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Could Plekanec be the one on the way out ?

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Old
07-07-2012, 01:46 PM
  #401
Madam Kadri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by macavoy View Post
Pleks is the kind of player that Bergevin covets. Strong two way player, very solid offensive upside. You win championships with these type of players.

Think 2012 LA Kings Justin Williams
2011 Bruins Patrice Bergeron
2010 Black Hawks David Bolland
2009 Penguins Jordan Staal
2008 Red Wings Johan Franzen.



Pleks isn't going anywhere. He is way more valuable than DD and Eller ainec. People love to under rate Pleks on HF. He's also known for having a great year after a down year. Pleks would likely be a PPG on an offensive minded team and people would be screaming at Bergy if he ever traded him.

Which is why he won't be trading him. Pleks is only 29, he's got a solid 5 years of averaging 60 points a season while playing hard defensive minutes.
Franzen and defense are not two things that go hand in hand. Datsyuk and Zetterberg were Selke finalists that year though and they deserve to be hailed as two-way players that year.

And offensively, Mikael Samuelsson played a much more pivotal role.

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07-07-2012, 04:59 PM
  #402
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Originally Posted by Blame it on PK View Post
Franzen and defense are not two things that go hand in hand. Datsyuk and Zetterberg were Selke finalists that year though and they deserve to be hailed as two-way players that year.

And offensively, Mikael Samuelsson played a much more pivotal role.
That list was seemingly just a random list of one player from each of the last 5 cup winners.

It was really bizarre.

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07-14-2012, 12:49 AM
  #403
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Originally Posted by Firestar27 View Post
Trade Pleks and see how DD becomes a lot less effective because suddenly other teams know he's the #1 center and needs to be shut down.


Heck, Pleks played with Darche and Bourque at the end of last season, can't do much with wingers like that... I'd love to see him go to a team like Chicago or Detroit. All of you wanting him traded would see that he ain't 'just a 50 pts softy'.

Remember Cammy, 50% of his goals came from a perfect saucer pass from Plekanec, he just need a real winger.
last 10 games of season for plek 6 points
last 10 games desharnais 5 pts

plek is underrated for some reason.

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07-14-2012, 12:57 AM
  #404
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I screwed up my quote and lost my train of thought.

That Pat guy is infuriating


Last edited by pickfair: 07-14-2012 at 01:15 AM. Reason: wrong quote
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07-14-2012, 08:01 AM
  #405
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
I wouldn't mind a packafe around Plekanec and Ryan.

This is exactly what i was getting at when i created this thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pickfair View Post
last 10 games of season for plek 6 points
last 10 games desharnais 5 pts

plek is underrated for some reason.
Yes, his amazing 10 game streak at the end of the season, locked up our playoff position. 1-2 line center pfffft.

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07-14-2012, 08:48 AM
  #406
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Quote:
Originally Posted by macavoy View Post
Pleks is the kind of player that Bergevin covets. Strong two way player, very solid offensive upside. You win championships with these type of players.

Think 2012 LA Kings Justin Williams
2011 Bruins Patrice Bergeron
2010 Black Hawks David Bolland
2009 Penguins Jordan Staal
2008 Red Wings Johan Franzen.



Pleks isn't going anywhere. He is way more valuable than DD and Eller ainec. People love to under rate Pleks on HF. He's also known for having a great year after a down year. Pleks would likely be a PPG on an offensive minded team and people would be screaming at Bergy if he ever traded him.

Which is why he won't be trading him. Pleks is only 29, he's got a solid 5 years of averaging 60 points a season while playing hard defensive minutes.
Sorry but THIS is a wrong reasoning.

It's unfair to compare Plekanec to those players because unlike him, all those players don't fear to go in high traffic areas and in front of the net, especially in the playoffs.

Plekanec is and has always been a perimeter player who shies to go in high traffic areas and in front of the net. He's a player who works hard at both ends of the ice with exemplary work ethic, is very good to read the play in the defensive zone and has above average offensive potential (50-60 pts). He is a player that can be very valuable for a team to help it get in the playoffs, but once there he becomes less valuable because he shies the high traffic areas and the front of the net unlike DD for example. He will get the job done in his own zone but in the offensive zone, it will be hard for him to have any sort of impact. In fact, to me, he doesn't look at all like a Michel Therrien/Marc Bergevin type of player.

