HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Philadelphia Flyers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Expectations

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
07-16-2012, 02:13 AM
  #1
Syracuse Bulldogs
Registered User
 
Syracuse Bulldogs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Allentown, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 17
vCash: 500
Expectations

What team is better, this 2012 or 2010? Do you feel better about the Flyers winning a championship now with their young core or within the Richards/Carter/Pronger era?

Personally I expected nothing from the Flyers last season... I felt okay with just missing the playoffs if they were rebuilding. However after the way their core of young players stepped up last season I feel like the Flyers can win the cup even with the loss of Jagr and Carle. I believe that Schenn, Couturier, Voracek and Simmonds will definitely grow into their roles this season.

What is exceptable for the flyers this year?

Syracuse Bulldogs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 02:57 AM
  #2
Rick Deckard
Registered User
 
Rick Deckard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Germany
Posts: 1,418
vCash: 500
I think we're worse than last season right now.

Goal might be the only position we will get better results. I expect Bryzgalov to have a better season than 2011, he now knows the situation in Philadelphia (Media, expectations and so on), he's the undisputed starter (hopefully we won't discuss after preseason about Leighton as starter, like we did last year about Bobrovsky) and he should be comfortable playing in the system. ... It has to be a better year for him.

The defense as a whole got worse. We have a lot of second pairing defensemen and a good #2 in Timonen, it's a deep defense core without top-end talent. By replacing Carle with Schenn we lost a lot of offense, Timonen got a year older and shouldn't play the amount of minutes he always has to, Meszaros comes back from back surgery ... There are many question marks.

On offense we lost two big winger (emphasis last offseason, getting bigger on the wing?) and only added Fedotenko (15 goals in a good season). I don't think that the SOPHOMORE players can replace that lost offense, Schenn will get better (if healthy), Couturier will stay (more icetime, similar totals) and I expect Read to slump. We lost a lot of depth on offense too, last year injured players were replaced by Couturier and Talbot, both will be in the top nine for the upcoming season and we don't have similar players to step into their roles. Voracek is the only player I expect to have a breakout season, especially if he plays at Girouxs wing.

With the current roster I expect us to battle for a playoff spot, 93, 94 points and finishing between 6th and 8th.


Last edited by Rick Deckard: 07-16-2012 at 03:02 AM.
Rick Deckard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 03:30 AM
  #3
BillDineen
Registered User
 
BillDineen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,672
vCash: 500
I did the below randomly. Assuming Briere has a better regular season and Schenn and Couturier improve this could should be fine offensively.

Claude Giroux (C) 28 - 28 (same)
Scott Hartnell (LW) 37 - 32 (-5)
Jaromir Jagr (RW) 19 - gone
Wayne Simmonds (RW/LW) 28 - 25 (-3)
Jakub Voracek (RW) 18 - 20 (+2)
Daniel Bričre (C/RW) 16 - 25 (+9)
Matt Read (C/RW) 24 - 24 (same)
Kimmo Timonen (D) 4 - 4 (same)
Matt Carle (D) 4 - gone
Maxime Talbot (RW/C) 19 - 15 (-4)
Sean Couturier (C) 13 - 20 (+7)
Andrej Meszaros (D) 7 - 7 (same)
James van Riemsdyk (LW) 11 - gone
Braydon Coburn (D) 4 - 4 (same)
Brayden Schenn (C) 12 - 20 (+8)
Chris Pronger (D) 1 - gone
Eric Wellwood (LW/C) 5 - 5 (same)
Zac Rinaldo (C) 2 - 2 (same)
Marc-André Bourdon (D) 4 - 4 (same)
Harry Zolnierczyk (LW) 3 - 3 (same)
Nicklas Grossmann (D) 0 - 1 (+1)
Andreas Lilja (D) 0 - 0 (same)
Erik Gustafsson (D) 1 - 4 (+3)
Pavel Kubina (D) 0 - gone
Andreas Nödl (RW) 0 - gone
Tom Sestito (LW) 0 - 2 (+2)
Jody Shelley (LW) 0 - 0 (same)
Brandon Manning (D) 0 - 0 (same)
Matt Walker (D) 0 - 0 (same)
Ben Holmstrom (C) 0 - 0 (same)
Kevin Marshall (D) 0 - gone
Ruslan Fedotenko (LW/RW) 9 - 12
Luke Schenn (D) 2 - 2
Bruno Gervais (D) 6 - 6

260 vs 276

Let's assume Gervais does not get 6 and gets 0, Couturier gets 15 instead of 20 and Biere only gets 16 again, that is still 256 goals vs 260 from the players above last year. This team is counting on sophomore's though.

