HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Los Angeles Kings
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

NHL vs. NHLPA: Battler of the CBA

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
07-13-2012, 09:30 PM
  #1
Sydor25
LA Kings
 
Sydor25's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: North Texas
Country: United States
Posts: 21,828
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to Sydor25
NHL vs. NHLPA: Battler of the CBA

NHL fires the first shot:

Quote:
Renaud P Lavoie‏@RenLavoieRDS

NHL proposal to players: 1-reduce players hockey related revenues to 46% from 57 %. 2-10 seasons in NHL before being UFA.
Quote:
Renaud P Lavoie‏@RenLavoieRDS

3-contracts limites to 5 years 4-no more salary arbitration. 5- entry-level contract 5 years instead of 3.
https://twitter.com/RenLavoieRDS

Looks like it could be a very long summer...

Might as well ask for everything with your first shot.

Sydor25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 09:45 PM
  #2
KopitarFAN
Reno Sucks!
 
KopitarFAN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Lost Wages, NV
Country: United States
Posts: 9,431
vCash: 500
I think that's how you do it though. Ask for the farm early, and then things get negotiated down.

They'll probably meet somewhere in the middle on the revenue split, 51-52% for the players. Number 2 isn't happening. With number 3 I expect their to be a limit, but more like 7 or 8 years. Number 4 isn't happening and I think 3 year ELCs are fine, but I could see that changing.

KopitarFAN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 09:56 PM
  #3
Vamos Rafa
¡Vamos!
 
Vamos Rafa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Clay Court
Country: Spain
Posts: 10,979
vCash: 500
Pros and cons of proposal #2?

Vamos Rafa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 09:58 PM
  #4
Ron
Bandwagon Since 1967
 
Ron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Brea, California
Country: United States
Posts: 7,612
vCash: 500
No way the players ever agree to proposition no. 2.

Ron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 10:09 PM
  #5
bobafettish*
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 5,961
vCash: 500
2,3,5 dont see happening.

bobafettish* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-13-2012, 11:57 PM
  #6
CTKingsFan
6/11/12 & 6/13/14
 
CTKingsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Connecticut
Country: United States
Posts: 2,387
vCash: 500
Why don't they just ask for permission to have sex with the player wives?

Jeez!

But as other said. You ask for the moon and work your way back to down to earth.

CTKingsFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:01 AM
  #7
Ron
Bandwagon Since 1967
 
Ron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Brea, California
Country: United States
Posts: 7,612
vCash: 500
Per Twitter:

Quote:
Mark Whicker ‏@MWhickerOCR Kings heard about NHL owners' proposal, decided to let each player keep the Cup for a month

Ron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:02 AM
  #8
Jason Lewis
Hockey's Future Staff
 
Jason Lewis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Country: United States
Posts: 5,052
vCash: 500
Yup. Aim high come back down on it. Maybe they will find something in the form of a compromise based on those.

Jason Lewis is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:09 AM
  #9
Ziggy Stardust
Master Debater
 
Ziggy Stardust's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 31,260
vCash: 500
Relax people. It's a negotiation tactic. They established what they want. Now the PA can counter it. No need to panic yet.

Ziggy Stardust is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 01:11 AM
  #10
tsanuri
Registered User
 
tsanuri's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Grants Pass OR
Country: United States
Posts: 2,065
vCash: 500
The real question is how close to this items do the owners really want to be.
I think anyone that has ever done any negotiating knows you ask for more than you want. But sometimes you come in close others times you shoot for the moon. And none of us know which one this was.
I really hope this was a shoot the moon because if it wasn't we are all going to have a very long wait to see a banner raised in Staples Center.
I can see where number 5 could happen as a concession since rookies are not in the league and therefore can get thrown under the bus without much problem. And that could be used as a big concession by the players to get the owners to budge on something they want. But the other 4 are just crazy. And number 3 is the owners trying to save them from themselves. Nobody forced them into these long term deals but agents or GMs, at the owners behest, started offering them and they were signed. Number 2 because it says 10 years NHL service they just don't want most players to ever be RFAs in their prime. Since most players don't play until they are 20 or more.

tsanuri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 01:22 AM
  #11
Ron
Bandwagon Since 1967
 
Ron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Brea, California
Country: United States
Posts: 7,612
vCash: 500
Yeah, its a moon shot.