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07-14-2012, 12:15 PM
  #407
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyFan87 View Post
Sorry but THIS is a wrong reasoning.

It's unfair to compare Plekanec to those players because unlike him, all those players don't fear to go in high traffic areas and in front of the net, especially in the playoffs.

Plekanec is and has always been a perimeter player who shies to go in high traffic areas and in front of the net. He's a player who works hard at both ends of the ice with exemplary work ethic, is very good to read the play in the defensive zone and has above average offensive potential (50-60 pts). He is a player that can be very valuable for a team to help it get in the playoffs, but once there he becomes less valuable because he shies the high traffic areas and the front of the net unlike DD for example. He will get the job done in his own zone but in the offensive zone, it will be hard for him to have any sort of impact. In fact, to me, he doesn't look at all like a Michel Therrien/Marc Bergevin type of player.
Very good point. Gone before the beginning of the season.

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07-14-2012, 12:26 PM
  #408
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You can't win with players that are all the same.

Boston, the team that causes a lot of Habs fan to have size and ''toughness'' issue with our current roster, had David Krejci as their no1 center when they won the cup.

He's comparable to Plekanec. Neither are really physical or big, Krejci is slightly more consistant offensively but plays with much better player while Plekanec is steadier defensively. Detroit excelled with players in the mold of Plekanec. Plekanec is a very hard worker, he's skilled and is reliable.

''He doesn't ram the net and deliver bone crushing hits while fighting goons all over the place!'' - sure, then why don't we have him play with a player that does it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by YourBuddy
Very good point. Gone before the beginning of the season.
30th place here we come! It would be a very long season without Plekanec, Desharnais, Eller and scrub Gomez would all struggle immensely. Honestly I'd rather have a lockout than endure the humiliation of a terrible team again. Seriously if Bergevin wants to tank, then trading Plekanec is the no1 solution.

If he wants to win then trading Plekanec is simply put a boneheaded move. He would never acquire a player than can be as useful to the team as Plekanec in a trade.

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07-14-2012, 12:27 PM
  #409
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Originally Posted by HockeyFan87 View Post
Sorry but THIS is a wrong reasoning.

It's unfair to compare Plekanec to those players because unlike him, all those players don't fear to go in high traffic areas and in front of the net, especially in the playoffs.

Plekanec is and has always been a perimeter player who shies to go in high traffic areas and in front of the net. He's a player who works hard at both ends of the ice with exemplary work ethic, is very good to read the play in the defensive zone and has above average offensive potential (50-60 pts). He is a player that can be very valuable for a team to help it get in the playoffs, but once there he becomes less valuable because he shies the high traffic areas and the front of the net unlike DD for example. He will get the job done in his own zone but in the offensive zone, it will be hard for him to have any sort of impact. In fact, to me, he doesn't look at all like a Michel Therrien/Marc Bergevin type of player.
Please... Plekanec is a player THAT EVERY COACH and GM will like. He is a professional, a hard worker and responsible player. Every single coach will like him. You don't need to be the grittiest player to have success in the NHL. Plekanec is a player capable of 60-70 pts with top 6 wingers and he will also be a great defensive player at the same time.

Plekanec is here for a long time now and not a single time he has to face any criticism or any kind of controversy. Saying he's not MT or MB type of player because he's not gritty enough is just stupid.

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07-14-2012, 01:10 PM
  #410
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pickfair View Post
last 10 games of season for plek 6 points
last 10 games desharnais 5 pts

plek is underrated for some reason.
who cares about the last 10 games of the season when you're not even making the playoffs? what's matters is every game of the season together

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07-14-2012, 01:29 PM
  #411
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Originally Posted by Rosso Scuderia View Post
Please... Plekanec is a player THAT EVERY COACH and GM will like. He is a professional, a hard worker and responsible player. Every single coach will like him. You don't need to be the grittiest player to have success in the NHL. Plekanec is a player capable of 60-70 pts with top 6 wingers and he will also be a great defensive player at the same time.

