HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Toronto Maple Leafs
Notices

NHL Proposal to NHLPA...first shot.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
07-13-2012, 10:26 PM
  #26
91Kadri91
Registered User
 
91Kadri91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,215
vCash: 500
Lockout? You people are crazy.

The government will just legislate them all back.

91Kadri91 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 10:46 PM
  #27
mix1home
Registered User
 
mix1home's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Toronto,ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,527
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 91Kadri91 View Post
Lockout? You people are crazy.

The government will just legislate them all back.
Not all of them, but only Canadian franchises. Which is kind of good as with all those extra point between our teams all 7 clubs can qualify for post-season if lockout lasts long enough.

mix1home is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 10:55 PM
  #28
91Kadri91
Registered User
 
91Kadri91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,215
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by mix1home View Post
Not all of them, but only Canadian franchises. Which is kind of good as with all those extra point between our teams all 7 clubs can qualify for post-season if lockout lasts long enough.
Are you kidding me? This is Lisa Raitt you're talking about!

The entire world is within her jurisdiction!

91Kadri91 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:12 PM
  #29
number72
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 5,883
vCash: 500
If things turn disastrous this means the leafs get another lotto pick in next years draft.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mcleex View Post
Wait why do they care when a player becomes UFA? like what difference does that make to the NHL, how does it benefit them
Because the leafs keep Gardiner for 10 years cheaply before he gets his big pay day as UFA at 30.

number72 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:15 PM
  #30
Kessely Snipes
Great White North
 
Kessely Snipes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Regina, SK
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,396
vCash: 500
It will be embarrassing for the NHL if they end up having another lockout, especially when the NFL and NBA manged to come to terms and salvage their seasons.

Kessely Snipes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:27 PM
  #31
Suntouchable13
Registered User
 
Suntouchable13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Thornhill, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 16,554
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kessely Snipes View Post
It will be embarrassing for the NHL if they end up having another lockout, especially when the NFL and NBA manged to come to terms and salvage their seasons.
There better not be any missed time at all. I am speaking for myself here, I am much more than a casual fan and if there is any lockout (even if it is does not wipe off the whole season) the NHL will lose me a little bit. I do believe that many hardcore fans will start tuning out this league a bit if there is another lockout. 2 lockouts within a span of less than 10 years? That is BS, and should not be allowed to happen.

Suntouchable13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:36 PM
  #32
smoke meat pete*
VoiceofReason
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,905
vCash: 500
Also of note:

5 year contract limits

Salary must be equal in all years of contracts, no signing bonus.

ELC 5 years instead of 3

No more arbitration

smoke meat pete* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:36 PM
  #33
number72
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 5,883
vCash: 500
The GMs are great - basically they are saying hey guys
1. Take a 20% pay cut
2. Delay your UFA payoff date by 40%
3. Accept a maximum guaranteed contract for 5 years with no signing bonuses
4. Let's extend by 40% the the time we can pay you least amount as possible even if you turn out to be the next Crosby and
5. Ditch arbitration because GMs will keep RFA salaries competitive by offer sheeting except the leafs where Burke will kill others GMs in a barn

number72 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:38 PM
  #34
LEAFANFORLIFE23
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 6,656
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by number72 View Post
The GMs are great - basically they are saying hey guys
1. Take a 20% pay cut
2. Delay your UFA payoff date by 40%
3. Accept a maximum guaranteed contract for 5 years with no signing bonuses
4. Let's extend the the time we can pay you least amount as possible by 40% even if you turn out to be the next Crosby and
5. Its time to ditch arbitration because GMs will keep RFA salaries competitive by aggressively offer sheeting except the leafs where Burke will kill others GMs in a barn
The owners are saying that not the GM's

LEAFANFORLIFE23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:39 PM
  #35
LEAFANFORLIFE23
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 6,656
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by smoke meat pete View Post
Also of note:

5 year contract limits

Salary must be equal in all years of contracts, no signing bonus.

ELC 5 years instead of 3

No more arbitration
I like the 5 year contract limits and I don't mind the 5 year ELC

LEAFANFORLIFE23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:39 PM
  #36
Thrillingbroom
Registered User
 
Thrillingbroom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 3,797
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by number72 View Post
The GMs are great basically they are saying hey guys
1. Take a 20% pay cut
2. Delay your UFA payoff date by 40%
3. Accept a maximum guaranteed contract for 5 years with no signing bonuses
4. Let's extend the the time we can pay you least amount as possible by 40% even if you turn out to be the next Crosby and
5. Its time to ditch arbitration because GMs will keep RFA salaries competitive by aggressively offer sheeting except the leafs where Burke will kill others GMs in a barn
You clearly have no clue what you're talking about. The discussion is between owner and players.