Very apt description.

Ron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 01:40 AM
  #12
BehindEnemyLines
2012&2014 CHAMPS
 
BehindEnemyLines's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: OC, CA
Country: Romania
Posts: 1,687
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
Relax people. It's a negotiation tactic. They established what they want. Now the PA can counter it. No need to panic yet.
Well they have another month and half to get this done. Unfortunately, I'm not feeling too confident right now. I wish they would have started these negotiations a lot sooner.

BehindEnemyLines is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 06:57 AM
  #13
rick3652
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 819
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
NHL fires the first shot:





https://twitter.com/RenLavoieRDS

Looks like it could be a very long summer...

Might as well ask for everything with your first shot.
What you do is throw in a few items that you can give up like 2,3,4,5

they want the players to take 46% so now they can give back 2,3,4,5 and get around 49% and everyone will be happy.

Even after 49% the players will be making a lot of money. Cap the contracts at 5 years that is enough. The players will go to 8 years instead or 7. ELC may stay the same or go to 4 years MAX.

What you want to guess is what the players will go back with.

1. Players will ask for 55% will take 51%
2. 7 years max contracts but will take 5 at the end
3. 7 years till UFA they will keep this like this and give up late to 8 years
4. will stay the same always they will never give this up
5. ELC stays 3 they could go to 4 late

so after talking for a long time here is what it will be

1. players get 51% then 52% going up 1% each year
2. 5 years contract MAX
3. 8 years till UFA
4. this will always stay the same
5. 4 years ELC
5..

rick3652 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 07:13 AM
  #14
Mr Writer
Registered User
 
Mr Writer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,615
vCash: 500
believe me, fans are not going to like the 5 year max contract. Just think about, you think Sid accepts less than market on a 5 year contract? No, he does not!!! Sid and every other Elite of the Elite player would demand max dollars on every contract they negotiate. There will be no, "I'll take less than market value 10 years from now for up-front money now." It will be max dollars every contract and Sid's cap hit would be this year 9.5-11 million &&&&....
and once that contract plays out and the Penguins are up against the cap, what do you think Sid is going to do? He's going to UFA to get another Max $$$$ contract.

Mr Writer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 08:18 AM
  #15
MsWoof
Registered User
 
MsWoof's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,032
vCash: 500
I wonder if they'll grandfather current contracts in.

MsWoof is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 08:51 AM
  #16
scramble91
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 921
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MsWoof View Post
I wonder if they'll grandfather current contracts in.
It would be impossible for them not to.

If the cap changes then they will probably just do salary rollbacks like they did last time.

scramble91 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 08:54 AM
  #17
Sydor25
LA Kings
 
Sydor25's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: North Texas
Country: United States
Posts: 21,828
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to Sydor25
I don't remember from the last lockout/lost season, did the contracts roll to the next season or did everyone lose a year on their contract? If there isn't a season, would Gagne and Penner be UFA on July 1st, 2013?

Sydor25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 10:48 AM
  #18
KingKopitar11*
Drew Doughty Eh?
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: staples center
Country: Russian Federation
Posts: 16,319
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Writer View Post
believe me, fans are not going to like the 5 year max contract. Just think about, you think Sid accepts less than market on a 5 year contract? No, he does not!!! Sid and every other Elite of the Elite player would demand max dollars on every contract they negotiate. There will be no, "I'll take less than market value 10 years from now for up-front money now." It will be max dollars every contract and Sid's cap hit would be this year 9.5-11 million &&&&....
and once that contract plays out and the Penguins are up against the cap, what do you think Sid is going to do? He's going to UFA to get another Max $$$$ contract.
Lol atleast offseason would be more entertaining.