Plekanec is here for a long time now and not a single time he has to face any criticism or any kind of controversy. Saying he's not MT or MB type of player because he's not gritty enough is just stupid.
He is not theri type pf player because he is NOT a winner. There happy.

And to respond to the centers of FlyingKostitsyn, I would love for Gally to come in and take the 3rd center and move Eller up to 2 with DD on the first and most productive line we have had in over 15 years.

DD,Gally-Eller,on the 4th Dumont-Noke....

My goodness the one who himself calls a girl, has gotten the Habs a 3rd pick in 2012...Time to move on.

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07-14-2012, 04:37 PM
  #412
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Originally Posted by YourBuddy View Post
This is exactly what i was getting at when i created this thread.



Yes, his amazing 10 game streak at the end of the season, locked up our playoff position. 1-2 line center pfffft.
yeah, I know its not that great. But he was playing with 3-4th liners and he still managed to get points. More than Deharnais and he played with his regulars.
The fact that he still performed and not slack off despite the fact they were not getting into the playoffs, says a lot about this man.


Last edited by pickfair: 07-14-2012 at 05:11 PM. Reason: to clarify better
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07-14-2012, 05:05 PM
  #413
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyFan87 View Post
Sorry but THIS is a wrong reasoning.

It's unfair to compare Plekanec to those players because unlike him, all those players don't fear to go in high traffic areas and in front of the net, especially in the playoffs.

Plekanec is and has always been a perimeter player who shies to go in high traffic areas and in front of the net. He's a player who works hard at both ends of the ice with exemplary work ethic, is very good to read the play in the defensive zone and has above average offensive potential (50-60 pts). He is a player that can be very valuable for a team to help it get in the playoffs, but once there he becomes less valuable because he shies the high traffic areas and the front of the net unlike DD for example. He will get the job done in his own zone but in the offensive zone, it will be hard for him to have any sort of impact. In fact, to me, he doesn't look at all like a Michel Therrien/Marc Bergevin type of player.
Plekanec really doesn't avoid contact completely, he just isn't very effective in it. I never understand it when people who watch this team regularly say Plekanec avoids the corners and net, he's not enthusiastically crashing into everything but that's because his game is about speed, positioning and stickwork and when you play significantly more time than any other forward on your team and are undersized without being built like a tank, you can't afford to be hitting into everything.

Desharnais for instance might go into the corners more and I love his fearlessness, but it's not always effective and if Desharnais is going to be a true number 1 center he's going to have to learn to pick his battles if he wants a long career.

Quote:
Originally Posted by YourBuddy View Post
He is not theri type pf player because he is NOT a winner. There happy.
But Desharnais is a winner for putting up 60 points on one of the worst teams in the league? What is a "winner" exactly?

Quote:
Originally Posted by YourBuddy View Post
My goodness the one who himself calls a girl, has gotten the Habs a 3rd pick in 2012...Time to move on.
It's Plekanec's fault the Habs were awful last year? Did he intentionally chose to start all his shifts in his own zone surrounded by scrubs?

I respect your opinion on thinking he should be trading looking to the future, but when you say things like this you approach patofqc territory.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TakiHaque View Post
who cares about the last 10 games of the season when you're not even making the playoffs? what's matters is every game of the season together
Plekanec was at a near PPG base for the first few months of the season back when the team was just outside the playoffs despite an awful start. His worse stretch of the season and including one of the worst months since he became an NHL regular was when the team was imploding. If anything Plekanec has been a barometer for this team's success in the past few years.


Last edited by Et le But: 07-14-2012 at 05:11 PM.
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07-14-2012, 05:31 PM
  #414
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Originally Posted by TakiHaque View Post
who cares about the last 10 games of the season when you're not even making the playoffs? what's matters is every game of the season together
I care. And I guess Pleks did too. He kept playing his game despite the fact they were out of the playoffs.

As a fan you should care if a player plays like crap; whether they make it to the post season or not. Plek rarely took a night off. Same for Desharnais. I'm not dumping on him, I just don't think he's number 1.