Thrillingbroom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:40 PM
  #37
Squiffy
Victims, rn't we all
 
Squiffy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,516
vCash: 500
ELC's from 3 to 5 years.. can't see that one getting through. Frankly I like a lot of the contract related stuff, it'll knock off all the BS structuring. Lots of room to compromise.. maybe UFA 8 years ultimately, 6-7 years max contract, in exchange the league moves the players share of HRR into the 52-ish range or something. It's not labour armageddon.. yet.

__________________
bWo: If you don't know, you should know... Buds WORLD Order Constitution
Adj: "Squiffy" - stupefied by a chemical substance (esp. alcohol)

R.I.P. Darryl buddy... it was too soon.. too soon
Squiffy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:40 PM
  #38
number72
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 5,883
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thrillingbroom View Post
You clearly have no clue what you're talking about. The discussion is between owner and players.
Edit...should be owners. Yeah I have no clue

number72 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:01 AM
  #39
smoke meat pete*
VoiceofReason
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,905
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Squiffy View Post
ELC's from 3 to 5 years.. can't see that one getting through. Frankly I like a lot of the contract related stuff, it'll knock off all the BS structuring. Lots of room to compromise.. maybe UFA 8 years ultimately, 6-7 years max contract, in exchange the league moves the players share of HRR into the 52-ish range or something. It's not labour armageddon.. yet.
With a fixed % of HRR, what does it matter how long any contracts are for, or how much goes out as bonuses? It's still 52% or whatever it ends up being. All signing bonuses are is one GM screwing small market teams. Not really a player issue.

smoke meat pete* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:03 AM
  #40
S2S
Come at me bros
 
S2S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,852
vCash: 500
Sounds like Burke's "self-imposed" rules about contract length might become common practice in the NHL. Good on him for not giving eternal contracts. If so, people can stop whining about not signing a player until he is 50 anymore.

S2S is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:04 AM
  #41
number72
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 5,883
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by number72 View Post
The GMs are great - basically they are saying hey guys
1. Take a 20% pay cut
2. Delay your UFA payoff date by 40%
3. Accept a maximum guaranteed contract for 5 years with no signing bonuses
4. Let's extend by 40% the the time we can pay you least amount as possible even if you turn out to be the next Crosby and
5. Ditch arbitration because GMs will keep RFA salaries competitive by offer sheeting except the leafs where Burke will kill others GMs in a barn

Just for heck of it, the players come back with something equally ridiculous
1. Player Revenue Sharing of 65% plus any unused cap space is paid out to players
2. No more RFA. Players will become UFA when their ELC expires.
3. 5 year minimum UFA contracts with a mandatory 10%+ signing bonus
4. Two year ELC term
5. Arbitration to be replaced by salary adjustment that increases yearly as the cap ceiling rises.

number72 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:05 AM
  #42
smoke meat pete*
VoiceofReason
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,905
vCash: 500
It sounds to me that owners are creating 200 issues knowing the only 2 that matter are the calculation and % of HRR. All the rest are GM issues, not NHLPA issues.

Although it's sad they need to put in parts to protect GM's from themselves. (Contract term limits).

smoke meat pete* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:34 AM
  #43
Quik
Agent 0091
 
Quik's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Unknown
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,883
vCash: 500
Considering where Bettman and the BOG are coming in, I think they'll probably end up settling around:

--Player revenues 50-52%
--Contract Length 7-8 years
--Unrestricted Free Agency 8-9 seasons/28-29 yrs old
--ELC 4 years, higher base, no bonuses (NHLPA won't care much about ELC's, since existing ones won't be changed, new ones aren't part of PA yet)
--Minimal Salary variation (10-25% from AAV)

I think another sticking point will be the cap, considering that in 7 years we've gone from an upper limit of $39 million to a lower limit of around $54 million...even with inflation that's more than a $8 million difference between the original ceiling and the current floor. I think that limiting changing the floor back to 55% instead of the $16 million from the ceiling would be the easiest solution to the huge rise in the floor, but I can see the league going after tighter control on cap changes.

Also think they should get rid of the trapezoid, and look at making goalie equipment smaller, but those are more personal hopes. My biggest wish would be getting rid of the loser point and keeping the system where ROWs are worth more than SOWs; or make SOWs worth just one point. That way, every game has a winner, good teams separate from crappy teams, and you get more motivation to win before the game goes to shootout, which means no more laying back and letting skill guys go for it on breakaways.