G couldn't be any worse as a whole then last year (I hope).

If Schenn plays as he showed as a rookie and Meszaros as he did two year's ago the D will be better IMO. Overall it will likely be worse.

Upside is probably what was done last year, but I expect he team to be still a good playoff team.

BillDineen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 05:09 AM
  #4
Krishna
Registered User
 
Krishna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Country: Canada
Posts: 82,237
vCash: 500
Cup Champions or bust

Krishna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 06:16 AM
  #5
chimrichalds18
the key
 
chimrichalds18's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 2,775
vCash: 500
I expect us to make the playoffs...beyond that, not much else. I do think that -- assuming next offseason is more productive -- this team will be a legitimate threat in the East starting in 13-14.

chimrichalds18 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 06:46 AM
  #6
RJ8812*
Hellooooo ladiiiies
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Sudbury
Country: Canada
Posts: 28,092
vCash: 500
Bryzgalov is the key

RJ8812* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 07:17 AM
  #7
Alchemy
Philadelphia Flyers
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 12,769
vCash: 500
If Bryzgalov comes into form and the youth takes the next step this team has a vast amount of potential. This group already seems to be pretty tight and with another year of the same core and some players coming in who already have good relations with certain members on the roster it should be a good year.

Alchemy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 08:01 AM
  #8
BrimFullofAsham45
Registered User
 
BrimFullofAsham45's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 1,512
vCash: 500
We have the worst goaltending tandem in the league, so all concerns about losing offense don't really matter. I just can't see Bryz leading any team to a cup, and in this world its cup or bust. He's ****ing horrible and the only reason people expect him to be better next year is because its hard to believe he could be any worse than last year. The dude is a trainwreck and embarrassed himself and the city in every interview he's been in. He's a sore loser and a ***** and not a guy this team is going to fight for.

However, people seem to forget already that last seasons team was a patchwork team, with a lot of new pieces that didn't really fit. There wasn't a lot of chemistry to start the year and we didn't really see the team come together until the close of the regular season. (Personally I think losing JVR and Jagr is a good thing because they were detractors of chemistry). But now we have players who know the system and their teammates, and a coach who is more familiar with his players limits and can approach this training camp with a better plan.

BrimFullofAsham45 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 08:29 AM
  #9
Krishna
Registered User
 
Krishna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Country: Canada
Posts: 82,237
vCash: 500
Bryz had an off year. He'll get better and he will win 8 cups, make the hall of fame, and get his number retired here.

Krishna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 08:33 AM
  #10
RJ8812*
Hellooooo ladiiiies
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Sudbury
Country: Canada
Posts: 28,092
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrimFullofAsham45 View Post
We have the worst goaltending tandem in the league, so all concerns about losing offense don't really matter. I just can't see Bryz leading any team to a cup, and in this world its cup or bust. He's ****ing horrible and the only reason people expect him to be better next year is because its hard to believe he could be any worse than last year. The dude is a trainwreck and embarrassed himself and the city in every interview he's been in. He's a sore loser and a ***** and not a guy this team is going to fight for.

However, people seem to forget already that last seasons team was a patchwork team, with a lot of new pieces that didn't really fit. There wasn't a lot of chemistry to start the year and we didn't really see the team come together until the close of the regular season. (Personally I think losing JVR and Jagr is a good thing because they were detractors of chemistry). But now we have players who know the system and their teammates, and a coach who is more familiar with his players limits and can approach this training camp with a better plan.
Yes, Bryzgalov is terrible. Not once did he play any good at all during the season last year. His player of the month stretch during March, where he went 10-2-1, with a 1.43 GAA and a .947 save percentage including four shutouts while setting a franchise record for consecutive shut out streak just shows how absultely god awful he is. He was also by far the worst player on our team during the NJ series.