Trading Plek just because Deharnais had 1 good year would be dumb. Especially if you can't replace his minutes.

And that guy we drafted first round (forgot his name), we have no idea if he will amount to anything.

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07-14-2012, 09:05 PM
  #415
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Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
Plekanec really doesn't avoid contact completely, he just isn't very effective in it. I never understand it when people who watch this team regularly say Plekanec avoids the corners and net, he's not enthusiastically crashing into everything but that's because his game is about speed, positioning and stickwork and when you play significantly more time than any other forward on your team and are undersized without being built like a tank, you can't afford to be hitting into everything.
I think you're trying to find excuses to explain his lack of willingness to get his nose dirtier if you ask me. I've watched Plekanec play with the team since the first game he played with them back in 2003-2004. What I mean is he doesn't engage physically often enough to have any sort of impact when the tougher get going. He seems like a nice guy but he definitely avoid too much playing along the boards, I'm not talking about playing a power forward game here. Players like David Krejci and Patrick Kane, to name a few, play a similar game to him and they don't mind getting their noses dirtier when they have to. I think deep inside, people know that. They just don't want to admit it to themselves.

Rarely have I seen him playing consistently the cycle game since he joined the team. His playing style should not prevent him to play a bit more along the boards. IF he is not able to do that, then he definitely isn't a player you're going to win with in the playoffs where the game becomes way more tighter than in the season.

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07-14-2012, 09:24 PM
  #416
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyFan87 View Post
I think you're trying to find excuses to explain his lack of willingness to get his nose dirtier if you ask me. I've watched Plekanec play with the team since the first game he played with them back in 2003-2004. What I mean is he doesn't engage physically often enough to have any sort of impact when the tougher get going. He seems like a nice guy but he definitely avoid too much playing along the boards, I'm not talking about playing a power forward game here. Players like David Krejci and Patrick Kane, to name a few, play a similar game to him and they don't mind getting their noses dirtier when they have to. I think deep inside, people know that. They just don't want to admit it to themselves.

Rarely have I seen him playing consistently the cycle game since he joined the team. His playing style should not prevent him to play a bit more along the boards. IF he is not able to do that, then he definitely isn't a player you're going to win with in the playoffs where the game becomes way more tighter than in the season.
Well, he is a perimeter player, like, Krecji and Kane. I just don't see it as someone afraid of contact, just someone that more physical players know how to push around when he does engage. But it's not true that he always avoids contact.

There are some players who genuinely avoid contact. Plekanec isn't one of them, he just rarely initiates it. Is it weakness? It depends on who he is playing with and against, it's not a one man sport.

If he could dominate in heavy traffic he'd be a better player. But it's not true at all that he disappears in the playoffs

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07-14-2012, 09:40 PM
  #417
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No what what we think, you only move him if it makes sense. For it to make sense, it has to be an upgrade.
Enough of this giving players away for nothing. If you trade Plekanec, there must be a darn good player coming back.
Players I would do one for one that are apparently available:
Marleau
Nash
Bobby Ryan
Stastny

I like Plekanec but.....at this point if we can get one of these guy, I'm all over it. The one that intrigues me the most is Stastny. Him and Pacioretty is just aw some.

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07-14-2012, 10:32 PM
  #418
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Originally Posted by YourBuddy View Post
He is not theri type pf player because he is NOT a winner. There happy.

And to respond to the centers of FlyingKostitsyn, I would love for Gally to come in and take the 3rd center and move Eller up to 2 with DD on the first and most productive line we have had in over 15 years.

DD,Gally-Eller,on the 4th Dumont-Noke....

My goodness the one who himself calls a girl, has gotten the Habs a 3rd pick in 2012...Time to move on.
Uh no. Still bull crap to me.

Why is Plekanec not a winner? How do you determine when a guy is a winner or not? Are Price, Gorges, Subban all losers because they haven't won the cup yet?

And move on from what? What the **** are you talking about? Here's still with this team and he is our most important center.

People like you that has no argument always bring up "I played like a girl" because you actually have no argument to bash Plekanec.

