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Old
07-15-2012, 11:36 PM
  #126
Eggers
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Quote:
Originally Posted by number72 View Post
Than why are some hab fans trying to trade Gomez?
Maybe you need to direct your insights at those fans.
This went downhill from this very post. If you don't understand the sorts of ridiculous assumptions you made from the start of this conversation, then I don't know what to tell you.

"The Habs can bury Gomez if they absolutely need to, but Habs fans want to trade Gomez, so the Leafs get Galchenyuk."

Good call.

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Old
07-15-2012, 11:47 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by Frozenice View Post
So you are able to tell the difference between what is and isn't a stupid trade.

Hopefully, you can apply this newfound wisdom when you post here in the future.

Don't let us down, remember only you can prevent blue and white disease.

Better fans make for better hockey.
Not quite. I never said that the habs trade offer was stupid just that it doesn't make sense.


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Originally Posted by Eggers View Post
This went downhill from this very post. If you don't understand the sorts of ridiculous assumptions you made from the start of this conversation, then I don't know what to tell you.

"The Habs can bury Gomez if they absolutely need to, but Habs fans want to trade Gomez, so the Leafs get Galchenyuk."

Good call.
That's exactly my point. They have been saying they can bury Gomez for a couple years now and yet here we are.
What they should say is we can keep Gomez on the team like we have been for last few years and keep trying to pawn him off on some team.

But question for my information - what is the last "material" player the habs bought out? And last "material" player they stuffed in the minors? (And by material I mean not some plugger)


Last edited by number72: 07-15-2012 at 11:53 PM.
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Old
07-15-2012, 11:55 PM
  #128
Vsevolod Bobrov
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Originally Posted by number72 View Post
Yes you need to add Galch if you want to trade him to leafs.
If you don't like the deal than move on.
You represent Leafs fans very well.

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Old
07-15-2012, 11:59 PM
  #129
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CBA resolution will fix the problem

Gomez has a negative trade value. Let's just forget about trading him while picking up another major problem and/or having to add in incentives. Moreover, the monster management, philosophy, and operations' changes that were implemented since two months simply make it impossible for him to step on the ice again wearing this jersey. This goes further than numbers as it touches the credibility of the ownership. The Habs can afford it and they will either wait for the CBA resolution to buy him out without any cap hit, or bury him in the East Coast League if there is no no free buyout priviledge handed out to the teams this time.

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Old
07-16-2012, 12:02 AM
  #130
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Originally Posted by Vsevolod Bobrov View Post
You represent Leafs fans very well.
I can't speak for other leafs fans but I hope that if Burke was doing a division rival a favour by taking a salary dump, that he would extract maximal value in the trade for the benefit of the leafs.

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Old
07-16-2012, 12:04 AM
  #131
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The Hawks are in need of a 2nd line center - Kane should stay at RW, Kruger isn't good enough offensively (at least not yet), Sharp should stay at LW, and none of the prospect centers are ready yet - so how about taking a chance on Gomez reviving his career. There would be no problem with his wingers not keeping up with him because Sharp and Hossa have plenty of speed.

But - that contract. Montreal would need to take some significant salary back and sweeten the deal. Chicago has no spot for Frolik ($2.33M x2) and with the signing of Brookbank - Montador ($2.75M x2) is expendable. Throw in Bickell ($0.54M x1) who is taking ice time away from a gaggle of prospects - and the salary going back to Montreal is over $5.5M - less than a $2M delta from Gomez' contract.

So to compensate for that $2M difference - Montreal includes Alexei Emelin and the Hawks include Shawn Lalonde, one of the Hawks better D prospects.

So the trade:

To Montreal: Frolik, Montador, Bickell, Lalonde
To Chicago: Gomez, Emelin

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Old
07-16-2012, 12:30 AM
  #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EbonyRaptor View Post
The Hawks are in need of a 2nd line center - Kane should stay at RW, Kruger isn't good enough offensively (at least not yet), Sharp should stay at LW, and none of the prospect centers are ready yet - so how about taking a chance on Gomez reviving his career. There would be no problem with his wingers not keeping up with him because Sharp and Hossa have plenty of speed.

But - that contract. Montreal would need to take some significant salary back and sweeten the deal. Chicago has no spot for Frolik ($2.33M x2) and with the signing of Brookbank - Montador ($2.75M x2) is expendable. Throw in Bickell ($0.54M x1) who is taking ice time away from a gaggle of prospects - and the salary going back to Montreal is over $5.5M - less than a $2M delta from Gomez' contract.

