HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Florida Panthers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

New CBA? Are Panthers Well Positioned? (ALL CBA TALK HERE)

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
07-14-2012, 10:43 AM
  #1
SufferingCatFan
Registered User
 
SufferingCatFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: fort lauderdale
Country: United States
Posts: 1,810
vCash: 500
New CBA? Are Panthers Well Positioned? (ALL CBA TALK HERE)

Numerous news articles suggest that the Owner's initial proposal reflects an effort significantly to reduce the players share of revenues and thereby lower the salary cap, eliminate cap circumvention contracts, and extend the time to free agency and lower the costs of contracts to younger players. Not saying that the players are going to agree to the owners proposal, but it does seem likely that whatever compromise the players and owners ultimately work out will: (1) lower the cap while narrowing the range between the cap and the floor; (2) contain limitations on long-term front loaded contracts designed to circumvent the cap; and (3) contain limitations on money going to the younger players in order to maintain the compensation of the current NHLers who will vote to ratify the CBA.

On the surface, this looks to favor the Panthers in several ways. First, the Cats are way below the cap so will have money to spend even if it goes down by 10%. Second, the Cats have few long term contracts. Finally, with its pool of deep prospects, the Cats will likely have to pay them less money for the first seven years of their careers.

What do you think?


Last edited by angry_treefrog: 07-14-2012 at 10:48 AM.
SufferingCatFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 10:47 AM
  #2
angry_treefrog
Moderator
T63813A
 
angry_treefrog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Country: Canary Islands
Posts: 6,482
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
Numerous news articles suggest that the Owner's initial proposal reflects an effort significantly to reduce the players share of revenues and thereby lower the salary cap, eliminate cap circumvention contracts, and extend the time to free agency and lower the costs of contracts to younger players. Not saying that the players are going to agree to the owners proposal, but it does seem likely that whatever compromise the players and owners ultimately work out will: (1) lower the cap while narrowing the range between the cap and the floor; (2) contain limitations on long-term front loaded contracts designed to circumvent the cap; and (3) contain limitations on money going to the younger players in order to maintain the compensation of the current NHLers who will vote to ratify the CBA.

On the surface, this looks to favor the Panthers in several ways. First, the Cats are way below the cap so will have money to spend even if it goes down by 10%. Second, the Cats have few long term contracts. Finally, with its pool of deep prospects, the Cats will likely have to pay them less money for the first seven years of their careers.

What do you think?
I think your post is very logical and well thought out.

Unfortunately the years have conditioned me to expect the worst (e.g. Crosby draft ping pong ball screw job).

(I think a thread to discuss the CBA negotiations outside of the News thread is appropriate. It's a far more significant topic than a signing. Lets make it this thread. All CBA talk here.)

__________________




angry_treefrog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 11:51 AM
  #3
Desert Panther
Resident Lurker
 
Desert Panther's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Frisco, TX
Country: United States
Posts: 2,234
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
Numerous news articles suggest that the Owner's initial proposal reflects an effort significantly to reduce the players share of revenues and thereby lower the salary cap, eliminate cap circumvention contracts, and extend the time to free agency and lower the costs of contracts to younger players. Not saying that the players are going to agree to the owners proposal, but it does seem likely that whatever compromise the players and owners ultimately work out will: (1) lower the cap while narrowing the range between the cap and the floor; (2) contain limitations on long-term front loaded contracts designed to circumvent the cap; and (3) contain limitations on money going to the younger players in order to maintain the compensation of the current NHLers who will vote to ratify the CBA.

On the surface, this looks to favor the Panthers in several ways. First, the Cats are way below the cap so will have money to spend even if it goes down by 10%. Second, the Cats have few long term contracts. Finally, with its pool of deep prospects, the Cats will likely have to pay them less money for the first seven years of their careers.

What do you think?
I think that we are far better positioned than most as far as long term future for the reasons you have mentioned. That said, the first offer out of the league is exactly that, laughably low-ball and with the obvious intention of movement upward.

Desert Panther is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 01:46 PM
  #4
Holy Jokinen
Registered User
 
Holy Jokinen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Tampa/Boca
Country: United States
Posts: 2,818
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
Numerous news articles suggest that the Owner's initial proposal reflects an effort significantly to reduce the players share of revenues and thereby lower the salary cap, eliminate cap circumvention contracts, and extend the time to free agency and lower the costs of contracts to younger players. Not saying that the players are going to agree to the owners proposal, but it does seem likely that whatever compromise the players and owners ultimately work out will: (1) lower the cap while narrowing the range between the cap and the floor; (2) contain limitations on long-term front loaded contracts designed to circumvent the cap; and (3) contain limitations on money going to the younger players in order to maintain the compensation of the current NHLers who will vote to ratify the CBA.

On the surface, this looks to favor the Panthers in several ways. First, the Cats are way below the cap so will have money to spend even if it goes down by 10%. Second, the Cats have few long term contracts. Finally, with its pool of deep prospects, the Cats will likely have to pay them less money for the first seven years of their careers.

What do you think?
You make some good points. But i think the process and amount of issues makes all of the discussions too convoluted to say whether or not we are in a "good" or "bad" position.