Quik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:35 AM
  #44
number72
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 5,883
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by smoke meat pete View Post
It sounds to me that owners are creating 200 issues knowing the only 2 that matter are the calculation and % of HRR. All the rest are GM issues, not NHLPA issues.

Although it's sad they need to put in parts to protect GM's from themselves. (Contract term limits).

Yep. The signing bonus and length are largely under their control of management.
I don't get why the NHLPA needs to approve the bonus/contract length. I mean, why can't the owners/GM simply agree to not provide bonuses nor offer these long contracts. The risk I see is a player walks to the KHL. And if a GM cheats he loses draft picks.

In fact, what the owners could push for terms that allow only the team with the player on their roster (Nashville in Suter's case) to offer a bonus and a 6 year contract. And other UFA teams have 5 year and no bonus.

number72 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:36 AM
  #45
Squiffy
Victims, rn't we all
 
Squiffy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,516
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by smoke meat pete View Post
With a fixed % of HRR, what does it matter how long any contracts are for, or how much goes out as bonuses? It's still 52% or whatever it ends up being. All signing bonuses are is one GM screwing small market teams. Not really a player issue.
Signing bonuses don't bother me, that one I would hope is small potatoes and the owners can slide right off it. Exactly as you say, fixed %, should be no problem, it's not a crucial negotiating point.

And, you're right, it's sad that owners have to save themselves from themselves with contract lengths, but lets face it, it's the only way it'll stop. I just think these 10 year deals are full retard mode, and as we know you should never go full retard. They mess up the pay scale, limit player movement, just don't like them. 5 years is probably too short to cap, but 6-7 sounds fine to me.

I think UFA happens too soon too, again, whacking out the pay scale. Think it needs a tweak, UFA at possibly 25 is silly, at definitely 27 slightly silly. I wouldn't mind seeing both slid back a year or two.

Saw a post suggesting that the PA ought to respond with a proposal including that RFA draft pick compensation be dropped.. like that idea.

The scariest part of what's being reported is re-defining the calculation of HRR. That I don't see any reason for, that's some ******** right there. Hopefully that's intended to be the negotiating piece they move off to get some of their more sensible requests. NHLPA response is sure to include a serious adjustment to revenue sharing, which is sure to get interesting too. As a Leaf fan I'm not sure I like any additional sharing, we'll see what's tabled though I guess.

I'm coming off here sounding very pro-owner I think, but I'm really not, traditionally I'm pro-player. I had no problem with no cap, but it's not coming back, so I guess since the framework of the CBA was set already in the last round I just want to see it finished off properly, 'cause really it is going to wind up there ultimately and get on with it all already. Pragmatic I guess.

Squiffy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:42 AM
  #46
Squiffy
Victims, rn't we all
 
Squiffy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,516
vCash: 500
Also for the record, this thread promises to be the best thread on here in ages, already seeing a few great posts from some guys that don't chime in here like they once did and know their stuff. Likely to be the second best CBA thread on HF behind the BoH board for knowledge and intelligence, this board always had that side to it when it's brought out. Could be real good for the forum..

Squiffy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:45 AM
  #47
Quik
Agent 0091
 
Quik's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Unknown
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,883
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Squiffy View Post
Also for the record, this thread promises to be the best thread on here in ages, already seeing a few great posts from some guys that don't chime in here like they once did and know their stuff. Likely to be the second best CBA thread on HF behind the BoH board for knowledge and intelligence, this board always had that side to it when it's brought out. Could be real good for the forum..
You mean me right? lol

But yeah, definitely a lot of good discussion already. I think we can all agree this is the league putting a bogus offer to pull back on some and get some of what they want. Only concern is that Bettman sticks with his hard stance like the last time and locks out again.

Quik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:46 AM
  #48
Squiffy
Victims, rn't we all
 
Squiffy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,516
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quik View Post
You mean me right? lol
Pretty much, ya lol. More will follow, lead the way Quik

Squiffy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:48 AM
  #49
Quik
Agent 0091
 
Quik's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Unknown
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,883
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Squiffy View Post
Pretty much, ya lol. More will follow, lead the way Quik
aw shucks




Quik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:56 AM
  #50
Kb21
Registered User
 
Kb21's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,381
vCash: 500
when the season become a doubt both sides will then start to negotiate, the first offers are always outta whack. i still believe the season will start on time.

Kb21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:37 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.