So to compensate for that $2M difference - Montreal includes Alexei Emelin and the Hawks include Shawn Lalonde, one of the Hawks better D prospects.

So the trade:

To Montreal: Frolik, Montador, Bickell, Lalonde
To Chicago: Gomez, Emelin
If Emelin is involved in the deal it's a pass from me. We have a really soft d as it is and trading him will only make it worse.

I'd rather put Gomez on re-entry waivers and if he's available when you're turn is up, I hope he does well for you.

Frolik interests me, I'd like to give him a chance here, see what he could do with Pleks or Eller.

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Old
07-16-2012, 12:40 AM
  #133
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Originally Posted by number72 View Post
I can't speak for other leafs fans but I hope that if Burke was doing a division rival a favour by taking a salary dump, that he would extract maximal value in the trade for the benefit of the leafs.
Like he did with the Bruins?

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07-16-2012, 12:42 AM
  #134
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frozenice View Post
If Emelin is involved in the deal it's a pass from me. We have a really soft d as it is and trading him will only make it worse.

I'd rather put Gomez on re-entry waivers and if he's available when you're turn is up, I hope he does well for you.

Frolik interests me, I'd like to give him a chance here, see what he could do with Pleks or Eller.
If I remember the rules correctly - when a player is claimed off re-entry waivers, the two teams split the salary. So in the case of Chicago claiming Gomez, the Hawks and Habs would both be liable for half of his salary cap hit. Correct?

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Old
07-16-2012, 12:43 AM
  #135
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Originally Posted by Max et Guillaume View Post
Like he did with the Bruins?
I'm sure you mean the Kaberle trade and yes that was quite good. But the Kessel trade set the rebuild back a few years and I don't think the leafs recovered yet.

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07-16-2012, 12:51 AM
  #136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EbonyRaptor View Post
If I remember the rules correctly - when a player is claimed off re-entry waivers, the two teams split the salary. So in the case of Chicago claiming Gomez, the Hawks and Habs would both be liable for half of his salary cap hit. Correct?
Correct, half his salary and half his cap-hit.

If we don't trade Plekanec I think that is the most likely route we will take - putting Gomez on re-entry waivers. We can fit them all in within the salary cap but it doesn't make sense to.

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Old
07-16-2012, 03:14 AM
  #137
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Gomez + 2nd pick (CGY) for Erik Condra ?

I'd totally do that. Best way to get rid of Gomez is to trade him. Burying him in the minors can be tricky. Ottawa could use him and they have plenty enough space.

That is if Ottawa would really do this trade like it was previously mentionned on page 4 of this thread...

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Old
07-16-2012, 03:21 AM
  #138
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Arent the Habs going to buy him out? I'd take him as a 3rd/4th line C in a heartbeat.

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Old
07-16-2012, 03:25 AM
  #139
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Gomez for Leino??

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Old
07-16-2012, 07:05 AM
  #140
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Originally Posted by number72 View Post
I agree and the leafs got lucky with Lupul as most were expecting him to stagnate. Lupul's turnaround would be like if Gomez was traded to another team and he rediscovered his offensive game.



Thanks but it makes more sense to buyout Komisarek next year.
And if you still want him you can resign him at that time.
Ok, you are starting to sort of get it. Now, the next time you offer the Habs a trade and ask for Galchenyuk along with Gomez for garbage, just put the sentence you wrote above into your own post and change Komisarek for Gomez. Now you have your own answer and don't need to waste so many pages on HFBoards having people tell you what you already have an answer for.

I really hope your participation in this thread is now over in regards to asking for Galchenyuk as a "bribe" to get rid of Gomez.

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Old
07-16-2012, 07:08 AM
  #141
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Originally Posted by CharlesHabsFan View Post
Gomez + 2nd pick (CGY) for Erik Condra ?

I'd totally do that. Best way to get rid of Gomez is to trade him. Burying him in the minors can be tricky. Ottawa could use him and they have plenty enough space.

That is if Ottawa would really do this trade like it was previously mentionned on page 4 of this thread...
As a Habs fan, I agree with this deal. Let's get our respective GMs on the phone and arrange it.

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07-16-2012, 07:10 AM
  #142
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Originally Posted by Derp Kassian View Post
Arent the Habs going to buy him out? I'd take him as a 3rd/4th line C in a heartbeat.
They didn't buy him out when the window was open. At this point, there is no reason to bury Gomez. His cap hit isn't preventing any deals. He will be buried if and only if we can use the cap space productively. In other words, Gomez will be buried if we sign Doan or Semin. In other words, Gomez won't be buried

2 more years...

