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Brophy on Lu and Nash Mega Deals are tying hands

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Old
07-17-2012, 02:30 PM
  #1
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Brophy on Lu and Nash Mega Deals are tying hands

http://www.sportsnet.ca/iphone/hocke...e_tying_hands/

"What Iíd also like to see is a complete abolishment of no-trade and no-movement clauses. A general managerís inability to move a player is bad for business. Donít believe me? Just ask the good people of Toronto who have not witnessed a playoff game since 2004 and had to sit back and watch Mats Sundin play out his deal when the team could have improved itself by trading him. Then Sundin departed for Vancouver with nothing coming back to the Leafs. It happened in Montreal when Mark Streit departed for Long Island. Curtis Joseph left the Edmonton Oilers, who got nothing in return. It has happened over and over and over again."

This quote is not all of points being made by Brophy. I just thought it was interesting and points to a JFJ shortcoming. It's also the reason to not go after Lu and Nash. Why should teams help out CBJ and VAN? I have a feeling both are going nowhere and we can be happy Burke didn't overpay for them.

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07-17-2012, 02:34 PM
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Why would anyone care about a JFJ shortcoming at this point, whatever it is.

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07-17-2012, 02:35 PM
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The only player there still having any sort of effect on this team is Tucker, because of the last year of his buyout, and even then, it's insignificant.

This is not thread-worthy

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07-17-2012, 02:36 PM
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I love to to talk JFJ. So do a lot of people. I guess you don't. Is that your point. Is Brophy wrong for bringing up his name too?

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07-17-2012, 02:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ForSpareParts View Post
http://www.sportsnet.ca/iphone/hocke...e_tying_hands/

"What Iíd also like to see is a complete abolishment of no-trade and no-movement clauses. A general managerís inability to move a player is bad for business. Donít believe me? Just ask the good people of Toronto who have not witnessed a playoff game since 2004 and had to sit back and watch Mats Sundin play out his deal when the team could have improved itself by trading him. Then Sundin departed for Vancouver with nothing coming back to the Leafs. It happened in Montreal when Mark Streit departed for Long Island. Curtis Joseph left the Edmonton Oilers, who got nothing in return. It has happened over and over and over again."

This quote is not all of points being made by Brophy. I just thought it was interesting and points to a JFJ shortcoming. It's also the reason to not go after Lu and Nash. Why should teams help out CBJ and VAN? I have a feeling both are going nowhere and we can be happy Burke didn't overpay for them.
those two players are elite players in the game right now, why would you not want to make your team better by trading for these 2?

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07-17-2012, 02:44 PM
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I don't want to talk about the Sundin debacle.

Still stings to this day. Hurts even more because of how much I liked the *******!

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07-17-2012, 02:52 PM
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Originally Posted by -DeMo- View Post
those two players are elite players in the game right now, why would you not want to make your team better by trading for these 2?
Because if you don't have success you're screwed for the next 6-7 years. Not as serious with nash who becomes a UFA in 2018-2019 but still a heavy burden none the less when his play will inevitably drop. Not up to your daily quota of threads SP?


Last edited by Everlong: 07-17-2012 at 02:58 PM.
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07-17-2012, 02:58 PM
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Originally Posted by HellasLEAF View Post
I don't want to talk about the Sundin debacle.

Still stings to this day. Hurts even more because of how much I liked the *******!
Yes, it was a debacle for how most of his career Sundin was forced to play with average or subpar linemates. Then all of a sudden he was expected to waive his NTC.

He deserved better, and he didn't get it. I don't blame him at all for not waiving his NTC. He paid his dues.

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07-17-2012, 03:03 PM
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Originally Posted by HellasLEAF View Post
I don't want to talk about the Sundin debacle.

Still stings to this day. Hurts even more because of how much I liked the *******!
I agree, he was treated very poorly.

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07-17-2012, 03:04 PM
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No idea why people in here would rag on Mats for not waiving his NTC.. He wanted to be a Leaf.. Can't think of any other elite talent getting in line to do that these days...

He was actually convinced the team could make the playoffs that year... He faught hard as a Leaf right till the end of his contract..

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07-17-2012, 03:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Tootoo Train View Post
Because if you don't have success you're screwed for the next 6-7 years. Not as serious with nash who becomes a UFA in 2018-2019 but still a heavy burden none the less when his play will inevitably drop. Not up to your daily quota of threads SP?
my problem with what he said was "why would any team want to help out Vancouver or Columbus", no team is gonna make a trade to help out ethier of those two teams, when those players are traded the teams acquiring them will be doing so because they believe they can help there team and wont need to worry about having to deal them away so there NTC's shouldn't be that big of a factor, and they will help there new teams out because there both still elite Players.

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07-17-2012, 03:12 PM
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Yes, it was a debacle for how most of his career Sundin was forced to play with average or subpar linemates. Then all of a sudden he was expected to waive his NTC.

He deserved better, and he didn't get it. I don't blame him at all for not waiving his NTC. He paid his dues.
Amen to this.

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07-17-2012, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by CodeBlue View Post
Yes, it was a debacle for how most of his career Sundin was forced to play with average or subpar linemates. Then all of a sudden he was expected to waive his NTC.