It was all Bryzgalov's fault because we all know we had the best blueline and defensively responsible forwards in the league.

RJ8812* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 08:44 AM
  #11
Pantokrator
Who's the clown?
 
Pantokrator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Semmes, Alabama
Country: Guatemala
Posts: 4,494
vCash: 500
I think the team will be worse - it will be difficult for the players that had career years to replicate that. I expect them to be fighting for a low playoff berth.

I am OK with it, because I keep thinking that the team will be better in a few years. The only players I can think of that will be gone for sure in two years will be Kimmo and Briere (I don't remember how many years he has left on his contract).

So, IF the current squad of young players can improve, then the team "only" needs a number 1 defenseman to compete for the Cup. However, that "only" is a pretty big one.

If the Schenns and Couturier turn into the players that they are projected to be, then the team could have a decent future. I still think it hinges on the defense though. They could try to go the route of the '06 Canes who really had an entire defense made up of #2-4 d-men. None of them were real #1s, but they had good depth on D.

Pantokrator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 08:50 AM
  #12
DrinkFightFlyers
Grave Before Shave
 
DrinkFightFlyers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 13,644
vCash: 50
Send a message via AIM to DrinkFightFlyers
I think the team is essentially on the same level, and could be better if everyone plays how they are supposed to (which never happens). While the 2010 had better defense by far, this year's team, if everyone stays healthy and plays to their abilities, will have a superior offense and goaltending, and the defense wouldn't be far behind. That said, I don't expect a Cup run this season. Playoffs for sure, Cup only if the team is 100% healthy and gets some good matchups along the way. But really all you need to do is get hot at the right time so who knows.

DrinkFightFlyers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 09:06 AM
  #13
BrimFullofAsham45
Registered User
 
BrimFullofAsham45's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 1,512
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RJ8812 View Post
Yes, Bryzgalov is terrible. Not once did he play any good at all during the season last year. His player of the month stretch during March, where he went 10-2-1, with a 1.43 GAA and a .947 save percentage including four shutouts while setting a franchise record for consecutive shut out streak just shows how absultely god awful he is. He was also by far the worst player on our team during the NJ series.

It was all Bryzgalov's fault because we all know we had the best blueline and defensively responsible forwards in the league.
Oh wow, a month of "good" play? Holy hell, let's pat the 51 million dollar man on the back. Hey, doesn't Brian Boucher hold the longest shutout streak ever? Let's not forget, Bryz wasn't "spectacular" in March, he just went a month without crapping the bed on a daily basis while the Flyers were steamrolling teams.

Bryz wasn't the worst player for the Flyers against the Devils, but that's not to say he didn't let in his fair share of clunkers each game. Go back and watch some tape and tell me thats a goaltender you have faith in.

BrimFullofAsham45 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 09:15 AM
  #14
turkinaa
Registered User
 
turkinaa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: PA
Country: United States
Posts: 915
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrimFullofAsham45 View Post
Oh wow, a month of "good" play? Holy hell, let's pat the 51 million dollar man on the back. Hey, doesn't Brian Boucher hold the longest shutout streak ever? Let's not forget, Bryz wasn't "spectacular" in March, he just went a month without crapping the bed on a daily basis while the Flyers were steamrolling teams.

Bryz wasn't the worst player for the Flyers against the Devils, but that's not to say he didn't let in his fair share of clunkers each game. Go back and watch some tape and tell me thats a goaltender you have faith in.
Boucher has that record playing in PHO, which is also where Bryz looked like a better goalie. Just saying.

I do agree that one month of playing well does not make a season, nor does it reflect how the goalie will play in the future. Let's just face the music here that unless we win a cup in the next few years Bryz was a horrible, horrible, horrible mistake (let's face it in a few years he'll be much older and most of the team in front of him will be different).

turkinaa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 09:26 AM
  #15
flyersfan187
Registered User
 
flyersfan187's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Morrisdale, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 1,864
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to flyersfan187 Send a message via Skype™ to flyersfan187
Feds should help out the defensive play, but with Kimmo getting older and losing Carle this team isn't as good as last season. Its a great regular season system though so they should make the playoffs, but when teams clamp down and play better D in the playoffs it will be hard for the Flyers to move on. I don't think they are done yet this off season.

flyersfan187 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 09:42 AM
  #16
rban*
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,894
vCash: 500
The defense is very sub standard. Like someone said, a surplus of 2-5 Dmen, no one close to a Number One.

