed to stay at 0.


Anyways, I doubt Glencross would waive his NMC, as he loves Calgary and has family here.

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Old
07-14-2012, 08:37 AM
  #71
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Technically it wasn't that pick that they moved to get Girgs and Regehr this year wasn't as good an all around defender as Butler the only thing we lost was a second.
The Sabres managed to turn a 4th line C, a bottom pairing dman, an ahl depth player, and a 4th rd pick into Robyn Regehr and Zemgus Girgensons. Id do that any day of the week

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07-14-2012, 10:30 AM
  #72
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Didnt Butler tie the record for worst statistical game in NHL history last year?
Yes he did, that was a hard game to watch without that game he was only -2 for the year.

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07-14-2012, 10:31 AM
  #73
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The Sabres managed to turn a 4th line C, a bottom pairing dman, an ahl depth player, and a 4th rd pick into Robyn Regehr and Zemgus Girgensons. Id do that any day of the week
You missed the point technically that also traded a 2nd as the 2nd they traded was their own not calgary's when they moved up.

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Old
07-14-2012, 10:50 AM
  #74
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You missed the point technically that also traded a 2nd as the 2nd they traded was their own not calgary's when they moved up.
Its a wash they were 2 picks apart in the 2nd round. If we didnt get the 2nd from you it would have made a difference, but it didnt

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Old
07-14-2012, 11:11 AM
  #75
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You missed the point technically that also traded a 2nd as the 2nd they traded was their own not calgary's when they moved up.
I'm pretty sure everyone would have ended up with the same players if we had traded you your own pick back. But just to keep the nitpickers happy:

The Sabres managed to turn a 4th line C, a bottom pairing dman, an ahl depth player, a 4th rd pick, and move back two slots in the 2nd round, into Robyn Regehr and Zemgus Girgensons.

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