He deserved better, and he didn't get it. I don't blame him at all for not waiving his NTC. He paid his dues.
I guess some of the people on this board are quite young. This goes back further than the Fletcher house cleaning era.

JFJ's first order of business was to trade Mats for futures (strangely contested by a board who usually promotes futures). Instead he have him a retirement contract which included a NTC. Then he offered the same thing to 4 others thinking he had a winning nucleus. GM's have to do bold things sometimes. He could have just paid Mats more and not include the NTC. Not trading Sundin for futures was the start of his downfall.

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07-17-2012, 03:18 PM
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i think it's more against the league to let those stupid terms in then Sundin himself. i'm not mad and i was never mad at Sundin for not waiving his NTC, that's what he agreed on so... let the guy do what he wants. but if the league would remove it, we would get some good trades and that Sundin day, he would have been traded, he would have said thanks to all the fans, and we would have had something in return. it's up to the league to wake up and remove it!!

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07-17-2012, 03:26 PM
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I'm not mad at Sundin at all for not accepting a trade but I'm still upset about the incompetence of our previous management groups to convince him or any of the core players to not accept a trade when Toronto needed to get assets for them so we could get younger and rebuild.

Burke didn't seem to have a problem getting Kaberle to move and get a great return in the process which is among the reasons I've got faith in our current management group.

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07-17-2012, 03:37 PM
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The leafs under JFJ had a league avg. amount of NTC's. He got too much crap over that.

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07-17-2012, 03:47 PM
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Personally I think Scott Howson and Mike Gillis are the ones tying everyones hands and are the reasons Nash and Luongo have not been traded. I understand them wanting to make the best deal possible for their respecitve teams, however if both want an A+ value in return they are dreaming. The reality is their demands are to much and etc. I also find it funny that Howson thought once Parise signed then the teams who didn't get him would give into his demands for Nash, however that hasn't happened.

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07-17-2012, 03:51 PM
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I won't be surprised at all if Nash is still in Columbus in October. Howson is just asking far too much, and he can't backtrack now given the deal he turned down from New York.

Luongo I think is more of a situation of 1 or 2 teams being mildly interested and that's it. His contract is far too long, and not many teams need a #1goalie.

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07-17-2012, 04:01 PM
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The leafs under JFJ had a league avg. amount of NTC's. He got too much crap over that.
I find it hard to believe that there might have been a team at the time with 10 NTC's. It's not the quantity that's the point. It's the decision to lock these 5. A league average doesn't excuse a misjudgment of talent.

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07-17-2012, 04:03 PM
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Yes, it was a debacle for how most of his career Sundin was forced to play with average or subpar linemates. Then all of a sudden he was expected to waive his NTC.

He deserved better, and he didn't get it. I don't blame him at all for not waiving his NTC. He paid his dues.
Agreed man. Sundin was the man. And I honestly believe that if he didn't get the raw deal with being ran over by the media with questions about his nmc, I think he would have signed back here for at least another year. It made me sick to find out we traded his rights to Montreal to see if they could strike up a deal. You dont do that to your star player.

He didn't handcuff this team, he didn't do the drafting or he didn't trade away every first rounder to try acquire marginal wingers. He wanted to finish out the year here. It was then that we should have didn everything in our power to sign him, or let him walk July 1st. Not trade his rights to try and get a 5th effin round pick.

Either way, my boy is gonna be in the HHOF. Haters can hate, Mats was a star player we'll be wishing we had for years.

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07-17-2012, 04:09 PM
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Agreed man. Sundin was the man. And I honestly believe that if he didn't get the raw deal with being ran over by the media with questions about his nmc, I think he would have signed back here for at least another year. It made me sick to find out we traded his rights to Montreal to see if they could strike up a deal. You dont do that to your star player.

He didn't handcuff this team, he didn't do the drafting or he didn't trade away every first rounder to try acquire marginal wingers. He wanted to finish out the year here. It was then that we should have didn everything in our power to sign him, or let him walk July 1st. Not trade his rights to try and get a 5th effin round pick.

Either way, my boy is gonna be in the HHOF. Haters can hate, Mats was a star player we'll be wishing we had for years.
What, we shud have paid him the 10 million Vancouver did?

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07-17-2012, 04:17 PM
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Agreed man. Sundin was the man. And I honestly believe that if he didn't get the raw deal with being ran over by the media with questions about his nmc, I think he would have signed back here for at least another year. It made me sick to find out we traded his rights to Montreal to see if they could strike up a deal. You dont do that to your star player.

He didn't handcuff this team, he didn't do the drafting or he didn't trade away every first rounder to try acquire marginal wingers. He wanted to finish out the year here. It was then that we should have didn everything in our power to sign him, or let him walk July 1st. Not trade his rights to try and get a 5th effin round pick.

Either way, my boy is gonna be in the HHOF. Haters can hate, Mats was a star player we'll be wishing we had for years.
He's already in the HHOF

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07-17-2012, 04:24 PM
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Amen to this.
amen from me as well..you may think NTC's are stupid, but it completely defeats the point of them if a player is expected to waive when asked...mats had every right to refuse a trade, as do luongo and nash

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07-17-2012, 04:31 PM
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I really don't understand why there is a thread about this. This link can be posted easily in the all loungo purpose thread. closed.

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