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07-16-2012, 07:39 AM
  #143
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Originally Posted by SeriousHabs View Post
They didn't buy him out when the window was open. At this point, there is no reason to bury Gomez. His cap hit isn't preventing any deals. He will be buried if and only if we can use the cap space productively. In other words, Gomez will be buried if we sign Doan or Semin. In other words, Gomez won't be buried

2 more years...
Exactly. No point in buying him out, no point in burying him, no point in trading him at negative value. The ships have all sailed at this point. Well, the only way Gomez gets buried at this point is if in training camp he legitmately fails to be better than whoever our roster-spot challenging prospects are. There won't be any salary-related reasons invovled, anyway.

Revisit the whole situation June 15th, 2013. (Depending on the new CBA, of course). I wonder if we can truly wait until then before somebody starts another one of these threads?

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07-16-2012, 07:50 AM
  #144
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I do wonder why Gomez has become so ineffective. He's first year as a Hab was not great, but it was something the Habs could sort of live with: average 2nd line centre, good playoffs, expensive for what he brings, sure, but not prohibitively expensive for a rich team. His second and third years, however, have been much worse than I think anyone anticipated. Now it's not a question of being expensive, it's a question of not being worth of time on ice. However, it's not obvious that he's lost anything physically or that he does anything that much differently than before.

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07-16-2012, 09:53 AM
  #145
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Originally Posted by Drydenwasthebest View Post
Ok, you are starting to sort of get it. Now, the next time you offer the Habs a trade and ask for Galchenyuk along with Gomez for garbage, just put the sentence you wrote above into your own post and change Komisarek for Gomez. Now you have your own answer and don't need to waste so many pages on HFBoards having people tell you what you already have an answer for.

I really hope your participation in this thread is now over in regards to asking for Galchenyuk as a "bribe" to get rid of Gomez.
I'm fine to drop this but you keep resurrecting this. In fact, it was dead and someone brought it back up yet again. Like I said a few times already if you don't like than let's move on.

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Old
07-16-2012, 10:03 AM
  #146
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IMO Phoenix, having signed guys like Lang and traded for Langkow, have shown a need for centers and a willingness to give a guy at the tail end of their career a shot. With the departure of Pyatt and potentially Doan, I could see the Coyotes sending Montreal a late pick for Gomez.

Had Gomez been playing even slightly better over the past two seasons, I'd say many other, internal cap, teams might be interested because his salary drops well below his cap hit. But, IMO, his play hasn't even justified anything near a 5m salary.

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07-16-2012, 10:06 AM
  #147
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IMO Phoenix, having signed guys like Lang and traded for Langkow, have shown a need for centers and a willingness to give a guy at the tail end of their career a shot. With the departure of Pyatt and potentially Doan, I could see the Coyotes sending Montreal a late pick for Gomez.

Had Gomez been playing even slightly better over the past two seasons, I'd say many other, internal cap, teams might be interested because his salary drops well below his cap hit. But, IMO, his play hasn't even justified anything near a 5m salary.
I'd even understand taking a bad contract off of PHX if they even have one.

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07-16-2012, 11:02 AM
  #148
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flambergius View Post
I do wonder why Gomez has become so ineffective. He's first year as a Hab was not great, but it was something the Habs could sort of live with: average 2nd line centre, good playoffs, expensive for what he brings, sure, but not prohibitively expensive for a rich team. His second and third years, however, have been much worse than I think anyone anticipated. Now it's not a question of being expensive, it's a question of not being worth of time on ice. However, it's not obvious that he's lost anything physically or that he does anything that much differently than before.
I presume that is part of why they decided to keep him for the upcoming season. So much is changing with the team... new coach, some grittier new players, maybe a healthier powerplay than last season... maybe in a season where there is labour unrest and the possibility of a) not having to pay him anyway, or b) getting a better buyout option, they could look at the on-ice situation as well, and consider that maybe a "3rd chance" is a worthwhile risk. Maybe he sorts out whatever mental block he developed, maybe he finds his groove and some chemistry again. As you say, the physical skills don't seem to have deteriorated, so maybe the Habs feel like there's not much harm in seeing if he can resurrect himself this season, given all that.

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Old
07-16-2012, 06:44 PM
  #149
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