As a fan, the only condition i have is that we get a full season this year. NOTHING is worse for the sport than a work stoppage. Similarly, NOTHING is worse for my hockey addiction than a work stoppage. So please please please figure this out before October. Please.

Holy Jokinen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-14-2012, 02:31 PM
  #5
gizmo12688
Registered User
 
gizmo12688's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Florida
Country: United States
Posts: 5,451
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Holy Jokinen View Post
You make some good points. But i think the process and amount of issues makes all of the discussions too convoluted to say whether or not we are in a "good" or "bad" position.

As a fan, the only condition i have is that we get a full season this year. NOTHING is worse for the sport than a work stoppage. Similarly, NOTHING is worse for my hockey addiction than a work stoppage. So please please please figure this out before October. Please.
More like September.

gizmo12688 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-15-2012, 08:25 AM
  #6
jol
Registered User
 
jol's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Miami Beach, Florida
Posts: 1,570
vCash: 500
Why I'm seeing these "Lockout" movie ads in this web page? Omen?

JOL

jol is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-15-2012, 09:24 AM
  #7
billysbreakdown
Registered User
 
billysbreakdown's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 3,331
vCash: 235
What are the chances for a lockout?

billysbreakdown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-15-2012, 10:55 AM
  #8
SufferingCatFan
Registered User
 
SufferingCatFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: fort lauderdale
Country: United States
Posts: 1,810
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FLA View Post
What are the chances for a lockout?
Too soon to tell if Owners intend to stand firmly on their proposal. But, if they do stand firm then odds of a lockout are very high IMO

SufferingCatFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-15-2012, 12:04 PM
  #9
Desert Panther
Resident Lurker
 
Desert Panther's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Frisco, TX
Country: United States
Posts: 2,234
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
Too soon to tell if Owners intend to stand firmly on their proposal. But, if they do stand firm then odds of a lockout are very high IMO
It is too soon to tell, but I believe that a lockout would backfire drastically on the owners in this case in the court of public opinion.

Desert Panther is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-15-2012, 12:34 PM
  #10
I May Be Wrong
I May Be The Stig
 
I May Be Wrong's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Florida
Country: United States
Posts: 8,411
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to I May Be Wrong
lol, if a lockout happened both sides are completely dumb. Just now getting established again and ratings/revenues going up. Another lockout? can you imagine what that would do? It shouldn't even be an option.

I May Be Wrong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-15-2012, 12:40 PM
  #11
jol
Registered User
 
jol's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Miami Beach, Florida
Posts: 1,570
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Booootthh View Post
lol, if a lockout happened both sides are completely dumb. Just now getting established again and ratings/revenues going up. Another lockout? can you imagine what that would do? It shouldn't even be an option.
I'm sure that NHLPA is ready to start season without contract (continue with existing one) and then if NHL and NHLPA cannot make a deal, start strike when playoffs start (and that's the reason season will not start without contract).

JOL

jol is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-15-2012, 04:51 PM
  #12
Desert Panther
Resident Lurker
 
Desert Panther's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Frisco, TX
Country: United States
Posts: 2,234
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jol View Post
I'm sure that NHLPA is ready to start season without contract (continue with existing one) and then if NHL and NHLPA cannot make a deal, start strike when playoffs start (and that's the reason season will not start without contract).

JOL
Baseball still has difficulty after pulling that ill-advised stunt (and yes, Fehr was the head of the MLBPA for that). They have the public leverage at the moment and striking at the playoffs would quickly kill that.

Desert Panther is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-15-2012, 06:22 PM
  #13
angry_treefrog
Moderator
T63813A
 
angry_treefrog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Country: Canary Islands
Posts: 6,482
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jol View Post
I'm sure that NHLPA is ready to start season without contract (continue with existing one) and then if NHL and NHLPA cannot make a deal, start strike when playoffs start (and that's the reason season will not start without contract).

JOL
Why would you be sure of that?

Financially it makes sense (would hurt owners $, not players), but it would be a public relations disaster for the NHLPA.

angry_treefrog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-15-2012, 06:25 PM
  #14
PanthersHockey1
Bond.
 
PanthersHockey1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: UF & Boca Raton
Country: United States
Posts: 5,535
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Booootthh View Post
lol, if a lockout happened both sides are completely dumb. Just now getting established again and ratings/revenues going up. Another lockout? can you imagine what that would do? It shouldn't even be an option.
this. taking 2 steps forward after 04-05 and 5 steps back with this blunder waiting to happen is not what either side should want right now.

I can't understand why our CBA is so short. Extend the ****ing thing so we fans aren't the ones screwed every 6 seasons.

PanthersHockey1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-28-2012, 06:16 AM
  #15
SufferingCatFan
Registered User
 
SufferingCatFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: fort lauderdale
Country: United States
Posts: 1,810
vCash: 500
Now that we have the opportunity to see the Owners full proposal, it is safe to state that the players are unlikely to agree to a 24% reduction in compensation, extending the time to free agency, eliminating contracts longer than 6 years etc.

IMO, a lockout/ strike is likely coming.

SufferingCatFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-28-2012, 02:16 PM
  #16
LUUUUUIS
¿Qué bolá, Tallón?
 
LUUUUUIS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,436
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
Now that we have the opportunity to see the Owners full proposal, it is safe to state that the players are unlikely to agree to a 24% reduction in compensation, extending the time to free agency, eliminating contracts longer than 6 years etc.

IMO, a lockout/ strike is likely coming.
Because the players don't like the first proposal? I'm fairly certain there will be some negotiations. It's more likely that they'll continue with the current CBA than risk another lockout/strike. Unless it's your guts telling you that a lockout is imminent... do you feel it in your bones? Is it a hunch? because I'm totally on board with your thoughts if it's a hunch.

LUUUUUIS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-28-2012, 03:44 PM
  #17
adam graves
Panthers 17yr sth
 
adam graves's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: south florida
Country: United States
Posts: 8,040
vCash: 500
Let me share my feelings humbly...

If these morons on both sides can't figure this out and go on what surely will be a suicide strike/lockout, I hope they get what they deserve.

Disgusting.

adam graves is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-29-2012, 07:41 AM
  #18
I May Be Wrong
I May Be The Stig
 
I May Be Wrong's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Florida
Country: United States
Posts: 8,411
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to I May Be Wrong
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=404044

NHL reduces financial demands from first proposal to an eventual 50/50 split in revenue sharing. The cap will drop to 58m this season under the new proposal and then rise to pre-set points in the seasons after.

Light at the end of the tunnel! Please Bettman/Fehr, let us have hockey!

I May Be Wrong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-29-2012, 11:13 AM
  #19
Desert Panther
Resident Lurker
 
Desert Panther's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Frisco, TX
Country: United States
Posts: 2,234
vCash: 500
I imagine the 58MM will get negotiated upwards. The good news here is that the NHL's counter is largely based in reality compared to the dream they started out with. They're at least speaking different dialects of the same language now.

Desert Panther is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-29-2012, 12:01 PM
  #20
Coolburn
Registered User
 
Coolburn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: South Florida
Country: Hungary
Posts: 7,781
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Coolburn Send a message via MSN to Coolburn Send a message via Yahoo to Coolburn
Yeah I see them settling on something a little higher because over half the league is over that $58M. They will have to do something in the way of a buyout period to get everyone under anyway.

We're around $53M now without having signed Kulikov or adding in Huberdeau (I think thats why its taken so long to sign Kuli...they were waiting on the CBA). So that puts us right against that cap it seems to my calculations. I guess that would at least kill any rumor of us being interested in Luongo finally

Coolburn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-29-2012, 12:46 PM
  #21
Boothinator
@MrBoothinator
 
Boothinator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Country: Germany
Posts: 2,061
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coolburn View Post
Yeah I see them settling on something a little higher because over half the league is over that $58M. They will have to do something in the way of a buyout period to get everyone under anyway.

We're around $53M now without having signed Kulikov or adding in Huberdeau (I think thats why its taken so long to sign Kuli...they were waiting on the CBA). So that puts us right against that cap it seems to my calculations. I guess that would at least kill any rumor of us being interested in Luongo finally
I am not sure if this is allowed to happen but I read somewhere that the players salary will be cut like the salary cap (same percentage) I dont think that is very likely...
But I still dont get why the owners are complaining about the cap hit..They are the people who are throwing out the money. But I like it more with a lower cap because of the lower market teams, like we are one.

Boothinator is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
08-30-2012, 04:12 PM
  #22
Great8Cam
Registered User
 
Great8Cam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 675
vCash: 500
At least Dineen will keep his coaching skills sharpened. He worked with the Junior Panthers last night at Incredible Ice.

Great8Cam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-31-2012, 04:16 PM
  #23
KittysGotClaws
We See Red
 
KittysGotClaws's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: N of BB&T
Country: United States
Posts: 1,840
vCash: 500
Talks have stalled and broken off. Good job NHL. Your sport is on the brink of elimination.

KittysGotClaws is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-02-2012, 08:21 AM
  #24
SufferingCatFan
Registered User
 
SufferingCatFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: fort lauderdale
Country: United States
Posts: 1,810
vCash: 500
Assuming that the lockout is relatively short, the Panthers look to be net winners for a variety of reasons.

First, it appears that the cap, at the end of the day, likely will be reduced and stablized for a couple of years, which is good news for teams like the Panthers which are way below the cap.

Second, it is likely that the time to UFA will be extended, which is great news for teams like the Panthers with great young prospects.

Third, it is likely that poor teams like the Panthers will receive increased revenue sharing, which will make the Cats more competitive.

SufferingCatFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-02-2012, 01:40 PM
  #25
nhlfan9191
Registered User
 
nhlfan9191's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Saskatoon, Sk
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,415
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by adam graves View Post
Let me share my feelings humbly...

If these morons on both sides can't figure this out and go on what surely will be a suicide strike/lockout, I hope they get what they deserve.

Disgusting.
This is what tears me. If the NHLPA and NHL get what they deserve, us fans end up suffering even more. It's a lose/lose situation for us.

nhlfan9191 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:43 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.