So you're saying that one of the reason why we ended last in the Eastern conference is because of Plekanec? It feels like you started watching hockey this june.. because you seem to miss the part where Plekanec played with pluggers almost all year long and despite that, he still managed to get 52 pts.

Btw, for the people saying Plek "disappears" in the playoffs. His season PPG average is 0.658 and playoffs is 0.617, its not that big of a drop.

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07-14-2012, 11:20 PM
  #419
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I would not mind that at all. Stasny would fit well here IMO. But the reality is that we would not be grade trading partners. They allready have good depth at center with Oreily and Duchesne.

I would not mind if Gally impresses enough at camp to go with him at center which could open for new possibilities. Perhaps Nash could be a possibilities.

How about.. Nash for Plek, gallagher and our 1st round selection in 2013. This would change our lineup.
Pacioretty, DD, Cole
Nash, gallchenyuk, Gionta
Moen, Eller, leblanc
Prust,White, Armstrog

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07-14-2012, 11:54 PM
  #420
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another quality thread.plex is our best center .why in the hell would he be on his way out?

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07-14-2012, 11:56 PM
  #421
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just saw this thread and was wondering.......Why would we want to get rid of Plekanec?

Centers currently available....

David Desharnais
Lars Eller
Scott Gomez
Tomas Plekanec
Alex Galchenyuk

Both Desharnais and Eller are young and still need improvement...

Eller - I know last year he filled that role but I don't see Eller as a shutdown center....he kind of reminds me of a less skilled Saku Koivu....good for assists and pots in a goal (or 4) here and there. He's going to need time to develop too.

Desharnais - he's had success with Pacciorretti in the AHL and it seems as though it carried over to the NHL. Though having one good year doesn't cement him into the #1 center position. He thrived because he has two big skilled wingers who were able to bring it to the net. The book is still out on him. Let's see how he does with a second full season.

Gomez - There's no way of getting rid of his contract unless he is sent down to the AHL or bought out. Buying him out doesn't make sense because the cap hit without him just isn't worth it to bear. Sending him down is unlikely as I'm sure Molson doesn't want to be spending $5.5 million (around what he's getting paid this year) for a player playing in the AHL (he doesn't have NY Ranger money to just throw it away). At the end of the day - money aside - Gomez makes for a really good 3rd-4th line center.

Galchenyuk - Skilled and young, will become a top 1-2 line Center....over time! It might not be worth it to rush him into the lineup. Especially since he's coming off of a pretty serious knee injury. For his development it would be wise to have him play another year in the OHL or wherever he's eligible to play. For his moral, it'll probably be disappointing to him if he doesn't make the club - which can either set him back or encourage him to work harder for next year. Although at the end of the day it all depends on how his training camp works out.

Plekanec - skilled two way center. Has proven he can shutdown teams top lines. Playing with skilled wingers he can put up points as well. Most teams would love to have him (and at his salary too).

With Desharnais currently centering the #1 line with Cole and Paciorretti, Gomez possibly centering the #4 line, Galchenyuk possibly returning to the OHL, and Eller in either 2nd or 3rd line duties, the center position hasn't had this much depth in years (and Nokeleinan as an extra) and it would be foolish to try and trade him for a winger (especially if we can sign one via UFA or allow one of the younger players to try to prove they belong in the NHL ex: Gallagher, Palushaj, etc...).

He can be the shutdown center that we lacked last year (he's very effective in that role...as long as he's told that that's what is wanted of him - just look at what made the habs successful in the year we made it to the conference finals). And if Eller or Desharnais don't work out on the top 2 lines he can be bumped back up.

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07-15-2012, 12:04 AM
  #422
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Quote:
Originally Posted by axman88 View Post
just saw this thread and was wondering.......Why would we want to get rid of Plekanec?

Centers currently available....

David Desharnais
Lars Eller
Scott Gomez
Tomas Plekanec
Alex Galchenyuk

Both Desharnais and Eller are young and still need improvement...

Eller - I know last year he filled that role but I don't see Eller as a shutdown center....he kind of reminds me of a less skilled Saku Koivu....good for assists and pots in a goal (or 4) here and there. He's going to need time to develop too.