KingKopitar11* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 11:01 AM
  #19
kingsholygrail
Interference = Cup
 
kingsholygrail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Derpifornia
Country: United States
Posts: 43,249
vCash: 500
It's how you haggle bros... Calm down.

kingsholygrail is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 12:49 PM
  #20
tsanuri
Registered User
 
tsanuri's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Grants Pass OR
Country: United States
Posts: 2,065
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by scramble91 View Post
It would be impossible for them not to.

If the cap changes then they will probably just do salary rollbacks like they did last time.
I really doubt that there will be another rollback of salaries. The players gave the owners everything they wanted last time but I suspect they will not go that far. I can see it where only a percentage of the salary counts against the cap for contracts that are already in effect.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
I don't remember from the last lockout/lost season, did the contracts roll to the next season or did everyone lose a year on their contract? If there isn't a season, would Gagne and Penner be UFA on July 1st, 2013?
A year was lost. So if for some reason we lose a season we will also lose our complete team trying for the repeat.

tsanuri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 02:20 PM
  #21
KINGS17
Smartest in the Room
 
KINGS17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 15,553
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Writer View Post
believe me, fans are not going to like the 5 year max contract. Just think about, you think Sid accepts less than market on a 5 year contract? No, he does not!!! Sid and every other Elite of the Elite player would demand max dollars on every contract they negotiate. There will be no, "I'll take less than market value 10 years from now for up-front money now." It will be max dollars every contract and Sid's cap hit would be this year 9.5-11 million &&&&....
and once that contract plays out and the Penguins are up against the cap, what do you think Sid is going to do? He's going to UFA to get another Max $$$$ contract.
Gee, you mean there would actually be a hard cap where cap circumvention could not take place? The big names would get the big

KINGS17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 06:48 PM
  #22
KopitarFAN
Reno Sucks!
 
KopitarFAN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Lost Wages, NV
Country: United States
Posts: 9,431
vCash: 500
I think it's funny how their is such a wide range of opinions on this among the media. Matthew Barry seems to think a work stoppage is a forgone conclusion, while others, like Bob McKenzie are taking a "wait and see" approach.

KopitarFAN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 06:55 PM
  #23
DAkings20
Kings can't score
 
DAkings20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Valencia, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 11,978
vCash: 500
Another lockout would be bad for the league. However I wouldn't mind if it lasted a month or two MAX as imo it would benefit the Kings in terms of getting rest after the Cup run.

DAkings20 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 07:14 PM
  #24
tsanuri
Registered User
 
tsanuri's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Grants Pass OR
Country: United States
Posts: 2,065
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAkings20 View Post
Another lockout would be bad for the league. However I wouldn't mind if it lasted a month or two MAX as imo it would benefit the Kings in terms of getting rest after the Cup run.
It didn't help either TB or Calgary after the last lockout and that was the whole season. They both made it back to the playoffs but one as an 8 seed the other as a 7. And don't think that the partying will stop if they get locked out or strike. They will party until they are in camp. So any delay really gives the greater likelihood that players would come back out of shape. Do we really want to think about more players in the shape of Doughty at the start of this last season.

tsanuri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 07:14 PM
  #25
Ziggy Stardust
Master Debater
 
Ziggy Stardust's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 31,260
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by KopitarFAN View Post
I think it's funny how their is such a wide range of opinions on this among the media. Matthew Barry seems to think a work stoppage is a forgone conclusion, while others, like Bob McKenzie are taking a "wait and see" approach.
Can Matt Barry really be considered part of the hockey media circle? He's always reactionary. Either way, those who are already panicking probably have never been involved in any form of negotiations. What's the first rule of thumb when you negotiate for a higher salary? You aim high, then come down from it to a happy medium that you are willing to accept.

That is the exact strategy being demonstrated with the NHL's offer. They know and I hope most people covering hockey know that the PA isn't going to accept the first offer. It's a starting point that makes clear what the league is interested in pursuing. Now we wait to see how the PA counters and what they're seeking when they make their counter offer.

Ziggy Stardust is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:26 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.