Carolina got very very lucky that yr, getting very favorable matchups and meeting teams totally crippled by injuries.

rban* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 09:50 AM
  #17
DrHamburg
Registered User
 
DrHamburg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 1,314
vCash: 500
I think this season success is going to be a lot about Luke Schenn. Flyers lost 2 roster players so far. Matt Carle and Jagr. Jagr at times was completely awful defensively and giving effort and cherry picked quite often. When the forwards were bad helping out he was a main reason why for his line.

So if Luke Schenn can shore up the defense better than Matt Carle for this team the Flyers make the playoffs easy (assuming there arent 1234123 injuries). Grossman and Coburn were outstanding once paired together. I always felt Kimmo was worn down by bigger players and now should have the benefit playing with Luke who is a big body guy who might deter some of the hits Kimmo takes. I already like those top 2 pairings better than anything the Flyers used most of the regular season. Add in Gervais and Mes at the bottom pairing with bourdon and Lilja makes me feel a lot better about our defense this season than last season. Also this season, the Flyers can again, run 4 lines all game, Fedotenko-Talbot-Rinaldo is going to be one of the best 4th lines in Hockey (assuming thats what they go with). keeps talbot fresh for the PK as well.

From all what Bryz has said he should improve this season. Those aren't major changes but if Bryz Improves, Schenn shores up the defense, Flyers should be right in the running again.

DrHamburg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 10:03 AM
  #18
Beef Invictus
Global Moderator
FAT SLOB
 
Beef Invictus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Centreville
Country: Lord Howe Island
Posts: 47,124
vCash: 500
I also think it comes down to Bryz. We don't have the defensive skill as a team to babysit him and expect success, since we have lost some offense and we don't know for sure that B. Schenn and Voracek (or whoever) will fill that gap. If he plays like he did last year the team is screwed, especially since he's the only NHL goalie on the team. If he gets his act together they'll be fine. Overall I'm predicting a 5-8 finish, an improvement over last year's 6-8.

I'm more concerned about the loss of Jagr than the loss of JVR. Yes, JVR has all that shiny potential, but in terms of actual importance to the team last year he was pretty minimal. They did fine without him. I'm not concerned about losing Carle, unless Schenn continues to be crap. Advanced stats show that the Flyers produced less offense when Carle was on the ice, and he's average defensively at his best. Schenn ought to be capable of at least replacing that if he gets back in his groove and even improving on it; if not...poop.

It should be expected that some of the guys who had career years last year won't be repeating that performance. Since there won't be as many goals scored by us, we need less goals scored against. Schenn is going to be important. If he's awful, that's going to be obnoxious. If he gets back on track it will be a huge benefit.

__________________
Down in the basement, I've got a Craftsman lathe. Show it to the children when they misbehave.

Last edited by Beef Invictus: 07-16-2012 at 10:07 AM. Reason: We have a lot of Schenns.
Beef Invictus is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 10:36 AM
  #19
RJ8812*
Hellooooo ladiiiies
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Sudbury
Country: Canada
Posts: 28,092
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrimFullofAsham45 View Post
Oh wow, a month of "good" play? Holy hell, let's pat the 51 million dollar man on the back. Hey, doesn't Brian Boucher hold the longest shutout streak ever? Let's not forget, Bryz wasn't "spectacular" in March, he just went a month without crapping the bed on a daily basis while the Flyers were steamrolling teams.

Bryz wasn't the worst player for the Flyers against the Devils, but that's not to say he didn't let in his fair share of clunkers each game. Go back and watch some tape and tell me thats a goaltender you have faith in.
my point was just because a player had one bad season on a new team, doesnt mean he's just going to suck for the rest of his duration here. Player take time to adjust. Some player do it quickly and some player take longer. It's life, accept it. Yes, he did not have a good season, but I'm not just going to write him off already. The potential is there for him to play much better, because we saw glimpses of it.