Desharnais - he's had success with Pacciorretti in the AHL and it seems as though it carried over to the NHL. Though having one good year doesn't cement him into the #1 center position. He thrived because he has two big skilled wingers who were able to bring it to the net. The book is still out on him. Let's see how he does with a second full season.

Gomez - There's no way of getting rid of his contract unless he is sent down to the AHL or bought out. Buying him out doesn't make sense because the cap hit without him just isn't worth it to bear. Sending him down is unlikely as I'm sure Molson doesn't want to be spending $5.5 million (around what he's getting paid this year) for a player playing in the AHL (he doesn't have NY Ranger money to just throw it away). At the end of the day - money aside - Gomez makes for a really good 3rd-4th line center.

Galchenyuk - Skilled and young, will become a top 1-2 line Center....over time! It might not be worth it to rush him into the lineup. Especially since he's coming off of a pretty serious knee injury. For his development it would be wise to have him play another year in the OHL or wherever he's eligible to play. For his moral, it'll probably be disappointing to him if he doesn't make the club - which can either set him back or encourage him to work harder for next year. Although at the end of the day it all depends on how his training camp works out.

Plekanec - skilled two way center. Has proven he can shutdown teams top lines. Playing with skilled wingers he can put up points as well. Most teams would love to have him (and at his salary too).

With Desharnais currently centering the #1 line with Cole and Paciorretti, Gomez possibly centering the #4 line, Galchenyuk possibly returning to the OHL, and Eller in either 2nd or 3rd line duties, the center position hasn't had this much depth in years (and Nokeleinan as an extra) and it would be foolish to try and trade him for a winger (especially if we can sign one via UFA or allow one of the younger players to try to prove they belong in the NHL ex: Gallagher, Palushaj, etc...).

He can be the shutdown center that we lacked last year (he's very effective in that role...as long as he's told that that's what is wanted of him - just look at what made the habs successful in the year we made it to the conference finals). And if Eller or Desharnais don't work out on the top 2 lines he can be bumped back up.
its because habs fans always need to rag on one of they re own ,thats why.why support the team you cheer for unconditionally ,when you could just complain about them all the time?cause complaing = winning.

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07-15-2012, 07:27 AM
  #423
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Rumblings are that Pleks is soon on his way out.

Bergy is working on a trade and has confidence in Gally as the teams 2-3 center.

That's what i like to hear.

Pleks + for E Kane. This trade offer is not a rumor.

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Old
07-15-2012, 07:34 AM
  #424
FlyingKostitsyn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YourBuddy View Post
Rumblings are that Pleks is soon on his way out.

Bergy is working on a trade and has confidence in Gally as the teams 2-3 center.

That's what i like to hear.

Pleks + for E Kane. This trade offer is not a rumor.
It would be a huge mistake. The only argument for Galchenyuk centering an NHL line next year is the 9 game try-out and selfishness of fans who don't want to wait.

And the only viable reason to trade Plekanec is if Bergevin wants to tank it up next season.

Its Gomez, not Galchenyuk, that would center the 2nd or 3rd line. Even if Galchenyuk isn't NHL ready and yet massively outplays Gomez at training camp.

As for the rumblings, they only exist amongst fans and ********* rumor mongers I won't name.


Last edited by FlyingKostitsyn: 07-15-2012 at 07:39 AM.
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Old
07-15-2012, 07:42 AM
  #425
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingKostitsyn View Post
It would be a huge mistake. The only argument for Galchenyuk centering an NHL line next year is the 9 game try-out and selfishness of fans who don't want to wait.

And the only viable reason to trade Plekanec is if Bergevin wants to tank it up next season.

Its Gomez, not Galchenyuk, that would center the 2nd or 3rd line. Even if Galchenyuk isn't NHL ready and yet massively outplays Gomez at training camp.

As for the rumblings, they only exist amongst fans and ********* rumor mongers I won't name.
Sorry to burst your bubble FK, but not rumor mongers.

Yeah i know how it ruined Seguins career by Boston keeping him up.

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