It's like how people treat Briere here. How many "Briere is so bad, we should trade him" comments are made during the season, and then when the playoffs role around everyone is swinging from his nut sack and talking about how clutch he is

RJ8812* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 10:47 AM
  #20
CouturiersFrontTeeth
Registered User
 
CouturiersFrontTeeth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: New Brunswick, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 15
vCash: 500
I have no idea how we'll end up. I have a hunch we'll be 1 to 5 points better next year. The whole season hinges on consistency from Bryzgalov, a better season from Meszaros, and improvements from our young players.

I think Luke Schenn will be better than he was in Toronto and I expect one of Marc-Andre Bourdon or Erik Gustafsson or possibly Manning to step up and play in the open bottom pairing role.

I also expect that we'll be buyers at the deadline and that we'll be in the mix for one of the more high-profile players.

CouturiersFrontTeeth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 10:49 AM
  #21
Krishna
Registered User
 
Krishna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Country: Canada
Posts: 82,237
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CouturiersFrontTeeth View Post
I have no idea how we'll end up. I have a hunch we'll be 1 to 5 points better next year. The whole season hinges on consistency from Bryzgalov, a better season from Meszaros, and improvements from our young players.

I think Luke Schenn will be better than he was in Toronto and I expect one of Marc-Andre Bourdon or Erik Gustafsson or possibly Manning to step up and play in the open bottom pairing role.

I also expect that we'll be buyers at the deadline and that we'll be in the mix for one of the more high-profile players.

Bold prediction there

Krishna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 10:57 AM
  #22
Flyerfan4life
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Richmond BC, Canada
Country: England
Posts: 14,918
vCash: 500
i think we can all agree this season is all on the back of Bryz.

if he has another stinker season, that will pretty much do the team in.

i'd Love for Leights to come in and have a stellar season, but i gotta be honest, if Bryz is having a bad season, i dont know if the Flyers management will sit back and give the reins to Leights. i would imagine they start shopping for a replacement for Bryz.

guess we'll see..

Flyerfan4life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 10:59 AM
  #23
jd2210
Registered Non User
 
jd2210's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Great White North
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,543
vCash: 500
I think we will be the same as every year in the past few years: good enough to make the playoffs, and threaten to win a round or two. And with the age of this group I'm perfectly fine with that. I hate giving up the farm to be a piece or two away from a cup. I like the new emphasis on youth and I think two or three years from now we'll be glad we went this way.

I expect improved play from: Bryz, Schenns, Voracek, Mezaros, Couts, Wellwood, Sesito

I expect a drop from: Hartnell, Talbot, Coburn, Simmonds, Read

And more of the same from everyone else.

I also expect Leighton won't suck as bad as we all fear, but I don't think we'll see much of him unless Bryz gets injured.

I expect that if Shelly is sent down the new whipping boy will be whomever is in the #6 d spot because we as a collective group can't comprehend that #6 d men always have shortcomings which is why they are #6 d.

I expect the Phantoms to make the playoffs this year. The addition of Syvret will help as will a full year of Ford. I expect guys like Harper and McGinn will have an added role and will more than makeup for the lost offense of Wellwood and Hamel (assuming Hamel doesn't resign)

jd2210 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 11:01 AM
  #24
jd2210
Registered Non User
 
jd2210's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Great White North
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,543
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RJ8812 View Post
my point was just because a player had one bad season on a new team, doesnt mean he's just going to suck for the rest of his duration here. Player take time to adjust. Some player do it quickly and some player take longer. It's life, accept it. Yes, he did not have a good season, but I'm not just going to write him off already. The potential is there for him to play much better, because we saw glimpses of it.

It's like how people treat Briere here. How many "Briere is so bad, we should trade him" comments are made during the season, and then when the playoffs role around everyone is swinging from his nut sack and talking about how clutch he is
Players do take time to adjust for sure, and in the case of Bryz I think his contract and the media here are contributing factors as well.

jd2210 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-16-2012, 11:17 AM
  #25
OriginJM
watch out im smart
 
OriginJM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 5,189
vCash: 500
we vastly overachieved last season

so, barring any #1 dmen coming in via trade, i'll be the guy who says this entire season will probably be a disaster

and bryz will still suck

there

OriginJM is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:05 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2015 All Rights Reserved.